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Zoe Quinn's screenshots of 4chan's dirty tricks were just the appetizer. Here's the first course of the dinner, directly from the IRC log

Sorry, guys. I actually read the logs.
Sorry, guys. I actually read the logs.

The We Hunted the Mammoth Pledge Drive continues! If you haven’t already, please consider sending some bucks my way. (And don’t worry that the PayPal page says Man Boobz.) Thanks!

A couple of days ago, embattled indie game designer Zoe Quinn embarrassed some of her biggest critics by posting screenshots she’d collected from a 4channer IRC channel, showing an assortment of hateful and duplicitous #GamerGaters literally conspiring to wreck her reputation and create the illusion of a vast grassroots uprising against alleged corruption in the gaming business.

Her critics, put on the defensive, tried their best to dismiss her screenshots as “cherry picked,” and a few even accused her of writing the very messages she screenshotted and posted. Oh, there might be a few bad apples in the bunch, some were willing to concede, but they were in the minority.

And then they pulled out what they thought was their trump card: the full chat log from the IRC channel #burgersandfries from when the Zoe Quinn “scandal” first erupted in mid-August up until September 6th. All anyone had to do, they suggested, was to read the log, and they would soon see that Quinn was presenting a distorted picture based on out-of-context, “cherry-picked” quotes.

Of course, reading this particular log is a bit easier said than done: it’s 3756 pages, in 10-point type, of chaotic overlapping IRC conversations.

This is a classic case of what’s come to be known as “doc dumping,” which Wikipedia helpfully defines as

the act of responding to an adversary’s request for information by presenting the adversary with a large quantity of data that is transferred in a manner that indicates unfriendliness, hostility, or a legal conflict between the transmitter and the receiver of the information. The shipment of dumped documents is unsorted, or contains a large quantity of information that is extraneous to the issue under inquiry … .

It’s clear that those posting links to the log are hoping that their opponents will take one look at this enormous, messy document and simply give up.

What they didn’t count on was anyone calling their bluff – and actually taking the time to read it. Because if they actually knew what this document contained, and thought anyone would actually read the thing, they would have kept the links to themselves.

Even a quick skim through the document demonstrates that Quinn’s screenshots are hardly cherry-picked; you can flip to literally any page in this long, long document and find evidence of egregious misogyny and outright malice. Look a little deeper and you can find discussions of doxxing and spamming and all sorts of other dirty tricks.

But I’ve given the document a lot more than a quick skim. So far I’ve spent probably ten hours going through it, collecting evidence of all the things that the defenders of 4chan insist isn’t there. Even after ten hours, I’ve only begun to scratch the surface, but I would like to present you with some of my results so far.

Today, let’s look at some of what the 4chan chatters had to say about Zoe Quinn herself.

On Twitter, the standard line of the #GamerGate partisans is that what they’re doing isn’t abut Quinn herself; its a protest against corruption and nepotism in the video game world. They also insist that they’re not motivated by misogyny, and that they are more concerned about the alleged ethical lapses of game journalists than they are with just who Zoe Quinn allegedly slept with.

When it comes to the 4channers in #burgersandfries, these claims are complete and utter bullshit. The name “Zoe” appears 4778 times in the document, more than once per page; by contrast, “Nathan” – the first name of the allegedly corrupt game journalist she allegedly slept with – appears only 108 times. The words “ethics” and “ethical” appear, collectively, only 146 times.

Zoe’s name is in the official thread topic; chatters include it in their jokey nicknames. She’s the topic everyone always comes back to. She’s the reason everyone is there.

I decided to examine each occurrence of the name “Zoe” in order to see just what 4channers thought of her. After about 6 hours on this particular quest, I’ve only made it through roughly one-third of the mentions. But the results are not pretty.

The 4channers express their hatred and disgust towards her; they express their glee at the thought of ruining her career; they fantasize about her being raped and killed. They wonder if all the harassment will drive her to suicide, and only the thought of 4chan getting bad publicity convinces some of them that this isn’t something they should hope for.

They gleefully distribute nude pictures of her, posting links to online archives of them and emailing them directly both to Quinn’s supporters.

They dig up all sorts of information about her and her family and do their best to track down anyone and everyone with even the most tenuous links to her. One industrious researcher even manages to find a picture of Quinn at age 13; while acknowledging that it had no relevance whatsoever to issues of gaming ethics, she posts a link to it anyway.

And then there is the ongoing discussion of her vagina, described variously as “wide,” large enough to “fit 12 dicks at once, and “a festering cheese-filled vagina” that leaves “a trail of cunt slime” wherever she goes. Several 4channers speculate about its smell.

It’s not clear how exactly the size or shape or smell of Quinn’s vagina relates to the high-minded issues of gaming ethics that the #GamerGaters are said to be concerned with. But in the IRC log no one ever seems to call out any of those talking about Quinn in the crudest sexual terms.

Lets’ go to the logs directly. Everything that follows is cut and pasted directly from the full log, available here.

That said, IRC discussions can be chaotic and confusing, generally with more than one conversation going on at once, so in some cases, I have removed extraneous comments in order to make what is being said clearer. I’ve indicated all cuts with ellipses, and if you want to see what I’ve removed it should be trivial for you to locate the quotes in the full log by doing a search for an appropriate phrase or the relevant time and date stamp.

TRIGGER WARNING for discussion of rape, suicide and murder.

The log starts early on in the Zoe Quinn “scandal,” and numerous people in the chat talk about distributing her nude pictures to as many people as possible:

Aug 18 17.37.57 <SweetJBro> lol I’m tweeting Zoe’s nudes to some of her defenders.

