>
 |
| He was cured, all right. |
Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) are endlessly fascinating. For men who want to have nothing to do with women, they sure spend an awful lot of time thinking about women, talking about women, obsessing about women.
And oftentimes, it seems, the women they obsess about the most are naked women. Which brings us to one of the central conundrums of the MGTOW “movement,” or “community,” or whatever it is: How does one square one’s desire to have nothing to do with women with one’s desire to put one’s penis in them?
Not surprisingly, this is a topic that sometimes pops up, as it were, on MGTOW forums. Recently I ran across one such discussion archived on Don’t Marry. A late-twenties guy calling himself grasser asked the assembled MGTOWers how he might go about reducing his sexual desire for those sneaky, sexy, evil women:
Here’s the problem: I despise American women, but some of them look hot anyway. I pretty much stay the hell away from them as much as possible. Still, I’m a guy with normal drives and impulses, and sometimes I just gotta have it. It’s very annoying, and distracts me from other important work. I don’t like to watch porn either. Fuckin waste of time. I’ve been going to the gym everyday to lift weights, do cardio, I eat 3 square meals a day. How do you reduce desire for the female sex – besides going gay, of course.
No one suggested he look into that last option — MRAs and MGTOWs tend to be pretty thoroughly heterosexual. But they did have a number of specific ideas. One jokingly suggested that marriage would kill his sex drive pronto; another suggested that just talking to a woman for any length of time would do it: “After half an hour of her heroic autobiography, poor wally will be as limp as overcooked pasta.” Another suggested he let time take its toll, as the sex drive declines with age. And of course there was the age-old standby, furious masturbation. And if you couldn’t stand celibacy any longer: hookers.
Many of the suggestions were a little more, well, original:
I was told that eating Tofu will help cut down your sex drive. Buddhist monks in Japan are known to eat Tofu to “cool” their desire.
Train in kung fu, chi kung, yoga to control emotions and libido.
And for those with less interest in Eastern ways:
If you are white make latent racism your ally. (Not a moral solution but a practical one.) When you see a hottie imagine how many black dudes she sucked off. Try to picture them frosting her face.
But the most popular suggestion had a touch of Clockwork Orange about it: Using a sort of MGTOW version of the Ludovico Technique, train yourself to think of women and their sexy sex organs as repulsive. As one put it:
Remember that they stink. The “natural feminine scent” that they have nowadays is every bit as sexy as a skunk.
Another chimed in:
These words have gotten me through it:
“It’s just a stinky hole.”
Another quoted from a strange “Pep Talk For Brilliant Sex Restrainers” on the website celibacy.info:
Realize her body is full of the various cruds that makes up the human body (this is a favorite of the Asian sages). Excrement is sitting in her, all sorts of fatty deposits, weird impurities and drugs, gristle and bone, etc. She has bacteria in her mouth, and when she wakes up it stinks. Even if she seems pretty, there is even more putrid bacteria in her lower orifices. She farts and defecates just like any animal. Try to visualize her skeleton beneath the skin, muscle, fat and fascia. See, she’s not really a turn-on after all.
Well, I don’t know about you, but I’m off to wash my brain with mind-bleach.
>This has been a fascinating expose on the lives of OCD sufferers within the men's rights movement. Tune in next time for recipes to use up all those leftover potatoes (and men, remember to remind your ladies of the difference between a scrotum and a Yukon gold! A lack of vigilance could be very painful).
>Is it really THAT difficult to relate to the situation of being physically attracted but mentally repulsed? Have you never met even ONE woman whose body was attractive but whose personality was utterly toxic? If not, then you must enjoy one incredibly sheltered and privileged life.
>David: Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) are endlessly fascinating. For men who want to have nothing to do with women…Who says MRAs do not want to have any relationship with women?Many of us are married, have children, have a good relationship with their female relatives and with women working in the same company…However MRAs advice men to be careful. I see no reason why men should force themselves into dysfunctional marriages, unwanted children and painful divorces.
