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#metoo actual activism allegedly false accusations alt-right AntiFa domestic violence hate speech literal nazis men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny racism rape rape culture sexual abuse sexual assault

Far-right groups involved in today’s #HimToo rally in Portland are full of men charged with domestic violence and sexual assault

The paper trail

By David Futrelle

Today in Portland, members of far-right street gang Patriot Prayer and assorted other brawlers on the fascist right are rallying around the banner of #HimToo, a trollish antifeminist response to the #MeToo movement suggesting that many rape accusations are simply false.

I don’t know about the “false” part, but many in and around Patriot Prayer certainly have experience with accusations.

Rose City Antifa has put up a lengthy post documenting that a stunning number of those invited by organizers to the rally today, or otherwise associated with Patriot Prayer or the group’s close ally The Proud Boys, have been arrested in the past for domestic violence and sexual assault. One man formerly associated with Patriot Prayer pled guilty to the sexual assault of a 14-year-old, and a regular videographer for the group “was charged with two counts of forcible sodomy on a victim under age 13,” according to Rose City Antifa.

“Men are certainly also victimized by the sexual and domestic violence and rape culture,” Rose City Antifa declares.

However, [rally organizer] Haley [Adams] and Patriot Prayer’s usage of the #HimToo hashtag has overwhelmingly ignored the possibility that men might be victims of violence in favor of simply “triggering the libs,” and publicly mocking and discrediting any claims of sexual violence.

The hypocrisy is especially ripe given the histories of so many of those involved. Rose City Antifa notes that

Not only is the premise of a “him too” rally ridiculous on its face, the behavior of Patriot Prayer, Proud Boys, Street Preachers and other associated far-right and white nationalist groups, both on the streets of Portland and in their private lives, shows that they are the exact the sort of threat described by the concept of “rape culture.”

Yep.

Local antifascist activists have organized a pushback march highlighting the experiences of sexual assault survivors; as I write this, the counterprotest has attracted several hundred, easily outnumbering the twenty or so who have shown up at the #HimToo rally. See live coverage of the even on the Twitter hashtag #PushbackPDX.

Here’s what the #HimToo rally looked like about a half hour ago:

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Bina
2 years ago

The Venn diagram between fascists and MRAs is rapidly approaching a perfect circle.

If it isn’t one already.

sunnysombrera
sunnysombrera
2 years ago

@Bina

It’s been said but: misogyny does seem to be a gateway to bigotry of other stripes.

Eldridge the Cleaver
Eldridge the Cleaver
2 years ago

I’m sure Paul Elam and co will be very quick to tell us they’re not in any way responsible for this.

(Hint: They are)

Jesus christ, this is almost as bad as that time people marched in India in favor of a rapist.

sunnysombrera
sunnysombrera
2 years ago

Jesus christ, this is almost as bad as that time people marched in India in favor of a rapist.

Wait what

TreePerson
TreePerson
2 years ago

#MeToo is already gender neutral and some cis-men have used it to come forward with their stories,
its not anti-men its anti-rape to conflate the two suggests you believe all men a rapists and still side with them.

Painteyelash
Painteyelash
2 years ago

Why am I not surprised..thank you for posting the link to Antifa, these people are hateful as f***.

heebee
heebee
2 years ago

I understand that if men are falsely accused it could ruin their lives but HIMTOO will just make less women want to report harrassment – very poorly thought out idea

Also I think men actually (by enlarge) understand what rape is. They just think rape is a typical grab-someone and pin them down in an alleyway kind of thing. They dont grasp that manipulation, emotional blackmail, asking a woman 10000 times until she says yes to sex is rape also

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
2 years ago

Ugh!

I still remember running into a guy who insisted that as a victim he had the right to speak up whenever rape was the topic, even if the topic was initially and specifically framed as how rape affects women. I could sympathize with his victimhood (child molestation), but not with his need to make the discussion about HIS pain.

