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alt-right anti-Semitism crank magnetism men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny sexual exploitation TERFs transmisogyny transphobia white supremacy

Transphobic feminist Posie Parker appears on a white supremacist podcast and somehow we’re not surprised

Parker on Jean-Francois Gariepy’s podcast The Public Space

By David Futrelle

If you’ve been struck by the strange and creepy ideological convergence between so-called “gender-critical feminists” and the far right on the subject of trans people, you may not be altogether surprised to learn that notorious British anti-trans activist Posie Parker — definitely NOT to be confused with indie actress Parker Posey — recently appeared on the podcast of one Jean-Francois Gariepy, an outspoken white nationalist, crude misogynist, and accused sexual exploiter of young women.

It’s still a bit shocking though, as Gariepy — known as JF — is not just an at-right shitbag who has hosted such anti-luminaries as Richard Spencer and David Duke on his show; he’s an alt-right shitbag who has managed to make himself controversial amongst other alt-rightists not for his views but for his alleged treatment of women and teenage girls. Given the amount of misogyny that’s considered perfectly acceptable on the far-right, that’s quite an accomplishment.

As the Daily Beast has noted, JF has been “accused of luring and attempting to impregnate a developmentally disabled Hispanic teenager” whom counselors declared had “the social and mental maturity of a 10- or 11-year-old child.” He has also reputedly engaged in what the Beast described as “a pattern of bizarre and abusive behavior towards [other] women.”

Parker — real name Kellie-Jay Keen Minshull — told PinkNews that she didn’t know about any of this, saying that a cursory examination of JF’s YouTube channel uncovered “nothing [that] stood out as … unusual or problematic.”

Perhaps, but if she had bothered to Google his name, she would have found in the top results a RationalWiki profile detailing his toxic views and behavior, as well as the Daily Beast article quoted above, which appeared under the title “Alt-Right YouTuber Accused of Luring Autistic Teen in Pregnancy Plot.”

While she says she abhors white supremacy, she also told PinkNews that

I make it my business to avoid researching or policing the entire spectrum of someone’s views, I think the mutilation of healthy children’s bodies is too important, and so it’s not usual for me to do an FBI style background check. …

These days so many people are called Nazis and far right that the prophetic warning that we will no longer recognise the real ones is beginning to come true.

It’s really not that hard to tecognize that JF is one of “the real ones.”

Even after JF’s full odiousness was exposed, PinkNews goes on to report, many of Parker’s fans on Mumsnet — a British site aimed at mothers that has been taken over by transphobic ideologues — defended the interview.

“‘Far-right’ always gets thrown around as an insult,” one Mumsnet user said. “Where are the left on this issue? Throwing women and children under the bus is where.”

“If there’s anyone who can confidently debate with anti-feminist right wingers it’s Posie. It’s a really brave and interesting way to go,” one Mumsnet user wrote.

“Posie is bringing the truth about genderism to a wider audience,” another said, adding that “even if it might be an audience of people we don’t particularly like – presumably they still have the right to protect their kids.”

Given his alleged past behavior, one would think these commenters would be more worried about the possible danger that Jean-Francois Gariepy poses to their children.

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Aron
Aron
1 year ago

How dare that evil wench steal Parker Posey’s name!

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

I have long speculated that TERFs are headed towards embracing full-on white supremacy. Now, it seems, they’ve made it official. I’m not surprised. TERFs remind me more of MRAs than feminists.

It was also pretty clear that a significant portion of Mumsnet users are actually white supremacists. The fact that they don’t even question Gariepy makes it pretty clear they are sympathetic to his views. There was another user not quoted here who expressed anger that a caller asked if Parker was Jewish and rambled about how she didn’t look like a Jew.

I’m wondering if r/GenderCritical has any even worse takes on this, but I don’t like going there.

EDIT: I checked r/GenderCritical. It seems they haven’t gotten wind of this particular development, but they have really liked this woman in the past.