>whoever is talking about OCD, i hope you've thoroughly read through the most updated version of the DSM.primatology studies have shown that females are usually the instigators of permiscuity when given the chance, and my guess is that since the women's rights movement, and with this vestigial monogamy thing lingering around, men are getting the brunt of women being unfaithful and in general, not living up to older expectations of heterosexual female behavior.the danger is probably that they've gone from one extreme, which was probably having unrealistic expectations of their women, which lead them to this new extreme, which is to have equally unrealistic expectations of women in a different form.if it works for them there's nothing wrong with it in my opinion. sounds a lot like radical feminism from the masculine end. interesting stuff.very cultish though. an anthropological study for sure.
>Yohan, Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) is a "movement" that overlaps with the MRM and that is explicitly about men avoiding women; I'm not suggesting that all MRAs avoid women. Cold,"Is it really THAT difficult to relate to the situation of being physically attracted but mentally repulsed?"No, not at all, if we're talking about individuals. But it is difficult for me to relate to someone feeling that way about ALL women or ALL women in the west, or whatever.
>Interesting that you speak about AVOIDING of women and not HATING of women…MGTOW is NOT a movement for avoiding of ALL women, but gives advice to avoid some certain groups of women and to reject some female individuals with a certain way of behavior and this for a good reason.Even the text of your example is about 'American women' and not about 'ALL women'.To say 'ALL women in this world' is by far not the same as to say 'ALL women in the west' or 'ALL American women'.Often the reason for this advice are not these women themselves, but existing laws in those countries, which create a situation which makes any contact with any female a risk for any male.USA is famous for such laws with busy lawyers exploring legal loopholes and a dating scenery, where mistrust prevails. Another country to mention is UK, where divorce means a disaster for any man and where it is legally possible to claim alimony even 40 years after divorce. Some Scandinavian countries are not known to be friendly and family-minded towards men, but these are countries with little population.As you see, it's not even about 'ALL Western women'.There is no law existing which says men must socialize with women even if this is clearly a disadvantage and a risk for them – men have the right to remain single if they prefer it this way. Men have the right to reject certain females and to say NO. – The shaming language in return from feminists does not disturb me.MGTOW also recommends men to gather more information before doing something which they might regret later on. Check it out and decide carefully and slowly.If you sign a marriage contract, you should be informed about what this means for you in case of divorce. If you accept children from a previous relationship even in co-habitation with a woman, you should know about possible consequences as a father, even if you are not the biological father. If you meet a woman drunk during parties and bargirls and you take them to your private rooms, you should know about your risk. If you feel uncomfortable in your own country, get on an airplane and check out the world outside of your own nation and see how is the situation beyond the borders.Of course for you to read this must make you feeling uncomfortable as a 'male feminist', but can you explain me what is wrong with that?Are you married? Do you have children? I do not think so.I do not want to be the husband and father of this woman and her daughter in UK, what about you?http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1330689/Portrait-VERY-modern-14-year-old-Tattoos-piercings-drinking-alcohol.htmlAnd this is a good example of a woman you should avoid when looking for a girlfriend…http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1331470/Glamour-girl-wannabe-Samantha-Merry-cried-rape-clear-drug-debt-jailed-18-months.html
>To be fair, Yohan, a lot of 'men going their own way' *do* say that stuff about "all" women. Look at the quotes from Christopher from Oregon was talking about just a few posts back in this blog.That said, in the interests of fairness, I have to ask our host if he thinks separatist feminists are as bad as "men going their own way." I have heard many "lesbian separatists" and the like say the same things about men these MGTOW say about women.
>Yohan: "Interesting that you speak about AVOIDING of women and not HATING of women…" True, but if you notice, the guy asking the question in the getting-rid-of-desire discussion did say he DESPISES American women.vagrant: I'm no fonder of lesbian separatist misandry than I am of MGTOW misogyny. Both are bad.
