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| Lara Logan, shortly before the attack |
There has been an astounding amount of vile shit posted on the internet about the reported sexual assault and beating of CBS reporter Lara Logan in Cairo’s Tahir Square. I spent a depressing hour or so the other night looking through hundreds of comments on the Yahoo news message boards; it was a virtual festival of misogyny, racism, victim-blaming and simple nastiness. A sample (each quote is from a different comment):
don’t put some nice white pu55y near crazy @#$% arabs. it’s like goddamn king kong
Kinda’ like sending a woman reporter into a locker room? Don’t ask me to feel any kind of remorse for her. Equal rights demands equal responsibility
it started as a revolution and turned in a black spring break! mwaa ha ha
She loved every minute of it.
I could multiply examples ad infinitum; the last I checked there were more than 1500 comments on the one Yahoo news story I looked at, and most were of this sort. The only slightly encouraging sign? Most of these vile comments have more downvotes from readers than upvotes.
You expect this kind of behavior from the Yahoo message board crowd, which has never been very big on civility, or even basic human decency. Typical anonymous internet assholery.
Leave it to the readers of The Spearhead, though, to take commentary on this sad case to an even lower low. Yesterday, Spearhead head honcho W.F. Price published his own, predictably victim-blaming, take on the subject — essentially blaming feminists for encouraging women to report the news in the same dangerous places that male reporters go. (When Anderson Cooper was attacked, you didn’t hear anyone suggesting that men shouldn’t be covering the events in Cairo.)
I think that’s a supremely tasteless way to use this tragedy to push an antifeminist agenda. But the comments to his article, roughly 270 of them at last count, are far worse — rarely bothering with even a pro-forma expression of basic human sympathy, some blaming and even mocking the victim, and most using the case to crudely push an assortment of their own misogynist agendas. Here are some of the worst; I present them without comment, as they pretty much speak for themselves. I have edited some for space reasons; you can follow the links to read them in their entirety.
Alucin explained about how rape allegedly benefits its victims:
When I studied in university a woman claimed to have been gang-raped. After telling the story, she acquired a certain authority. She was at the top of the feminist hierarchy …. Her word was gold because of her rape.
It was never even verified if she had in fact been raped.
It’s a harsh thing to say, but the woman at university gained immensely from the rape, or her rape story-telling, with this increased stature. She probably wouldn’t have gotten into that very small degree program without the rape story to tell to the admissions committee.
At school, no one, especially a man, could ever challenge her about any subject, however remotely related to rape. …
Rape against men or women is a tragedy, but I also find it sickening how “survivors” or their “friends and supporters” often use their status for personal gain. … It’s the same thing when feminists politicize breast cancer.
Opus added:
I agree with Alcuin: In my experience women wear RAPE like a badge of honour or military medal (as I presume Ms Logan will now do). I, of course, never believe word of it, and I notice most guys these days are equally sceptical. There may be an increasing Rape epidemic but no one I know is a Rapist. Funny.
Confused declared that he didn’t give a shit:
No group on earth is more privileged that American/western women.
I won’t waste my time any more worrying about their safety, or lack thereof, due to their choices.
intp took it a step further:
Don’t believe her. Don’t care. I hope the Arab guys didn’t catch anything from her.
That is what the non-stop lie called feminism has done to me. Vive la nihilism.
Rebel offered this highly original take on rape:
I don’t see the point here..
According to feminist orthodoxy, humpteen gazillion women are raped every day. This one is the humpteen gazillionth plus one for that day.
Women are raped if you have sex with them, women are raped if you don’t have sex with them, women are raped even if there are no men around. …
Every time two animals are copulating, a woman feels raped. There are more rapes on earth than there are hydrogen molecules in the universe.
To women of today, rape seems to be the highest achievement, the Royal Road to Success.
I’m laughing so much I might get a hernia, my belly is aching from the laughter.
Papa Smurf suggested the reported rape was a great career move, and ended his comment with a smiley:
she’ll be a CBS news anchor in no time. great way to get promoted.