The self-centeredness, sadly, was not limited to sexual abuse discussions. He also once told me that if someone doesn’t care for or doesn’t like media of which he is a fan, then he has “the right” (his phrase) to try and get them to try it again. Apparently “it just doesn’t appeal to me” cut no ice with him.

I don’t understand that behavior. Sure, I’ve had times when I wished the world would accommodate itself to me, but I always knew I was being childish or selfish or whatever. I didn’t think I had the right to insist on accommodation to my wishes.

Michael Suttkus, II
Michael Suttkus, II
2 years ago

heebee:

I understand that if men are falsely accused it could ruin their lives but HIMTOO will just make less women want to report harrassment – very poorly thought out idea

Poorly thought out? From their perspective, that’s the idea working exactly as intended. As they say, it’s a feature, not a bug.

Also I think men actually (by enlarge) understand what rape is.

FYI, the phrase is “by and large”, not “by enlarge”.

sylvia bath
2 years ago

This is what my mom believes! Today she was defending Kavanaugh and talking about how unjustly he was treated and attacking Blasey Ford! It’s so infuriating how people think women should just live in fear of rape but it’s so sad and unfair if rapists have to fear any sort of consequence.

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
2 years ago

@sylvia bath

Yup. Strangely, a lot of conservatives will rant a great deal about victims’ rights and scream about coddling criminals, except when it comes to sexual assault. Unless the perpetrator is black and the victim’s white, of course.

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

Also I think men actually (by enlarge) understand what rape is. They just think rape is a typical grab-someone and pin them down in an alleyway kind of thing.

If they don’t understand that rape is not always (not usually, even!) a grab-someone and pin them down in an alleyway kind of thing, they don’t understand what rape is. There have been studies showing that most school-aged boys and a fair number of girls, too, incorrectly identify what is and is not rape when scenarios are described (basically, they don’t understand what is and is not consent). This is not something to be handwaved away.

Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
2 years ago

@sunnysombrera: You don’t want to know.

MissEB47 (Rainbow Lorikeet and Beak Typist)
MissEB47 (Rainbow Lorikeet and Beak Typist)
2 years ago

It sickens me that these far right arseholes (many whom are rapists as David pointed out) believe that they are the real victims. The good thing about these events, though, is that the counter protestors often vastly outnumber those in the rally itself.

Red Lion
Red Lion
2 years ago

“There have been studies showing that most school-aged boys and a fair number of girls, too, incorrectly identify what is and is not rape when scenarios are described (basically, they don’t understand what is and is not consent). This is not something to be handwaved away.

THIS!

Katherine the Adequate
Katherine the Adequate
2 years ago

Victorious Parasol,

How ironic the guy you ran into doesn’t accept having a difference of opinion from his and the right to say “no” to something. Sometimes people change their minds, but their rights to make decisions are always theirs and theirs alone. At a certain point it’s creepy and out of bounds to persist at trying to persuade them.

But you’d think a survivor of abuse would appreciate the right all individuals have to say “no” to something, whether it’s a media choice, or something more fundamental such as having physical contact.

Bina
2 years ago

Is it just me, or does that Haley Adams look just like Hatey Katie Hopkins?

(And not just in terms of visages, either.)

Gijoel
Gijoel
2 years ago

@sunny. It might be this.

Bina
2 years ago

Also, I wonder if this guy isn’t going to end up in that bunch pretty soon, if he’s not there already. He sure sounds like he’s picking up their basic ideology:

https://www.reddit.com/r/self/comments/9vs05k/my_son_is_a_hateful_incel_and_i_just_cannot_save/

Jane Done
Jane Done
2 years ago

I knew, the instant I heard it, the term “western chauvinist” was dog whistle for “male chauvinist”. Seriously, the latter is the only context I have ever heard that word being used in my entire life.