>thevagrantsvoice said… To be fair, Yohan, a lot of 'men going their own way' *do* say that stuff about "all" women. Look at the quotes from Christopher from OregonYou have to see 'Christopher from Oregon' within his own small mindset. He was never out of USA, maybe has not even a passport, and for him 'all women' means 'all American women, regardless their race'.You cannot blame him, he cannot compare.These young American men are quickly changing their mind about women when there is a chance for them to get out of USA.USA is a wide area, long hours in an airplane to get away and very short vacation for most people, often not able to speak any other language than English …Most angry complaints from men about their local women are men from USA, most hateful response is from US-feminists. That's for sure.We men outside of USA are often astonished – USA is the most productive country in this world but personal communicaton between men and women is very much disturbed. Mistrust prevails.David: the guy did say he DESPISES American women There are only about 150 million American women, but over 600 million Chinese women in mainland China … over 500 million women in India … etc.I do not think he despises all women worldwide.How does he know? He was never outside of USA.For sure, American men outside of USA are not considered to be 'women-hater' and they are also known as very honest and rarely accused for criminal behavior. – Exactly what is happen to them inside the USA, nowhere else are so many men in jail but in the USA. I wonder why?
>@yohan,Christopher and other MRA's so full of hate for American women do not represent the majority of men in the U.S.. And most American women are not the evil creatures with malicious intentions that MRA's describe. I do not run into these MRA's who hate women or the "evil" women out to exploit them often in my daily activities. Men aren't crowding the borders trying to exit the U.S. en masse. Most men I know – married, single or divorced – are pretty happy overall and not blaming women for their personal problems and all of societies ills. I think people like Christopher very likely have bigger problems that have nothing to do with women at all.
>As far as why American men seek foreign brides, there aren't that many who do that. I think that most men who are seeking foreign brides are seeking a woman they can control, who will be more likely to be submissive, obedient and compliant and not likely to leave them. Men who seek to dominate an American woman in a relationship are very likely to be left.
>Feminists have made it illegal for american men to talk to women on foreign dating sites without registering and having a back ground check in some states, so men marrying foreign women must represent some sort of threat. Christine, you are mapping the characteristics of certain personality disorders on to most men that want to marry foreign women. So I your eyes, if I married a woman from a country other than my own, chances are that I have psychopathic characteristics and an irrational desire to control women? Your theory is somewhat unlikely.It more likely that these men are looking for a partner that is less likely to have an abrasive personality, dominate, be high maintenance and to use the courts to bleed them dry and kidnap their children than it is out of some irrational desire to control a woman.Mainly I think men that aren't attractive or wealthy enough for the home market start to look over seas.
>and the american feminist depiction and stereotyping of foreign women as doormats is feminist myth. The distribution of dominant and submissive personalities is uniform the word over.
>@Eoghan,From the time you started posting on this board, you have manipulatively taken so many things people say and twisted the meaning up, added words and phrases that were never said, and embellished it to suit your own purposes. There is no honest discussion with you which is why I have been generally ignoring you and why I will be completely ignoring you from now on.
>@ Christine, point to where I twisted your words…is it where I twisted" I think that most men who are seeking foreign brides are seeking a woman they can control, who will be more likely to be submissive, obedient and compliant and not likely to leave them. Men who seek to dominate an American woman in a relationship are very likely to be left"into"mapping the characteristics of certain personality disorders on to most men that want to marry foreign women. So I your eyes, if I married a woman from a country other than my own, chances are that I have psychopathic characteristics and an irrational desire to control women?"In which case, closer to the truth is that you dont like hearing what feminist thinking and rhetoric sounds like when its played back to you. If its about the stereotyping of foreign women are doormats, american feminists, who have never traveled a day in their lives often stereotype women from other cultures as doormats, just as you did.
>"american feminists, who have never traveled a day in their lives often stereotype women from other cultures as doormats, just as you did."Well, no. Christine didn't say the women were actually doormats; she said that most men seeking these brides do it because THEY are seeking doormats, and they believe these women are doormats.
>That said, I think Christine is right: it's time to ignore you.
> David… Christine didn't say the women were actually doormats; she said that most men seeking these brides do it because THEY are seeking doormats, and they believe these women are doormats. Who cares about such gossip? Except US-feminists?No other country in this world has such ridiculous discriminating laws like VAWA-IMBRA trying to cut down or to delay considerably the number of international marriages between US-men and foreign women.Considering USA as a country full with people of any kind you can imagine, this rejection and prejustice against foreign women-only is remarkable.Foreign men are not rejected – neither by US-feminists or by MRAs, so why are foreign women? The immigration of entire families is no target of rejection either in US-politics. Luckily we in Europe do not have such problems. I never heard about a German feminist, speaking out against a marriage between a foreign wife and a local man. Why are only US-feminists showing up with arguments like that?And about foreign women in poverty, foreign women as doormats, foreign women as prostitutes, uneducated foreign women etc… It would be good for you to take a look outside USA, did you ever travel abroad? Beyondthe US-borders? – There are many foreign women who are neither poor not uneducated, nor doormats or prostitute and some of them are nevertheless married with a husband from USA and EU. If you like that or not, is irrelevant, as this is not your business.About US-men in general, yes, they do have the right to look for a foreign wife – feminists cannot outlaw this, but they try to make it more difficult for BOTH of them, for the US-man AND for the foreign woman. It's me, me, me – and no foreign wife is welcome – competition is not much appreciated.
