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New Comment Policy

Cutest mod ever!
Cutest mod ever!

As promised, here is the new and I think improved comments policy.

It’s a bit long, but that’s in part because I’ve included sections that are designed to hopefully eliminate some of the contentious and often repetitive debates that have erupted in the past over the issue of ableism — in particular the use of words like “crazy” and “psycho” and the like. In the future, I am hoping that we can simply link new commenters to the policy (in particular, the “notes on ‘crazy'”) section and avoid a lot of the drama.

This policy is stricter towards those who “dig in” and insist on using problematic terms even though they’ve been informed of the rules about them; if they’ve been linked to the comments policy and persist in arguing or behaving badly, they will be banned. I’m also asking regulars to rein in their language in criticizing first-time offenders, and to not argue back with them if they persist. (There’s not much point to it, because offenders who persist will be banned.)

Not all of the changes and additions to the comments policy are in response to the ableism debates; I’ve also taken into consideration other controversies here, as well as comments policies on other blogs and broader discussions online about the best ways to moderate sites.

One other change: I will also put regular reminders in posts that all new commenters should read the comments policy before posting.

I am very much cognizant that many people who regularly read this blog — some of them who comment here regularly, some of whom are lurkers or only occasional commenters — are frustrated by the flame wars that have erupted here from time to time. I am frustrated as well, and troubled by the personal attacks I’ve seen in these discussions, directed not at trolls but at other commenters here in good faith.

I hope this new comment policy can end some of these flame wars before they start. If it doesn’t, I will (reluctantly) have to resort to shutting threads down and even suspending some commenters.

So here is the new comments policy. Discuss. Suggest improvements. Be civil.

Welcome prospective commenters!

Unmoderated internet forums quickly become shitheaps, so we have a few rules here. One thing to remember right off the bat: this is a feminist blog, designed (mostly) for a feminist audience. You don’t have to be a particular kind of feminist to post here, or even a feminist at all, but you do need to keep this in mind.

First comments from new commenters – or old commenters changing their name – automatically go to moderation. Regardless of your politics, if you start off here with a jerky or tediously argumentative comment, or if you trigger some other red flag for me, your first comment will never see the light of day.

MRAs, MGTOWs, PUAs, Red Pillers, “Equalists,” #GamerGaters and the like: you will be allowed to post here, if your first comment is amusing and/or not especially egregious, and if you more-or-less behave.

But I reserve the right to revoke your posting privileges at any time for any reason. You have a right to your opinions, but you don’t have a right to our attention. I am especially not interested in hearing your thoughts on Anita Sarkeesian (or some other target of angry dude harassment online).

Oh, and I sometimes set aside threads here as “no troll, no MRA” threads. If you post in one of them, even politely, you will be banned.

If you’re NOT an MRA or a troll, welcome!

You’re who this blog is really meant for. The comments too, provided you can participate in a generally constructive manner and can treat those you disagree with here with a certain degree of respect. Snark is fine; attacks and accusations and namecalling, not so much. 

If someone – whether a troll or a regular commenter — is acting badly enough to possibly warrant a suspension or ban, EMAIL ME OR THE MODS. That’s the fastest and most effective way to get it taken care of.

Some slightly more specific guidelines.

No bigotry (misogyny, racism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism, body shaming, and so forth). No slurs. I’ve put the worst ones in the mod filter, so comments containing them won’t appear. If you want to discuss someone else’s use of a slur, disguise the word so your comment won’t get caught by the filter – though if you do this as a “clever” way to use a slur yourself, you may well find yourself banned.

No threats or violent comments. That includes telling someone to “die in a fire” or remarking that so-and-so would probably be better off dead. This rule is in effect even when you are talking about vile misogynistic shitbags.

No gratuitously nasty personal attacks. Yes, discussions can sometimes get a bit contentious. You’re not required to be perfectly nice all the time. Just don’t be a total asshole. And don’t drag your disagreements with someone into every thread.

No doxxing or posting of personal identifying information. Don’t spread rumors or speculate without evidence on the possible criminal activity of anyone else, whether this is another commenter or a misogynistic shitbag.

No rape apologism, pedo apologism, victim blaming, and so forth.