On the topic of gender, I know I’m a bit late, but happy International Pronouns Day to everyone.

Fruitloopsie
Fruitloopsie
1 year ago

The women’s march and now this. Feminism and leftists are eating themselves and became MRAs. Disgusting.

Aron
We can criticize women without sexist slurs/sexism in general.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

This is slightly off topic from the post but I’ve been thinking of it since I saw this on twitter

I hate the way terfs frame spaces that we assume to be cis gender only as a safe place. Like its some magical portal where all cis women protect each otber against the evil penis or some shit. As a cis woman who was raped in a public bathroom by a cis man. It is anything but. Hell for me one of the most traumatic things about that day was not even from the rape itself. It comes from the fact that someone walked into that bathroom during the middle of it. Saw a crying bleeding girl being held down by her hair and then just walked out. They apologised for something and then quickly just walked out. After an hour of laying there and waiting for police noises that I was sure were going to come didn’t. It broke me more then anything else. I was given hope and nothing came from it. I stopped believing in human goodness for a long time after that.

Fruitloopsie
Fruitloopsie
1 year ago

Lainy
via GIPHY

kupo
kupo
1 year ago

@Fruitloopsie

The women’s march and now this. Feminism and leftists are eating themselves and became MRAs. Disgusting.

Was this meant to be tongue in cheek? I can’t tell.

@Lainy
That’s awful. I’m sorry that happened to you.

Amy E
Amy E
1 year ago

@Lainy – Oh my goodness, that’s awful. I’m so sorry.

I personally find this alliance astonishing – are they seriously uniting over their hatred of trans people, in spite of what one would assume are their differences? I guess it goes to show that in the case of both groups, hate is the strongest impulse.

Bina
1 year ago

Oh noes, the trans women are coming for Mumsnet’s kids!

Except no, they’re not. And some of those kids might well be trans themselves, and just haven’t come out yet. And with parents like these, who could blame them for not doing so?

And in fact, nobody’s “mutilating” ANY children’s bodies; every medical expert in the trans field recommends that nothing so radical as surgery be undertaken before a child turns 18. Until then, the only medical treatments that they CAN undergo are to take puberty blockers at onset of puberty (which is known to be safe, because those drugs are also given to much younger kids to stop premature puberty), and hormone treatments later, once they’re ready to make that transition (and 100% certain that they want to do so). Surgeries are the last step (and in many cases, not even A step), and since they can only happen when the trans kid is legally an adult and capable of making that decision alone, there is nothing to clutch one’s pearls over on this issue at all. Unless, of course, you’re a yucky ‘phobe who would disown a child for not sticking with the gender you arbitrarily assigned them at birth.

Thanks, Mumsnet, for throwing your own kids under the bus and siding with the far right just because you don’t understand transgenderism! I’m sure the Nazis do appreciate that!

Knitting Cat Lady
Knitting Cat Lady
1 year ago

Grrmbl.

‘These days so many people are called Nazis and far right that the prophetic warning that we will no longer recognise the real ones is beginning to come true.’

No it’s not. There ARE that many people who are far right and Nazis! And if you can’t see that you’re either one of them or some clueless centrist or liberal enabler. If you’re not explicitly against the Nazis, you’re with them.

Also, Mumsnet was always scum riddled with antivaxxers and other woosters.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Amy E

I personally find this alliance astonishing – are they seriously uniting over their hatred of trans people, in spite of what one would assume are their differences? I guess it goes to show that in the case of both groups, hate is the strongest impulse.

Yup. This isn’t the first time TERFs have agreed with the far right, but it’s one of the most obvious. Because to them it’s more important to hurt trans* people than to be a feminist. AFAICT most TERFs don’t actually do anything resembling feminist activism, they just try to stir up hate. You are correct that this is their main motive.

@Knitting Cat Lady

if you can’t see that you’re either one of them or some clueless centrist or liberal enabler. If you’re not explicitly against the Nazis, you’re with them.