I dont know if she genuinely didnt want what just happend or maybe feminism has affectivly blinded her and rendered her stupid. Blonde western women in the arab world are like all you can eat restraunts to fat people. Just help yourselves 😉
Troll King posted a long rambling diatribe against “western women” in the Middle East, of which these remarks are only a small portion:
*yawn*
Typical feminist/western woman(as if there is a difference) acts like her typical bitchy self in a place that won’t tolerate it. ….
The fact is that women, western cunts, think they can go into a culture and act how they want and treat the poorest of the poor not just like “help” or a but like a slave that should be lashed for simply flirting. I bet these rapists look who do this probably thought she would act towards them the same way white women act towards brown and black men on western tv. Like he was a stud….
But, umm, like yeah dude. That is so hurrible I might go and cry a river.
The Contrarian Expatriate took victim-blaming to a new low:
Sounds like she got what she set herself up for. You can yell, “I am woman, hear me roar!” all you want in the Anglosphere, but step into the 3rd world behaving that way and they will pound you (no pun intended) back into your place.
Again, as is generally the case with the comments from The Spearhead that I quote here on my blog, these are not weird outliers in the discussion there. Unlike the comments from Yahoo I quoted above, all of the comments I quoted from The Spearhead got multiple upvotes from readers there, in most cases several dozen; none had more than a handful of downvotes. Alucin’s comment about the benefits of rape — a comment surprisingly similar in spirit to an infamous quote on false rape accusations from Catherine Comins, an assistant dean at Vassar, that still raises hackles from antifeminists two decades after it was uttered to a Time magazine writer — got more than 80 upvotes. There is more than a little irony here.
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>wytchfinde555It's no surprise that many feminist men are probably the creepiest men of all. Many may use feminism to get closer to women with the "I'll protect you" stance. Such like a creepy old man telling a girl that he will drive her safely home. Then we have the ones who like to watch naked men whack off while getting milk poured on them.
> Many may use feminism to get closer to women with the "I'll protect you" stance.Okay, that made me laugh. Thank you. And…er… what's wrong with watching men whack off while having milk poured on them? It's a little weird, but transubstantiation is waaaay creepier.
>If it was a woman masturbating while having milk poured on her on stage, it would be female oppression, objectification and degradation of women. But when it's a male, well there is a double standard
>Oddly enough, my "trolling" on the 200+ comment thread he mentioned (it's the one with the santa picture) resulted in the feminists coming up with several well-researched and cogent responses (none of which came from him, admittedly) and even Wytch, the MRA, acknowledging at least one of the points they made. I may have been a bit harsher than usual, and for that I do apologize; recent events in my own life have made me a good deal more sympathetic to the MRAs than I was before. If Tri considers that "trolling," though, I consider it quite a bit more likely that Tri is simply a fool. In any case, however, this is Mr. Futrelle's blog–if he feels I've been trolling or disruptive for whatever reason, he can simply ban me at his leisure. The fact that he hasn't, however, would seem to indicate that perhaps the issue is all on Tri's side.Anyways, on to Richard's points:True, but the absence of cheering, men being docile and apologetic has led, in part, to these anti male laws being passeed. That may be so, but this is something of a false dichotomy–you don't have to be docile, quiet lapdogs *or* angry and rage-filled. You can take action without being so hateful, and you can be moderate and considered in that action without rolling over.Two things. One, I don't recall praising in any way the violence that occurred to this woman. If I did please point it out and I'll concede my error. Two, when men praise the Sodini's of the world, instead of outrage by women it should be viewed for what it is. Men feeling desperate.In response to point 1, I admit you haven't, to your credit, but I was referring to many of the MRAs who have, such as for instance Arpagus. The problem with your second point is that feminists can use the exact same argument–whenever someone like Marilyn French says something hateful about men (despite the fact that the quote itself is of dubious provenance, as our host mentioned in the other thread), feminists would say, "don't condemn her! You men should watch out! You've pushed us women this far!!!" Remember, what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.True, but being docile little boys won't get us anything but patronized.Perhaps so, but as I said above, this is a false dichotomy–you don't have to be docile lapdogs *or* rage-filled crazies. There are other paths.
