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internal debate MRA

MRA: Thomas Ball is no martyr

Not everyone in the MRM is hailing Thomas Ball as a martyr. Here’s what the blogger at Rise of the Zeta Male has to say on the subject:

What happened was a tragedy, and he absolutely should be honored for his fight. But at the end of the day, I still think his methods, and advocacy for violence (see the Molotov cocktail section) are wrong. The only thing violence breeds is more violence, and I am not going to excuse that, just because he proves a point I stand by. This was not an act of self defense, it was not an act of selfishness, it was an act of self destructive protest and it is a great tragedy.

I don’t often agree with what’s posted at Zeta Male – I’m not sure I’ve ever agreed with anything he’s said previously – and there are things in this comment and the rest of the post that I think are problematic. But I have to give the blogger credit for taking a principled stance on this issue, and one that is distinctly unpopular amongst MRAs online.

 

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Molly Ren
10 years ago

Kirby, you torment me. :'(

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
10 years ago

I suppose I could always cut slices of my home-made bread, then take some cheese, grill up some bacon, and make grilled-cheese and bacon sandwiches!

okay.. I’ll stop now. 😛

Molly Ren
10 years ago

Sadist!

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

He’s a feminist, it goes w/o saying he’s also a sadist xD

darksidecat
10 years ago

Here’s a few links with some stats and a basic outline of child support law:

http://family.findlaw.com/child-support/support-basics/support-intro.html
http://family.findlaw.com/child-support/support-basics/support-stats.html

A person cannot be jailed for civil contempt if they demonstrate and inability to meet the conditions (this is true in general). As to child support, a non-custodial parent being charged with contempt must be given “clear notice that his ability to pay would constitute the critical question in his civil contempt proceeding.” Under Turner v Rogers, a civil contempt defendent in these cases does not have to be provided counsel, but in the words of the court “…we attach an important caveat, namely,that the State must nonetheless have in place alternative procedures that assure a fundamentally fair determination of the critical incarceration related question, whether the supporting parent is able to comply with the support order.” So, all Ball needed to do was show up to his contempt hearing and (if it is true) state his lack of income, and he could not be jailed for civil contempt for failure to pay. Some districts require those who are unemployed and failing to pay support to participate in state programs which provided job training or do job searches, but beyond that, no income means no civil contempt punishment for failure to pay. Unless, of course, the person refuses to appear at their court dates or fill out their forms.

zombie rotten mcdonald
10 years ago

Also, people, remember that whenever you disprove one of Slavey’s points, it shows that you’re full of hate.

Can I just hate him because he is a vile, pathetic, miserable-excuse-for-a-man?

I am all about the shortcuts.

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

@Molly Ren

http://www.gamer-source.com/?cmd=media&sec=artwork&act=view&id=231

how about this for your card? (or do you prefer to be a hippo?)

Captain Bathrobe
10 years ago

Thanks, DSC!

Molly Ren
10 years ago

@Ami Forget the hippo. This is soooo much cooler! 😀

Bee
Bee
10 years ago

Ami! If the ghost bees didn’t fit in with the storyline, I wanna be something nonhuman anyway. Could I be a feminist boat? Like, Scott Adams’ counterpart? (Although that’s certainly an overstatement of my feminist powers. Maybe a feminist canoe!)

Alex
10 years ago

@Ami,

By itself and out of context, the princess/prince thing really isn’t all that bad (though I wonder how she would possibly be tonguing with him is she was asleep, and that’s disturbing in another way). The teacher/student thing though is just wrong. I mean, sure, adults can role-play a student and teacher and there’s nothing wrong with that, but the juxtaposition of the clearly adult teacher and child student suggests the student in the “adult” pannel is probably in high school, and that’s not cool no matter how it’s spun. So shame on KIA!