Judging from the comments, it seems many of the Mumsnet people are Nazis, or at least Nazi sympathizers. I don’t think they’re clueless, they’re just trying to play plausible deniability. They know full well what’s going on, they just prefer to ally with Nazi rapists than support trans* people.

I know TERFs are a very small minority of feminism, and the vast majority of feminists are not TERFs, but I do worry about how TERFs affect the outside perception of feminism.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

In other TERF news, Linda Bellos, a prominent lesbian activist, showed up at the Supreme Court to oppose protections for LGBT people simply because that includes trans* people.

Knitting Cat Lady
Knitting Cat Lady
1 year ago

What the hell is wrong with so many LGB people that they have to pull the ladder up after them?!

And even trying to stop LGBT protections just because they would help T?

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face…

I have lost count how many times my Aro/Ace ness was commented on with ‘It’s just a phase/You haven’t met the right person yer/etc.’ by LGB people.

Don’t get me started on mainstream LGB folks reaction to us non binary people.

People suck.

ObSidJag
ObSidJag
1 year ago

To Lainy:
How horrible for you–I’m so sorry you had to endure that.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Knitting Cat Lady,
Apparently, some think that the legalization of same sex marriage was some sort of automatic win for all time on every issue. Do they really not think that right wing Christian health care providers or employers won’t “exercise their conscience” and discriminate against cis queer people too?

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@to all

Thank you, I just needed to get it out of my head. I saw that and I’ve been seeing so much terf shit on my pinterest lately that basically talks about how magical and special cis women spaces are. Like it’s somehow going to save you from violence. When the truth is women and girls will leave you in a room with the devil just the same way as men and boys will turn a blind eye to clear abuse of those around them. We as a society do not know how to handle these things when we see them so we look the other way.

But the one good thing from that trauma? it made me stop waiting for someone to save me. For someone to give a damn when they saw him hurt me. For someone to notice the bruises and bag under my eyes. It made me stop relying on others and taught me that if I wanted to survive I had to stand on my own feet and find some sort of strength to save myself. It took all of my hope being destroyed and my lost faith in humanity for me to finally start fighting back. And then to fight for others, because even though I was strong enough to take, there will always be someone who isn’t. They need the help that I was looking for.

I hope that if any terfs come to this post. They read this comment. They examine there views if they have real concern for others. If they care about real rape survivors and real suffering. They will see how their views are harmful. Maybe they’ll even learn some real compassion.

(trigger warning)
My hands shake, and tears run down my face as I type. It’s painful to do so but I know if I don’t get it out it will rot my soul. All the things I hyper focused on to get me through that day, that girls face is one of them. As is the way her body moved in my blurry vision as she turned out the door and her voices echo’s in my ears as she apologizes and the thud of the door closing makes my heart stop. I wait and I wait, heart beating faster, there must be some sound. Foot steps coming, a loud knocking on the door, sirens, something, but there is nothing. The cement floor is cold and dirty of that bathroom. There are dead falls leaves on the floor of it because someone left the door propped opened and then blew in. their brown and crispy and focus on the wave the veins of them go through out the leaves. It had been raining and there are muddy shoes prints on the cement. The tread of HIS shoe has a diamond pattern on it. A pattern I can now draw in my sleep because of how long I stared, memorizing all the lines just to focus on anything but the pain.

He had slapped me and my teeth cut the inside of my bottom lip. Blood drips down from it and onto the dirty floor. five drips, five drips exactly, before he moved me and the blood smeared on the floor. I don’t dare look myself in the many bathroom mirrors. I don’t dare look at his face because I know what demon is going to look back at me. I look at anything else I possibly can incase these are my last moments I get to look at anything and I’ll be damned if the last thing I see in this world is him.

