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>Comment of the Day: Child support is worse than rape

>

Er, not so much.
Sometimes this job is just too easy. Sometimes I don’t have to even bother to check in on my favorite manosphere sites to find hair-raisingly awful quotes to feature here. Sometimes the Boobz are thoughtful enough to leave them in the comments here. 
Take this quote from resident MGTOWer Cold, who currently seems to be spending more time on this blog than I am, comparing rape and child support. (You don’t think these two items are actually in any way comparable? Clearly you do not understand Boob Logic.) 
In response to commenter Amused, who pointed out that “being ordered to support a child you’ve fathered isn’t the same as being pinned down and penetrated against your will,” Cold responded:
Exactly, it’s much, much worse. The latter lasts for some number of minutes, the former for at least 18 years. Given the choice it would be a no-brainer for me, and I think a very large number of men agree with me on this.
Setting aside the appalling trivialization of rape as something that’s over in “some number of minutes,” what does this say about Cold’s attitudes towards children? Paying a couple of hundred buck a month to pay for some of the expenses for a child you fathered – your own flesh and blood – is worse than being raped?
If Cold ever becomes a father, through circumstances which are frankly too horrible to imagine, I feel safe in saying that he will not be winning any “father of the year” awards. 
I can just imagine the following scenario, some 11 or so years into the future: 
EXTERIOR, MOVIE THEATER

Cold’s 10-year-old son: Happy Father’s day, daddy! I’m so glad we’re going to see Toy Story 5! I love Woody!

Cold: Yeah, so does your whore mom, if you know what I mean.

Son: Huh? 

Cold: When you get older, you’ll understand. Did I mention that you mom’s a whore?  One, please!

Son: Um, daddy, why did you buy only one ticket? 

Cold: It’s for me. Get your own. You get enough of my money as it is. I stick my dick in your mom for two fucking minutes, and I’m screwed for life. It’s worse than rape! 

Son:  Um, daddy, I don’t have any money. I’m ten. 

Cold: Well, you should have thought of that when you were a sperm! 

Son:  When I was a what? 

Cold: I’m going in. See you in two hours. 

Son: Dad? What am I supposed to do now?

Cold: Not my problem!  I’m Going Galt! I’m Going My Own Way! You were a MISTAKE!

Son quietly sobs 

Cold: Hey, when we get back to your mom’s place later, remind me to tell her she’s a filthy whore. 
And … scene!
(By the way, Cold actually does claim to be going Galt, if self-admitted tax evasion counts.)
If you enjoyed this post, would you kindly* use the “Share This” or one of the other buttons below to share it on Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, or wherever else you want. I appreciate it.
*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.
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Johnny
9 years ago

>Now there's a movie I'd see. I bet it would be better than Sucker Punch.

Billy Ray
9 years ago

>Wow those MRA's are crazy Boobz. I heard one of them once compared children to "invaders" and said that it was okay to KILL your children if they interfered with your "liberty".Oh wait, that wasn't a MRA. That was a tenured feminist professor.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Defense_of_Abortion

Yandie, Goddess of Pickles.

>The argument makes sense if you consider that many MRA type dudes don't see much in the way of self-identification beyond their own monetary value. Hurt my wallet, hurt me.

Ozymandias
9 years ago

>Hey Yandie! I didn't know you read Manboobz. Small world. :)Billy Ray– Well, I sure as fuck have the right to remove an unwanted presence from my own personal body. Bodily autonomy is inviolable. You have a right to an abortion the same as you have the right to not donate one of your kidneys– even though you don't need it, it would save a life, and it is way less strenuous than a pregnancy.

ScareCrow
9 years ago

>Uhm, what is GALT?

David Futrelle
9 years ago

>Scarecrow, I think you mean "Who is John Galt?" It's from a book some lady wrote.

Elizabeth
9 years ago

>Galt is a company in Arizona that does payday loans (or did until that law expired.)