>Christine said… As far as why American men seek foreign brides, there aren't that many who do that. If this is true, why do you need even laws, created by feminists and sponsored by millions of USD funds out of tax-payers money to restrict these few men who are looking for a foreign wife?I think that most men who are seeking foreign brides are seeking a woman they can control, who will be more likely to be submissive, obedient and compliant and not likely to leave them This is what you think, but what means 'submissive, obedient' by your definition?Can you give me some examples?And is it wrong if you are married to a wife, who not likely will leave you? What is wrong with that? is it better to be married with a woman, who will likely divorce you soon, like all these marriages among US-celebrities?
>@yohan,Where a man is controlling, dominating, a woman with the expectation that she be submissive, obedient and compliant, I define that as an abusive husband as I know what actions people take in order to force another human being into submission, obedience and compliance. I do not expect you, or other MRA's, to view it that way as they make it clear they expect to dominate women and are angry over having been left. And considering my reference to a wife leaving her husband was said in the context of a wife leaving a husband whose goal is to dominate her, I will say that those men should not be surprised when they are left – by any woman, American or foreign. No one has to live that way. Your comparison of women leaving men who are dominating and controlling them to celebrity divorces is so far off-base to what I said, it's ridiculous.
>@yohan,Who said foreign women are all poor, uneducated, doormats, or prostitutes?BTW, my younger brother, an American, is married to woman from Uzbekistan, and she has a college degree she earned outside of the U.s.. They met in Afghanistan, and they live in Florida. She is not poor, uneducated, a doormat, or a prostitute. I have been outside of the U.S. borders and have lived in New York City where many foreign women live, and were welcomed into this country.I really don't understand why you and Eoghan twist things people say into something different and make up things and claim we said them when we didn't. It's so manipulative and immature. Or else you just spout off words without reading what was said. There is no honest or intelligent discussion to be had with either of you.
>I should clarify that SOME MRA's make it clear that they expect to dominate women, not all.
>ChristineYou said"As far as why American men seek foreign brides, there aren't that many who do that. I think that most men who are seeking foreign brides are seeking a woman they can control, who will be more likely to be submissive, obedient and compliant and not likely to leave them".Ive heard this stereotype from american feminists over and over, american man seeking over seas wife cast as a psychopath and the overseas women cast as doormants. If its not what you actually believe, I suggest that you dont parrot the cliche as if you do.
>"american man seeking over seas wife cast as a psychopath and the overseas women cast as doormants."Twice you have attributed the word "psychopath" and "doormat" to me which I, of course, never said. But that is just you – you lie a lot. You make up stuff constantly and say people said them when they didn't. You're a manipulative liar. And a troll. Here is what I believe, Eoghan. I believe that many members of the MRM are abusive men who bully and beat their girlfriends and wives into submission and compliance because they think they are superior to women and entitled to control and dominate them. I believe that some MRA's want to marry foreign wives because they believe they have a better chance of finding a woman who won't stand up for themselves – whether this is true or not. The MRM didn't earn the reputation as an "Abuser's Lobby" for nothing.
>ChristineYou said"As far as why American men seek foreign brides, there aren't that many who do that. I think that most men who are seeking foreign brides are seeking a woman they can control, who will be more likely to be submissive, obedient and compliant and not likely to leave them".You just do not like the way is sounds when its played back to you and you have since changed what you siad in your mind, but that doesn't mean that you didn't say it. You are correct is saying that you didnt use the words "psychopath" and "doormat" but you did use the characteristics of a psychopath and a doormat to stereotype the two groups.