After it’s done I lay there for a while and watch the blood dry. I’m hurting but I’m not crying and I don’t understand why I’m not crying. I’m cold, I know that I’m cold because I can see my breath in air and I’m nude laying on this cement floor, but I don’t feel the cold. It takes me three days to realize I’m in shock. Now the things that haunt my day to day nightmares are not always the things that were done to me, but things I focused on to survive. They linger like the scars he left. Scars on the brain. I still wonder how long it will be before that stops. before I don’t smell the leaves, see the thread of that shoe print, watch my blood drip, or see pale skin, white blondish hair and blue eyes walking away from me, and here the slam of the door like a gunshot. How long until I close my eyes and I don’t see that.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

I guess I had more weighing on my chest about this then I thought.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
1 year ago

Thanks, Mumsnet, for throwing your own kids under the bus

More like throwing them away with bathwater, I’d say.

Katamount
1 year ago

I don’t buy Posie Parker Picked A Peck Of Pickle Peppers’s story for a second, but this does underscore one truism of the internet: with so much information available, it really is incumbent upon everybody to do a little bit of homework with respect to engagement and opinions. Odds are Pickle Pepper here knew exactly who JF Gariepy was and knew it would get attention. Nobody buys ignorance as an excuse anymore, not when Google is powerful enough to read minds.

There was another story I saw blowing up upon my return to Twitter, which was Contrapoints upsetting non-binary folks by having trans porn star Buck Angel cameo in her latest video on “Opulence”. Buck being a “transmedicalist” had the Twitter pile-on going so vehemently that I really am baffled by why they hope to achieve by tearing Natalie down. It had me reflecting on why I so rarely engage people directly on Twitter: I’m not one for dog-piles.

Sorta on the same wavelength was the story that Air Canada would be using “Welcome Everybody” instead of “Ladies and Gentlemen” to greet passengers onboard flights, in deference to non-binary travelers. Now Air Canada does indeed suck for other reasons, but the triggered right-wingers were nothing short of delicious. I had to point out that even a cartoon character who debuted a quarter-century ago knows the score:

comment image

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Lainy
I’m so sorry you suffered that traumatic experience. And I’m sorry it continues to hurt you today. May you have healing and peace.

@WWTH

Do they really not think that right wing Christian health care providers or employers won’t “exercise their conscience” and discriminate against cis queer people too?

Judging by the way TERFs have acted before, my guess is they see any cis LGB people harmed as collateral damage. They, like the alt right, are willing to harm themselves so long as it harms others as well (i.e. “to own the libs”).

sarah_kay_gee
sarah_kay_gee
1 year ago

I absolutely DID confuse Posie Parker with Parker Posey when I saw the title of this article in my email and had a few seconds of extreme disappointment. Whew, crisis averted, I can safely continue to enjoy Christopher Guest mockumentaries.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Judging by the way TERFs have acted before, my guess is they see any cis LGB people harmed as collateral damage. They, like the alt right, are willing to harm themselves so long as it harms others as well (i.e. “to own the libs”).

Sometimes I do wonder though how many terfs that speak for lesbian women are actually lesbians. It just be really ironic if it was a bunch of straight women talking about how lesbian women feel about certain things.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Lainy

Sometimes I do wonder though how many terfs that speak for lesbian women are actually lesbians. It just be really ironic if it was a bunch of straight women talking about how lesbian women feel about certain things.

Well, I know of a number of cis male TERFs who claim to speak for cis women, so it wouldn’t be that surprising if they have straight women speaking for lesbians. The majority of lesbians I know are supportive of trans* folks, and the majority of transphobes I know are cishet men (with a few cishet women).

@sarah_kay_gee
I had the exact same thought.

Amy E
Amy E
1 year ago

@Katamount – just fixing your link to the Air Canada story – here

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

Well, I know of a number of cis male TERFs who claim to speak for cis women, so it wouldn’t be that surprising if they have straight women speaking for lesbians. The majority of lesbians I know are supportive of trans* folks, and the majority of transphobes I know are cishet men (with a few cishet women).