A few days later, several other chatters talk about harassing Quinn by sending her own nude pictures to her:

Aug 21 23.20.35 there should be a massive campaign to tweet zoe her own nudes …
Aug 21 23.21.01 <Silver|2> They’ve been tweeted at her a lot

Here’s a chatter making clear that he’s mainly interested in seeing Quinn suffer:

Aug 18 20.10.06 i couldnt care less about vidya, i just want to see zoe receive her comeuppance

Here are some speculating about her state of mind:

Aug 19 01.34.01 if you were zoe right now what would you do
Aug 19 01.34.07 <FIVE-GUYS> get mugged
Aug 19 01.36.41 in all seriousness, i dont know
Aug 19 01.37.03 <FIVE-GUYS> ive never been in a situation like this
Aug 19 01.37.15 i’d probably kill myself tbh

Here are some others talking about the possibility of Quinn committing suicide, a possibility one chatter greets with a smiley:

Aug 19 02.28.30 okay, is zoe actually depressed?
Aug 19 02.28.35 i bet she is now
Aug 19 02.28.37 <mugg> diagnosed etc?
Aug 19 02.28.39 kek …
Aug 19 02.29.22 <Opus> I think she tried killing herself before
Aug 19 02.29.28 <kailasha> she should try that again :^)

“Kek,” by the way, is a nerdy version of “lol.”

Here one chatter suggests that focusing only on Quinn is a bad idea – because it will make 4channers look bad:

Aug 21 17.23.31 <sarahv> The problem is that making it about Zoe sleeping around amounts to a personal attack which, while funny and something she totally deserves, will hurt our chances of pushing the other point …
Aug 21 17.23.38 <rd0951> ./v should be focused on the implications of gaming journalism …
Aug 21 17.23.47 Because SJWs will cherry-pick the /b/ shit posting and say “See? It’s sexist MRAs!”

A few days later, this (relative) voice of moderation gleefully jokes about Quinn being choked to death during sex:

Aug 22 02.02.46 <CutestGAmerGorl> Okay guys, how much does Zoe like being choked
Aug 22 02.02.49 <CutestGAmerGorl> during sex? …
Aug 22 02.02.58 <sarahv> clearly not enough

Here one chatter openly fantasizes about driving Quinn to “an hero” — that is, kill — herself:

Aug 21 17.48.06 I’m debating whether or not we should just attack zoe …
Aug 21 17.48.29 <Opfag> push her… push her further….. further, until eventually she an heroes …
Aug 21 17.48.51 <OtherGentleman> … What makes you think she has the balls to kill herself?
Aug 21 17.48.57 I kind of want to just make her life irrepairably horrible …
Aug 21 17.49.16 <NASA_Agent> but what if she suicides …
Aug 21 17.49.24 <Opfag> Good.
Aug 21 17.49.29 Then we get to troll #Rememberzoe

One chatter warns that this strategy might … make 4chan look a tad misogynistic:

Aug 21 17.49.45 The more you try to attack her directly, the more she gets to play the victim card and make a bunch of friends who will support her because, since she has a vagina, any attack is misgony

Meanwhile, one of the other chatters suggests a rather creative division of labor amongst partisans of different 4chan message boards:

Aug 21 17.49.48 <rd0951> ./v should be in charge of the gaming journalism aspect of it. /pol should be in charge of the feminism aspect, and /b should be in charge of harassing her into killing herself

In the following excerpt, the IRC channel moderator asks one chatter why he is so obsessed with elaborate fantasies of Quinn dying in particularly gruesome ways:

Aug 21 18.26.37 <Cyberserker> You need a reason …
Aug 21 18.28.14 <Opfag> Well I don’t have a legitimate reason.
Aug 21 18.28.21 <Cyberserker> Nothing?
Aug 21 18.28.21 <Opfag> I just want to see her die horribly.
Aug 21 18.28.29 <Cyberserker> I’m talking about [your particular fantasies]
Aug 21 18.28.33 <Opfag> Oh.
Aug 21 18.28.39 <totality> sometimes you just want someone to get hurt
Aug 21 18.28.43 <Opfag> That, I have no idea
Aug 21 18.28.48 <totality> nothing wrong with that
Aug 21 18.28.51 all I know is I want zoe to die like that

While some fantasize about Quinn dying, others fill the chat with crude and often bizarre sexual remarks. All of the following comments came from a mere seven minutes in the chatroom:

Aug 22 02.21.54 i want to smell zoe quinn’s armpits …

Aug 22 02.25.42 you all would fuck the zoeholes
Aug 22 02.25.46 <JTG> given a chance too
Aug 22 02.25.47 <The_Remover> I am extremely aroused right now …

Aug 22 02.26.47 someone seduce zoe quinn
Aug 22 02.26.53 <vanu> follow the shekels
Aug 22 02.26.56 <The_Remover> I volunteer to take one for the team
Aug 22 02.26.57 <vanu> to her vagina …

Aug 22 02.28.51 meditate to nude pictures of zoe
Aug 22 02.28.53 <The_Remover> she gonna get raped

Of course, the 4channers are quick to profess disgust at the assorted nude pictures of Quinn they’re happily passing around to one another and the internet at large:

Aug 22 04.50.24 by the by, trigger warning on that mediafire archive. don’t download if you don’t want to see zoe naked …
Aug 22 21.17.13 <JCTheDenthog> Zoe’s mouth must be the strongest vacuum in nature to compensate for her face, body, and everything

Another suggests that his 4chan brethren download Quinn’s nudes if not for their own sexual gratification than for possible further blackmail later:

Aug 22 04.53.14 Eugh, why would you want to have her on your HDD? …
Aug 22 04.53.45 <The_Remover> because, a couple of months from now, when all this shit has died down, a raid may just be in order …
Aug 22 04.54.10 and i bet her dad doesn’t know she did porn …

Several days into the scandal, one chatter laments that there’s not much dirt left to dig on Quinn:

