MRAs regularly accuse feminists of promoting the idea that all women are “perfect princesses” who can do no wrong. Which is a rather silly accusation, as every feminist I’ve ever met is well aware that women, like men, are capable of vast evil. Jiang Qing, also known as Madame Mao, was one of the ringleaders behind China’s bloody Cultural Revolution. Madame Delphine Lalaurie was a 19th century New Orleans socialite who tortured her slaves and performed bizarre medical experiments on them. And then there were Ilse Koch, the “Witch of Buchenwald,” and her counterpart Irma Grese, the “Bitch of Belsen,” sadistic Nazis who tormented the prisoners under their charge and kept grisly “souveniers.” (For more on them and other truly evil women see here and here.)
But today I’m going to talk about some women who aren’t so much evil as retrograde and wrong: the 800 women who have reportedly joined the newly formed Obedient Wives Club in Malaysia, an offshoot of a fundamentalist Islamic organization called Global Ikhwan, previously known for its Polygamy Club.
If you set aside the whole fundamentalist Islam thing — MRAs by and large don’t seem terribly fond of Islam — these Obedient Wives would pretty much represent the ideal women for manosphere misogynists; much of what they profess sounds like it came straight from discussions on The Spearhead or one of the popular MGTOW forums.
According to the Obedient Wives, for example, “disobedient wives are the cause for upheaval in this world” — including social ills like domestic abuse. As one spokeswoman for the group sees it, “domestic abuse happens because wives don’t obey their husband.” Asked by the newspaper The Star if this meant that a wife was at fault if she was abused, the spokeswoman replied with a “yes,” because “most probably … she didn’t listen to her husband.”
But it’s the group’s pronouncements about sex that have caused the most controversy in Malaysia. Apparently Obedient Wives need to be sexual dynamos as well as submissive helpmeets, eager and willing to “obey, serve and entertain” their husbands “better than a first-class prostitute” can. As one of the group’s founders put it at the event heralding the formation of the Obedient Wives,
Sex is a taboo in Asian society. We have ignored it in our marriages but it’s all down to sex. A good wife is a good sex worker to her husband. What is wrong with being a whore … to your husband?
Several days later, another Obedient Wives Club spokeswoman attempted to “clarify” these remarks in an interview with the Malay Mail:
I believe we have been misunderstood and misinterpreted. When we said that husbands should treat their wives like first-class prostitutes, we were not putting wives on the same level with prostitutes. We are talking about first-class elite types, not street hooker types.
So that’s … good, I guess? Although we should point out that actual prostitutes in Malaysia – even those working at “high end” clubs — are treated like shit.
Before all the “American-Women-Suck” dudes reading this convert to Islam and buy one-way plane tickets to Malaysia, I would like to note that there are feminists in Malaysia who think these women (and the men Involved in starting the group) are full of it. Islamic feminists, even.
@DKM:
Here’s my quote from earlier. “Posture all you like about being willing to change your mind about Hockfield’s competence if only she would have MIT not except any government funding (seriously, how are those two related at all?).” How are those related?
“drunken, incompetent white males” Never said anything like that…. How do you get from me being egalitarian to thinking that white males are all drunk idiots? Wouldn’t a true egalitarian think that white males were every bit as competent as the rest?
But of course, all this is bluster, and not actually responding to anything I’ve wrote… So I’ll ask again, in a slightly different way. What evidence do you have that women and minorities are systematically less competent than their white male peers? Why do you think the way you do, and could you convince someone else of your position through evidence rather than assertions?
Darkside, as far as you being a socialist, frankly ,I couldn’t care less!
With Trillions of $$$$ in debt, the manufacturing infrastructure and foundations in utter disrepair, no money, and probably no people any longer capable of servicing them, the, monetary, technological, legal, and every other foundation, of what is left of an economy (and a private property owning, and largely saving and work-oriented middle class) looted to death by parasitic bankers demagogues, and lawyers on one hand, and street vermin, unwed mothers, and the other human(?) detritus of a welfare state run amok since the 1930’s, along with the tax-feeding bureaucrats–and Federal courts- who foisted them on the rest of us on the other, the USSA is inevitably and irreversibly headed for the crapper, and would be headed down there even if the likes of Billary, Bush II ( the Stupid) or “our first blaaaack President” had never even existed! Whether there are more people who “believe in” socialism or not, the label put on this already largely bankrupt welfare/warfare kleptocracy as”socialism” or “capitalism” will be the last thing on anybody’s mind!
Widespread acceptance of socialist ideas and policies made accepting the misrule by the criminal oligarchy
easier, and probably enabled them to pursue policies making the existing–and coming debacles much worse than they otherwise would have been, but you’ll note that I don’t even blame generations of acceptance of socialism to be accountable for the existing bloody mess!