Ozymandias
9 years ago

>"Going Galt" is removing your productive capacity from society in the hopes this will lead it to topple and be replaced with a society more to your liking, based on Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand.

DarkSideCat
9 years ago

>@billy, I suspect you have never read Jarvis-Thomson's actual paper. It is available online in full here http://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/Phil160,Fall02/thomson.htm

johnnykaje
9 years ago

>I tell you what, this gentleman has colored my perception of all Phoenix Wright cosplayers.

johnnykaje
9 years ago

>Basically, going Galt is the adult version of going home and taking your ball with you. Only less effective.

Joe
Joe
9 years ago

>But David, you "cherry picked" that quote!

Yandie, Goddess of Pickles.

>Hey Oz, yeah, I'm a new reader 🙂

NWOslave
9 years ago

>This is a shameful article David Futrelle. You have literally called this man a poor father, a lout, loser and scum of the earth in a fictional future conversation.Bravo, well done. Be sure to twitter all your friends to show them the how fair and equal they'll be treated.

Sandy
9 years ago

>Cold was the one who said supporting children is rape. David just imagined the comedy that would come from such a belief.

Ozymandias
9 years ago

>Yandie, stick around! This place is the best for stress-relieving screaming-at-teh-st00pids.Speaking of–NWOslave, he just said that child support is worse than rape. That's right: he said that paying a couple hundred a month is worse than a crime that makes some women have flashbacks and intimacy issues and nightmares and sobbing YEARS later. Rape is the ultimate dehumanization, and the lack of empathy it takes to not get that shows that he is a lout, loser and scum of the earth– no mocking required.

Sandy
9 years ago

>Oh I also like how he misses that you cannot choose to be raped over paying support. If you choose it is no longer rape.What he's saying is he would prostitute himself to get out of paying support. And frankly, most people's prostitution price is probably lower than the sum total of 18 years of child support.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>No he didn't Sandy, he maliciously attacked someone who did NOT say supporting children is rape. I've read what he said. He said it was as bad as rape, as in being financially raped while being denied the "right" to equal custody, instead of the "right" to pay for a child or be incarcerated.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Tell me the Bradley Ammendment if fair.A veteran of the first Gulf War who was captured in Kuwait in 1990 and spent nearly five months as an Iraqi hostage being arrested the night after his release for not paying child support while he was a hostage. In other words right now there may be US soldiers in Afganistan as captives. They risk death and their reward is if his wife divorces him while captive he will be incarcerated if he escapes alive.A Virginia man required to pay retroactive child support even though DNA tests proved that he could not have been the father. "The 1986 Bradley Amendment to Title IV-D forbids any reduction of arrearage or retroactive reduction for any reason, ever. This reinforces the approach that inability to pay is no excuse. Needless to say, there are endless stories of men who are now crushed by a debt they will never be able to pay because they were:In a coma In jail Medically incapacitated Lost their jobUnder the Bradley Ammendment there is no excuse not to pay, tell me how this is "fair?"

Elizabeth
9 years ago

>"Exactly, it's much, much worse."He clearly said paying child support was worse then rape.

e4919700-4d45-11e0-bbf3-000bcdcb8a73

>Rape is the ultimate dehumanizationI always thought genocide or murder was, but live and learn. I guess we can't all be smart like feminists. Is it any wonder 3 in 4 women avoid feminism like the plague?he is a lout, loser and scum of the earth– no mocking required. Oh the irony! I'm sure the feminists will defend her or at best silently condone this hypocrisy, but then most feminists live in a perpetual echo chamber – they never, ever question one of their own.Shine on, you nutty feminists, shine on.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Under current no fault divorce a woman who commits adultery is able to divorce her husband and retain child custody. Is this fair?Under current divorce law a woman gets default child custody, as can be seen by the fact that a man has to "fight" for equal custody. He will lose 83% of the time. Is this fair?Under current no fault divorce if a man "contests" this atrocity he has to pay for both his lawyer and hers only to lose and be horribly in debt. Is this fair?

e4919700-4d45-11e0-bbf3-000bcdcb8a73

>I'm sorry, wrong link. Here it is.