>nickI'd bet that the guy who masturbated while having milk poured over him is happier then you are. He has the art community expectance. You have a thousand or so bitter guys circle jerking on the internet. Faceless and nameless. A so called movement where no movement really exists.
>If it was a woman masturbating while having milk poured on her on stage, it would be female oppression, objectification and degradation of women. But when it's a male, well there is a double standardBut that wasn't your point. Your original point was mocking Kave for attending a performance where that happened, as if there was something wrong or shameful about it and Kave had somehow lost credibility as a result.
>"I'd bet that the guy who masturbated while having milk poured over him is happier then you are. He has the art community expectance"How is he happier than me? I am perfectly happy here."You have a thousand or so bitter guys circle jerking on the internet. Faceless and nameless"The feminism movement is a 100 times bigger. You have 10 million or so bitter women circle jerking on the internet. Faceless and nameless.Oh, I am forgetting, feminists love their double standards even that they preach for equality at the same time.Its okay for a woman to complain about men at any place at any time but when it's a man, he must be condemned immediately.Around of applause for feminist bigotry
>Lady vicThere is nothing wrong with having 2 points to a problem
>@ NickYou still haven't explained what is wrong or shameful about the performance, or why we should think less of Kave and what he has to say because he attended. Try to focus on the merits or demerits of the performance itself, not 'but if it had been X, you would have hated it!'. It wasn't X, it was Y. Why is Y bad?
>Lady VicIf you don’t find it disturbing for ANYONE to enjoy watching someone masturbate publicly on stage, I really question your merits and your morals. Why would someone want to see such a play? It's ludicrous.Here we have feminists judging men on objectification, expoilting women and how they operate their sexuality and then in another stance, there is nothing wrong with what's being discussed. heh
>See, I don't think masturbation is something to be ashamed of. Masturbation as art? Sure, why not? I don't really mind if it's a man or woman up on that stage, I can think of a few ways for the performance to have artistic merit. Again, it's a little weird, but it's not outright immoral. You're still failing at answering the question.
>Lady vicWhat question am I failing? It's no doubt weird for someone to enjoy watching a man masturbate with milk getting poured on him. If you enjoy this, well it raises concerns for me.I find it funny how you are trying to justify such an outrageous act and the people who enjoy watching it.Blabble on all you want with your poor attempts of justifications. I have pretty much made my point clear.It's pointless trying to further discuss this with you as in your feminist perspective, a feminist can never be wrongCarry on
>NickIt wasn't a play. it was performance art. It was supposed to be disturbing. Something your little redneck mind can't quite understand. Cute though.. I threw that out as an after thought and you hillbillies latched onto it.
>What question am I failing?You are failing to explain why this performance is wrong, outrageous or immoral, and why we should immediately be suspicious of anyone who attends this performance, enjoys it or just doesn't mind that it happened. Your entire argument seems to be "It's wrong because it's wrong!" (or, perhaps, "It's wrong because feminists suck!") That might work on a kindergartener, but not among adults. You actually have to back up your claims with evidence or reasoning, and so far, you're failing at that. Yeah, it's a bit weird, but a lot of good art is weird. Enjoying things that are weird (or just tolerating them) doesn't make someone a terrible human being.
>Well,this discussion has taken a strange turn. I was going to mention another performance artist whose name rhymes with "Maren Dinley," but I think I'd better leave well enough alone.
>I like how enjoying or not enjoying performance art has become a feminist issue somehow.Also if we're weighing in, I don't get performance art but I am for the right to do crazy shit as long as it doesn't hurt anyone.Also, nick, as has been explained over and over to you, most modern feminists are pro-porn.