Aug 22 23.00.55 <Drinky_Kraw> I don’t think there’s anything left to harass Zoe over anyway. …
Aug 22 23.01.00 <Drinky_Kraw> The laundry is pretty much all aired

By the 23rd, some bored chatters compare notes on what they see as the relative sexual pros and cons of Quinn and game critic Anita Sarkeesian:

Aug 23 05.40.20 <Josh_> Zoe has a gross robotic hand, blue hair, and tats 4 days
Aug 23 05.40.29 <Josh_> if I was forced to put my dick in one of them
Aug 23 05.40.29 <Josh_> Anita
Aug 23 05.40.39 <GribFabdabgib> If I had to put my dick in them, yeah Anita
Aug 23 05.40.43 Anita is a skinny bitch whos all bones
Aug 23 05.40.48 <DarkHiero> True …

Aug 23 05.41.07 <DarkHiero> But at least it looks like she tries to take care of herself. …
Aug 23 05.41.15 <Headsmash_> From just looks alone, Id rather do Zoe than Anita. Fat bitches usually give better head anyway.
Aug 23 05.41.21 <DarkHiero> If I’m putting my dick in crazy, that matters.
Aug 23 05.42.00 <DTrig> Yeah but odds are good you get the clap/crabs from Zoe
Aug 23 05.42.14 <Headsmash_> Same could be said for Anita based on what we know
Aug 23 05.42.17 <Headsmash_> lol
Aug 23 05.42.32 * DarkHiero shrugs
Aug 23 05.42.34 Anita looks like she douches though
Aug 23 05.42.36 <DTrig> ANd cleans up
Aug 23 05.42.39 Zoe…. eh

And then it’s back to another discussion of suicide:

Aug 23 19.38.17 <Headsmash_> So does anyone think Zoe’s gonna off herself and become a catalyst for misogyny and hatred of women in video games and video game culture? …
Aug 23 19.38.47 if zoe offed herself she probably wouldn’t be anything but an ED article ..
Aug 23 19.38.55 <Araf> Headsmash_: She won’t, she has a too big ego …
Aug 23 19.39.13 <Headsmash_> I’m not too sure about that. I think she could.
Aug 23 19.39.16 <Araf> She would off herself if everyone ignored her and abandoned her, which is not the case. …
Aug 23 19.39.25 <Headsmash_> Depends on how much she gets stuck in the victimization complex. …
Aug 23 19.39.28 Really the 5guys scandal is the most famous Zoe has been …
Aug 23 19.39.43 <rd0952> yeah but she’s also been harassed night and day for a week

Other chatters indulge in sadistic fantasies:

Aug 24 12.24.22 who really wants to meet zoe quinn and be kind and comfort her in this time of crisis
Aug 24 12.24.43 <Cyberserker> Not if you comfort her with a knife-hug
Aug 24 12.24.45 <Cameralady> and slowly, through friendship and blossoming relationship, get her to repair her shitty ways and come clean and become a good person …

Aug 24 12.24.52 <Cameralady> and then
Aug 24 12.24.56 <Cameralady> once she’s reformed
Aug 24 12.24.58 <Cyberserker> knife-hug?
Aug 24 12.25.07 dump her in the most brutal, heartwrenching way possible

One chatter wants his fellow 4channers to declare victory and move on:

Aug 24 15.16.10 <PaperDinosaur> Also Zoe is no longer the target to be focused on
Aug 24 15.16.13 <Josh_> ^^
Aug 24 15.16.14 <sarahv> ^^^^^
Aug 24 15.16.18 It’s about the 5guys
Aug 24 15.16.21 <sarahv> It always has been
Aug 24 15.16.28 <Josh_> It’s more about the journos
Aug 24 15.16.33 <PaperDinosaur> She’s done, we’ve wrecked her in a professional manner. …
Aug 24 15.16.42 <sarahv> Unfortunately most of the people involved in this seem to be interested in destroying Zoe
Aug 24 15.16.46 stop digging up shit on zoe’s past
Aug 24 15.16.47 <PaperDinosaur> Now we have to wreck her shield, the people who tried to defend her

Soon afterwards the same guy who suggested that they move on from Quinn is back making jokes about her killing herself:

Aug 24 16.33.54 <PaperDinosaur> Guys, lets me fair to Zoe here
Aug 24 16.34.02 If every time I did something people sent me nues of her
Aug 24 16.34.07 <PaperDinosaur> I’d fucking kill myself

That same evening, Quinn’s ex-boyfriend – the fellow who started the whole thing going with a long series of blog entries documenting Quinn’s alleged infidelities – shows up on the channel to ask questions from the assembled mob.

Here is one of the questions he chose to answer:

Aug 25 00.02.21 <Cyberserker> Last question is from several people actually. I wanted to save it until the end due to how popular it was.
Aug 25 00.02.22 <Cyberserker> “Would you say Zoe was a “big girl” for you?” …

Aug 25 00.03.04 <Eron_G> she is heavier than people I usually date. …

Aug 25 00.03.12 <Cyberserker> Fair enough …

Aug 25 00.03.14 <ebola-chan> Did she not fly so good?

