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"No I won't read your literature … bitch!" and other thoughts on female fiction from the dudes of The Spearhead

This better not be written by some dame!

So Esquire magazine recently posted a list of “The 75 Books Every Man Should Read” on their website.  Esquire being Esquire – that is to say, a men’s magazine that had its glory days in the era of Mad Men and that seems to be aimed mostly at old farts (and aspiring old farts) —  only one book of the 75 was written by a woman.  (That’s 98.67% male, for those of you with lady brains who can’t do the math.)

The internet being the internet, some people noticed that the list was a wee bit heavy on the dudes, even for a men’s magazine, and pointed this out. The bloggers at the Joyland Publishing blog suggested that while the books on Esquire’s list were “mostly fantastic,” it might behoove men to pick up a book or two written by a woman once in a while. And so, with the help of some of their readers, the two assembled a list of “250 Books By Women All Men Should Read.” (Why 250 and not, say, 75? Because they got a lot of suggestions.)

Here’s a little one-question quiz for you all: What title did W. F. Price at The Spearhead give his post on the controversy?

A) “Some Great Suggestions for Books by Women You Guys Might Want to Read.”

B) “Did You Know There Are Female Authors Besides The Chick That Wrote Harry Potter?”

C) “Feminist Publishers: Force Men to Read Women’s Lit”

Yep, the correct answer is C, of course.  Apparently a couple of bloggers suggesting some books by women that men “should” read  is some kind of Gestapo-like imposition upon men by “Feminist Publishers.” Price grouses:

[I]it strikes me as rather mean-spirited of females in the publishing industry to denounce even ineffectual efforts to introduce men to literature. By all accounts, publishing has come to be dominated by women, and men are reading far fewer books than women these days. Given this state of affairs, you’d think that the women in the industry might be a bit gracious and let the boys pick and choose which titles interest them.

But of course that won’t do, because feminists must find fault with any and everything men are involved in. …

The implication [of the Joyland Publishing blog post] is that men should be forced by political pressure to read female writers (sometimes these feminists come off as whiny, annoying girlfriends complaining that “he just won’t listen to me!”).

Or, you know, it might just be that the writers of the blog post, and those who wrote in with suggestions, really enjoyed the books in question and thought that dudes might just enjoy them too.  Sort of like when a friend tells you that you should totally watch the movie Dogtooth, because it is so fascinating and creepy and awesome. Or when I tell you right now that you should go watch Jane Austen’s Fight Club on Funny or Die.

Naturally, the comments from Spearheaders were even more ignorant and obtuse than Price’s post. The basic theme: Bitches can’t write for shit (as far as I know).

In case you think I am offering an unfair characterization of the, er, debate, here’s one Spearheader’s contribution to the discussion:

when a man says “no, I won’t read your literature”, you have to respect that, bitch.

And another’s:

I basically do not read anything a wimminz has written, not even in my favourite genre of science fiction, because every single time I have tried they have been unmitigated fucking crap full of feminazi girl power bullshit and emotional baggage and basically very little hard SF…

And still another’s:

I never read anything written by women unless it happens to be instructional and related to work. Pretty much all the fiction I’ve ever read is by and for males. If I read some non-fiction for fun it’s always got a male author. I realized a while back that my cd collection is about 98% male. When I was a kid I never thought about it, it just came naturally. Now that I’m older I intentionally avoid anything by women.

It’s always,er, instructive to see what some random guy who apparently reads mostly instructional manuals has to say about the literary controversies of the day.

There were, of course, more thoughtful analyses, like this earnest comment from the excitable, exclamation-point-happy David K. Meller:

Women write for an audience of their own level–to wit themselves! Most men are simply too intelligent to be interested in what passes for literature scribbled by women! …

Correct me if I am wrong, but is most woman’s “literature” one more kvetch klatsch of women–or girls–getting together to complain about, to defeat, or to evade the workings of us evil, letcherous, abusive, horrible M-E-N! There is no point in men reading such drivel …

There may be better days coming; when women are once again taught the arts of pleasing men, in their creating a comfortable environment for the chosen man in their lives, and when they again will use their ability to read to discover new and better ways to do this, and their ability to write to communicate these truths to others of their sex! Until that happens, literacy for women, much less dominance in authorship, editing, and publishing has been, and is, a BLOODY MESS for everyone, especially men!!

PEACE AND FREEDOM!!
David K. Meller

Yes, women should really only be allowed to read and write if they are reading or writing instructional manuals on how to cook and give better blow jobs, possibly at the same time.

PEACE AND FREEDOM!! to you too, good sir.

Speaking of which — the blowjob bit, not the PEACE AND FREEDOM!! — the commenter calling himself dragnet suggested that young men such as himself were simply too busy to read much of anything. They have other priorities:

The vast majority of my reading is for work, research, and classes. …

Frankly, I’d rather be getting laid than reading a novel after a grueling work week. The three or four hours I sometimes have free on the weekend when I’m not working or working out or sleeping or eating, I’d rather be out with my friends or getting serviced by whatever girl I’m with at the time.

It is a truth universally acknowledged, that a single man in possession of a penis, must be in want of some girl to service it.

PEACE AND FREEDOM!!1!!

Anyway, ladies and manginas, any good lady books you want to suggest for the dudes of the world?

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Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
13 years ago

Stephen King is a very good writer who is snubbed by stuffy literary retards because the material is “mainstream”. His best books are, or will be, classics.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Also, Stephen King is an SF/horror writer who writes good female characters, and he’s JUST a little prolific. So I don’t think it’s that rare.

ummm, regardless of the number of books he’s published, it’s still only one data point, so it doesn’t disprove the rarity.