>hey david, is there a reason that richard is allowed to violate your commenting policy? From my understanding those who cannot play nice in the sandbox are removed from it
>A PSA that suggests that injudicious social conditioning could result in men becoming rapists…Because they have distorted the message to be a PSA that suggests that men are rapists from birth and need to have this inherent flaw conditioned out of them. Some (not necessarily on this blog, but on other MRA sites) have taken the message to mean that the PSA is suggesting that male children should be killed.
>Yeah, Richard, the thing is, this hate and oppression you keep railing against isn't real. It's made up. Nobody hates you. Nobody is oppressing you.Lara Logan was raped. That's a real thing that happened to a real person who exists outside of Internet message boards.You've gotten yourself into a place where you refuse to feel empathy for a woman who was gang-raped, because she's a woman and Women Are The Enemy. Not only do you not feel sorry for her, you just twist it into yet another opportunity to feel sorry for yourself for who-the-hell-knows-what. That is not a good place to be. You need to get out of that place.She's not Women. She's a woman.
>I didn't think I made a comment about that performance piece in this thread. I thought that maybe David had erased it? I didn't. Our mra boys took a part of a statement I made on another post to have fun with (boys will be boys).Btw, my 16 year old son is twice the man these boys will ever be.Here is my comment in full.Richard said:"She also tried to teach that lesbians seducing underaged girls is "good rape."The quote you stated is from the original Vagina Monologues. I do not believeDworkin was involved in the writing of that play. Speaking of the Vagina Monologues as someone who attends the theater, fringe fests, etc I’ve always wondered why there is so little understanding of alternative performance art in America (actually I don’t wonder). Hopefully I can explain it to you. The Vagina Monologues consisted of narratives of women’s personal experiences with their bodies. One of the narratives was from a lesbian who had sex with an adult woman as a teen, she spoke about how she felt about the relationship. “Good rape” meant that although it would be considered to be statutory rape it she considered it to be a positive experience. As the Vagina Monologues gained in popularity this monologue was taken out of the production because of in my opinion puritan views of teen sex that is rampant in North America. I once attended a performance art piece, which the artist (a guy) stripped down and masturbated while being dosed with milk, makes the VM look pretty tame in comparison. Because his performance stayed within the art community the undertones of what seemed to be an Oedipus complex did not make national news."….Why do they keep needing to do that?
>Another pussy begging wimp boy trying to crawl in that oversized handbag with Captain Bathrobe, and David.Again with the handbag? Seriously, WTF? I don't mind being insulted, Richard, but to be insulted in such a hackneyed, inartful, repetitious manner…why, why, it's an INSULT I tells ya! I'm profoundly disappointed, Richard, I really am. I put considerable time and effort into antagonizing you and your ilk, and this is all I get? Handbags? The next time you insult me, I expect you to put some real effort into it. No more half-assing it, m'kay?With affection,Captain Bathrobe
>Nick::: It's no surprise that many feminist men are probably the creepiest men of all. Many may use feminism to get closer to women with the "I'll protect you" stance. Such like a creepy old man telling a girl that he will drive her safely home… :::Really?Seems to me it would be far more creepy to have someone who absolutely no respect, consideration or even a modest liking for members of my gender offer me a ride home. Not that a member of the MRA bunch around here would. Or they might – but they'd expect to get sex for it. They appear to see every interaction between men and women as a transaction for sexual access to the woman's body. That's creepy.And the fact that you think a feminist man would have the same expectation is nothing more than projection.
>LOL @ the "I'll protect you" strategy for feminist men to seduce us helpless ladyfolk.So according to the MRM, feminists are "getting what we deserve" because we've decided we don't need men anymore. Simultaneously, feminists use men to defend us. Contradiction much?I'm fairly certain that the whole point of feminism is that women don't need men to rescue us.
>briget, I'm kind of giving Richard some extre leeway here — call it the "Richard Pass" — because he's really just digging a bigger hole for himself with each comment. Also, his insults are sort of hilarious. It's actually quite comfortable in the oversized handbag with the rest of the manginas.
>CB, you hairy-legged feminist!! Get outta my oversized handbag!! And take your hundreds of cats with you!!!