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

Yeah, that’s basically what I said in my blog. I had no problem w/ the princess/prince thing but I can ttlly see how the other one is being read that either this is how the teacher sees the student or that it’s still her being underage 😐 even if that was not the intent.. :

Bee
Bee
10 years ago

Or, crap, Ami … that sounded different in my head. I meant to say I don’t care if you do the bee card, but I didn’t mean to make it sound like I demanded anything! Sorry. Poorly typed.

Pecunium
10 years ago

darksidecat: There are jurisdictions where arrears in childsupport (e.g. Rhode Island, Michigan, Missouri) is a crime, not an issue of Civil Contempt.

darksidecat
10 years ago

@Pecunium, I think even in those states, civil contempt is still the first go to option. Apparantly, such criminal statutes are fairly common, but almost never used (obviously, in a criminal case the defendent has the right to an attorney and the prosecution must prove each element beyond a reasonable doubt and these statutes all seem to include that the violation be willful or intentional, which a failure due to inability is not). Still, it might be an interesting issue in another case, but we know here that Ball’s case was a civil contempt case (he cites the opponent as the wife’s lawyer, not the prosecutor or the DA’s office).

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
10 years ago

Buck Swamp already has one? *is impressed at his douchatude*

denelian
denelian
10 years ago

Ami; the Zeta cards are BEEEYOTIFUL! [yes, i deliberately misspelled “beautiful” if anyone cares]

Slave:
let me see if i follow your logic. there ARE rigid gender-roles, and it is the JOB of the woman to take care of the kids full-time, while it’s the JOB of the man to bring in income.
but when there is a divorce, those rigid gender roles are to be UTTERLY DISCARDED, so that the men who did little in the way of DIRECT child-care can now have “equal time” if they want it.

HUH?!?! look, either there are rigid gender roles that state WOMEN do the actual WORK of child-care [and fucking trust me – child care is WORK!] while the MEN pay for it, and so in the case of divorce there’s NO NEED to really change this formula – or, there *IS* a need to change the formula because gender roles are NOT rigid and MEN are completely capable of LEARNING HOW to be primary child-care-givers.

which is it? because you’re trying to both have your cake and eat it, too. these are mutually impossible ideas – if you think men should get equal fucking time, then you DON’T believe in rigid gender roles. if you DO believe in rigid gender roles, than the idea of men getting equal time should be ABHORENT to you.

moving on a bit – the average amount of child support the non-custodial parent is SUPPOSED to pay is around 20% of their income [it’s often lower; rarely higher]. if the average person makes $30k – $2,500/month – then the average child support check is $500. *MY* rent is higher than that, and i live in one of the cheapest areas of town! paying for 20 hours of child care a week is about $400 a week. 40 hours a week is about $800. yet most non-custodial parents don’t even pay enough child support each month to have their child in daycare “full time” for a week!

last-but-not-least – in cases where the custodial parent is recieving welfare, which account for over HALF the cases where child support has been mandated, the REASON child support is now mandated is because Regan and the Republicans [that should TOTALLY be a punk rock band name, btw] spent YEARS throwing a fit about welfare and had the laws changed so that instead of getting welfare from the state, the single parent on welfare was getting said welfare, second had, from the non-custodial parent. as in, the custodial parent IS NOT the one who goes after child support – the STATE is, to “pay back” that welfare – and this is a policy that feminists fought tooth-and-fucking-NAIL for YEARS, correctly stating that it would A) cost more to get that money than the money itself would recoup, B) unfairly punished primarily poor men, who often have low-earning jobs and can’t afford to pay child support and *that’s why the custodial parent was applying for welfare to begin with*

but sure, go ahead and continue to blame the wrong people. as the republican continue to steal your jobs and your money and raise your taxes to off-set the taxes they refuse to collect from the uber-rich, blame to one group of people who FOUGHT the current child-support system. go ahead, slit your own throat. it’s what the republicans want, anyway.

Skyal
Skyal
10 years ago

NWO, the child’s right is to a STABLE situation that most closely approximates what they are used to and which best provides them stability and consistency in parenting.. And given I made no distinction about who was the primary caregiver, your ridiculous claim of hatred has no basis. If the primary caregiver is the father, the same situation applies.