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
13 years ago

No worries Fatman.

And honestly, most of what Stephen King is crap that sounds good. At least that is the best way to describe it. There are exceptions: Bag of Bones was amazing.

Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
13 years ago

KING’S BEST BOOKS/SHORT STORIES

– The Shining (this was adapted into a movie by Stanley Kubrick, best film director of all time)
– The Stand
– Rita Heyworth and Shawshank Redemption (adapted into one of the best movies of all time)
– Stand By Me
– Misery
– The Long Walk

He is good, people.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Currently, the Vegas over/under on MRAL making a repulsive degrading personal insult in a given number of comments is 1.5. I am taking the under.

Nobby
13 years ago

Well, you also said they weren’t literature, and many would disagree with you. Those being the Hugo Award, Locus Award, University of Maine, National Book Foundation, O. Henry Award, and a decent few others.

Sorry for that misunderstanding, though.

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth
13 years ago

Stand By Me was actually a short story called The Body.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Bag of Bones also had some pretty strong feminist undertones, in my view. Also, some pretty harsh misogynistic scenes.

Actually, now that I think of it, most of King’s work is pretty strongly feminist. Although until someone tells me differently, I kind of suspect his female characters are always less than realistic.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Well, you also said they weren’t literature, and many would disagree with you.

well, zombie opinions are mine own. I still like most of his books though.

Lady Victoria von Syrus
Lady Victoria von Syrus
13 years ago

OK, color me interested.

It’s really good! The good news is that no one gets cancer or the common cold anymore, because of engineered viruses. The bad news is that these viruses combined to form the Zombie Virus. George, Georgia, Georgette and Barbara are very popular names, thanks to George Romero, who taught people how to survive the zombie apocalypse through his movies. The main character and her brother are fairly popular bloggers, as bloggers have replaced a lot of the functions of the mainstream news media (most people lost faith in the MSM when news reports always insisted that outbreaks were pranks or isolated incidents; only the bloggers were the ones talking about ‘WTF? ZOMBIES!’). It’s a pretty good analysis of what life would be like in the generation after the first zombie apocalypse, when zombies are just a way of life now.

Her other series, the October Daye novels, are also pretty good. The main character is a changeling private investigator, which is probably no sillier than a wizard detective.

Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
13 years ago

ozymandias, it seems like a lot of people aren’t super keen on Erikson (kind of like King) but personally I find his scope kind of amazing. His ideas and his ability to tie together such huge events are similar to GRRM’s ASOIAF, although I think GRRM is a better writer in terms of prose.

In fact, let me suck GRRM’s dick even more. Best fantasy writer EVER, unquestionably better than Tolkien. His books are frankly amazing and his prose is at the level of the greats. A Storm of Swords is among the best novels I’ve ever read, and I’ve read a lot.

amandajane5
13 years ago

Okay, so female characters in MRAL’s top six? The wife in The Shining and the crazy lady in Misery? Surely I’m missing some – I know there aren’t any in The Body, but I haven’t read most of those in over 20 years.

Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
13 years ago

Right right right, it was called The Body originally. The MOVIE was Stand By Me. I forgot. It’s been a long time.

Nobby
13 years ago

Also, leaving out all of the Gunslinger? That’s just criminal.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Well, you also said they weren’t literature,

Whether I agree or not, I have sometimes thought that “serious” critics main problem with King is that “serious” authors take much longer to write, agonizing over each word, each syllable, and thus that an author who doesn’t do that cannot be serious.

Also, genre fiction can NOT be serious.

Mr. Kobold
Mr. Kobold
13 years ago

Stand by Me is a movie based on the short story The Body.

MRAL are you the grocery-store literature version of those guys I’ve met at shitty jobs who, instead of reading the Bible, watch Bibleman videos instead?

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

taught people how to survive the zombie apocalypse

we’ve never really forgiven him for that, you know.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

Okay, so female characters in MRAL’s top six?

The Stand is filled with female characters, including the “Good” avatar, Mother Abigail.

Nobby
13 years ago

I’ll agree he is prolific, but I can’t really see that as being a real detriment. It’s like saying that Da Vinci wasn’t good because they he so much art.

Also, you’ll have to explain what precisely you mean by ‘genre fiction’, definitions I know are way to lax for sweeping statements like that.

Nobby
13 years ago

Also, editing fail ‘because he made so much’.
Still horrible grammatically, but whatever.

amandajane5
13 years ago

Ah, well that’s good – The Stand I have not read, but I’m pretty sure I’ve read all of the others.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

The Stand

although it also inspired kind of a weak song by The Alarm.

zombie rotten mcdonald
13 years ago

what precisely you mean by ‘genre fiction’,

I have always understood it to mean things like Science Fiction, horror, detective novels, romance…

Now, before you get out the chainsaw, I am perfectly willing to stipulate there are awesome books in all of these categories. Please understand I am describing what I have seen from the serious critics.

Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
Men's Rights Activist Lieutenant
13 years ago

My top female characters? I’d have to think about it. I don’t like female characters a lot, because so many of them are really annoying. There are some good ones though. The narrator of To Kill a Mockingbird was very convincing. I’ll be back with a list later.

Avicenna
13 years ago

Bookwise?

I am a fan of the Honor Harrington universe.

Although currently murdering myself by attempting to read the entire Wheel of Time saga by Robert Jordan (Why! this is masochist!)