The Men’s Rights subreddit on Reddit is awash in mini-manifestos. My favorite of the most recent batch, a rousing 3-part rant running under the title “Do not fear them!”
Who is “them,” you ask?
Women who might just decide that they don’t really want to have sex with some dude who keeps going on about how men are the most oppressed group in the world.
Responding, apparently, to a comment in an earlier thread suggesting “that being publicly vocal about the way men’s rights are trampled on and ignored is a great way to lose the opportunity of getting laid,” manifesto writer Kuppers argues that it just ain’t so — but when it is, just bite your tongue for as long as it takes to get into her pants.
He starts off with a strange variant on the notion that there are plenty of fish in the sea. If you feel that women won’t want to have sex with your Men’s-Rights-espousing self, Kuppers suggests, it’s
because your brain was conditioned in a small communal/tribal setting. A group of angry women was a serious threat to your prospects of reproduction. As you know, women often act like herd animals, and view acceptance and appreciation from their peers of their choice of man to be important. This is completely moot today. There are millions of fish in the sea.
Aside from that final truism I have no fucking idea what he’s talking about. I don’t recall growing up in anything that might possibly be considered – literally or figuratively – a “tribal setting” ruled over by a group – sorry, a herd – of “angry women” hell-bent on keeping me from reproducing. Is this a common experience? Also, I have precisely zero interest in “reproduction.” Indeed, I sort of make it a policy to only have sex with women who are at least as interested in preventing reproduction as I am.
On to point two in this curious document, which is that ladies love dudes with strong opinions:
Women, while they do not always explicitly say so and sometimes contradict so, sincerely do appreciate a man who has strong internal beliefs and principles, and does not compromise that for the sake of assuaging someone else’s sensitivities, including theirs. A man who is willing to pretend he is something he is not, isn’t attractive on a deep masculine level to women.
True, up to a point, but you might want to keep all that shit about women being angry reproduction-threatening herd animals to yourself. That might not go over so well on your first Starbucks coffee date. Or ever. Protip: Misogyny aside, very few people want to get with people who refer to sex as “reproduction.”
But if your desire for sex outweighs your manly desire to be truthful about your obnoxious beliefs, well, that’s all good too – if by “all good” you mean “you can still have angry sex with women you despise if you just keep your pie hole shut for a few hours.” Or, as Kuppers puts it in his third and final point, which he apparently doesn’t realize completely contradicts point number two:
The kind of woman who a) wants you to be subordinate to her crazy foaming feminist nonsense, and b) has no tolerance or patience for your concerns, is not worth anything more than a cheap, well-protected fuck anyway. Fine, keep your mouth shut for the couple of hours it takes to get her into bed, but you’d be mad to pursue anything more serious with a woman like that.
Men’s Rightsers – such romantics at heart!
Okay, while ppl are humouring him, I’m going to ask ppl to go up and read my question if you haven’t 🙂 For one, I’m actually taking the answers honestly rather than dishonestly xDDD
Secondly, you will get cat points for answering it! 😀
REALITY CHECK TIME!!
If a man truly believed the patriarchal lies about women’s sexuality, then he would see it as an act of love to control his daughter’s sexuality.
There was no such thing as “raping your wife” until the late 20th century. Up until then it was a man’s right to do whatever he wanted to his wife’s body, including beating. If she was showing signs of unhappiness, it was because she was a hysterical and irrational woman, and a man SHOULD “chastise” her to correct her behavior, just as you would spank a small child. As before, it could have been seen as an act of love.
Is it really impossible to both love your mother AND expect her to be your servant?
Here Oaf devolves into incoherence — where did this little thing about incest come from? In any case, it’s the same old, same old thing. Patriarchy is a system. People operate within it. Some men really did love their wives and mothers and sisters, but patriarchy restricted them in how they expressed that. Suppose they wanted to express their love by helping Sis start her own business? Uh uh. Not happening. Show your love for Sis by finding her a nice man to marry and be dependent on. That’s love. Business are for brothers and fathers, regardless of the desires of the individual men and women caught within the system.