If non-primary caregivers want to get equal custody, they need to fucking step up and do equal PARENTING. Bathing, feeding, diapering, playing, educating. And in the case of infants and toddlers, they still have no “right” to equal custody because it’s too hard on the child. And if they really fucking cared about their kids, they would choose what is best for the CHILD not their own selfish desire to look like a decent parent when they couldn’t be bothered when they had the chance.

Skyal
Skyal
10 years ago

Kirby, your sandwich sounds awesome. Now I’m hungry.

denelian
denelian
10 years ago

and – oh, WOW, the Queen Beetch is almost IMPOSSIBLE to play – but sooooooooooooo wonderful!

i was gonna say, when i saw the pic for MollyRen, that you have her be a “Barbarian Queen commonly know as ‘The Ravening Hippo'” or something – but the drill seargant is pretty cool! i especially like the slave-driving aspect of her 🙂

on my card – i particualarly like how i can kill ANY non-artifact creature with just 3 black mana. that’s HAWT 😀

i think i’m gonna write some backstory for mine – i has some ideas! [i didn’t say before – but i specifically like that i was an “athlete” before being kicked out because my boobs distracted from the “real” athletes – it parallels my problems in dance without screwing up the story line. thanks! i totally ♥ my card!]

chocomintlipwax
10 years ago

I’ve mentioned before that I know a lady who has a lot of kids and the dad has primary custody (of the ones she had with him, then she ran off and had some more with another dude and married him).

I found out recently that she quit her (50k/yr) job so that she could get out of paying child support. Is she going to jail for it? Nope. She’s just paying a percentage of her income, apparently. Which is nothing.

I would use that as some evidence against something someone said, except I know I’ll hear how it’s different because she’s a woman (except that I also hear that men never get primary custody, so this situation shouldn’t even exist).

By the way, her sister (a woman) and her mother (another woman) are both appalled at her behavior. All of it. Because there’s a LOT of behavior to be appalled at …

(I finally connected my phone to my computer. Hallelujah. Real browser internetz. I haz dem.)

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

Swamp is a land type in Magic… his name was too perfect not to make it xD And all his ramblings about how we were hurting ourselves gave me the perfect idea for the card xD It’s hard to offend somebody who’s just here for ideas for cards xD

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/VirginalPlains.jpg

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/SilverflowMountain.jpg

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/SecondWaveIsland.jpg

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/HardwoodForest.jpg

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/BuckSwamp.jpg

There’s the 5 sac land cycle for this set xD

@Denelian I was hoping you’d like the little nod to your RL athletic struggles :3

Magpie
Magpie
10 years ago

In practice, NWO doesn’t have to muck up his rigid gender roles. He gets some other woman to do the hands-on work while he plays with the kids.

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

@Denelian I’m basing the beetches on the slivers xD where each Beetch gives powers to every Beetch in play… so if you made a 5 colour Beetch deck, it’d be possible to play Bee, and she’d be producing Beetches that would be v powerful if you had the other ones around :3 (they’re like the Borg, or the Replicators, or w/e passes for the hivemind species in Sci Fi these days xD)

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

Given that I’ve found an MRA who likes my cards, I’m hoping others will come around XD My goal is to have them all embrace my cards! And peace shall reign thru the online genderverse! xD

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

http://s749.photobucket.com/albums/xx134/ami_angelwings/Magyc%20Cards/?start=all

All the cards so far (gonna redo Kirby at some point >_> sry Kirby xD )

any ideas, feel free to suggest :3 And if you requested a card and I forgot about you (I know I still have to do Pecunium and Kave), or if you want one, let me know, and give me any details you want me to include :3

I’m over the 50 card mark xD I didn’t think I’d be able to do it! xD

Ami Angelwings
10 years ago

http://johnnypez9.blogspot.com/2011/06/curse-of-hound.html

and if nebody missed it, here’s Johnny Pez’s fanfic based on the Magyc: The Gendering storyline :3

Hook
Hook
10 years ago

Firstly, manboobz isn’t any sort of moral authority in the first place and there isn’t an internal debate on T. Balls call for violence.