And a few that he didn’t:

Aug 25 00.04.13 What does her pusy smell like must answer …
Aug 25 00.07.11 Eron, when you went down on her, did you taste the other guys semen? If so, what did it taste like? …
Aug 25 00.10.40 Eron I don’t think you want your headphones back, it’s most likely splattered in Nathan’s semen and Robin’s Menstrual fluids. …
Aug 25 00.16.52 eron are you going to take up sucking dick now that you’ve been cucked by the 2/10 ugly jew

Later that morning the chatters are back to sharing their creepy and violent sexual fantasies:

Aug 25 00.19.28 <EronLovesZoe> I feel like I would probably fuck Zoe. But not out of a loving sense of sexual attraction. More of that “hate fuck” sense where you just want to assert your dominance as a male on her, a primal savagery. Then I’d probably have to sterilize myself to prevent the genome from spreading.
Aug 25 00.19.59 I’d slap a saddle on zoe and ride her throught the midwest
Aug 25 00.20.02 I wouldn’t even get that far EronLovesZoe, I’d just start raging and headbutting her and gnawing on her cheek …

Aug 25 00.20.10 that seabiscuit looking ass bith

And talking again about the pros and cons of trying to get Quinn to kill herself:

Aug 25 07.18.18 <Logan> Any chance we can get Zoe to commit suicide?
Aug 25 07.18.29 if we can get more daming evidence
Aug 25 07.18.29 I think the [doxxing info removed by DF] is a good shot.
Aug 25 07.18.33 <temet> like her fucking a train of lack dudes …
Aug 25 07.18.39 <PaperDinosaur> fuck off Logan
Aug 25 07.18.39 <temet> black
Aug 25 07.18.51 <Logan> Nah 21st century doing a train is so 90s. …
Aug 25 07.18.59 <PaperDinosaur> If she commits suicide we lose everything …
Aug 25 07.20.34 <PaperDinosaur> If you can’t see how driving Zoe to suicide would fuck this entire thing up then you’re a fucking idiot
Aug 25 07.20.41 Imagine the kotaku article …
Aug 25 07.20.48 <temet> PaperDinosaur is right
Aug 25 07.20.51 <temet> not the right PR play

Not. The. Right. PR. Play.

And on that note I am going to end this installment.

This is only a small fraction of the terrible stuff said about Quinn, in the small portion of the log I have managed to read through so far.

I may return with more installments. Honestly, I’m not sure how much more I can stomach.

But I will certainly write more about the 4channers’ discussions about doxxing and hacking Quinn and others; again, I have looked only at a portion of the logs so far, but there is already a great deal there.

EDIT: Just realized that WordPress ate a bunch of the names of the posters in the quotes here. (WordPress likes to eat angle brackets.) I’ll manually add the names back in when I get the chance.

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kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

Probably more accurate to say “I hope they grow out of it,” which could also apply to adults?

Myoo
Myoo
6 years ago

Thanks to everyone who resolved the misunderstanding without using irony towards me.

“Lord Vetinari won’t stop at sarcasm. He might use’ -Colon swallowed- ‘irony.’ “

Kakanian
Kakanian
6 years ago

@cerberustheasexual

You’re in for a major disappointment if you imagine this as some sort of epic battle between the feminist forces of light and the misogynist 4chan of darkness that will put an end to the history of sexism for good. These events aren’t symptomatic, they’re systemic. They happen because we as a society hold certain gendered standards of sexual behaviour and because there are clearly defined differences in social power between the classes, the sexes and the races and they all feed into each other.

Some users did even call these Gamergate raiders out on the fact that they were harassing somebody who didn’t even have a role in the corruption within the actual video game industry and for stuff that was none of their business in these logs, but these kids were trying to put a spin to their story and sell it and they knew that selling her as a damnable whore (including photographic proof if everything else fails!) was the best spin they could get. They figured that such a story had enough mass appeal to rally the neutral and indifferent masses to their banner and looking at the internet at large, they certainly were correct in that assumption.
If you check out the logs, you’ll read that their threads got deleted by mods time and again, though not because they’re sexist or because they were about harassing somebody, but because the owner of the server banks doesn’t want to risk getting sued over somebody using 4chan as a base for recruiting folks for raids and doxxing attempts. Most counterreactions to sexism we see from popular news outlets and message boards are of that nature – like when Reddit shut down the Fapping because child porn was shared on it among other stolen nude photos. Considerations of criminality and sexism are secondary to our society at large, basically, which again is nicely exemplified in the way DV cases between stars and starlets are getting discussed and framed.

brooked
6 years ago

I used this name so I couldn’t use my supreme male privileges.

Say what you will about Lisa, I have to admit this is a pretty funny sentence.

JM
JM
6 years ago

@Lisa

I don’t know what you’re referring to when you’re asking for proof. Proof of my comments can be found on Eron anti-Zoe blog, I use the same username there as here.
Proof of a google search result going the way I say? Like screenshots? I mean, the search I have opened now for Zoe goes:

Wikipedia page
New Yorker article about abuse
Independant article on orchestrated campaign of abuse
Telegraph article on misogyny
Personal twitter page
Personal tumblr page
Mary Sue article about abuse
Patreon page
Personal website
Breitbart negative article accussing SJW of trying to focus on Zoe’s personal life
Daily dot article about 4chan conspiracy
Article written by her

So if someone knew nothing about her at this moment, and did a google search, they would find fairly consistent articles saying “She is a programmer who was harrassed online because of her gender” with one exception article. That’s after 1 month of the #gamergate tag. Imagine what it would be after 6 months, especially as the mainstream press (With the New Yorker recently getting on board), starts paying more attention to this.

Compare to Eron Gjolni’s results from a google search:
His blog is number 1 result.
An article defending the right to reveal people’s personal details online.
Twitter handle
Tumblr search results.
Ravishly article criticising Gjoni
Geek party article showing how Gjoni has been inconcsistent
Dailydot article reporting on sexist attacks towards Zoe.
8cn article reporting inaccurate details about conflict of interest
Youtube page reporting on controversy
Reddit comment thread which, surprisingly, is fairly balanced.

While this is less consistently presenting a single image, the fact that the majority of articles would condemn Eron, most importantly his own blog post (Eron looks better the more people hear about his blog than actually read it, as the blog itself is so inconsistent and overly dramatic that unless you’ve completely drunk the MRA koolai before you start it is completely unbelievable. IT seriously goes “She cheated on me….we were on a break…she slept to get good reveiws….no she didn’t….I don’t want to harm her professional life….I hope all employers are cautuious about her…).