So too, will any notions of of “equality”,which envy-ridden and demagogue bossed sheeple, not all of them een socialists, hold dearly,especially in the economic realm! If somehing doesn’t–and cannot–exist in nature, however, it becomes a little bit difficult to argue that it is some sort of a “right”, doesn’t it?
darkside,, enjoy your popularity! You, along with other such people on “manboobz” and like antimale blogs and websites, earned it!
PEACE AND FREEDOM!!
David K. Meller
kirbywarp–11 June 2011 at 9:35 pm
What evidence do I have that women and minorities are less competent than their white male peers? Only what has happened to us as a nation, as a race, and as an economy since their economic “equality”–or appearance thereof–was enforced by law, White men–as a group–started to be displaced and dispossessed as a matter of State policy, Our industry and technology have fallen apart, our cities are well on the way to becoming unihabitable, and we are a fiscal and monetary basket case on one hand, and also your refusal to support repeal of these laws. At this late date, kirbywarp, I think that you along with many of your colleagues on this site, AGREE with the truth of what I say, and that, on some level, you KNOW that the equality, especially when women are concerned, is totally artificial, and relations between the sexes will renormalize in a family-friendly, economically sound way–men working primarily outside the home, and women working happily, successfully, and prosperously in and around the home, creating a loving and healthful environment for those they love! You may well, on some level, I think understand that the very goal of “equality” is unsound and poisonous, even when race relations are concerned, and becomes absolutely wretched when gender issues are involved, but you don’t have the courage (yet) to admit it! If I was totally wrong there, you would, at least for the sake of honesty, say, what is sauce for the gander is sauce for the goose, he doesn’t want any government or corporate privileges, he wants them all out of the way, come hell or high water…! You would have no argument against my simple proposals advocating repeal of govenment interventions whose enforcement has played a significant role in destroying what was once the greatest country in the world, and to attain ends that are useless when not evil, and evil when not useless!
If they were in fact “equal” in ability, drive, and assimilability, than it would make no difference to an employer (or even to the general public) whether or not one was hired, promoted, or dismissed. Even if a less able (inferior) employee was kept at the expense of a superior one, the inevitable–and very rapid–consequence would be losing money (and customer base) to a competitor hiring–or promoting–the better one.
That this would be going on all the time, throughout the society on all levels, as everyone seeks their own level!
IF “equality” existed, you wouldn’t need the government to foist it upon society at such enormous economic and social costs. and such “antidiscrimination laws would not be necessary; still less the noisy and unrelenting media and church crusades to support such laws, their attendant lawsuits, and threats against even the innocent!, If, on the other hand, equality in fact doesn’t–and cannot–exist, any attempts to impose it impose costs on society that eventually will render the economy and society completely unviable. That is at least a part of what has happened in the past four or five decades! I think that we are coming upon the final phases.
This may not be “proof” that you demand, but I think that, as evidence, the condition of the modern world, especially its premier Nation-State, the USA (or the USSA, as I prefer to call it), as it has emerged since WWII, with the mania for politically and legally imposed equality–the enforced dispossession of White men in favor of females of all races, and nonwhite men–with the consequent social disruption,along with shameful economic impovershment of its productive middle classes, (taking place during an era of spectacular technological and industrial improvement) is rather compelling!
I’ll offer another proposition for you! If White man are totally displaced, the remaining “economy” will come to resemble a third-world hellhole where all commerce, all industry, all, business, and all science and medicine will disappear! If, the other hand, the artificial equality imposed by government, along with its corporate and media lickspittles and renegades, is repealed, and people–inlcuding White Men, seek and find OUR own level, the path that we were so tragically diverted from after 1914–and much more so after 1939–would reassert itself after a generation, and the prospects offered by the best of the 18th and 19th century enlightenment will return, with 21st century industry and technology to benefit us all unimaginably well!!
PEACE AND FREEDOM!!
David K. Meller
Mr. Meller,
You really should take your show on the road. There are people who would pay good money to see it.
@DKM
Alright, so when I exist “what evidence do you have of your views,” your response is “everything?” Really? Oh but it gets better, now I actually agree with you, deep deep down, but I’m just in denial! How many other cliched bad arguments are you gonna pull out of your hat?
I’ve already told you why I wouldn’t join you in abolishing AA policies: bias still exists out there, and through no fault of employees, employers still have the idea in some fields that men > women universally. On a side note, are you claiming that the recent economic collapse is a result of women being allowed to work outside the home? Grah, I’m not gonna be able to stay polite with you much longer.
“I’ll offer another proposition for you! If White man are totally displaced, the remaining “economy” will come to resemble a third-world hellhole where all commerce, all industry, all, business, and all science and medicine will disappear!”