Yes the majority of lesbians I know are supportive of trans people as well. And I know there is bound to be some that are not because that’s how people work, but I can’t imagine it’s wide numbers like everyone seems to think it is. The way a lot of it is framed that it’s lesbians against trans women. It bothers me because there is still that idea that lesbian women are dangerous to straight women so I just can’t imagine mass numbers of lesbians turning around and throwing the same stereotype at trans people.

Cyborgette
Cyborgette
1 year ago

@Lainy – so much sympathies. And what an absolute coward the other person was! I hope their decision still haunts them TBH.

Re: lesbian vs. trans folks politics. Yeah, my experience as well has been that the strongest support I get from cis folks is from cis lesbians, especially from those who defy gender conventions themselves. They deal with a lot of the same oppressions we do, and I wish more trans women would treat them nicely. And there’s discourse to be had IMO around the inherent binarism of cis vs. trans, and how blanket distrust of cis people can perpetuate oppression.

And yeah I’m completely not surprised by a TERF allying with open white supremacists. Transphobia in feminism tends to come out of a lot of the same stuff that sees Black people as predatory, and Black women as “not real women”.

OTOH from what I’ve seen, TERFs farther on the left – not transphobic liberals, rather MLM aligned ones like Meghan Murphy – are in fact very loud and effective feminists. And one of the things that really bothers me about this, is that I’ve gotten to associate terms like “anti-rape” with people who are anti-trans and anti-sex-worker, because of their domination of more radical anti-abuser discourse; and also because the intersectional left is IME fucking terrible at handling abusers within its own collective ranks.

IDK. That militant willingness to judge and to harm others, the same stuff that helps us root out abusers and protect each other, also seems very easy itself to corrupt into bigotry and systematized abuse. (Including child abuse, if you look at some of the stuff TERFs do online.) I really don’t know a solution.

Sorry for the ramble, just feeling exhausted and cynical.

Dalillama
Dalillama
1 year ago

@Bina

And in fact, nobody’s “mutilating” ANY children’s bodies; every medical expert in the trans field recommends that nothing so radical as surgery be undertaken before a child turns 18

In fact, intersex children are routinely surgically mutilated at birth, but TERFs seem fine with that.

betrayer
betrayer
1 year ago

Buck Angel is a bigot who outed Lana Wachowski against her will, and Contrapoints absolutely deserves whatever she gets as a result of working with him.

What people want is for Natalie to stop palling around with reactionaries that spread hate speech. Imagine if she had Blaire White do voices for her videos, would you be ok with that? Because that’s the direction she’s heading.

Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
Redsilkphoenix: Jetpack Vixen, Intergalactic Meanie
1 year ago

*slides a Purrli over to Lainy as a distraction from bad memories*

I don’t recall if you ever said you have/had a cat, but this is a decent substitute whenever you need exposure to emergency purrfection and your cat can’t be near for whatever reason.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@betrayer

Imagine if she had Blaire White do voices for her videos, would you be ok with that? Because that’s the direction she’s heading.

She tried to have a live event with Blaire White a while ago. It got cancelled. It wouldn’t surprise me if she tried to have Blaire White guest. Blaire White is awful and anyone should notice that, but it seems Natalie is more interested in shocking people than anything else. She’s a shock jock at this point.

Nick Kiddle
Nick Kiddle
1 year ago

Posie Parker said that trans men should be sterilised. Not sure whether it was a proposed punishment for our betrayal of the sisterhood or a solution to the onerous burden of having to say “pregnant people”. But with attitudes like that, you can see why she was quite comfortable chatting to a Nazi.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Nick Kiddle
I’m guessing it’s the former. TERFs, much like conservatives, are mostly interested in regulations and laws for the purpose of punishing people they don’t like.

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@Lainy

I’m sorry that happened to you. It sounds terrible and no one should ever have to experience something like that.