And while more and more articles are beign written about Zoe, and the harrassment she received, less and less is being written to defend Eron, especially after the 4chan leak. Also, while Zoe is launching a game which will presumably receive significant attention in the months to come which will push down some of the negative pages out of the first google results page, Eron is unlikely to be contributing anything in the months to come to swamp his negative image, especially considering he is still maintaining his blog.

Or are you asking me for proof that Eron is trying to commit relationship suicide with this? Oh, in that case I don’t have proof because I don’t think he’s trying. I think he’s done this by accident because he didn’t think about what he was doing. He was so eager to hurt someone else, that he didn’t bother to check how that would effect him. Based on the blog he wrote, and comments elsewhere, he does come across a guy who thinks he can do whatever he likes without any negatvie repercussions, which suggests future planning is not his strong point.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

I post here under my own name, and have never been treated badly for being a white man.*

*I don’t like saying ‘male’, because people online who refer to women as ‘females’ skeeve me out.

A. Noyd
A. Noyd
6 years ago

tinyorc sez:

[Lisa:] Zoey Quinn […] took the insults of many dumb-acting individuals that were from the whole “gamers” group, and told to an audience that every person from this group was a misogynist asshole.

No, that’s not what she did. Lord above, why is it so difficult for you people to understand this?

Nobody is characterizing each individual gamer as a misogynist asshole.

It’s particularly nonsensical given that Quinn is a gamer and the people she’s exposing the fetid shitbuckets’ collaborative abuse to are also gamers.¹ She’s not calling herself or the rest of us misogynists. There’s just no way that an honest person would fuck up understanding who Quinn is focusing the crosshairs on.

Quinn and her supporters are saying the abusive asshole contingent (AAC) who cooked up #gamergate is all abusive assholes. It’s the AAC claiming the “gamer” label belongs to them and only to them and then QQing like spoiled toddlers that Quinn is going after “all” gamers. This is clearly not an argument meant to be convincing to non-AAC gamers, so it’s hilarious all these ingrown tit-hairs are trying it outside AAC territory.

……………
¹ I’ve been a gamer since I was a little girl playing Sneakers on some early 80s computer of my dad’s. Couldn’t get enough of it. I’ve also never not had a game console in my house since the Christmas my dad bought me and my sister a NES. And then for years I was a minmaxing hardcore MMO raider and even wrote a couple fan guides to game content. And I’ve also been a feminist—if not always a great one—since I could understand the term.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Isn’t is weird that so many trolls think we owe them all the charity, patience, hand holding and tutoring their dear little hearts desire. They can enter the conversation in full irrational tantrum mode, lying, telling us just how awful we are for reasons they just invented or heard from the manosphere and still feel as if we owe them some mommying.

I’m not disappointed at this point. I’m almost impressed by the entitlement and audacity of their privilege.

“Lisa”,
You write like a teenage boy trying to sound precocious. You might want to tone down the ‘tude. You are not the smartest, most logical, informed person in the room and it shows. You don’t need to be telling anyone anything about feminism. You need to sit down, shut up and listen the next time you get the chance.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

@Lea:

They can enter the conversation in full irrational tantrum mode, lying, telling us just how awful we are for reasons they just invented or heard from the manosphere and still feel as if we owe them some mommying.

Pretty true. I told Lisa that his comments about feminism were instigating the insults, and he decided what I said was that they were a response to the insults. No concept of the notion that maybe people are insulting you because you were insulting first.

Sarah
Sarah
6 years ago

Hey, kudos on the resilience and the patience everyone. I admire those willing to put up rationally with the (willing or not) trolls and their (willing or not) misrepresentations. I don’t think we owe them that, or the apologetic “but we didn’t know you were just ignorant and oblivious of everything until now”, but it’s a nice display of how more civilised even a feminist *mockery* site is than their forums.

Anyway, I guess I’m still annoyed that he came to a thread that exposes an overt campaign to get Quinn harassed, ruined professionally and personally, and even to kill herself and still have the face to badmouth her “some people don’t like her because sleeping with people to get favours is wrong”. And complain that they get called assholes.

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
6 years ago

Assholes argue in bad faith, try to call a bluff, and face plant. Did they really think people wouldn’t read the logs, if posted?

I went to that gamergate harassment tumblr and holy fucking shit, what a bunch of whiners. They mistake criticism for harassment pretty consistently. Imagine if they had to put up with being the target of the hate parade they produce? Plus, the posts on that tumblr put to lie the claims they made about how victims shouldn’t share harassment they receive.

I feel like I don’t have too much to add because the OP and comments have been wonderful. Maybe this should be the moment we make a gamer+ movement. We could make a movement which aims for games and a gaming community which enriches and not just entertains. Where the only thing that gets you hounded is being an asshole.

hellkell
hellkell
6 years ago

I am so shocked Lisa’s a dude. A whiny dude who, like Lea said, wants us to be his mommy.

Trolls these days.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
6 years ago

He kind of gave himself away the moment he claimed to be using Logick ™ when the only things he’d been using up to that point were fallacies.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

Fallacies are a type of logic, right?

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

Fallacies are what emotional people call logic, right?

thebewilderness
thebewilderness
6 years ago

Fallacies are totes a type of logic, or so say the fallacy trolls.
“Lisa” havs got to be the most horrendous mansplainer we have had here for quite a while. And an enormous mendacious disembodied anus into the bargain.
A twofer troll.

Luzbelitx
6 years ago

Hey everyone! Wanna know what’s really destroying games?