The general mens movement position from what I can see is an understanding that if acts of violence are committed by the state, against the people, some sort of violence will come in retaliation as an inevitability. If anyone is unclear about the violence that was committed against T. Bell. The state were looking to collect more money than he could afford to pay from him,a financially disadvantaged man under the threat of being locked in a cage, enforced by men in costumes with guns.

Finely, the state feminist system that Ball was railing against is one that was built out of terrorism.

Here from what I can see, is the reason we have a stalinesque system, instead of a humanitarian system.

“Erin Patria Margaret Pizzey (née Carney, born 19 February 1939, China, daughter of a diplomat) is a British family care activist and a best-selling novelist. She became internationally famous for having started one of the first[1] Women’s refuges (called women’s shelter in the U.S.) in the modern world in 1971. She was also the founder of the UK domestic violence charity Refuge. However, Pizzey reports that she has been the subject of death threats and boycotts because of her conclusion that most domestic violence is reciprocal, and that women are equally as capable of violence as men.

Pizzey said that militant feminists – with the collusion of Labour’s leading women – hijacked her cause and used it to try to demonise all men, not only in Britain, but internationally.[3]After the hijacking the demand for a service for women survivors of domestic violence grew and soon public funding became available. Today the movement has been rebranded asWomen’s Aid and garners millions of pounds a year from a variety of sources, the primary one of which is the state. Pizzey has lamented that the movement she started had moved from the “personal to the political”.

Pizzey says it was after death threats against her, her children, her grandchildren, and the killing of her dog, all of which she states were perpetrated by feminist activists, [8][9] that she left England for North America.

Erin Pizzey Wiki

Yaz
Yaz
10 years ago

‘all of which she states were perpetrated by feminist activists, [8][9]’ – Hook Quoting some article on Erin Pizzey

8 is a Fox news article. *eyeroll* excerpt : ‘Pizzey wrote that when she arrived in England for her book tour, she was “met with a solid wall of feminist demonstrators” carrying signs that read “ALL MEN ARE RAPISTS, ALL MEN ARE BATTERERS.”‘ Uh huh…
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,197550,00.html

9 is a paranoid and ranting Father’s rights blog (which has lots of articles denouncing gays and feminists). And statements like this : ‘If a sober woman consents to have sex with you and later regrets it, you could falsely be charged with rape. A recent study finds 50% of all campus rape charges are false.’ and this : ‘If your female conceives a child, she has absolute power to make you a father against your wishes.’ Emphasis mine. Sounds like we’re talking about livestock. And I’m sure that’s how some of these douchenozzles think.
http://www.fathersforlife.org/mens_issues/advice_to_men.htm

But I’m sure this is totally credible, unbiased, and that there was no agenda at all.

Hook
Hook
10 years ago

So what Yaz?

Eyerolling is not an argument, pointing to the media outlets that have covered Prizzys story is no argument either, You will notice that there is no dispute as to the accuracy of Erin’s wiki and to this day she is still a very credible domestic violence activist, she is involved in setting up the first shelters in Iran and supporting an inclusive domestic violence treatment in the west. Her story has been covered by at least one feminist and has been told in the guardian newspaper.

The system that you support, is based on violence, lies about men and is enforced by the threat of state violence.

Were it not for the lies that the feminists that took over Pizzeys movement told about men, we would not be seeing the lack of empathy and hatred towards men that we are seeing on this blog, others like it, the family courts and society in general and there would likely be no men’s rights movement with an agenda to tell these truths about the feminist movement or men setting themselves alight on the steps of court houses or killing themselves because of the family court to the amusement of feminists.