Yeah, you NEED to continue pretending that this is what feminists thing. You NEED your imaginary feminists to justify your idiotic, misogynist bullshit. You NEED to keep telling lies about feminism, just like our violent little friend, Mral, or else the the whole edifice of your discombobulated belief system will be crashing around your ears. So I won’t be expecting any true statements about feminism from you.
Again, I ask you: WHY DOES IT MATTER TO YOU WHAT A WOMAN’S MOTIVATION IS FOR CHOOSING ONE OUTFIT OR ANOTHER?
Your next question makes no sense again, women dress to attract attention men don’t. I simply doesn’t do anything because men’s seuality is their words and actions. If i dressed in a thong as women do than perhaps a woman might have reason to object to my attire.
You didn’t answer my question. It’s not up to you to decide whether what you wear is acceptable. You describe it to me, and I decide. Now, how do you dress, and what is your motivation for wearing that clothing?
If you’re having trouble answering, I personally like a guy in a simple T-shirt and jeans, the tighter the better. If you say you wear T-shirts and jeans, it means you want to be raped and you’re a hypocrite if you complain about it.
If I had a girlfriend is a stretch of the imagination, sweet. (quite the pedestal you place women upon, as if a womans approval of me is how I am rated as a person).
Not really. I can’t imagine you getting a boyfriend either.
I’ve had more than several g-friends and I’ve actually turned down sex with a few. Again I kinda like that old fashion loyalty thingy. I’m such a backward human being, Stupid slave with his stupid morals.
Again, no answer to my question. What would you do if one of your many girlfriends liked to talk to men? How about if she flirted with other men? If she told you to dress differently because she didn’t like the attention you were getting from other women, what would you do?
I know, I know, men’s attractiveness is in their “words and actions.” Okay, what if your girlfriend told you to talk and act differently to make yourself less attractive? Would you do that?
MRAs make me want to be a WGTOW 😛 I know there are plenty of awesome, sane, non-misogynist men out there but I’ve become just a tiny bit paranoid of coming across an MRA/PUA while dating. Quite frankly, my guard is up even more now. Thanks MRA/PUA types…you bitch about how women are cold and rude…well it might be the result of your constant disrespect and hate for them. Seriously, go your own way. On an island. Or preferably a different planet. Weed yourselves out of society so we don’t have the distaste of coming across you in person.
I dont visit Reddit, does anyone ever call them out on their bullshit?
and in regards to Kuppers idiotic plan to hide his woman hate in order to get laid: it’s called body language and vibes. Most people can sense when someone is bitter and distasteful to be around. It’s hard to hide and chances are he’ll let some of his anger and sexism slip before he gets her into bed. I pity any woman who comes across this creep (oh noes! there I go with my shaming language! creepcreepcreepcreepcreep!)
Ami, no man will go clothes shopping with a woman and stay in the dressing room to give her opinions unless he really likes her.
I like how the women who answered differently to him he just ignores xD No wonder he doubts all studies and stats ppl give him, cuz THAT’S HOW HE OPERATES xD
Given that this is a place filled w/ feminists (fat, ugly, winged, horned, haloed, etc etc xD ) I’m amused that he can’t even believe a couple could be an exception to his unifying theory of everything xD Nope nope… WHAT I KNOW IS WHAT I KNOW CUZ IT’S EASIER THAN GOING OUTSIDE!
xD
G-friends (if it’s not alrdy) is a great name for a brand of vibrators and other smex toys btw 😀
I care about how I look and I own 50+ watches. My wife cares about how she looks and owns 50+ pairs of Fluevog shoes.
Neither one of cares about attracting sexual attention from the opposite sex. I love watches and she loves Fluevogs. It’s that simple.