Tampon run!!!

idledillettante
6 years ago

@Misha

You bet Eron Gjoni fancies himself. Here’s something else I wrote today about him… his involvement in the #burgersandfries logs. Despite his hand-waving about trying to “shift the conversation” away from direct harassment of ZQ, he knows next to nothing about the gaming scene apart from what he learned from ZQ. So the only reason he’s being interviewed in the chat like an internet celebrity is so he’ll give out more info about ZQ… info which I think he might not have,given the content of his first interview.

I still need to go through the rest of the logs, but have a look here

http://idledillettante.wordpress.com/2014/09/10/eron-gjonis-involvement-in-burgersandfries-the-first-interview/

Luzbelitx
6 years ago

Ugh, did the Link Mammoth eat my link?

Here it is: http://tamponrun.com/

Flying Mouse
Flying Mouse
6 years ago

I don’t like it when someone use irony, it just widers the gap between the people being made fun of and the people using irony. Please speak objectively and directly to me if you see any issue.

*Feels mildly bad that used sarcasm on person who ultimately claimed to be here in good faith.*

*Considers apologizing, since obviously pushed some of Lisa’s buttons.*

*Remembers that said good faith poster posed as a lady to try to circumvent preconceived criticism and complained endlessly that other, kinder commenters were not treating him with enough deference.*

*Glances up at banner of website. Notices that word “MOCKED” figures prominently in subtitle.*

*Considers making an even snarkier comment instead of an apology.*

*Decides to eat pumpkin muffin instead.*

A Wolverine
A Wolverine
6 years ago

the dipshits in /v/ are falling further down the conspiracy theorist hole and whining about how no one in the mainstream media takes a pro-gamergate stance as proof of conspiracy

In addition they keep praising Christina hoff sommers as if she was an actual feminist (usually I wouldnt call someone else not a feminist but for her i’ll make an exception) and not a crank.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

Oh man, I was kinda hoping for gameplay similar to the flash game “Flood Runner,” where you’re outrunning a huge tidal wave. Ah well.

thebewilderness
thebewilderness
6 years ago

Yet another troll who couldn’t be bothered to read the effing biggest thing in front of them when they came to the blog and then takes us to task for doing what it effing says on the tin.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Oh, it’s Erin again. Hi, Erin, how are the chickens?

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

@katz (a litte late):

Ok, I must be a kid, cause I saw the intro text and the title and steeled myself for an offensive commercial. Watched it, saw nothing wrong, saw them asking whether the kids noticed why some people would be upset with it, and was legitimately confused.

Then they revealed it was because the family was mixed race, and I facepalmed. Oh, right. That type of “controversial.”

Alais
6 years ago

Hey, Lisa, I’ve got a really important question for you. The answer to it interests me very greatly, so I hope that you’re not planning on sticking to your flounce.

Once, probably about six or seven years ago, I was walking down the Ocean City Highway with two of my friends. A group of girls drove by in a car. One of them leaned out the window and hollered, “Hey, Lisa!” at us. Since then, we’ve been trying to figure out who was Lisa and which one of us looked most like her. Now I’m wondering, are you that Lisa?

kittehserf - MOD
kittehserf - MOD
6 years ago

@”Lisa”

I indeed didn’t want to see my opinion disregarded just because I’m a white male.

That’s sockpuppeting, genius. It’s not just being anonymous, it’s lying from the get-go.

It’s also stupid. You’ll notice, if you ever bother reading, that this blog is written by a white man. It has plenty of white men commenting. It’s not your colour or sex that gets your opinion disregarded around here, it’s spouting sexism, racism or other bigotries. Pretending to be a woman didn’t help you, did it?

@marinerachel

Don’t gamers eat at their computers usually?

So do non-gamers.

::looks at sad state of keyboard::

@cloudiah

Yeah, it would have been much more entertaining if he’d told stories about seeing bras (BRAS!) in the laundry room or something. XD

The flickering flame of Blog Herpes’ great trolling days!

@kirbywarp

Fallacies are what emotional people call logic, right?

I know it’s a joke, but using emotional like there’s something wrong with being emotional/having emotions squicks me a bit. Plays into the Straw Vulcan shittery about rational good, emotional bad.

@Flying Mouse

*Considers making an even snarkier comment instead of an apology.*

*Decides to eat pumpkin muffin instead.*

Do both! Yer a woman, we’re supposed to do all that multitasking stuff!

vaiyt
6 years ago

I doubt Lisa has any specific examples of feminists being Just as Bad on Tumblr, it’s just standard whining about minorities and women daring to be visible. Add to that standard whining about how pointing out bigotry is worse than bigotry.

The nature of Tumblr makes them both more visible and harder to silence, so privileged dudes tend to get a perception of being outnumbered because they aren’t used to not being the only loud voice in the room. The old 20% effect.

daintydougal
daintydougal
6 years ago

So I pretty much read all of “Lisa’s” comments in Adam Buxton’s foreign swindler voice. Even moar hilarious. I can’t find the clip of him talking about the foreign swindlers so here is different awesomeness:

daintydougal
daintydougal
6 years ago

Vid contains swears. Soz. Well, he’s reading youtube comments, there’s really no way it couldn’t contain swears and various…unpleasantness.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

@kittehserf:

I know it’s a joke, but using emotional like there’s something wrong with being emotional/having emotions squicks me a bit. Plays into the Straw Vulcan shittery about rational good, emotional bad.

Sorry about the squick. In my defense it was on purpose. I have the same views towards emotion being used as a dismissive thing… With a special loathing towards people using “logic” to describe themselves using words even when those words aren’t part of a syllogism. Thus, a comment that claims “logic” and dismisses “emotion” while having no clue what the former means. I was definitely trying to reference the Straw Vulcan shit rather than play into it.

kittehserf - MOD
kittehserf - MOD
6 years ago

Oh, gotcha, kirbywarp! Sorry, I misread. I thought you were snarking at the ragefrothy trolls who claim they’re super logical.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
6 years ago

Add to that standard whining about how pointing out bigotry is worse than bigotry.