Yaz
Yaz
10 years ago

‘Her story has been covered by at least one feminist and has been told in the guardian newspaper.’ – Hook

Yet even with more credible choices you chose instead to link to wikipedia. Which cites unreliable sources and conspiracy blogs as support. Interesting choice on your part. In future you might want to consider how your choice of links effects whether or not people take you seriously. It does.

‘The system that you support, is based on violence, lies about men and is enforced by the threat of state violence.’

Citation needed. Also…which system is it that I support, exactly?

Hook
Hook
10 years ago

Yaz, Im not going to get into a silly debate over sources with some who gets their information with someone that gets their information from manboobz and feminism. You read the Pizzey story, you know its true and you want to misdirect and bicker now in order to provide subterfuge for the systemic violence that’s designed by feminism, based on lies about men and causing people to kill themselves and mobilise against it.

That’s all.

Magical Laura
10 years ago

“Eyerolling is not an argument”

I would imagine that it was more a response to yet another link that gives information about rape that has been proved false. “If a sober woman has sex with you and regrets it, you could be charged with rape” – this simply isn’t true. Changing your mind after consensual sex has never been, and is not currently, classed as a crime of any sort.

“pointing to the media outlets that have covered Prizzys story is no argument either”

It kinda is. The views widely represented on Fox News are against most of the things I stand for, and for many things I am against. But mainly, it supports liars and lies.

How can you expect us to take a source seriously when the rest of the time it is going on about the ‘gay agenda’?

Yaz
Yaz
10 years ago

‘you know its true ‘ – Hook

I suspect quite strongly the opposite, in fact. Seeing as the only sources that support you are not credible ones, I don’t believe what you’re saying at all. And asserting that I do believe you just makes you seem silly.

‘with some who gets their information with someone that gets their information from manboobz and feminism. ‘ – Hook, failing at proofreading.

You have no idea where I get my information. I haven’t cited any sources. All I did was point out how shoddy yours were. Seeing as one is noted for being biased and untrue, and the other seems to be a conspiracy theory site which rants about the gay agenda and feminist propaganda.

You make a lot of unbased assumptions about me. What system I support and where my info comes from are not things I’ve mentioned. But apparently you can read my mind over the internet and even know what I’m thinking better than I do. See, it’s stuff like this that takes away from your credibility.

AbsintheDexterous
10 years ago

BACON BREAD

kirby – I don’t know if you’re a fan of popovers or not, but bacon popovers are really awesome. They don’t puff up as high as regular popovers do, but trust me, my life was better once I made them.

Eyerolling is not an argument

ou want to misdirect and bicker now in order to provide subterfuge for the systemic violence that’s designed by feminism, based on lies about men and causing people to kill themselves and mobilise against it

Eyerolling isn’t an argument, and neither is crazy conspiracy theories regarding some Monolithic Female Feminazi Beast. Eyerolling is pretty much the only response to that.

Hook
Hook
10 years ago

Magical Laura, that’s all nonsense too, you want to shift the focus away from the violence and agenda of the feminist movement that commandeered the domestic violence movement, on to something else because you support the state violence that is causing people to kill themselves by focusing on splitting hairs about sources.

That “Fox news article” was written by a feminist, and it appeared in numerous media outlets.

“How can you expect us to take a source seriously when the rest of the time it is going on about the ‘gay agenda’?”

That is a republishing of an article by Erin Pizzey

1652 words published in The Scotsman 30.3.99.
© erin pizzey
WHO’S FAILING THE FAMILY

BY ERIN PIZZEY

I don’t expect you to take any evidence that contradicts your ideology seriously, I expect lies, mobbing, misdirection, personal attacks and so on.

This is a feminist site after all.