But the one good thing from that trauma? it made me stop waiting for someone to save me. For someone to give a damn when they saw him hurt me. For someone to notice the bruises and bag under my eyes. It made me stop relying on others and taught me that if I wanted to survive I had to stand on my own feet and find some sort of strength to save myself. It took all of my hope being destroyed and my lost faith in humanity for me to finally start fighting back. And then to fight for others, because even though I was strong enough to take, there will always be someone who isn’t. They need the help that I was looking for.

I don’t want to overstep my bounds or sound dismissive here, I would also like to add that I haven’t been sexually assaulted before. However, I was raised by both a malignant narcissist and a victimized narcissist, and had other abusive figures throughout my life so I know a little bit about trauma. Still I can only relay to you what I have learned from my experience, and I’m not sure how it will apply to your case.

It’s okay to learn how to stand up for yourself and fight back. It’s also okay to try and stand up for others who can’t fight back, for one reason or the other. But make no mistake: the ability to do so, does not stem from trauma and trying to connect both might be harmful to your mental and/or emotional health.

The idea that you needed such a horrible experience to lose hope in humanity, and start fighting back would seem to almost justify the evil and apathy you were subject to. And I get that you in no way wished for such a thing to happen to you, and you’re just trying to make sense of the world around you with what you were left with, after what happened.

But you didn’t need such a thing. You did not deserve it. Carrying trauma around can, at first glance, make you feel powerful because all the anger and rage can often numb the pain and sorrow, and provide you with the strength to fight back. But at the same time it sort of makes you have to carry the trauma around as a catalyst for your strength.

You can be strong without trauma, as a matter of fact you already are and you always were. I’m not sure how you can get rid of it, make sense of it, or overcome it, because I’m still sort going through this process myself. Nothing I say is magically going to make it go away, but I do recommend you seek therapy to learn how to better understand and process these feelings.

Hope I did not overstep my bounds or offend you, or anybody else in here. Take care!

Sheila Crosby
1 year ago

I’m surprised that nobody’s mentioned Posie Parker cosying up to the American religious right. One reason TERFs are so loud is that they get a bundle of cash from people like Focus on the Family to produce glossy brochures full of lies. I seem to remember that they’ve mentioned a strategy of trying to split the T from LGB as a first step to going after the LGB.

Sorry, I don’t remember the exact details.

I seem to be seeing two kinds of TERFs. One is the older feminists who used to be great. People like Germaine Greer and Ophelia Benson. I’m deeply disappointed in them.

The other kind is feministsin name only. Posie Parker and friends are activists for women about as much as MRAs work for men.

Katamount
1 year ago

@betrayer and @Naglfar

I am neither trans nor non-binary, so my opinion amounts to little in this discussion. However, I did find InnuendoStudios venture an analysis of this matter on Curious Cat and found myself agreeing with a great deal of it:

https://curiouscat.me/InnuendoStudios/post/1004730846

Probably the biggest takeaway I’ve had from Natalie’s videos is just how fraught with tension transition can really be, and she lays it bare with every video she does. She’s navigating the waters of her own identity the best she can, and perhaps her level of prominence isn’t conducive to that. Frankly, she shouldn’t have agreed to allow Buck Angel to cameo and hope she learns from this. We’ve all seen her learn from her mistakes, so I’m confident she’ll learn from this one.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Does anyone listen to the Gaslit Nation podcast? They connect the dots between various right wing movements really, really well. And they pick up the big stories before everyone else is paying attention. For example, Ukraine.

Anyway, it’s no coincidence that Nazis and evangelicals and TERFs and the manosphere and the major conservative parties in every country are all blending together.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Sheila Crosby

I’m surprised that nobody’s mentioned Posie Parker cosying up to the American religious right. One reason TERFs are so loud is that they get a bundle of cash from people like Focus on the Family to produce glossy brochures full of lies.