Don’t misgender anyone. If you do it accidentally, apologize and get it right the next time. If you do it deliberately, you’re out.

Don’t attack anyone for their sexual preferences or kinks, so long as they involve consenting adults. Refrain from weird or creepy sexual oversharing. Whatever your opinion of sex work, don’t disparage sex workers, or use words like “whore” as a pejorative. (Feel free to talk about MRAs who are using the word pejoratively.)

Don’t attack people for their religion or their lack of religion.

Don’t be a mansplainer or indeed any kind of ‘splainer. That is, don’t lecture anyone on something they know better than you, particularly if that thing is their lived experience.

Don’t post too much or try to make threads all about you. Try to avoid drama.

If you have personal issues you want to bring up, that’s fine! Use the troll-free open threads set aside for personal stuff. I’ll post a new one every couple of weeks. (I also start threads regularly to discuss big events in the news that people here are concerned about; feel free to email if you think something has happened that warrants one.)

No sockpuppeting. No lying. No misrepresentation of yourself or other people. No posting in bad faith – e.g. posting friendly comments here while trashing the site and/or the people on it elsewhere.

No pile-ons. If a number of people have already offered the same criticism of another commenter, don’t add more comments to the pile.

All this said, you don’t have to be perfect to comment here. As sociologist Katherine Cross (@Quinnae_Moon) has noted, very few people arrive “fully formed to the world of activism, the perfect agents of change, somehow entirely cognizant of the ever shifting morass of rules and prescribed or proscribed words, phrases, argot, and thought.”

I want this blog to be open to all those who genuinely oppose misogyny and bigotry more generally, even those who may slip up from time to time.

Still, if you’re new here, or new to feminism, and the regulars here are telling you to avoid certain words, or pointing out something that you’re doing that’s problematic, don’t take it as a personal attack (unless it is couched as a personal attack, in which case email me). If they tell you to avoid particular language, uh, avoid using that language, and don’t explain that in your country calling a person a something-or-other is perfectly fine.

You don’t have to agree with all the rules and/or cultural norms here; but while you’re commenting here you are expected to respect them. If you think a rule is really, really wrong or ridiculous, don’t argue about it in the comments; send me an email about it.

And this brings us to the issue of ableism, which has been a contentious one here.

NOTES ON “CRAZY”

Avoid “crazy” talk. That is, using words like “crazy,” “psycho” and the like to describe the terrible ideas and actions of people you don’t like. It’s stigmatizing to those dealing with mental illness, who really don’t need the extra indignity of being compared to MRAs. Try using words like “ridiculous” or “absurd” or “terrible” instead. Call someone an “asshole” instead of a “psycho.” Try to avoid internet diagnoses of mental illness, and don’t use autism or Aspergers as an excuse for someone’s shitty behavior.

Saying someone is “paranoid,” “delusional,” or “narcissistic” is fine, if you don’t mean it as a diagnosis; these are useful descriptive terms.

If there is evidence that someone you are discussing does indeed have a mental illness, and this is relevant to the discussion, it can be appropriate to bring this up, though you should keep in mind that a hunch is not evidence.

All this said, words like “crazy,” “psycho,” and the like are extremely common, and plenty of people (including feminists, progressives, and people dealing with mental illness themselves) use them casually without intending to stigmatize those with mental illnesses. There’s a difference between saying “crazy people should all be locked up” and “boy, Eraserhead sure was a crazy movie!”

If you’re someone who uses these terms casually, and doesn’t actually want all “crazy” people locked up, it doesn’t make you an evil person, but you need to refrain from doing it here. (Again, if you disagree with this policy, and feel a need to make this disagreement known, DO NOT ARGUE ABOUT IT IN THE COMMENTS, send me an email instead.)

If you are a regular commenter here, and someone uses a problematic term like “crazy” or “psycho,” remind them gently that this is not how we do things here, and send them a link to this comment policy (and possibly the Welcome Package as well). Unless what they have said is particularly egregious, do not insult them or question their motives.

If they argue, remind them that arguing about this rule is also not allowed. If they continue, do not argue back; send me or the mods a note and they will be banned. (This may take a little while, so be patient and please do not give in to the impulse to argue with them.)

