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| Women in groups: Always trouble. |
One of the strangest places in the burly world of Men’s Rightsers and MGTOWers is The Spearhead’s Shieldmaidens forum. And no, I am not making that name up. It’s a forum, essentially, for women interested in being a sort of Women’s Auxiliary to a bunch of guys who are all about hating women.
Given that such a role – trying to help dudes who don’t much like you or your whole gender — is a bit of a tricky one, the forum moderator Hestia has written a long introductory post explaining just what new gals should and shouldn’t do to support their menfolk. It’s kind of a masterpiece of doublespeak. Let’s look at some of its highlights.
Hestia starts out by warning the ladies that these rough men sometimes talk in a rough manner:
As this is a male environment, us girls can expect styles of communication that we might not use ourselves or readily relate to. For the purpose of this post, I will call all of this “locker room talk”. … Topics and expressions women may find crude are likely to occur and generalizations about women (or white, western, whatever) used to adequately get a point across. These differences, while bothersome to some women, are not wrong in and of themselves and are not reason to shame men into expressing themselves differently. As women in the locker room, we are the ones who need to look the other [way] and make accommodations; not the men for whom this website is for.
In other words: the guys here may call you sluts and whores and worse, but really, that’s your fault for being here in the first place, so don’t complain.
Welcome aboard!
Hestia continues:
We must also respect this place as one of the few politically incorrect sanctuaries that men have in today’s misandrist world. … We should not be bullying men into saying, “yes, indeed not all women are like that!” to appease our own egos. … This is sacred male friendly ground and should be treated as such. … We are but guests on this website and must know our place and respect certain boundaries for the sake of the men here and for the work towards gender peace.
Hard to be more abject than this. So how have the menfolk responded?
It appears that not too many men actually read the Shieldmaidens forum, but among those who do, the reaction has been a little less than enthusiastic. Our friend GlobalMan, one of the more excitable Spearhead regulars, basically tells her (and all women) to fuck off entirely:
I have voiced my opinion many times women should be banned all together from here. They are contributing nothing and they are taking up a lot of time and energy of the stupid young men who do not realise that women are just attention whores who won’t actually do anything at the end of the day. ….You women pretty much fuck up everything you stick your nose into. And you never, ever tire of fucking things up for men under the delusion you have ‘something to contribute’. You don’t. Get over it. You pop out babies. That is your one and only ‘claim to fame’ and it used to be enough for a man to love a woman for her whole life and to provide for her and the kids. Now it is not. So you women need to ‘act like men’ and suck it up.Indeed. If women had any class at all you would leave of your own accord and let the men sort out what you refused to. The only posts from women here should be ‘Men, please tell us what to do’.
A fellow calling himself Diogenes offers his two cents:
That Hestia has to write this thread proves that indeed women who come to this board do exactly that which she complains against. They have such a cozy and male-coddled life that they are shocked when some men rightly express their scorn and foul language towards their attitudes and manipulative behaviour. Women BREED misogyny because all they do is constantly manipulate and get the attention and protection of men by trying to look sexy all the time. Every time a man turns his head towards a pretty lady, she knows she is being looked after and will be rescued by a man if ever her poor little ass does something stupid. They are CHILDREN at heart. One female college student mentioned to me how according to her “every girl” has gone on dates just to get free dinners. How much more proof do we need that women are NO GOOD WHORES?
I guess that’s some of the “locker room talk” Hestia was warning the ladies about.
Granted, it’s been awhile since I’ve seen the inside of a locker room, but I don’t remember much of the talk in the locker rooms I’ve been in revolving around the no-good whorishness of all women. I think that might be because most men are not in fact hateful assholes who think all women are NO GOOD WHORES.That’s just a theory though.
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> but nobody wants to address the inherent sexism of a single gender institutionShow me where you're advocating that the Catholic Church, the Mormon Church or conservative Judaism should extend ordination rights to women who want them, then I'll take you more seriously.