… I will no longer be able to stay polite with you. You are apparently convinced that White Men are the paragon of human kind, and every other toxic, disgusting opinion of yours directly follows. In addition, you are unable to comprehend the notion that skin color and gender does not imbibe the owner with special abilities. You are living in the past, with disproven antiquated biases against your fellow human beings, and nothing I say or do will convince you otherwise. This “conversation” is over. Fuck you.
If anyone has any idea wtf Meller just said, translate it for me and I will rebut it…
I thought I saw something in there blaming bankers on socialism, which can’t be right, but it is too hard to be certain what is going on in that word salad.
@darksidecat:
Basically, White Men have been slowly and systematically being removed from their positions of power starting from WWII by the United Socialist States of America, which has caused all of our current economic woes. If only white men could reclaim their jobs, and women could lovingly stay locked in the kitchen, all of our problems would be solved! (Presumably all minorities should be deported or hired to work on fields for no pay… I dunno, he hasn’t really expounded upon that….) If not, White Men will be eliminated from buisnesses, and the US will collapse into a hell-hole with no technology or medicine.
Oh, dear, I think I hurt somebody’s ittie-bittie feelings!! I’m Soooooo Sorry! C’mon, manboobyz, let me kiss it and make boo boo all better!
I did you HONOR by talking rationally to you, talking to you like MEN, discussing our differences thoughtfully and (I hope) intelligently, and even gave you a chance to work with me with a very simple offer, while holding on to your cherished beliefs regarding equality! Sometimes I might have been a bit snappish, or said something out of turn, but the meaning was clear to anyone who could read English!
You find it difficult to remain polite? I have said nothing discourteous to you people! If my ideas disturb you, that is YOUR problem! Check your premises! There is nothing about anything I said here that should make anyone–least of all, not men–unhappy! You, however, are not men, just boobz.. My Mistake! I’m sorry!
I would have been glad to offer supplemental literary and research material to support my viewpoints–both regarding racially based, and gender based inequality- if requested, but there is no point to citing anything now, since any references to e.g. Michael Levin, Phillipe Rushton,Charles Murray, Madison Grant, Lothrop Stoddard, Jared Taylor, Samuel Dickson, Thomas Sowell, Samuel T. Francis, and Richard Lynn, for starters, Their conclusions regarding the race issue differs from mine in some respects, but we share common adversaries here!
On Banks, especially central banking, and resultant economic disruption (and yes, such banking practices have facilitatied the rise of socialism in many countries) again for starters–Eustace Mullins, G William Domhoff, Henry Hazlitt, Murray N. Rothbard, Ron Paul (who has personally made a thirty year study of the Federal Reserve) Antony C. Sutton, Elgin Groseclose, Ludwig von Mises, and Amasa Walker, again for starters.
Feminism and “equality” for women–Helen and Aubrey Andelin, Phyllis Schafly, Nicholas Davidson, Midge Decter, (quite a few women popping up, aren’t there) Bryce Christiansen, Allen Carlson, C.H. (Max) Freedman, Florence King,, and no doubt a dozen or so others for starters! Again, some of their conclusions differ from mine, regarding perfect relationships between the sexes, but we share common adversaries!
I couldn’t suggest that you read any of them because you would probably have a breakdown, if not an apoplectic stroke,if you were ever exposed to simple, clear, and honest fact! Your belief in “equality” is a fraud, perpetuated by people (and interests) who do NOT hold your well being close to heart! They will skin you alive for laughs, and the same people who have pushed feminism on us, are up to no good elsewhere as well!
You can lead an ass to water, but you can’t make him drink!
If you don’t defend youselves, even verbally (and largely anonymously)on the internet, you “men” would be useless in the coming struggles anyway! Enjoy your thumb sucking! Go back to your pacifiers, your sandbox, and your independent “strong womyn”! I have more important things to do! Your reactions showed that I can’t even feel angry at most of you “man(?) boobs–just pity at being so fragile that simple disagreement–over something that, after forty or so years, we really shouldn’t disagree anyway–drives you all into a tantrum! Go back to sleep!
Nighty nite, little ones….
Given his use of !s to end every! single! sentence! I think we should call him Megatron from now on xD
Yeah, I might’ve known he was a Ron Paul fan. Dumb as bricks, the lot of them.
Still, he was moderately entertaining. It’s always refreshing to see an unrepentant racist.
Yeah, I think you could garner 2-bits a head at your average freak show.
And suddenly I am all men on manboobz! I… have.. THE POWER!
@DKM
“I have said nothing discourteous to you people! If my ideas disturb you, that is YOUR problem! Check your premises! There is nothing about anything I said here that should make anyone–least of all, not men–unhappy!”
“If White man are totally displaced, the remaining “economy” will come to resemble a third-world hellhole where all commerce, all industry, all, business, and all science and medicine will disappear!”