If others have already reminded them of the rules, move on.

Again, if someone is acting really shitty in the comments, whether a troll or a regular, SEND THE MODS (or me) AN EMAIL.

One other thing to keep in mind:

MRAs read this blog. So I would strongly urge you to comment here using an anonymous handle that cannot be traced to your real identity. And to be very careful about revealing any sort of personal information on this blog. If you inadvertently post something using the wrong account, or that otherwise reveals personal information, let the mods know so we can remove those comments.

Oh, wait, one other other thought:

Enjoy yourself!

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Alice Sanguinaria
5 years ago

This is awesome. 😀 Thanks!

Faint Praise
Faint Praise
5 years ago

Thanks for all the work put into maintaining the policy. I comment only infrequently which is probably why (it seems) I missed some recent hostility. Just wanted to share this because from my perspective, and probably that of many others, the comment section here is always delightful.

Everyone’s efforts are appreciated and effective. Those of you that encounter the rare hostilities undoubtedly find them demoralizing so I wanted everyone to remember how great it is the rest of the time.

Cheers all.

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago

I’m a little worried about the “don’t argue back” thing and how it relates to troll-mocking, I must admit.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
5 years ago

Looks pretty great to me! I guess we’ll see how things are enforced, but it looks sensible.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
5 years ago

I like it. Thank you.

Are there mods anymore? I mean beside you, David. If it’s just you right now, which email address should we use?

Deborah Hitchens (@Deb_Hitchens)

I think if you are having serious discussions then the comments should not be allowed to deteriorate into trivialities like “hey, what are you having for dinner tonight” because that is not staying on topic and it then it appears to make commenting on here a nonsense.
Either you are taking it seriously or you are not?

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago
Reply to  David Futrelle

@David

Great! Just making sure.

And thank you for all the hard work you do on this blog. It really means a lot; despite this not being a “safe space,” it’s one of two places on the Internet that feels safe to me, so I’m going to thank you and everyone else in this wonderful community. *hugs*

Deborah Hitchens (@Deb_Hitchens)

Apart from that, everything else seems fine, but just pondering does every comment I make have to wait for moderation?

katz
katz
5 years ago

ALL HAIL THE NEW COMMENT POLICY!

For real, dude, thanks for putting up with us and attempting to maintain law and order despite our best efforts to the contrary.

Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Banana Jackie Cake, for those who still want to call me "Banana", "Jackie" or whatever)
Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Banana Jackie Cake, for those who still want to call me "Banana", "Jackie" or whatever)
5 years ago

comment image

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

Wow. This is really good. I am embarrassed to admit that I’m surprised. I guess you were far more concerned with the personal abuse that has been going on than I gave you credit for.

These new rules, especially the one about personal attacks, would remove 25% of the comments on recent threads — and that’s good.

As a sometimes contrary commenter here who tends to receive abuse instead of argument, I sincerely thank you for this.

I was getting really sick of just ignoring it.

weirwoodtreehugger
5 years ago

This mostly looks good. I just have a couple of questions.

What exactly is grounds for thread closure or suspension? Was there a specific standard you had in mind? Or will it just be a case by case basis when there’s a threadsplosion? I do worry a little bit that a stricter comment policy might be used to tone police and people could just wind up spending time trying to get people they don’t like banned. I know it’s a tough balancing act between keeping things running smoothly and allowing people to speak their minds. I only ask because we’re all a bunch of opinionated people and inevitably we’re going to disagree about things. Sometimes passionately. I’m sure you only meant these things will be a last resort if things get thread of doomy, but I just wanted to make sure.

The other thing is, could you define piling on? As we discussed in the other thread, sometimes people get ninja’d. We all type at different paces and sometimes when one types out a longer post, there’s several replies by the time one hits post. Different people also seem to have different ideas about how many posts constitutes a pile on. To me it’s around ten posts, for someone else it might be two or three.

They’re just minor concerns. I’m sure you’re not looking to ban regulars willy nilly. I just thought I’d get some clarification.

Thanks for the new policy. I know you probably have better things to do than moderate fights.

marinerachel
marinerachel
5 years ago

Well done, David!