>Tit-No.Again, you are being purposely obtuse and trying to argue that an women's abuse shelter should allow men in simply because to do otherwise is sexist no matter how many times she (and others) explains it to you why banning men from such a place is a good idea.These places do not have the time, nor the resources to verify whether or not the man at the gate asking for admittance is an abuser or not. They also cannot determine he is not a wannabe James O'Keefe or Lila Rose bent on exposing the shelter to the world and ruining the hidden nature of the shelter. So the simplest and easiest way of dealing with it is to ban all men.Now you have all the reasons why you should stop demanding we open up shelters to men except of course for the obvious fact that you are a jackass trolling (albeit in a less obvious manner then NWOslave.)
>@IonUh, no… Was there actually someone that tried to do that?"I'm willing to bet that if you looked into the personal histories of commenters here, you'd find a lot of social outcasts and people with emotional/psychological problems."You seem to be implying that a person being a social outcast or having emotional/psychological issues is enough reason to disregard what they're saying.As a matter of fact, I do have social and psychological issues. My current therapist has been swell, however, and I'm starting to come to terms with the ghosts in my past. With luck, I may become a responsible adult one day.IMHO, there's more shame in not being willing to admit you have a problem than there is in having problems to begin with.
>LadyYep, you are right, I agree. But it still doesnt allow us to escape the fact that certain ways of thinking in regards to shelters are sexist and discriminatory. I am just wondering how we can ever get to the point where this is not necessary. Obviously the reality is that equality doesnt work in these situations(presently).
>A bunch of long comments got caught in the spam filter and are up now. Sally, not sure why the spam filter decided to start eating your comments, but I made it spit them out. T4T, you know that public bathrooms are segregated by sex, right, for some of the same reasons that shelters are? (Safety, privacy, etc.) Do you consider this sexist? Or do you recognize, as everyone else in the world seems to, that in a few very specific instances gender segregation makes more sense than a unisex approach?
>Maybe you could start by LISTENING AND ABSORBING what women are telling you as to why it is the way it is and stop showing us how little regard you have for any of our opinions. Then you could spend your subsequent free time advocating for solutions that address abuse.
>DavidTell me why in a world of equality would it matter if we pee and have a bowel movement in the same facility? Equality is the final outcome, right?
>Golly, now I am thinking of Larry Craig and I have NO idea why.
>Shorter Tit for Tat:"I own a horse."
>If bathrooms actually did become unisex, I wouldn't be surprised to hear a lot of men whining that the tampon/pad quarter machines threatened their masculinity.
>"I own a horse." Win.
>T4T is evincing a concern for eliminating sexism that he has not demonstrated before. Why the sudden concern, T4T?Do you also regard the existence of OB/GYN clinics as sexist? Are you outraged about the Army's insistence on barring women from "combat roles" (not that there's a big difference between combat and non-combat roles nowadays)? If not, why not? Boy, it takes a lot of work to get you to respond to a few simple statements and questions. Why is that?
>I also wonder if, in his heroic pursuit of all equality, all the time, he goes onto Catholic or Mormon forums and agitates for women to be ordained. Or perhaps if he tries to convince Hasidic Jews that their practice of dividing the sexes during services is sexist. Or if he writes letters to the Department of Corrections explaining how sexism is bad and therefore prisons should also be mixed gender, for the good of everyone.
>LVvS:While it's true that T4T does seem absolutely unable to absorb your point no matter how many times it gets explained and rephrased and that he continually replies by just repeating the same thing, you shouldn't have compared him to a six-year-old. Insulting someone is never a good strategy, even if it's an understandable comparison.
>Gee, Cboye, thanks for the nifty tone argument. WAnt to lecture us on the proper way for us laydeez to keep our legs crossed, too? Fuck a duck. That's what you get annoyed about.
“We must also respect this place as one of the few politically incorrect sanctuaries that men have in today’s misandrist world”
I loathe how often these people use the word “misandrist,” especially when applied to the entire globe. I guess they forgot about how girls and women are treated in places where they have male child privilege (which has led to female fetuses being terminated and female babies being abandoned), thus creating a gender ratio imbalance in countries that practice this. Then there’s the whole thing about women needing their male family member’s permission to travel or get a job (in this case, even a woman’s son has the authority to tell her if she can or cannot do something).
Yep, the world sure is “misandrist.” Not.