For them, it is. Bigotry doesn’t really affect them, so they rarely see it, and when they do it often doesn’t register so they might as well have not seen it.

Pointing out bigotry doesn’t work the same way. Now they have to acknowledge it, and bigotry makes them uncomfortable, so when you point out bigotry it upsets them in a way that the original bigotry didn’t (because they didn’t really see it).

I think this “victims of harassment should stfu” meme comes from the same place. They’d prefer to not have to know this kind of thing happens, but the only way they can know is if the victims speak up. Therefore: the problem is the victims speaking up. They can live in happy ignorance if that doesn’t occur, so it must be stopped.

strivingally
6 years ago

@PoM:

It’s kinda how a lot of the MRA/PUA/incel types think that everything was rosy before the Sexual Revolution, which ruined things by making women strident, whiny and overly demanding of men.

Of course, what actually happened was that women became more included in society and gained more of a voice in public discourse, so problems that had always been there for women were being spoken about in ways they hadn’t been previously, along with many women realising they didn’t have to put up with shit treatment in silence.

“I don’t see it, so it’s not happening” is not a valid response when someone tells you about a problem that affects people outside of your demographic and/or that you have no experience of.

Chris Rodriguez
6 years ago

“It’s clear that those posting links to the log are hoping that their opponents will take one look at this enormous, messy document and simply give up.”

Those are my logs. I do not appreciate being spoken for. My hope was that people would use a ctrl+f on timestamps or specific lines and see things within context. My purposes were to show that the storify screencaps were heavily cherry picked, which I later found that some on reddit had already done. http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/comments/2fn6vz/looks_like_zoe_edited_those_irc_logs_a_little/

Above all, I side on truth. If that means showing off even when we in the channel are in the wrong, so be it. The full info is there for you to judge for yourself but I didn’t anticipate that people would ignore 4chan culture and etiquette as well as those of irc in general. I

n this article all you’ve managed to prove is that you don’t quite understand the brand of humor 4channers are known for and that people in any irc will always diverge off topic and shoot the shit. If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things.

The lines of serious inclinations to harass are indeed present, to speak earlier of being in the wrong. But you should be aware that such comments usually follow a trend of a flood of new users resulting from the channel being advertised on 4chan. In clear view of those who would use the site for discussion purposes AND those who are always seeking to abuse things for malicious reasons. They are free to join as the channel has always been public (you need to register your name with rizon now in order to chat) but whether they are taken seriously is up to the crowd mentality of whether they’re judged to be serious or just another shitposter that frequents 4chan and no one likes anyway.

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

Chris Rodriguez:

My purposes were to show that the storify screencaps were heavily cherry picked, which I later found that some on reddit had already done.

Uh-huh, sure. That’s a lot of fucking cherries. You folks keep shouting “cherry picking! cherry picking!” as if that’s going to make people ignore the mountains of evidence.

The full info is there for you to judge for yourself but I didn’t anticipate that people would ignore 4chan culture and etiquette as well as those of irc in general. I

n this article all you’ve managed to prove is that you don’t quite understand the brand of humor 4channers are known for and that people in any irc will always diverge off topic and shoot the shit. If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things.

The “culture” and “humor” of 4chan involves plotting to drive someone to suicide, fantasizing about killing, hurting, and raping someone, plotting to create sock puppet accounts pretending to be highly stereotypical racial minorities, sexual shaming women and calling them slurs? Then your “culture” and “humor” is shitty. Saying that “that’s just how 4chan is” doesn’t actually excuse anything or make any of this better. It just means that 4channers are assholes. Complete and total assholes.

They are free to join as the channel has always been public (you need to register your name with rizon now in order to chat) but whether they are taken seriously is up to the crowd mentality of whether they’re judged to be serious or just another shitposter that frequents 4chan and no one likes anyway.

This doesn’t excuse anything either. Why aren’t the “shitposters” being called out? Why aren’t they being kicked out?

grumpycatisagirl
6 years ago

What a despicable comment.

grumpycatisagirl
6 years ago

Obviously I meant the comment above Sparky’s, not Sparky’s, which is awesome.

maistrechat
6 years ago

More accurate Chris Rodriguez:

Why aren’t you cherrypicking these logs that I released with the intention that people would cherrypick them for the things that make these people look marginally less like assholes

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

Fuck it. My comments aren’t posting for some reason, or showing up as moderated. Look for the timestamp at “Aug 18 17.34.45” in the logs, and tell me that cyberserker is just a random shitposter, Chris Rodriguez.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

n this article all you’ve managed to prove is that you don’t quite understand the brand of humor 4channers are known for and that people in any irc will always diverge off topic and shoot the shit. If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things.

Misogyny, homophobia, racism and ableism is neither funny or edgy. That you and your buddies think it is shows that they’re assholes who are indeed sexist, homophobic, racist and ableist. I’m not sure what you think this statement proves.

The lines of serious inclinations to harass are indeed present, to speak earlier of being in the wrong.

What a weirdly passive way to put it. Zoe Quinn was actually harassed by 4channers. The statements didn’t reflect an inclination to harass they were an admission of guilt.

But you should be aware that such comments usually follow a trend of a flood of new users resulting from the channel being advertised on 4chan.

Oh look, the Scotsman are never true.

In clear view of those who would use the site for discussion purposes AND those who are always seeking to abuse things for malicious reasons. They are free to join as the channel has always been public (you need to register your name with rizon now in order to chat) but whether they are taken seriously is up to the crowd mentality of whether they’re judged to be serious or just another shitposter that frequents 4chan and no one likes anyway.