Ami: You mean alll the women who answered him. *sigh*
O_O and yes… yes it is…
Wait, Men don’t dress for attention?
Gosh, I must be hallucinating all of those new clothes and shoes that I got recently. I need to see a therapist.
(I bet that NWO will ignore this post and continue to trumpet about what individual women say to use for his broad brushstroke of all women)
Hee hee, I’ll bet NWO keeps a big list: “Who have contradicted my genious theories and therefore I must ignore:” It will eventually contain every member of this forum, and he’ll start asking questions, get about 100 answers, and respond “Really? Nobody wants to answer? You feminists really know how to treat a slave, don’t you?”
I would. I have strong opinions about clothes, and I like having opportunities to be judgmental about them.
I went to my University’s graduation ceremony yesterday. I corrected a number of men about how they were wearing their jackets (quit fastening the bottom button, people!) and helped one guy tie his tie.
Spearhafoc, I stand corrected and willingly admit that I engaged in a shameful generalization.
That said, as an amateur and adhoc stylist myself, my hat’s off to you sir. Thank you for making the world a better place.
Nobinayamu, I still think he likes her. Not many guys would do that.
MRAL: You are saying (apart from what the stylist did to her hair) that this photo, and this photo are “gross”?
I mean dude… WTF? I can see saying you don’t find her attractive, but “gross”. Have you no aesthetic appreciation?
You stand by everything you said in the groping thread. So, since you’ve not responsded to my comment about hardships I assume you are telling me you have more understanding of hardship than I do. That no one here has had it worse than you. That the wrong sort of hello on an elevator is, in fact, at least as bad as someone committing a physical assault?
Because that’s the content of what you said. That and you reserve the right to pass judgement on everyone else’s personal history; but we have to take yours as gospel truth.
You aren’t it the NWO category, or the EWME one: where something really special is required to make me respond to your bleatings, but until you start to own your shit: i.e. defend your words (and by defend I mean support with arguments, not mere assertions), or admit to having spoken out your ass, there’s not much slack.
You insulted a lot of people. You keep casting yourself as a special snowflake, abused more than any other, an Omega; who is somehow wronged that Alphas and Betas don’t treat him like an Aplha.
So… own your shit. Accept your miserable place in life, or admit that the “Greek System” is a pathetic justification to cover your personal lack of social skills.
Look at what you say about women. Substitute some other minorities in the locutions you use. Ponder what Malcom X would say if you were spouting the sort of crap about women, about blacks.
Step outside. Robert Burns said, “o’ wad a gift the Giftie gie us, ta’ see oursels as others see us”.
Just try, for a little bit, to see what you say, as if you were a woman, and it was being said about you.
Because really, I’ve got better things to do than keep trying to show you how your attitude is fucking you up.
I could be baking bread, digging in the garden, on the phone with my girlfriend (or my fiancée), riding a motorcycle, cleaning a rifle, sharpening knives for someone, mucking out a stable or digging a latrine, all of which seem to be a lot more useful, and pleasant.
Everyone of those is rewarding.
@redlocker Congratulations! Welcome to womanhood! 😀 Here is a complementary gift bag you get with membership complete with poison lipstick, a number to the police false rape reporting hotline, a small cheat sheet on how to take men for all their worth, and the sekrit feminist designed girdle we designed with special high tech fabrics (srsly, do ppl honestly think Mamie denied sex to Dwight to create NASA to go into space? xD )to keep in all the fat until marriage. 😀
As you are a converted member, 20,000$ will be deposited into your bank account for you to rectify your unfortunate inferior status.
David, me too.
1) Have any of you women ever gotten free stuff from men? Drink, movie, meal, jewelry, anything?