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

“don’t argue back” doesn’t apply to troll-mocking. Talking shit about MRAs, etc,, always fine.

Is there any kind of standard before someone gets the troll/MRA treatment?

Because right now the standard is that a commenter gets to call anyone who disagrees with them an MRA, an accusation which is then used to justify abuse. There are apparently some really good psychics here who seem to be able to discover secret MRAs under every rock. Coincidentally, these secret MRAs happen to be exactly the people they already feel like abusing.

Same thing with “troll.” Anyone you want to abuse, just decide they’re a troll.

KL
KL
5 years ago

“Don’t be a mansplainer or indeed any kind of ‘splainer. That is, don’t lecture anyone on something they know better than you, particularly if that thing is their lived experience”

I really want to stress this one. Please dont call someone names or say they are ridiculous based on an assumption you have that you havent actually lived or seriously researched.

weirwoodtreehugger
5 years ago

I’m going to quote Kirbywrap from the other thread here.

I would love for the people concerned about dogpiling to actually point towards specific examples. Like, with a link if at all possible, or enough detail so that people might be able to find the thread with google. Because I’m not sure if folks are using different definitions of “dogpiling,” or if someone’s memory is fuzzy and isn’t remembering the details (either remembering it as better or worse), or if stories are being passed around off-site, or what.

It’s hard for us folks accused of dogpiling to defend ourselves against something we don’t remember (or remember happening differently), and vague accusations that the community is terrible because of some unspecified behavior doesn’t exactly promote useful discussion.

I was just going to say something similar. A lot of people are constantly talking about how mean we are here, but it’s always vague. Can we stop with that? Address specific things that people have said and argue with that. Or if it’s a violation of the policy, email David. It’s extremely unhelpful to say things like “you’re always so mean and you were all mean to me this one time” without context. Don’t expect us to all remember and don’t expect everyone to take you at your word. Either link to the previous incident (if it relates to the current discussion) or just don’t bring it up all. A lot of the recent fights have started because someone will seize on one thing said to somebody else and use that as a springboard to talk about how horrible we all are. To me, that’s a form of bullying in and of itself because you can’t really defend against that.

weirwoodtreehugger
5 years ago

Had to be said,
Constantly playing the devil’s advocate in every single thread is troll behavior and that’s what you’ve been doing. If you think somebody abused you, email David, but don’t use this conversation to troll and cause extra drama.

Troll score 3/10. You get a few points for finding a somewhat clever way to troll. But since you mocked David’s furniture and what you perceived his relationships status to be on your very first post, I don’t think anybody is buying that you’re one of these misunderstood newbies we’ve been discussing. You cemented your troll status right away. Nice try though!

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago

@Had To Be Said

…wasn’t your first comment complaining that David was fat? (Or was that someone else using a really similar name?)

But I’m not sure here was the best place for a passive-aggressive comment (your first on this thread, not your second). I’ll try to keep this relatively civil, as I’d like not to derail this too much with the oh-no-meanness stuff.

“Sometimes contrary” is a bit of an understatement; I’ve never seen you come here except to disagree. What is a troll, if not someone who shows up only to disagree?

Jono
5 years ago

“… don’t use autism or Aspergers as an excuse for someone’s shitty behaviour.”

I hate it when people do that. It just makes people think that all AS people are like that when it’s not an excuse and we’re not all like that.

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago

@WWTH

Ah, that’s what it was. For some reason I thought he was one of the “your weight makes your argument invalid” people. Or did he do that as well? >_<

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

wwth,

I was not addressing you.

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago
Reply to  Had To Be Said

@Had To Be Said

What’s my comment, then, chopped liver? 😉

katz
katz
5 years ago

Is there any kind of standard before someone gets the troll/MRA treatment?

You are the standard.

Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
Scented Fucking Hard Chairs
5 years ago

I still think Had To Be Said is a sock of the dozen other trolls with very similar names and identical schticks. Either that or they’re the Borg of trolls.

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago

@Had To Be Said

I mean, not that you weren’t just rude to WWTH, but why *only* her? Was mine just not even good enough to acknowledge, even rudely, or something? 😛

@everyone else

Maybe I need a different icon. I think trolls see the boobs and decide I’m ignorable.