Yandie, Goddess of Pickles.

>Was it a question of fairness? I thought the debate was whether it's comparable to rape. Fair? No. Should the custody and support laws need work so as not to be biased based on gender but focus more on who is actually a more fit parent? Heck yes. Does the financial hardships endured by some men (because there are many men who are cool with their financial obligations toward their children) warrant this hyperbolic comparison to a very real, very traumatic violation of ones' physical and emotional self? I'm thinkin' no. Not so much.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>As you sit there in all your smug, righteous superiority, right now there are men in prison whose only crime was losing their jobs in a depressed economy. Because as the Bradley Ammendment states, there is NO excuse not to pay.Let me elaborate on the fate of these 10s, if not 100s of thousands of men. They lose their drivers license, they go to prison for an average of 6 months, the State continues to pay their exwives while they are in prison, (on average $200.00 a week). When they are released from prison they will be $5600.00 in debt, no drivers license, jobless, penniless and a criminal record. All for the crime of being poor. And the best part is, their own taxes paid for their incarceration. Maybe they'll even get raped for real while in prison. Why don't you wish that on cold, hehe, wouldn't that be funny.Talk to me again about the equality of feminist jurisprudence, when you can explain to me how what I've just written is "fair."

e4919700-4d45-11e0-bbf3-000bcdcb8a73

>traumatic violation of ones' physical and emotional self?Like becoming a father against your consent, losing your child, and then having to send a check each month to a woman you hate and a child who hates you? That lasts for far longer, and it's enough to drive many men to suicide. One feminist claimed that the abuse of the family court system is completely the man's fault for "sticking his junk in a woman he didn't trust" and not getting a vasectomy. Some of the feminists here actually defended that statement and claimed it was self-evident to anyone except MRAs.

Raoul
9 years ago

>@Yandie: "The argument makes sense if you consider that many MRA type dudes don't see much in the way of self-identification beyond their own monetary value. Hurt my wallet, hurt me."I love it. Hurt my wallet, hurt me. An anti-slogan to fling at the greedheads of the Earth.Pithy and to the point.

Marissa
9 years ago

>@ estringmass rape can be part of a genocide.

Captain Bathrobe
9 years ago

>Re: the Bradley Amendment:Please provide the names of these guys or STFU. The Wikipedia article is poorly sourced. It's based on a letter some guy wrote to a Congressional committee, which provided no names nor cited any actual cases.

Ozymandias
9 years ago

>What's annoying is that I agree with you! Custody should be equal between men and women, and if you're broke you shouldn't have to pay child support (unless the woman is broke-er, of course). I just don't think it's as bad as rape, is all. Mr. String: Fine. Rape is AN ultimate dehumanization. Happy?Also, there's some bare facts of biology here, i.e., men cannot get pregnant. Until the development of a male birth control pill, using condoms EVERY TIME and choosing to date women who would choose abortion if they got pregnant is the only path for a man who fears pregnancy.And I bet if you asked most of those 3 of 4 women whether they wanted to work a job, not be sexually harassed, have good body image, not be raped, etc., they would support it. Feminism has an image problem, not an issues problem.

Captain Bathrobe
9 years ago

>Please also see a recent post on Pandagon, in which Amanda Marcotte decries jailing people for failure to pay child support.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>No…Yandie, Goddess of Pickles. Men are not "cool" with their obligations. They want equal custody but that is DENIED by feminist LAW. By LAW their obligation is to pay while being DENIED equal custody or they go to JAIL.So you see, Goddess. Men are NOT "cool" with that, they have a gun to their head.