I suppose I have. My husband gives me gifts or takes me out on occasion. Uhm, but I also give him gifts and take him out on occasion. Same has been true with the other relationships I have been in. When I was earning more than the man I was with, I tended to take the larger part of the bills for dinner, etc, when they made more, then it tended to go the other way. Usually, the first couple of dates were dutch, and then after that it was whoever had done the suggesting/planning (which, again, was 50/50 over the long haul). So was my husband a total user when I supported him through his two stints of joblessness? I’m sure you’d say I was a total user when he supported me through grad school…
2) Have any of you ever worn skimpy clothing, make up, perfume, ect? If so why? And don’t tell me to feel good aboout yourselves unless you do these things when you’re alone in equal proportions.
Yeahp, I have certainly got dressed to go out dancing. Actually, I pretty much ONLY wear perfume when I’m alone, and not for anyone’s benefit (not even a man’s) because I am not allowed to wear perfume at work and my husband has about the least sensitive nose on the planet. He can never tell I’m wearing perfume. I wear it FOR ME. As for dressing up, I tend to wear heels/dresses to work, even though it is not required and I work with *gasp* all women most of the time. And stop telling me that I am lying about what women really do when I am a woman and am telling you my own experiences.
3) If you’ve had/have a steady boyfriend/husband and he like to talk to other women and flirt would that be ok? If said boyfriend/husband said I don’t want you wearing revealing clothing/make up, ect because it attracts other mens attention, what would you tell him?
I have a lovely husband. I have no issue with him looking at other women (frequently, I point the really pretty ones out to him if he was looking the other way). We both consider playful flirting to be a lovely social lubricator when mingling, I have no problem with him talking or flirting with other women. Two of his very best friends are women. Yay, my husband relates well to women! I can only see this as a plus in my world.
If my husband told me that he thought that the way I was dressing was unbecoming in some way (too garish? too tight? unflattering?), I might ask him how he meant and consider making changes, but ‘you are attractive to other people’ would not be considered a reasonable critique for modifying my clothing, nope. However, my husband has never had anything but praise for how I dress, how I apply cosmetics, and how I comport myself.
Also, he too is a snappy dresser, and this too pleases me! He likes to dress up to go out.
And hooray for the lovely taste of others here. BPAL and Fluevog 4-EVAH.
So far it’s pretty unanimous 😀 (along w/ my friends I’ve asked elsewhere) :3 Ty so much to everybody who answered (and you can still answer if you want! :D) I appreciate you humouring me amidst everything going on 🙂
1) Have any of you women ever gotten free stuff from men? Drink, movie, meal, jewelry, anything?
Sure. Sometimes I even buy things for men I know. It’s called gifts.
Honestly, I wouldn’t feel comfortable in a relationship where my partner paid all the time, even if he was okay with it. Deeply ingrained psychological need to feel like I’m contributing equally to any relationship, you know?
2) Have any of you ever worn skimpy clothing, make up, perfume, ect? If so why? And don’t tell me to feel good aboout yourselves unless you do these things when you’re alone in equal proportions.
Yeah, cause I felt like going swimming, and the department store was fresh out of non-skimpy swimsuits for women. They always are, you know.
3) If you’ve had/have a steady boyfriend/husband and he like to talk to other women and flirt would that be ok? If said boyfriend/husband said I don’t want you wearing revealing clothing/make up, ect because it attracts other mens attention, what would you tell him?
My last boyfriend was actually trying to get me to wear clothes that were more revealing than I would like. I pretty much told him that I wasn’t taking fashion advice from a guy who couldn’t be bothered to expand his wardrobe beyond t-shirts and baggy pants.
@NWO
Since it will always be a man asking a woman out (a woman flirts with a man to get his attention). The man will pay.
My wife asked me out on our first date. And she paid for it.
Feminism, FTW!
I’m late to the game, but Ooooh, questions! Can I play?
1) Have any of you women ever gotten free stuff from men?