Aerinea
Aerinea
5 years ago

Although I can’t speak for the ASD community as a whole, I’m personally happy to see that autism and Asperger’s aren’t allowed as excuses for bad behavior. What I’ve been able to get from the Autism Self-Advocacy community is that many of us want acceptance, reasonable accommodation for our disability, and understanding, not a justification for creepy actions towards those we find attractive.

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

None of my comments in this thread called out any specific people, and they were not meant to do that. I have no desire to re-litigate old threads. I sincerely like the new comment policy and I hope people follow it.

I intend to go forward as if I have never received any abuse here from any particular person and that I’m not going to, considering that personal abuse now seems to be proscribed.

It is a new day, and I am willing to love everybody.

weirwoodtreehugger
5 years ago

I was not addressing you.

Oh, well I’m glad you told me that. Because I only speak when spoken to!comment image

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago
Reply to  Had To Be Said

@Had To Be Said

…that is not a response to anything anyone asked, unless you mean the bit about you being rude to WWTH. In which case, that’s demonstrably, obviously untrue. O_o

benfromcanada
5 years ago

First time commenter. Now that there’s an easy-to-follow and clear comment policy, I might actually comment more. Totally feminist & humanist here, by the by. I loathe the bigots you regularly mock here.

katz
katz
5 years ago

It is a new day, and I am willing to love everybody.

Good. Start with the seven billion who aren’t on this blog.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
5 years ago

Heh, “old threads.” As if those “old threads” weren’t from a little earlier today. As if you can unilaterally decide that everyone should forget not only your previous bad behavior, but your insinuations of “abuse” both here and in the recent threads.

Aerinea
Aerinea
5 years ago

@kirbywarp Don’t you know? Anything on teh Internet that took place more than a day ago is old news!

Aerinea
Aerinea
5 years ago

Dammit, I used the wrong brackets for my sarcasm tag, and now it’s invisible.

katz
katz
5 years ago

Incidentally, the “abuse is awesome” post clearly violates the “no rape apologism, pedo apologism, victim blaming, and so forth” clause of the new policy. So he’d be out on his ear the second we asked.

andiexist
andiexist
5 years ago

Let’s see… new avatar?

autosoma
5 years ago

I feel it’s a clear, well thought out policy with examples, I personally like it a great deal. I read and comment here expressly for the purpose of preventing myself getting caught up in the whole MrA (the tla doesn’t deserve a capital R as the MrA-ers disabuse the concept of rights)/MGTOW cobblers. Main reason is that I’m a bloke and at times a pretty unsavoury one.

So this policy, to my mind, I’d pretty clear and unambiguous and is of great help to someone like me – thank you David for putting in the time and effort.

I find the clarity around ableism good, although I’m not an expert in this area, and it helps me immensely to reframe my own language.

Ta David, you’re a star

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
5 years ago

On-topic:
A decent, sensible comment policy for a happier Britain. Kudos, David, it looks good.

Off-topic:
There’s a phrase I came across whilst reading about Twitter’s attempts to crack down on #GGers, which is now springing to mind when I see Had to be Said’s posts.

“Future Banned User”

Lam
Lam
5 years ago

David (and anyone else), I wondering about your thoughts on the words “stupid”, “lame”, “dumb”, and the likes. I’ve seen regulars here use them, so I assume they don’t count that as ableism?

I’m asking because I know both physically disabled people who count them as ableist slurs and some who do not. What is the policy on them?

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
5 years ago

Hi, benfromcanada! I am, too.

@Lam

I avoid “lame” because it means physically disabled and shouldn’t be used as an insult. I believe “stupid” and “dumb” are okay.

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

katz,

That post was clearly lampooning the commitment to personal abuse that so many were advocating.

That’s why I told David that the new comment policy was so refreshing.

There seems to be a strong signal now from David that habitual personal abuse of other commenters needs to not be so much of a thing. This is great. If it actually happens, it will greatly improve the quality of conversation on this blog.