Here is the full list of sources

^ Haven House in California was founded in 1964, seven years earlier than Pizzey’s shelter (see About Haven House).
^ “BATTERED WIVES (RIGHTS TO POSSESSION OF MATRIMONIAL HOME) BILL (Hansard, 11 July 1975)”. Retrieved 9 June 2011.
^ “How feminists tried to destroy the family”. Daily Mail (London). 2007-01-22.
^ “Domestic Violence Against Men by Charles E. Corry, Ph.D.”. Retrieved 9 June 2011.
^ Fiebert, Martin S. References Examining Assaults by Women on Their Spouses or Male Partners: An Annotated Bibliography. First published in Sexuality and Culture, 1997, 1, 273-286; updated May 2009
^ Malcolm J. George of the Department of Physiology, Queen Mary and Westfield College, London, United Kingdom.Riding the Donkey Backwards: Men as the Unacceptable Victims of Marital Violence
^ WorldCat search for Prone to Violence (accessed April 16, 2010).
^ Fox News article on Erin Pizzey
^ Erin Pizzey’s March 20, 1999 article published in The Scotsman
^ http://www.mankind.org.uk/aboutus.html
^ “Campaigner accepts libel damages”. BBC.co.uk. 2009-04-01. Retrieved 2009-04-01.
^ Adams, Stephen (2009-04-01). “Andrew Marr’s publisher pays ‘significant’ damages to women’s campaigner The publisher of Andrew Marr’s best-seller, a History of Modern Britain, has paid out a “significant sum” in damages to a women’s campaigner after the book mistakenly linked her to the 1970s terror group the Angry Brigade.”. The Daily Telegraph (London). Retrieved 2010-05-02.
^ Rabinovitch, Dina (26 November 2001). “Domestic violence can’t be a gender issue”. The Guardian (London). Retrieved 2009-03-20.
[edit]

“In 2009 Pizzey successfully sued Macmillan Publishers for libel over content in the Andrew Marr book A History of Modern Britain. The publication had falsely claimed she had once been part of the militant group The Angry Brigade that staged bomb attacks in the 1970s.[11] The publisher also recalled and destroyed the offending version of the book, and republished it with the error removed.[12] The link to the Angry Brigade was made in 2001, in an interview with The Guardian, in which the article states that she was “thrown out” of the feminist movement after threatening to inform police about a planned bombing by the Angry Brigade of the clothes shop Biba, “I said that if you go on with this – they were discussing bombing Biba [the legendary department store in Kensington] – I’m going to call the police in, because I really don’t believe in this.”[13]”

darksidecat
10 years ago

Okay, a few points on Pizzey: it does appear that she is a conservative, religious, anti-feminist herself and has always been such. There’s no real evidence that she turned against feminism, but rather that she rejected it from the outset based on misconceptions and her psychological issues from her mother’s abuse (her father was also apparantly abusive, to the children and his spouse, whereas the the mother was abusive to the children). She has in the past blamed violence against women on those women’s participation in the workforce. She also has a habit of making overblown claims about herself (for example, that she authored the first book on domestic violence, which is flat out obviously false, even if one just bothered to look at things like the prohibition movement in the US in the 20th century, or, you know, things like 19th Century books literally entitled “Wife Torture” written all about domestic abuse). So her claims should be taken with a grain of salt, especially on issues where all of the hard data directly contradicts her statments, or certain other people’s reading of her statements (for example, there were in fact public abused women’s shelters in the US in the 60s, such as Rainbow Retreat and Haven House, and even a state run shelter in Maine opened in 67, so claims about her opening the first women’s shelter are easily demonstrated to be false, not to mention the fact that by the time her service morphed from advice and meetings into a shelter, the shelter movement had been in full swing for years). Not exactly an objective source.

Note, my information on Pizzy (as an individual and as to what specific claims she herself did in fact make vs what some conservatives state her claims as, the data contradicting her is from other sources) was primarily garnered from her own website and the linked articles that she wrote, and she has specifically published statements saying she was never a feminist and was always against the feminist movement, despite the fact that anti-feminist sources love to play the conversion story on this one.