I believe I had heard about that somewhere. That doesn’t surprise me, and I’m sure the right likes this deal as well. Not only do they get their ideas out there, but they can use these women as shields from accusations of misogyny (e.g. “We aren’t misogynists! Posie Parker is a feminist, and she’s with us!”) and they can use them to infiltrate spaces that ordinarily would not allow their presence.

The other kind is feministsin name only. Posie Parker and friends are activists for women about as much as MRAs work for men.

They sound quite a bit like MRAs, at least to me. It would be genuinely hard to distinguish MRA quotes (with a few words swapped) and TERF quotes, like that quiz on TERFs vs incels.

@Katamount
My opinion is by no means the only valid one, and there undoubtedly are others who are more immersed in the study of gender and are more qualified than I am to respond to this. However, my thoughts on Innuendo’s analysis:

Innuendo (is this 1 person or a team of people under one name?) is much more forgiving than I am about mistakes. They are correct in noting that Natalie has changed, as people do, in her opinions and that she has apologized for many past mistakes.

I am not very forgiving as a person. I tend to hold long grudges against people that cloud my perception of them. This is probably not a good tendency, and it is likely not the best for my mental health, but it is still a part of my personality. To me, it is hard to forgive when someone repeatedly makes mistakes. Different kinds of mistakes, yes, but it seems many of them demonstrate repeated indifference to a certain group. Time after time, her actions have shown ignorance toward the non-binary community, which has led to a somewhat unsteady relationship between her and that community. I am not accusing Natalie of being transmed or truscum, but I am saying that she does not seem to care that she has agitated this community, and she seems to repeatedly invite people who are known antagonists.

I am not saying not to watch her videos or to avoid her social media, and I am definitely not calling for more people to pile on on Twitter. I am simply saying that I’m through with her, and I will not be continuing to consume her content, as she has wronged the NB community, which already is marginalized even in LGBT spaces, too many times.

Marcelinethevampirequeen
Marcelinethevampirequeen
1 year ago

Delurking to say holy shit what is with all the hate on sites that seem innocent? I’m not a parent and never want to be so sores like mumsnet don’t enter my sphere of consciousness but how is it such a cesspit of hatred?

I thought it was just a group for parents and would have tips on bedtime routines and parenting advice. Instead it’s a toxic hellhole; transphobia, racism, bigotry, hatred against people with fertility issues…hate does love hate.

I truly believe all TERFs are only a YouTube video away from outright nazism and this proves it.

@Lainy I’m so goddamn sorry you lived that. My heart breaks for you. You’re so strong. If you want them please have my internet hugs and my dogs sweet snores

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@WWTH

That sounds insteresting. Mind if we get a link? How long has it been going on?

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Marcelinethevampirequeen
This article explains a bit about how Mumsnet went to the TERFs. It doesn’t talk about the racism and other bigotries, but my guess is those were brought in on the backs of the TERFs.

mcbender
1 year ago

@WWTH, @Diego Duarte

Gaslit Nation is excellent! I’ll admit I don’t always listen immediately when they come out, because it can be tough to get through (and I often find it frustrating because they make everything seem so obvious and nobody else is covering it).

https://www.patreon.com/gaslit is where I find it, I don’t know if it’s available elsewhere. They do have some content that’s patron-exclusive (including ad-free versions) but you can listen to the episodes without subscribing.

On topic: fuck TERFs. I’m trying to think of something more coherent to say and not really finding it. They’re reactionary assholes who go out of their way to do harm, and if that weren’t bad enough, they make it harder for actual feminists to get work done by making them look worse through association.

bekabot
bekabot
1 year ago

In fact, intersex children are routinely surgically mutilated at birth, but TERFs seem fine with that.

