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I’ve been watching the Men’s Rights movement, such as it is, for some time, with a mixture of amusement, horror and disgust. It’s a movement that’s bad for everyone — for men, for women, for children, and probably even for my cat, though I haven’t yet quite worked out how. The best thing you can say about the Men’s Rights Movement is that it doesn’t, and hopefully never will, have anything near the impact on the world that feminism has had over the years. And this blog, in its own little way, hopes to help keep that way.
So in this blog I hope to take on the assorted myths promulgated by the Men’s Rights Movement, to dismantle their rickety logic and their dubious statistics. I’ll round up assorted examples of misogyny, mendacity and just plain stupidity from MRA’s online and off. And I’ll highlight some of the best anti-MRA arguments I can find.
As for the boobz in the title, I do not refer to those rounded lumps of flesh and fat on the chests of women and some men. I refer to the classic definition of boob as “a stupid or foolish person; a dolt.” Too many MRA’s, alas, fit this definition to a T.
Oh, and the Z on the end of “boobz?” Someone else already took the “manboobs” URL. So I improvised. I’m crafty.
@Acid
if your biggest concerns is that someone said your being a dick when your doing dickish things that’s really sad. Why are you here? if you want to help boys and men why don’t you go do that instead of troll a feminist site you are so sure has sperate views then you? I’m treating you the same way i would any boy who does this. You act like a dick, i called you out by calling you a dick.
Oops, looks like a part of the conversation didn’t load for me. Will react to those here.
@Lainy
I don’t care that much, but I care enough to respond. Mainly because I like debates. I usually try not to write long paragraphs, but then I get carried away.
I don’t think that, because I’m not on the right. I’m not on the left either, but I lean more left. I don’t have a political party, to be exact.
Though, I might end up forming my own.
I was never told that. I experienced it through interacting with feminists.
So how about you actually confront those feminists and make feminism out to be about equality, and then I MIGHT think about joining feminism.
@Naglfar
I don’t think you’re all living in a meme-world, if that’s what you think.
@Lainy
I never expected you to call me a she. I have reacted to one of @David Futrelle ‘s articles in the past (MRA Says Trans People Are Allies. “We Hunted the Mammoth” Thinks Most MRAs are “Transphobic” – Acid Men’s Rights (wordpress.com)), and so I understand that Futrelle is pro-trans. It would follow that the people who read his blog are also pro-trans.
I have no idea what you’re talking about.
I’m actually kind of confused.
I never said that nobody else doesn’t have it as bad as me or worse. There are plenty of people who do.
But if you act like a person has never had anything bad in their life, then you’re going to get a response.
I don’t know why you people think that I’m basically 10 years old, but I’ll clear that up. I’m nearly 17 years old.
There. Can you sleep at night now?
@Naglfar
No, I do not think most feminists are TERFs. A large portion of feminists are, but there’s enough feminists that probably only between 10 to 20% of feminists are TERFs. I would doubt 30%, but there’s always the possibility.
I am more against TERFs than normal feminists, mainly due to their anti-trans and anti-male approach.
@Lainy
Then it’s good that I don’t, hm?
That, we can agree on.
Well, I don’t care if they refer to me as she, yeah it might hurt, but I don’t care about that.
I do care, though, when people will attack people for who they are, in this case being trans.
“Our boy.” I’ve never been referred to that lol. Maybe “boy,” but not “our boy.”
@Lainy
No, my concern is that you accused me of being a “dick” when I merely explained my side.
To explore! I don’t like to be in an echo-chamber, I’m afraid.
I do help men and boys. I’m going to be writing a book called, “Men’s Rights Are Human Rights,” and some 30% or so will be going to support a Men’s Domestic Abuse/Violence shelter that I am going to be creating as soon as possible, and also some of it will be going to charities that help men.
Oh, you’re treating me like a boy. Cool? Thanks?
I merely explained my side. I don’t get how that makes me a “dick.”
@Acid Kritana
The term misandry has been rendered meaningless by MRAS screaming that anything they don’t like is misandry, so you’ll have to be more specific for what you mean by misandrists.
You are free to check the archives of the blog, I don’t really feel like digging it up just because some troll wants me to.
Can you find me a single case of feminists shutting down a men’s shelter? Because I have seen a number of feminist DV organizations advocate for men, but have never seen what you describe.
The whole time?
A few reasons. Even if you are against feminists, it can be useful to learn about your opponents. For instance, the reason the far left is much better at infiltrating right wing groups than the inverse is because the left learns what the right thinks. You might be able to put together some cohesive arguments instead of straw men if you knew what feminists actually think.