Lady Victoria von Syrus

>I do think it's silly and counterproductive to send parents to jail for not paying child support. Child support is supposed to be in the best interests of the child, and having a parent in jail certainly isn't in the child's best interests. However, that doesn't mean that child support is unfair by its nature; nor does it mean that it's as terrible a crime as rape or even assault.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Pregnancy is a biological function Ozymandias, A woman does not perform anything "extra" to achieve pregnancy. Women don't even know they're pregnant unless they miss their period. Most don't even realize it for months. She didn't have to do anything to achieve pregnancy.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Tell me is abortion as terrible a crime as rape when a father is denied the right to a live child?

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Oh yes Lady Victoria von Syrus…sending a man to prison for being poor is "silly." Oh how harsh your words, tone it down a little.

DrewskiDaMan
9 years ago

>There are many "deadbeat moms" too. Although I prefer to label them with a more accurate, and correct, term: "poor moms".I have custody of my child. I am a single father and the mother has paid child support a total of one time. She paid $30 and owes over $8,000. I bought half an outfit with the money the mother has provided over the last 5 years.Many men incorrectly labeled as "deadbeat dads" are really just "poor dads". Think about it, let's say you make $100 a week doing odd jobs, or whatever, and the custodial parent makes $1,000 a week. You are ordered to pay $400 a month in child support. Are you going to be homeless and hungry and cold and live in dangerous bum camps so that you can pay all the money you earn so as to not be a "deadbeat"?

Elizabeth
9 years ago

>It is awfully feminist to have the best interests of the child when determining custody…*goes back to reading about this guy*

Ozymandias
9 years ago

>Drewski: I agree! That sucks! It's just… not worse than rape.NWOslave: You don't have the right to a live child. It's my body. I have to live here, dude. If I don't want a kid in there, I don't have to have one. You don't have a say.Not only is pregnancy insanely dangerous (look up "health risks of pregnancy" if you don't believe me), that also has nothing to do with my argument. It doesn't matter if pregnancy is as painless and harmless as taking a piss. Men can't get pregnant, so they have no say in pregnancies that happen in, you know, SOMEONE ELSE'S FUCKING BODY.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Elizabeth… Was that supposed to prove some kind of purity of intention about how feminists are so about childrens welfare?Try looking up the stats on infantcide and child neglect that cuts across all financial boundaries. Surely you know 80% of these crimes are commited by women. Wheres that good old maternal instinct?

DrewskiDaMan
9 years ago

>Men can't get pregnant, so they have no say in pregnancies that happen in, you know, SOMEONE ELSE'S FUCKING BODY.Sounds reasonable, but if men don't (and shouldn't really) control a woman's body, why do women feel the need to control a man's body? Going to jail for being poor is completely and utterly controlling one's body, is it not?

Yandie, Goddess of Pickles.

>Agreed that jailing over non-support is a stupid tactic that doesn't help anyone, and does more harm than good. I don't know how support is calculated in the U.S. but here it's based on taxable income, so the situation Drewski describes ($400 a month on $100 a week income) while not unheard of, seems to happen a lot less.I will concede that there should be much more level playing field when it comes to custody negotiations. There should also be more room for divorced parents (those ones, mothers AND fathers, who can see beyond their anger and think about the child's best interests) to negotiate custody/support arrangements without being penalized from a legal standpoint. I've seen situations such as the one Drewski described, and yes.. it's fucking bullshit. Here's the thing.. There are custodial mothers getting fucked over by non-custodial fathers who don't pay support, quit jobs and work under the table to get out of paying support (here, with the income based tables) nor are they interested in more access to their children, even when it's offered.There are custodial fathers with non-custodial mothers pulling the same bullshit.There are non-custodial fathers working their asses off to pay exhorbitant child support fees and are still denied access to their children because of the bias in custody laws.Although I don't hear about non-custodial mothers being denied access to their children, I wouldn't be surprised if it happens as well.The system does not encourage civil mediation (in this case I mean civil as 'Hey, let's not act like fucking babies about this' as opposed to civil in a legal sense) in support and custody cases. Yeah, that's a big problem. But child support itself being inherently evil? It's based on an idea that both parents are obligated towards a child's upbringing. It's a fucked up system that decided that the mother's obligation is to raising the child where the fathers is a solely financial obligation.