I, being a white man, am actually being offended at your insinuation of white male supremecy. Imagine that… And you say you HONOR me by talking to me RATIONALLY like a MAN. Wow… So yes, devolve into mocking and patronizing slime… Rattle off a bunch of authors without actually saying anything about why you believe what you believe, and write a novel for every post. Better yet, characterize my opinion as the opinion of the entire forum, and instead of addressing me personally, instead attack everyone who hasn’t spoken to you. That oughta show how mature you are by comparison.
This is exactly why I said the “discussion” is over, if ever there was one before. All you’ve done is spout out drivel from the start, and if I bring up a point, you instead go on a slightly-related tangent without ever discussing the issue. That’s not an intelligent conversation, dude, its just spewing a bunch of crap.
Though I gotta say, it still is very well presented crap.
BTW, CB, I love your new Avatar. Somehow it matches your personality on this these threads beautifully.
This is what I love about manboobz – I come here and I find out that Someone is WRONG on the internet!”
But then I realize I don’t need to tell them! Because someone else already did! And I can just sit back and enjoy the carnage 🙂 *makes popcorn*
No, I am all men on manboobz! And so is my wife!
I like how his reply to Kirby was basically a giant Gish Gallop xD He still hasn’t articulated what he believes either (esp about race, I guess he’s afraid of how he’ll come off xD ) and his “I dun believe everything they say” without elaborating what means he can wiggle out of nething even after ppl spend their time dealing w/ the Gish Gallop xD
@Johnny Pez
I’ll just leave this here then.
And anyone who claims that Phyllis Schafly is for equality for women is lacking in competence in basic knowledge period.
I also wonder if he noticed that the rise of right wing America caused the marked decline in the US since the late 70s.
Elizabeth – As a pretty die-hard democrat there’s a big part of me who would like to blame it all on the right-wing, but I think that some of the right-wing’s ascendance is in response to not because of the decline. I think a lot of it has to do with forces and trends beyond the reach of either political faction.
Of course as a die-hard democrat I definitely think right-wing reactionism has made the problems WORSE instead of better 🙂
@Plymouth
Well, at least according to DKM’s reasoning, since the right has come into power during the time the economic disaster struck, obviously the first caused the second. And all of it started after WWII… Yeah…
DKM: Could you explain exactly why you felt the need to add three extra a’s to the word “black?” What exactly were you trying to convey here?
PEACE AND FREEDOM!!!!11!!
Actually, like the GD, the problems of the 1970s that have led to this mess were a mix of a lot of things but one consistent theme: right wing politics.
Of course I am a politician so…
So, Meller is basically just shouting “people of color and women are naturally inferior” without of course proving such a premise, then he expects us to just jump on his blatantly racist misogynistic worldview? Guess what, we reject your premise that people of color and women are inferior. Anything you build off of that will not impress us.
As to banks, you do get that socialism means not capitialism, right? At the very least, it means that. Banking is an essentially capitialist venture-it deals solely in capital, for the purpose of generating and concentrating capital. Also, the US has not had a centralized federal bank since the late 1800s (though we did have one off and on for a good hundred years-including the very early years of the US). Is this some sort of long term meta plan where we carefully orchestrate a federal bank, have it dissipate, wait a hundred years for private banks to fail, and then…profit? That is an NWO level conspiracy theory right there.
Also, I really do not give a shit about economies except insofar as they increase the general welfare. Living as an abused slave with a few rich people down the street is not more appealing to me than living as an abused slave with only more poor people down the street. Production to meet the needs of the people and to preserve their collective wellbeing is the only thing needed out of an economy. An economy that only serves rich white dudes is useless to me. Meller has cast me in the role of slave in his little plantation fantasy (as I am not a man-genderqueer-I am not totally white, and I am not rich), why the hell would I ever go along with such a system? Because the mythical economy (which is not supposed to work for me and mine anyways) might collapse and make me end up…still with more rights and better off than I would be as an objectified slave class member?
@David, I think the extra aaa’s are supposed to convey the extra racism.
Thanks, kirby. All the other pics I wanted to use were NSFW (for language, mostly).
@David, I think the extra aaa’s are supposed to convey the extra racism.
I thought he forgot the Baa, baa part of baa baa black sheep the MRA version could possibly go
Baa,baa black sheep have you any wool?
Yes sir,yes sir three bags full.
Only three bags, you lazy little bitch, and you are naked so you deserved to be raped you slut sheep.
Xtra, that’s fab! MRA nursery rhymes are a rich seam of comedy.
“Little Bo Peep has lost her sheep and doesn’t know where to find them,
That’s what you get for passing affirmative action laws allowing incompetent women access to men’s careers such as animal husbandry,
Bitches.”