@acid
Kiddo, you were missing point on a lot of things not directed at you because i wasn’t talking to you. I was talking to naglfar on a previous conversation her and i had about guns. I don’t think your on the right nor do i care. You do have my pitty though for how tough you’ve had it with your depression, self hated and mean things said to you. I don’t care if you want to join feminism or not. I think you would hurt a lot of people in it because you think it would be funny or something. You kind of a mean self centered person so you being in the mra’s is better for everyone’s mental health.
Also to clear up, we do this because an 11 year old boy came on here. Told us he was gay and how he’s a man going his own way. Then starting calling naglfar a tr*nny and me a r****d and being shitty to rape victims. He was also putting person information, you are smart enough not to do that of course, he was a baby. He put his cell phone number, his school, his parents names, his names, his sister names, and his home address on a blog that he linked us all to. So I found his mom work, called her and got him grounded and let her know what he was doing. That’s why people keep talking about it and your age is a sore spot for you. The kid also threaten he would bring all of his bois to harass me every time I posted and that he was somehow going to sue me for using the information he put online to call his mom.
So you are 16, you don’t have much life experience and it shows. when i mock you it’s not because of your age, it’s because you say stupid thing so I mock the stupid things you say. And sweetie, I care if they call you she. I care if they call naglfar he. I care if they proposedly misgender you, me, or anyone else on this blog because it’s not right. If it doesn’t hurt you, that’s fine, but you still shouldn’t be treated that way. You should have your gender identity respected at all times. and it makes me angry that many will not give this to you.
And yup, when you here you our boi!
@Acid
yeah I don’t think people will want to read a book made by a 16 year old boy who thinks he’s got the whole world figured out but sure, go try and get that published. As a published author though I can tell you it’s hard and you’ll waste a lot of money. Also do not sell your soul to a contracting agency. You’ll have great expectations and then you’ll have nothing. Please have a beta reader because reading you here, it’s very clear how you are and that won’t sell a book at all.
@Naglfar
The literal definition. “People who hate men.”
Also, I could claim the same of misogyny.
I could, and I am, but I would like to hear YOUR proof.
Yes. I’ll supply a single case. And if you want more, I’ll supply more.
My case is this:
Erin Pizzey created the world’s first female domestic abuse/violence shelter, right?
Well, she learned that women are just as abusive as men, and tried to create a male domestic abuse/violence shelter.
Feminists opposed her, claiming that only men abuse or that most abusers are men, and also opposed the shelter that would support male victims.
Pizzey got death threats many times, and it got so bad that the bomb team had to have all her mail directed to them first. Her pets were brutally slaughtered, and her family put at a high risk.
All because she wanted to help men.
How about some proof?
I’ll look into it for that reason, but not to become a feminist.
That could be debated, but based on the group, I suppose. However, the left might be OVERALL better at it. I don’t know.
I do know what feminists think.
And so far, you’re proving me right on the fact that many feminists don’t have actual evidence to support their claims.
@Acid
Oh no! the 16 year old troll doesn’t want to be a feminist! whatever shall we do!
@Acid
If you’re a trans man, you’re a man (or boy in this case). I am a trans woman, and therefore a woman. We accept trans people here. You are lucky to have transitioned before puberty, doubly so if you are on puberty blockers. I transitioned starting at 21, in adulthood, so the “male puberty” which I underwent has permanently disfigured me. I get misgendered and deadnamed until this day by people who pretend to love me. They don’t love me: they love the fantasy which they constructed for me of the temple-married worthy Priesthood holder with a homemaking wife and three to ten little tithe-payers.
It may interest you to know that for all TERFs (transphobes who wear a thin veil of feminist, pro-woman rhetoric, really the only major modern strain of “feminism” which could be called man-hating) profess their hatred of MRAs, they are really allies with a common enemy: us.
MRAs want nothing to do with us. They (and their allies TERFs and fascists) blame us for the “degeneration” of society, jeering at us as though we were circus freaks. Feminism, especially the much-slandered intersectional third wave, does much more for men (especially trans men!) than does MRAism.
@mabret
I don’t think you’ll get through to him. Kid has big “pick me” energy that he’ll have to work out on his own. You can’t tell a 16 year old anything, they think they have the world all figured out. Hopefully he grow out of the stage he’s in right now and choose healthier options. Right now, it’s basically just give a pity glance.