chocomintlipwax
9 years ago

>"Like becoming a father against your consent, losing your child …"Wait wait wait wait wait. So you didn't want it, but now that it's in the world, it better damn well be yours? And don't try to backtrack and say that these are two separate scenarios when the full sentence clearly shows that this is a linear progression of events. This is something I've seen multiple times and always bugs me. The guy "didn't want to be a father," but then when the kid is born he's pissed to fuck that he doesn't get sole custody. Because none of this is about the little human being that needs to be loved and cared for or even "father's rights." It's all just about ME ME ME ME ME MY COCK ME ME ME ME ME and sticking it to that bitch who made herself get pregnant after I blew my load in her.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>@Ozymandias, it is not "your" body, it never was. The instant of conception the zygote travels down the fallopian tube for about 5 days and connects itself to the uterine wall. It is separate; it always was and still is. It is connected to a womans body much like an IV bag is connected to a person during an operation. No one would ever say that bag of solution is, “part” of their body, it is simply connected to them, and it is separate.There is no one alive was not a zygote, fetus, ect. If a fetus was, “part” of a womans body it would always remain, “part’ of a womans body. Your arm is part of your body, it always was, and barring an unforeseen accident it always will be, a fetus was always separate. A mans seed fertilized the egg; it is; “part” of his body as well, yet it is separate. When a child is born it is equal, “parts” of a man and woman, yet it is separate because it always was.When a woman contemplates an abortion one day and changes her mind the next, does the status of that fetus change from dead to living by conscious choice? Did it change from being an, “unwanted” dead, disposable fetus to, “my baby” by conscious design? The most abhorrent manifestation of modern society is the denial of rights to the completely helpless and totally innocent unborn child. The right to simply live.Right now you are part of your mothers and fathers body, can they now kill you? Tell me when does that seperate being finally have a "right" to live? Today it's a "fetus", tommorow, "my baby" the next a "fetus" again. Back and forth all on a womans whim. Tell me, are you God that YOU created life from nothing? It is not "your" life to give or take it never was, that child was always seperate, the culmination of a man and a womans genes. The hypocrisy staggers the imagination.

Johnny
9 years ago

>It can't exist without her, and could potentially kill her. I'd say these things make it, if not part of the body, then a parasite. Just as one can choose to have a tumor removed or not, one chooses to carry it to term.

NWOslave
9 years ago

>Yes Johnny…Its a fucking parasite. If thats the case it always was and always will be a parasite. Tell me Johnny, are you a fucking parasite?

Cold
9 years ago

>Ok, let me get this straight. In a hypothetical future where my vas deferens re-canalize and I become a father as a result, and somehow also develop a severe case of whore Tourette's that compels me to use the word in every other sentence, I will pay money to see a kid's movie by myself???I also had no idea you only spend 15-20 minutes a day on this. Obviously that figure can't include the time you spend lurking around on MRA forums.

David Futrelle
9 years ago

>NWO, so you're outraged that men have to pay child support … but you also think you should have the right to force women to carry a fetus to term. All right then. Do your feelings about zygotes carry over to your feelings about sperm and/or eggs?

SallyStrange
9 years ago

>NWOSlave, you're so right! That's why I always refer to abortion as an eviction. After all, this separate human being which has its own rights is perfectly free to pursue its interests… just somewhere outside of my body. If it can't survive outside my uterus, well, that's not my problem. It is a separate human being after all. [/sarcasm]Seriously though, yes. The only thing which transforms a blastula or a fetus into an "unborn baby" is the eager anticipation of a willing mother. She has the power to create it or kill it. If she doesn't want it then it's just a fetus. If she does then it's a baby. It is rather god-like isn't it? Hence all the womb envy.

Johnny
9 years ago

>NWO, it's interesting that you think the state of matter cannot change in the way it's perceived, treated, etc., based on its circumstances and relation to other things.

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