Yes, my dad give me stuff and buys me dinners when he comes to town, my uncle sends me a couple dollars on my birthday (I wish he wouldn’t), and my grandpa (when he was living) always gave me gifts and candy. But I think what you’re getting at is whether any guys who wanted to sleep with me have given me things, and to that, also yes. I’ve gotten a thing or two from guys who wanted to impress me. And I’ve thanked them for those things. And I’ve bought stuff for guys too. I actually bought my current boyfriend a car, because he needed it and I could afford it.
2) Have any of you ever worn skimpy clothing, make up, perfume, ect? If so why?
I wear makeup when I need to so I can look “professional.” I don’t wear perfume anymore because I’m sensitive to it and a lot of other people are too. I’ve worn lingerie for various boyfriends over the years, in the privacy of our own homes. I wear bathing suits sometimes when I’m at the beach. If I wear a shirt that’s a little more low cut, or a dress or a skirt, it’s usually for one of a few reasons, such as: Because it’s flattering on me, because I’m dressing up for an occasion and the outfit is appropriate, because I am trying to look nice for my boyfriend. Sometimes I wear shorts and a T-shirt because it’s stinking hot out and it’s painful to bundle up.
3) If you’ve had/have a steady boyfriend/husband and he like to talk to other women and flirt would that be ok?
I actually had this problem with my boyfriend at the beginning of our relationship. He’s very good friends with one of his ex-girlfriends, and I didn’t quite trust that it was over. (Now I do.) I just had to bite my tongue for the most part, or risk being a shrieking haridan or a nag. I basically made a pact with myself a long time ago to leave any relationship that isn’t working for me, but not make things worse by jumping to conclusions when I don’t know what’s going on.
If said boyfriend/husband said I don’t want you wearing revealing clothing/make up, ect because it attracts other mens attention, what would you tell him?
Fuck you, crazyman. Or: What did you do with my boyfriend!?
Seriously, he wishes I would dress up more often. I think he was originally attracted to my prissy librarian style; now he wants to witness the hair coming down and the glasses coming off a little more often.
Oaf isn’t really interested in why women do anything they do. He all has the answers he wants, he just has to tailor what he observes to fit those answers. Him and that other empty little creature all ready know what they feel to be everything they need to know about women, when in reality all they know is what they and others have made up to allow themselves to feel superior to women. They claim to be hated for being male when it’s obvious to anyone but themselves and their ilk that if they are hated, they’re hated for being vile, twisted and deficient in every aspect that makes a human being fully human.
Also, whether a woman dresses in a sexy manner to get men’s attention or not is irrelevant.
Why?
Because a woman dressing sexily does not ever, in any way, justify her being harassed, groped or raped.
Being a self declared slut does not in any way mean that said slut is required to endure abuse, harassment, groping, or rape.
How can I say this more plainly? Women are human beings, and as such they get to choose with whom they associate, who gets to touch them, and who gets to have sex with them.
Why is this so hard to understand?
Sexily dressed women may give you a boner. Good for you. That in no way entitles you or anyone else to treat these women in a way that is disrespectful or hurtful.
Seriously, how fucking stupid are you, NWO?
Men don’t dress for attention??? I must hae hallucinated all those J-guys staring at hand mirrors and reflective surfaces, fixing their hair while wearing expensive brand-name clothes. C’mon, they aren’t floofing their hair and dressing in Armani for shits and giggles. They’re either hosts or just engaging in good, old fashioned nanpa. Either way, trying to get female attention.
I don’t wear perfume or skimpy clothing. I almost always wear makeup, even if I’m not really going anywhere. I just prefer the flawless face. If I’m especially tired, sometimes I don’t, even if I’m just popping to the store. Just depends. My face isn’t tons different with or without. But here in zee tropeeks the spf 25 in my foundation, as well as the powder (keeps face from getting oily) are quite nice. (Btw, I use bare minerals and it doesn’t really melt, if someone needs unmelty makeup.)
Finally … who wants to bet mral will be back with another name/identity tomorrw?
Ties are my nemesis.
Ami proves her awesomeness once again. 🙂