Magical Laura
10 years ago

“Magical Laura, that’s all nonsense too, you want to shift the focus away from the violence and agenda of the feminist movement that commandeered the domestic violence movement, on to something else because you support the state violence that is causing people to kill themselves by focusing on splitting hairs about sources.”

Where on earth did you get that from? I don’t want anyone to kill themselves, and I don’t want gender bias in any laws. You’re just shoving words into everyone’s mouth and then arguing with yourself.

“That “Fox news article” was written by a feminist”

How do you get to be a ‘feminist’ then, is it like a club where you get a membership. Cause altho me, Sarah Palin and Valerie Solanas are all self-described ‘feminists’, none of us have anything in common politically with each other than being ‘feminists’.

People say hateful shit in the name of feminism all the time, I remember Ami was talking recently about a really hateful and transphobic article linked on Carnival of Feminists.

Someone just saying ‘feminist!!!’ doesn’t make them my ally.

KristinMH
10 years ago

Bacon. The one kind of meat I still miss.

I guess we can’t get mad at Hook for going off topic, since half this thread has been about either Magyc: The Gendering or nitrate-laden meat products, but really dude. Some lady who founded a DV shelter (good for her!) is also an anti-feminist (OK, whatever)? How is this an argument? For what?

@MollyRen: you asked upthread who you had to blow to get your cheques? The postman, silly! I think I hear mine at the door…BRB!

Yaz
Yaz
10 years ago

KristinMH, you just need to accept that women are a monolith and that if one woman says or does something, it represents all feminists everywhere. The sooner you accept this universal truth, the sooner you’ll come to understand how badly you and every other woman on earth has personally injured Thomas Bell and others like him. And then you can work on making amends and being grateful for all the mammoth that was hunted for you.

/sarcasm

Hook
Hook
10 years ago

Darsidecat, of course feminists are going to compile an ad hominen attack on Pizzey, that’s their main argument, that’s what they do, and feminists using ad hominen and slander is no more an argument than any of the other arguments being presented here today.
Its no more convincing than “wendy mcelroys story was published by fox and the article that was originally published in the scotsman was republished on a site that talks about a possible left wing, radical social engineering project being housed in the gay rights movement, therefore the early history of the shelters movement never happened and nothing Erin Pizzey of any of the other sources says is true”

Its just feminists being true to form.

Captain Bathrobe
10 years ago

Actually, I think Darksidecat has done a rather damning job of questioning Pizzi’s credibility. If you think she’s being slandered, Hook, then prove it.

Tabby Lavalam
Tabby Lavalam
10 years ago

[O]f course feminists are going to compile an ad hominen attack on Pizzey, that’s their main argument, that’s what they do, and feminists using ad hominen and slander is no more an argument than any of the other arguments being presented here today… Its just feminists being true to form.

Are you at all familiar with the words “irony” or “hypocrisy”, Hook?

KristinMH
10 years ago

Of course, Yaz. Silly me, assuming we were all individuals or something dumb like that. Guess the concept of the Hive Vagina is beyond my puny ladybrain.

ithiliana
10 years ago

@Ami: Cards!!

I didn’t want to ask earlier because you were swamped, and the Radical Feminist Beavers of WAR are to die for, but if an Ithiliana card were possible, I’d love one! Roses, witch imagery (CRONES!), cats, esp. BLACK, all good. And mebbe books…

*smooches*

Pecunium
10 years ago

Hook (this seems to be Logic 101 week on Man Boobz).

Ad Hominem means to make an accusation about a person, and then say that accusation discredits the argument; though the accusation has nothing to do with the argument.

1: You think the AKC Standards on the shape of the head for American Collies is bad for them.
2: You own a cat, so you must hate dogs.
3: Therefore you are wrong.

That’s ad hominem. Another ad hominem is to be seen when you respond to darksidecat providing actual evidence about Prizzy with, Its just feminists being true to form.

That doesn’t actually address darksidecat’s evidence, it just says that “a feminist” said it, QED it’s wrong.

So much fail, in six little words.