Fairly radical surgery has always been OK with pretty much everybody as long as the end product of it is ‘better’ (that is, more heteronormative) men and (especially) women. Hormonal meddling is not off the table either, when it’s used for the purpose of producing bodies which society regards as more ‘ideal’ that the bodies produced by nature. I know I’ve told this story before, but I’m repeating it now: I went to school with a very boyish-looking girl whose parents were thinking about having her shot up with estrogen in order to give her a more womanly appearance. They didn’t want her to go through life looking like a beanpole, which sounds harmless enough, except that she was perfectly healthy the way she was and the least of the side effects she would have experienced if she’d been put on an estrogen regimen would have been something like artificially-induced morning sickness — and it would have gotten worse from there. (She could have ended up with high blood pressure or cancer of the ovaries or both, etc., etc.) Fortunately her parents thought better of it in the end, but for a while they were all set to go, for no better reasons than strictly aesthetic ones. So, basically, when somebody comes at me today with some story about teenagers having their body parts chopped off or radically reconfigured or being made to chug-a-lug horrible hormonal cocktails, I’m not impressed. I know perfectly good and well that the same things have been done in the past in pursuit of a different goal, and were not deemed objectionable then — which means that it can’t be the procedures themselves which are at issue, but only what the procedures are for.

weirwoodtreehugger: chief manatee

Diego,

I listen here
https://gaslitnation.libsyn.com

I’m a newer listener so I’m not sure how long it’s been going. I may go through all the archives eventually though. There are a couple of ads, but nothing invasive.

It’s hilarious how yesterday’s episode warned about how much more open and brazen the Trump regime is going to become about their corruption and then today, Mick Mulvaney admits to quid pro quo.

Lainy
Lainy
1 year ago

@Diego

I go to therapy ever other Tuesday, I’m doing okay right now.

To Everyone else
I’m okay really, I think I just needed to get it off my chest.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
1 year ago

@Katamount:

I am neither trans nor non-binary, so my opinion amounts to little in this discussion. However, I did find InnuendoStudios venture an analysis of this matter on Curious Cat and found myself agreeing with a great deal of it:

https://curiouscat.me/InnuendoStudios/post/1004730846

Erm … how do I read the contents of this article without letting them run code on my machine?

It just says “Javascript is required” and neither disabling CSS nor View Source seems to expose the article text.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Surplus
Try this.

Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
Surplus to Requirements, Observer of the Vast Blight-Wing Enstupidation
1 year ago

@Naglfar: That’s readable without lowering my machine’s security. Thanks. How did you find it?

Kevin
Kevin
1 year ago

@ bekabot

Now you’ve reminded me about how Caster Semanya and some other cis women athletes are being treated just because their quite naturally unusually high androgen levels confer a competitive advantage. Yet another example of society trying to police women’s bodies. Some TERFy types even commented on Semanya being big and ‘masculine looking.’ Well, so are the Williams sisters, in some folks’ view, but nobody is seriously suggesting or even hinting that they might be ‘men in drag.’

Ohlmann
Ohlmann
1 year ago

@Kevin : you wish. Of course there is plenty of people saying they are men in drag or transexual.

Apart from that, I am not surprised despite the fact they should be enemy. Thoses people are more motivated by their hatred than by the thing they hate.

Also, female TERF are probably my number one thought when anyone say that the world would be more peaceful, less hateful, or anything if it was women who leaded. Turn out that A – power corrupt and B – it’s education and upbringing that count to make you an hateful piece of wood, and not gender, skin color, or other genetical trait.

Naglfar
Naglfar
1 year ago

@Surplus
I just pasted the contents of the page into pastebin.

Diego Duarte
Diego Duarte
1 year ago

@WWTH

It’s hilarious how yesterday’s episode warned about how much more open and brazen the Trump regime is going to become about their corruption and then today, Mick Mulvaney admits to quid pro quo.

That and yesterday William Barr went to Notre Dame university and said non-christians can go to hell. It seems their strategy is to own everything they’ve done and then say “so what?!”

Hoping it doesn’t pay off because, more often than not, this is the crossroad that will decide whether Rule of Law will prevail or whether you will spiral down into an open dictatorship. One where elections are extremely rigged, or don’t even take place.