@Victorious Parasol, Katherine the Adequate

Reminds me of an anthropomorphic graphic novel based on the stories of real Holocaust survivors called “Maus”. The author contrasted a couple who were the sweetest people ever, despite surviving being put in death camps, with another survivor who was grumpy, caustic to his wife and extremely, unapologetically racist against black people.

Anyone can lack empathy. Anyone can be an asshole.

Aaron
Aaron
2 years ago

The “hateful incel” story is almost certainly fake. It trips a lot of my bullshit detectors, but the breaking point was when the father described finding a “treasure trove” of the sister’s underwear in the incel’s closet, “so saturated with old, moldy semen that they were hard as bricks.” This is not a thing that happened.

Vucodlak
Vucodlak
2 years ago

@ Aaron

I have no idea whether the post is real or not, but I really don’t see anything that pegs my bullshit-o-meter. I mean, yeah, what you highlighted is a repulsive bit of imagery, but why is it you think it didn’t happen?

Mogwitch
Mogwitch
2 years ago

@Vucodlak
I thought it was fake too. The story telling and the details “the father” chooses to linger on, when most parents who have stories about their children doing horrible things usually talk about their emotional pain, almost always describe the sweet child they loved and wonder when things went wrong. Parents who care about atrocities committed by their children feel a horrible sense of responsibility. Obviously some parents don’t care, but then they don’t write stories.
There is some clever story telling on reddit, but given the anguished accounts that do exist elsewhere of people whose children murdered or became neo-Nazis, this rubbed me up the wrong way. It felt emotionally shallow and a bit cruel.

Rei Malebario
Rei Malebario
2 years ago

I remember visiting a friend in Brighton when he was studying at the University of East Sussex. We went for a pint at the pub nearest to where he lived, a pub he hadn’t been to before.
When we had our pints and had sat down, we realised that two blokes at a table a few meters from us had stopped talking after we came in and were now just staring at us. It was pretty unpleasant and we quickly finished our pints and left.
As we exited, my mate remarked “This must be what being a woman is like”.

Kevin
Kevin
2 years ago

@ Rei Malebario

University of East Sussex ? As a Brightonian I have to be ‘that guy.’ My home town (The City of Brighton and Hove) is the home of the University of Sussex and of the University of Brighton (my old college in a previous incarnation.) Easy mistake for an out of towner to make though, especially if the two of you visited some other watering holes to steady your nerves after your unpleasant experience. I can only apologize for those inhospitable types, this is usually a pretty accepting sort of place.

Sheila Crosby
2 years ago

You know, here’s a certain similarity in the way they treat accusations of rape and racism.

They’ll swear up down and sideways that racism is really bad, but what they just did isn’t racist, no Siree. “Prefering the white candidate over the slightly better qualified PoC 27 times in a row isn’t in the least racist. I’m not in favour of gas chambers and I have black friends!”

They’ll swear up down and sideways that rape is really bad, but what they just did isn’t rape, no Siree. “That wasn’t rape because she voluntarily invited him in to use the toilet. Rape-rape is a dreadful thing. Besides, some of my friends are female!”

In both cases they agree that the bad thing is rape, but it never applies in this case. Or any other case they come across.

Victorious Parasol
Victorious Parasol
2 years ago

@Katherine the Adequate and Jane Done

Yeah, his lack of self-reflection is one of the reasons why we no longer move in the same circles. There are times I regret not trying to make him understand just how much he has hurt people, but whenever I start thinking like that, I remember how many times I’ve seen other people try to redirect him, ranging from “Dude, not cool!” to more sophisticated arguments. None of it ever seemed to make a difference.

What scares me the most is that he’s a teacher. Not in the public school system, but he’s in a position to influence kids.