@Acid
That’s not why feminists oppose Pizzey. There are articles on this very blog about that. And, I might add, there is no evidence it was feminists who sent death threats or killed her pets.
If only there were a blog which documents and debunks MRA claims…oh wait, there is and you’re refusing to look at it. I’d dig up some links, it I know you wouldn’t read them anyway so I won’t.
I doubt that, given that so far most of your accusations have been claims based on collective guilt or strange strawmen.
And when you do get around to supplying references, would you PLEASE make them about incidents that occurred sometime in the last 10 years? Because it seems like EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. a MRA-type shows up here to complain about the massive inequalities suffered by men as a whole, they almost always bring up stuff that was a major deal back in the 1960-80’s. The Draft, last active sometime in the 70’s at extreme latest. Erin Pizzey’s shelters, which she hasn’t been involved with in decades. Valeria Solanas and Andrea Dworkin, who said mean things about men DECADES ago, and have been dead DECADES now.
Get some new material, won’t you? Sheeeesh.
ETA: fixed a coding error. >.<
Is this guy actually posting from 2010? He’s commenting on the very first post, talking about Erin Pizzey. Wild. Does anyone want to try and catch our time traveling friend up on what the world is like here in the future in 2021.
I tell you, Acid. It’s wild. You wouldn’t even believe me.
@Lainy
And? You guys were talking about me.
Good.
I don’t want your pity.
I merely brought it up because you were basically saying that I had faced nothing bad in my life.
Good?
Because, with the way you guys are treating me, it’s not like I’ll want to join it any time soon.
I think that certainly says something about your perceptions.
If I’m actually a “mean self centered person,” why not supply evidence along with your claim? If it turns out that I’m actually like that, then I’ll try to fix it.
Actually, he’s almost 13. Yes, he contacted me.
Yes, he is gay.
Yes, he’s MGTOW.
And I don’t see why y’all are against a pro-trans, pro-gay, pro-woman guy who just happens to be MGTOW.
Is it because there are men (and boys) who don’t want to waste their lives being sacrificial sheep just for female comfort?
I know that he called @Naglfar a tr*nny, though he said he did it because he views her as a “transtrender.” I don’t know when he called you a “r****d,” but if you can supply proof, I’ll believe you. I know that sexual assault can be harder to prove online, but when you get called something by someone online, you should be able to prove that pretty easily.
And I would also like proof for the last claim.
And his mom has know that he was MGTOW for some time. Your point?
And I don’t post that information, mainly because I want to keep my family safe.
And myself safe as well, but that comes in second.
No, you didn’t.
@Lainy can’t stop lying about me | Social Media | Facebook | |► – RoboKitty (wordpress.com)
Wanna lie about that again?
Ah, good to know why you keep comparing me to an almost-13-year-old you keep on calling an 11-year-old.
Do you have proof of this?
And, he’s actually going to sue you for spreading lies about him.
I’m Suing @Lainy | Social Media | Facebook |► – RoboKitty (wordpress.com)
Wow, that doesn’t sound demeaning at all! /s
God, no wonder I’m still an MRA, when MRAs are much nicer as well.
What stupid things have I said? I’ve actually brought forth proof, and y’all just keep on saying “No” like a broken record, yet not providing proof.
Well, I don’t. It might hurt, but there’s better things to do than pick this useless fight. I mean, c’mon, I don’t want them to feel like I’m forcing them to do it, either.
What things are better? For example, fighting against misandry, violence against men (and boys), getting equality for men and boys, etc.
Okay?
The cringe XD
@Lainy
Wow, demeaning, once again!
And plenty of people are actually interested in the book.
I’ve already got a plan laid out for the book, I need to draw the (admittedly simple) cover. It might be simple, but it’ll be striking, as it’ll only be the colors black and gold.
And I’ve got a cool idea for the cover, where, if you take off the dust jacket, the symbol is still there, but the words aren’t.
It’ll also make it easier to hide in class if there is a biased teacher or something (though, hopefully, there aren’t).
And I don’t have the whole world figured out.
Thanks for giving me your real side.
Who said I was dumb enough to go to a publisher?
Self-publishing. See? Problem solved.
You can thank my mom for helping me learn that (through the things she gave me).
Already having a beta reader, but your sentence is, once again, demeaning. Dude, do you have another mode of talking?
@Lainy
Maybe be nicer, for a start.
@Mabret the Virile Maiden
Okay…?
And…?
Congratulations?