Take some responsibility. Your site allows people to act like bigots and assholes and harassers. If you allow that behavior you are effectively condoning it. Don’t get mad because the rest of us have noticed that behavior and don’t like it. It’s not our fault you are part of a haven for the worst people on the internet. It’s your fault.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Argh. Blockquote fail. The first paragraph was supposed to be quoted. I’m hungover 🙁

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

“Culture” and “humor”? Seriously, dude? Where are all the mods?
But your post basically boils down to “It’s just humor, we do it all the time here. If you don’t like it, don’t come to 4chan.”
Weak defense.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
6 years ago

If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things.

Yeah, when your humor is misogynist, you are actually a misogynist. When you think it’s hilarious and fun to act like a misogynist, you are actually a misogynist. When your idea of buddying around with your friends involves misogynist statements, you are actually a misogynist.

If your “culture” is indistinguishable from misogyny, it is misogynist. If it has effects that are indistinguishable from those of misogyny, it is misogynist.

I honestly don’t care if you understand this or not, but I have to say it to put it out there: if you act like a misogynist, you are one. Misogyny is not your inner heart and soul, it is your actions and your words. If you don’t want to be one, don’t act like one.

seraph4377
6 years ago

Maistrechat hits the nail on the head. You wouldn’t think it would still be possible, but sometimes I’m still amazed by the nerve of these people…

Kakanian
Kakanian
6 years ago

@Chris

If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things. Even leaving the most obvious quotes aside, the fact still remains that they singled out some random woman to become a scapegoat for an industry because they felt that she had slept with too many people. They figured that enough folks would get really mad about a woman sleeping with too many men to join their cause and that from that they could get enough trajection to hurt some men in the industry.

Yep, it was totally not an exemplary case of sexism they delivered with these logs.

Kakanian
Kakanian
6 years ago

Let’s try again.

If you choose to analyze the many lines of joking as being harassment or a foothold for the misogyny argument, then there’s nothing that can be done about that as 4chan will always be guilty of joking about inappropriate things.

Even leaving the most obvious quotes aside, the fact still remains that they singled out some random woman to become a scapegoat for an industry because they felt that she had slept with too many people. They figured that enough folks would get really mad about a woman sleeping with too many men to join their cause and that from that they could get enough trajection to hurt some men in the industry.

Yep, it was totally not an exemplary case of sexism they delivered with these logs.

twincats
twincats
6 years ago

I’m sill laughing so hard at that failed teal deer.

This makes me wonder if we keep the herd of teal deer long enough, do they eventually rehabilitate to the point that they regain their natural coloring and get released back into the wild?

I’m still trying to catch up with this thread, but I couldn’t resist responding to this.The welcome package handouts are hit or miss; I never got one either the many, many moons ago when I first posted. I just decided to ‘steal’ one, mwahahahaha. (Just letting you know that it happens, it’s not intentional and stolen ones are just as fun as the ones properly awarded!).

Seconding this. If I got my own welcome package, it’s probably buried in a very long thread somewhere and I’m not going to try to ferret it out due to more interest in current(ish) threads and laziness. I glommed on to someone else’s welcome package looong ago. Doesn’t matter either way; This is the place I feel most comfortable commenting, so thanks for that, Mammotheers!

And that Cheerios commercial reaction vid is teh awesome. That is all. I have no idea how far behind I am at this point. :s

Sarah
Sarah
6 years ago

“It’s clear that those posting links to the log are hoping that their opponents will take one look at this enormous, messy document and simply give up.”

Those are my logs. I do not appreciate being spoken for.

Hey! Look we’ve found something that people who don’t blink an eye at the sight of organised plans to harass, detailed violent rape fantasies, or speculations about the convenience of driving people to suicide, DO NOT APPRECIATE.

My hope was that people would…

So you don’t bother to try to refute anything yourself, just dump the logs and then whine because they didn’t find the refutation you wanted? Awwwwww.

“4chan culture” yadda yadda “4chan humor” yadda yadda “you don’t understand”

Nobody denies that those logs fit well into the 4chan “humor” and “culture”. A heavily bigoted “humor” and a despicably misogynist “culture” of harassment people.

The lines of serious inclinations to harass are indeed present, to speak earlier of being in the wrong. But you should be aware that such comments usually follow a trend of a flood of new users resulting from the channel being advertised on 4chan. In clear view of those who would use the site for discussion purposes AND those who are always seeking to abuse things for malicious reasons.

FFS, speak like a person and not a passive-voice generator.

But back to the point WHO FUCKING CARES if next to the doxxing that enabled fucking real life harassment were five dudes discussing about the weather.

Even ignoring all the misogynist slurs and “jokes” about her sexuality, you created and participated in a space where people gathered to dox and ruin a woman’s life and career.

And you’re fucking more concerned about cleaning the name of your stupid community than about the fact that as a result of it, real people, their friends and family were heavily harassed you fucking human garbage.

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

n this article all you’ve managed to prove is that you don’t quite understand the brand of humor 4channers are known for

(Pardon me for getting…blunt, y’all)

I understand it just fine and dandy, Mr Rodriguez.

I understood that kind of humor real well probably before you were born, when I was in third grade…One night I heard my dad call black people “porch monkeys,” and laugh like he’d said the funniest thing ever.

…Do you think that’s fucking funny?
I didn’t.
I wanted to drop through the floor because I knew in that moment how it felt to be thought of as less than someone else based on the way you were born.

But that’s the kind of humor that turns your crank in 4-chan, except you hate based on sex and not race.
You hate people for the sex they were born into.
Thanks for letting us see that in over 3000 pages of detail.

Y’all keep on shuckin’ and jivin’ over there in 4-chan, brother.