JenniferAndLightning
JenniferAndLightning
2 years ago

@MissEB47:

It sickens me as well, and yet it is all too common among perpetrators of sexual assault and domestic violence. It’s one of the key reasons that various redemption programs for sexual assault perpetrators focus so strongly on admitting guilt. The type of people who commit these crimes are also the types of people who never accept responsibility for anything.

hebeee
hebeee
2 years ago

Sorry I meant “don’t understand what rape is”

Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
Yutolia the Green Hash Thing
2 years ago

Apparently some of them are complaining that we don’t just let landowners vote:

https://eugeneantifa.noblogs.org/post/2018/11/16/weed-nazis-rent-house-to-white-power-couple-meet-the-kilgores/

kupo
kupo
2 years ago

@heebee

That makes more sense!

@Mogwitch

Everyone deals with emotionally difficult situations uniquely. This is in the same vein as assuming how someone should mourn a death or respond to a violent attack. There’s no script for how people process pain. If the story is true he has spent years coming to terms with this and has now reached a point where he’s just done with the son. I don’t find it hard to believe he would no longer be dwelling on the child he once knew.

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

Didn’t #metoo start with Harvey Weinstein and a large number of accusers? Considering how these women were then accused of “seeking attention”, and how many other men were subsequently exposed, I’ve sometimes thought in retrospect that the movement should’ve been actually named #himtoo.

Monzach
Monzach
2 years ago

Now, you can call me weird for this (and I suspect that the men at that rally probably would), but I’ve found that the easiest way to avoid getting accused of doing things is not to do them. I’m sure it’s just me being lucky and all that (/s, obviously).

Full Metal Ox
2 years ago

@Jane Done:

Reminds me of an anthropomorphic graphic novel based on the stories of real Holocaust survivors called “Maus”. The author contrasted a couple who were the sweetest people ever, despite surviving being put in death camps, with another survivor who was grumpy, caustic to his wife and extremely, unapologetically racist against black people.

(1)

Art Spiegelman’s portrayal of Jews as mice–i.e., just about everybody’s prey and stock plucky cartoon underdogs–prompts this thought; bear with me.

The average hearing range of humans in their prime runs ~20 Hz to 20,000 Hz.

The hearing range of dogs–extremely subject to breed and age, of course–averages around 67 to 45,000 Hz.

The hearing range of mice runs 1Hz to 70,000-100,000 Hz.

Ergo: mice can hear dog whistles.

(In other words: Gentiles need to pay attention when Jewish people become nervous about seemingly happenstance things like too many occurrences of the numbers 14 and 88. This applies with other privileged and marginalized groups, of course, although the specific dogwhistles differ.)

(1)Note that this was Spiegelman’s rightful story to tell; the grump was based on his own father.)

Jesalin: Clit-o-centric Lesbian Goddess
Jesalin: Clit-o-centric Lesbian Goddess
2 years ago

Now, you can call me weird for this (and I suspect that the men at that rally probably would), but I’ve found that the easiest way to avoid getting accused of doing things is not to do them. I’m sure it’s just me being lucky and all that (/s, obviously).

No…I just don’t see that catching on.

/s

Diptych
Diptych
2 years ago

Speaking of dogwhistles involving 14s and 88s… anyone remember there was a bit of a brouhaha about White Wolf apparently winking to the far right, including suggestions that vampires could join the alt-right online, and 1488 being snuck into dice roll examples? So I mentioned this to a chum who’s more of a tabletop gamer than me, and he laughed in my face and said there was obviously nothing to it and why would a gaming company court fascists anyway? (To indicate that their official forums were a good place to recruit, perhaps? But what do I know…)

Anyhow, White Wolf’s just been integrated into their parent company and had their leadership ousted as a result of bungling a story about persecution of queer folks in Chechnya. I don’t know all the details, but, given this isn’t the first time something like this has happened (including a book about the Holocaust, if memory serves), I feel faintly vindicated.

Katamount
Katamount
2 years ago

Oh sweet internet… if you’re not connecting me to the furry community that changed my life, you’re connecting chronic sexual batterers for virtue signalling public spectacles.

@Jane Doe

I knew, the instant I heard it, the term “western chauvinist” was dog whistle for “male chauvinist”. Seriously, the latter is the only context I have ever heard that word being used in my entire life.