Actually, no. I started my transition at 14. I hit puberty at 11 or 12. I haven’t even had a single shot of testosterone hormone therapy yet.
And, yes, I hit puberty early because I’m physically female without my biological father living with me. It has been found that girls that grow up without their fathers hit puberty earlier (mainly due to other males’ pheromones being registered), which causes a host of problems, including earlier death.
Congrats, single motherhood is literally killing girls.
Yeah, I’m currently getting disfigured.
And I know that it takes a little longer for trans women, but as long as you use estrogen hormone therapy and testosterone-blockers, you should be on your way to looking a woman, if not at least mostly.
The only reason I don’t get misgendered too much is for the fact that I’m actually pretty good at making myself look like a dude. If you met me, you wouldn’t even know that I haven’t been on testosterone yet.
And I’m sorry that people misgender you and deadname you because they can’t accept the fact that you are living the way you feel best.
They aren’t common allies against an enemy. I would rather hang myself than ever say that their claim that trans women are all “perverted men” (which is also built off the misandristic belief that all men are perverted) as real. As would any other MRA I know. Let’s just take a look at all the pro-trans MRAs out there, ey? Let’s add pro-male people as well. Just in case.
Men Are Human actively supports trans people, and it is owned by a gay man.
RoboKitty, who is a gay MGTOW, is pro-trans.
Rocky Mountain Men’s Rights Advocacy is pro-trans, and states in their FAQ that Men’s Rights helps all men, including trans men. They even have at least one trans woman among them.
Paul Elam and A Voice For Men are actually pro-trans and pro-woman. They are just anti-abuser.
Dr Shaym, a YouTuber who is a straight white male, is pro-gay, pro-trans, and pro-woman.
There are many more, but a list like this would have to take time to compile.
Because I would indeed have to look at a LOT of sources.
Since when?
Do you have proof?
Because I have proof of the opposite claim.
Nope.
Just TERFs.
Nope.
Do you have proof?
@Lainy
Well, you certainly aren’t going to “get through to” me (whatever that means) by being the way you guys currently are.
You’re literally demeaning me in a multitude of cases, mocking teenagers and kids for their ages, and more! You’re also just repeating “No” like a broken record when I provide evidence for my claims and you guys can’t provide anything!
No wonder I’m never going on your side.
Not until you become better people.
Fighting for the equal rights of men and boys, and providing evidence for my claims, all the while defending myself, is not “pick me” energy.
How many times are y’all gonna be demeaning?
What healthier options are there besides fighting for equality? Certainly, you all aren’t providing feminism as a healthy option.
Wow. Seems like demeaning is the only language you understand.
@Naglfar
Then why don’t you provide the evidence?
Do you have evidence for that? Proof?
Cause I can bring up evidence proving that feminists did that, if you want.
Go ahead and dig up links. I’ll read any you pull up, as long as the link doesn’t lead to Pornhub or something like that.
I have read links that you guys have dug up, and gave them tabs, so I could always go back.
Unlike you, I don’t like to live in an echo chamber.
I don’t blame every single feminist. I merely blame those that need it.
Sadly, that appears to be a lot of them.
@Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Mean
Sure thing. How big you want the list?
I’ll put a starter list in the comment labeled “List.”
“MRA-type”…? Pfft. It’s called an “MRA,” not “MRA-type.”
Don’t worry, you’re getting the list.
Even though it’s not being used at this moment, men are still being forced to sign up for it. Ever heard of “selective service”? Most countries don’t even have it. Less than 1/3 do. And of those that do, few include women. When they do include women, they are much more lenient towards the women than the men.
So while it may not be up right now, it could be used at any time.
And it’s not just America that men are oppressed or discriminated against. I can fight against anti-male inequalities around the world.
Okay? It’s still a good point.
And she got kicked out by feminists.
So that’s why she hasn’t been involved.
Imagine if all Hitler had done was write his manifesto and kill one Jew. And then was praised by the New York Times, many feminists, and Sweden?
I do have “new material,” but I haven’t had a reason to bring them up until now, so I haven’t. But don’t worry, you’ll be getting the list.
By the way, I keep the whole quote when reacting to y’all here, so that’s why that’s here.
And you’re nickname’ll be longest-name-yet.
Otherwise I won’t remember who you are.
@weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee
Nope. Posting from 2011. /s
Maybe because the first post is free game? I’m not posting on every single article. If I did, I’d be wasting valuable life force.
And Erin Pizzey is still important.
Time Travel may not ever be possible.