I think this new comments policy is great news for anyone except those who come here specifically to get off on abusing people. It is a victory for argument over abuse, for ideas over invective. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if lurkers who actually had plenty to add to the conversation start showing up when they see that abuse-as-a-first-resort will not be their immediate welcome.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
5 years ago

Personally, I try to avoid even things like “stupid” and “dumb.” Beyond the ableism, I think they often miss the mark on what bad beliefs are based on. The policy here, though, is that they’re acceptable.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
5 years ago

@Had To Be Said:

Oh come on, dude, you’re wearing out the word. Get a little variety in your hyperbole! Sure, there’s the tried-and-true “bullying,” but take a page out of the US right-wing extremist handbook! Get a little Nazi imagery in there somewhere, accuse us of even more grandiose acts like literal (figurative) murder!

But most importantly, never ever actually point out any specifics. Just keep beating the drum of accusations; repeat a lie often enough and someone will think it’s true.

Oops! Sorry, beat you to the punch a little.

Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Banana Jackie Cake, for those who still want to call me "Banana", "Jackie" or whatever)
Pandapool -- The Species that Endangers YOU (aka Banana Jackie Cake, for those who still want to call me "Banana", "Jackie" or whatever)
5 years ago

Stupid is probably the only word out of that list that doesn’t come from an actual label for something, I think, but there’s plenty of words outside of “stupid”, “dumb” and such that we shouldn’t have a problem not using them.

Rabid Rabbit
Rabid Rabbit
5 years ago

Looks like a great policy to me. That being said, while I think the policy covers it pretty well, it might be an idea to add a link to an Ableism 101 site or two, in a “If this doesn’t quite make sense to you, please read this and this”. Likewise, maybe a link or two to a Feminism 101 site? I’ve noticed over years of lurking how commenters often come up with the response “This isn’t a Feminism 101 blog.” Most of the time, they’re responding to obvious trolls, but sometimes it’s a confused newcomer who gets hit over the head, and a readily-available place to go (“If you’re new to feminism/don’t know anything about feminism/are confused about feminism, try going here before commenting”) could be helpful.

Lastly, I really would recommend making the link to the policy more obvious. Right now, it’s in the type of heading people rarely bother looking at. Whether it’s a way of redirecting first-time posters to the policy before they can hit “Post” or just making the link sparkly, since the comment policy is more important on this blog than on many others, highlighting it somehow would be a good idea.

Had To Be Said
Had To Be Said
5 years ago

“Abuse” is not hyperbole. It has a specific meaning in argument:

Abusive ad hominem usually involves attacking the traits of an opponent as a means to invalidate their arguments. Equating someone’s character with the soundness of their argument is a logical fallacy.

Ad hominem abuse is not to be confused with slander or libel, which employ falsehoods and are not necessarily leveled to undermine otherwise sound stands with character attacks.

In David’s new policy he is clearly concerned about abuse, otherwise known as “personal attack.” He even says so:

I am very much cognizant that many people who regularly read this blog — some of them who comment here regularly, some of whom are lurkers or only occasional commenters — are frustrated by the flame wars that have erupted here from time to time. I am frustrated as well, and troubled by the personal attacks I’ve seen in these discussions, directed not at trolls but at other commenters here in good faith.

I hope this new comment policy can end some of these flame wars before they start.

All I am doing is agreeing with David about this. People who use personal attack as their weapon of choice are apparently going to have to do less of it. This cannot be anything but a good thing for this blog.

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
5 years ago

Argumentam ad dictionarium? Really? I trust you’re aware that that’s a specific fallacy all of its own.

@Andiexist: Ohmygodohmygodmohmygod! It’s little a scaly little firebreathing bumblebee! It’s adorable!

Hobbesian Academic
Hobbesian Academic
5 years ago

Hi

I’m a long time reader and I’ve commented under a different handle in the past but given my comment I wanted to post under a different name.

Anyway, the new rules look great
Just one minor addition to the rules if I may suggest: can you make it explicit to not demean the clients of sex workers? I love this blog and I almost always read the comments. I always skip posts connected to sex work because I’m a long term client of a sex worker, because of trust issues make it difficult for me to enjoy my sexuality without the commercial dimension and/or being a very long term relationship.

I don’t want to demeaned here because of that

Morrizaurus
5 years ago

I just found out we had mods! And they are grumpy cats in the sidebar!

… Also nice set of rules!
I’m so excited today!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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