What makes that so laughable is that they just take things from all sorts of civilizations and cultures that warred and competed over the years and just dump them under the heading “Western.” I was listening to Natalie “Contrapoints” Wynn on the Chapo podcast and they were riffing on YouTube The Golden One (basically a Swedish Nazis bodybuilder who’s really into Skyrim), and how he cosplays in Roman helmets while holding a Celtic sword and a Norman kite shield. Just zero historical or even self-awareness.

AsAboveSoBelow
AsAboveSoBelow
2 years ago

@Katamount:

…he cosplays in Roman helmets while holding a Celtic sword and a Norman kite shield.

OMG. That actually hurts. This kind of crap is sadly common in some neo-pagan circles, too.

@Full Metal Ox:

Ergo: mice can hear dog whistles.

Mind. Blown. Seriously. That adds a whole new dimension to Maus.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
2 years ago

There was another similar incident in Philadelphia that was even more demeaning to the alt-right than this one in Portland:

‘Proud Boys’ Outnumbered at Protest, Taxis Refuse to Drive Them Home

Alan Robertshaw
Alan Robertshaw
2 years ago

In Liverpool they chased the Nazis out of town, whilst playing the Benny Hill music.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/edl-laughed-liverpool-benny-hill-13133627

Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
Lumipuna (nee Arctic Ape)
2 years ago

Katamount:

The Golden One (basically a Swedish Nazis bodybuilder who’s really into Skyrim), and how he cosplays in Roman helmets while holding a Celtic sword and a Norman kite shield

…with an arrow in his knee.

(sorry)

Cheerful Warthog
Cheerful Warthog
2 years ago

I already had no patience for the “you should be as or more outraged by false sexual assault charges as you are by actual sexual assault” argument, because… well, it’s dumb… but that took a whole new level when it was pointed out to me that because false sexual assault charges are so vanishingly rare, it is far, far, FAR less likely for a man to be falsely accused of sexual assault than it is for a man to… be sexually assaulted.

Anyone actually concerned with the plight of men, and not just about being the He-Man Woman Hater’s Club, might want to consider that.

Katamount: A Celtic sword, a Norman kite shield, and no shirt. “You will not get past my solid defence, for my shield is as…” “just stab him in the anywhere guys, i mean, literally in the anywhere”

Diptych: White Wolf has a serious problem with that, as I recall. The conflation of “edgy with an artistic purpose” (which is often great) with “edgy for edginess’s sake” (which is always terrible).

Jane Doe: I’d say it’s about as often white chauvinism as it is male chauvinism, but you’re right, it’s definitely frequently the latter.

Jenora Feuer
Jenora Feuer
2 years ago

The good news is that more and more people are starting to see exactly what the alt-right is and are taking it seriously and mobilizing against it. (Note that taking them seriously is different from treating them seriously; playing Yakkety Sax is definitely the former but not the latter. They need to be taken seriously, but they don’t necessarily deserve to be treated seriously.)

The bad news is that this sort of thing is just giving them more reason to move from the ‘gaslighting’ page to the ‘look what you made me do!!!’ page of the abuser’s handbook. Which, of course, a number of them already have.

Doesn’t mean we can afford to stop standing against them. Don’t give them the Heckler’s Veto.

Kiwiwriter
Kiwiwriter
2 years ago

Proud Boys and Junior Fascists having criminal records of rape and domestic abuse?

“I’m shocked. Shocked to my foundation. Gambling, here!”

“Your winnings, Captain Renault.”

“Oh….thank you.”

vaiyt
vaiyt
1 year ago

“Don’t be that girl”, “#HimToo”, the Men’s ‘Rights’ ‘Movement’ can only think of activism as reaction. They only get off their asses to attempt to disrupt the efforts of feminists rather than find their own ideas to promote. They’re focused on bringing women down rather than helping the men they say supposedly need it.

They’re a bigot’s idea of what a social justice movement is like.