Atoms must have their own space, so it would not be possible to even have other dimensions, really.
If you think about it, the past already happened, and wouldn’t be able to go back.
Ant Man also wouldn’t have the ability to shrink or grow big, unless if he wanted to blow up from the air pressure in his lungs and lose MUCH of his mass, or to suck in things around him to cover for the immense amounts of mass gained.
I tell you, too-long-of-a-name. It’s wild. You wouldn’t believe science.
The List’ll be next, by the way
@Acid Kritana
He is very obviously not pro-trans or pro-woman, he called the women here various slurs as outlined before.
I don’t really care why he did it, he still did it. Not very pro trans. And that really doesn’t help his case.
Well, good luck suing someone who uses a pseudonym on the Internet for something that is not illegal.
He very clearly isn’t. Pro-trans people don’t call trans women slurs.
The creator of “Bash a Violent B*tch Month” is pro-woman? Hahahaha, good one.
Sure.
https://www.mic.com/articles/88277/23-ways-feminism-has-made-the-world-a-better-place-for-men
https://medium.com/amp/p/5777dde965f
https://www.bustle.com/articles/131350-5-ways-feminism-benefits-men
Every time anyone gives you anything you refuse to acknowledge it, that’s on you.
You’re asking me to prove a negative. First give me evidence it was feminists.
The blog has a whole tag on her, you could look at it if you were actually interested in productive discussion.
So, Paul Elam’s claim he only wanted to assault women who deserve it, but with women replaced with feminists.
I can’t speak for the NYT or Sweden, but I don’t think many modern day feminists praise Solanas.
This is called missing the point.
P.S. could you be a little less verbose? Or at least write 1 comment instead of 5?
@Acid
It’s called look it up where he called me laintard on his blog. and he did it because I’m autistic. I’m done kid. if you want to be on the side of the kids who mocked my rape, go ahead. Good luck with the book. this is why I don’t want you to be in feminism because you would just hurt survivors.
@Acid
Just, go debate somewhere else. I’m done now. You’re just to triggering. I’m sorry that you can’t take it if someone doesn’t kiss your ass all the time. Grow up, good luck. Maybe don’t be a dick to people and you’ll get a boyfriend someday.
@Acid
Also, i started puberty at 10 and my father is a big part of my life and living with us. He being there had nothing to when I started puberty. How the hell are you able to blame your mother for you starting puberty at the normal time a female bodied person stars puberty? most people with vagina start puberty around age 12. you didn’t start early. your mother being a single mother didn’t make you start puberty early.
@Lainy
Do you want me to email David?
@naglfar
No I’m fine, I’ll just stop doing this to myself with trolls that aren’t trying to do anything but hurt people. I try to be nice, he spits it in my face with a sarcastic “okay?” i try to give advice but it’s wrong because I don’t kiss his ass enough. He’s a kid. If he this is what he wants to do, he can do it. I’ll just stop responding. I’ve opened up these vulnerable parts, but the kid doesn’t matter. I just… i can’t with them asking me to back up the “claim” that I have been raped. That’s just to much. I don’t know what I expect though, he’s a mra. Even if he’s just a kid it’s obvious he doesn’t care about any woman that gets hurt. Hell, I’m just going to stop before he says I deserved it for being a feminist or something. I know it shouldn’t bother me anymore. this shit happened when I was 16, I’ve come along way from it. but these type… they have no empathy naglfar. I just…. what makes a kid like this.
Should I even being try to have a baby with my husband if this is the thing that we have to fight against. It feels like it’s never enough, like what if I have a baby. they grow, someone rapes them when they just a kid and then they have to deal with people from all over demanding they prove it. telling them it was their fault, discrediting them. I want to be a mom more then anything. My husband wants to be a dad more then anything. But the world is just so… evil.
the kid just making remember when i was 16, and i was telling people what happened and everyone took my rapist side. Everyone made excuses, either told me i lied or that i deserved it. Bleeding from the vagina and anus and their telling me I’m lying because one boy say that I am. After the last few replies I know that… Acids just going to side with any abusive man just because their a man and the women they’ve hurt doesn’t matter. If the man says the woman is lying then she’s lying. That’s the world he lives in and I can’t do anything else about that. So I need to stop so I can go to work later and teach some 6 years old the basic of ballet and maybe see just a bit of goodness in the world before it gets snuffed out when their older.
Apparently, the troll got the boot. Good riddance I guess.
(I didn’t see the incident, I just followed the link indicating Acid vomited some bile in a lot of post in a row)