Creepy comment of the day: If men can’t get “the steady love and wild sex of a valuable young girl,” naturally they’ll start shooting people.
Banana slug: A better role model for horny humans than bonobos?
Sometimes I hunt the misogyny, sometimes it wanders up right up to me and says hello.
Today’s post is an example of the latter. Below, a slightly edited comment that someone left for me this morning. It’s a response to a post of mine about a dreadful post on Return of Kings in which a fellow calling himself Billy Chubbs argued, with absolutely no evidence, that a recent high school shooter was driven to murder because of his “probable sexual frustration,” Chubbs went on to argue that young women are “selfish” because they don’t have sex with guys they’re not attracted to.
Anyway, my new commenter – posting under the name “whogoesthere?” – thinks that I and the other commenters here were being too hard on Chubbs’ “very good argument.” And so he deposited this giant rant, which in many ways is even scarier than Chubbs’ original.
He’s a tad verbose, so I’ve trimmed out some stuff that isn’t relevant to his general, er, thesis. And I’ve also taken the liberty of adding a few paragraph breaks and bolding a few of the best (i.e. worst) bits.
When men don’t get the women they want they turn to violence.
Not a good start here, because this just isn’t true. In this case, the phrase “not all men” is, for once, appropriate. Most men don’t get violent when they’re turned down.
This is established all over the animal kingdom and offers a good example about how it applies to humans, that snotty girls who keep their sexual treasures to all but a few males cause the remaining males to snap. …
Animals do all sorts of things that humans don’t do, and we can’t always learn from their behavior or assume that it relates to our own lives.
Or maybe the Evo Psych crew is just looking at the wrong animals. When banana slugs can’t find a partner to have sex with, they simply fertilize themselves. There’s a lesson here, I think, for the angry incels of the world: you can’t always get what you want, and when you can’t, sex with yourself is better than murder.
High school is a massively sexually charged winner take all environment. … Today’s high school is basically an ongoing audition for a porno video and the guys and girls who don’t make the cut can only sit at home and masturbate.
wat
It’s demeaning and hits a major blow to a person’s sexual identity to not be invited to frolic with the beautiful people.
Somehow most people, regardless of gender, manage to survive even if they’re not frolicking with Charlize Theron and/or Channing Tatum.
I’m sorry but almost no men go on wild shooting rampages if they have a beautiful female in their keep.
In their keep?! Also, no. Charles Manson was surrounded by beautiful young women. Yet he orchestrated multiple grisly murders.
The only guys that do so are bank robbers and thieves, generally guys at a later stage of life more fixated on money.
wat
Human beings naturally assess the amount of sex going around them and judge themselves in relationship to the amount and type of sex others are getting.
You know, you can’t actually tell how much and what kind of sex someone is having just by looking at them. Yes, there will always be people in the world having more sex with you. And some of these people are having sex with people you would probably like to have sex with. There are also people who are smarter than you, funnier than you, who can play chess or kickbox better than you, who have hundreds or thousands of times more money than you do.
That’s life. Life isn’t fair.
This makes sense because from a reproductive standpoint sex is coveted, and sex with beautiful thin, young women are the most coveted. Being the first to spoil these young women sexually is viewed reproductively as a guarantee of parentage, thus this is why males instinctively covet and burn with passion for these females.
Ah, yes, it was only a matter of time until the creepy pedo-justifying Evo Psych assfacts made their appearance. Not all men “burn with passion” in their pants for virginal high school girls.
This is why we have “morality” which is in its essence is a promise not to flaunt or indulge in sex moreso than the lowest man or woman in your tribe. This is what is meant when people say “morality went out the window.” They mean someone with more sexual prowess is openly indulging in sex and broadcasting it to stimulate the jealousy of the underclasses.
I’m pretty sure that’s not what people mean when they say “morality went out the window.”
This teen killed people cause he thought that beautiful girls were out of reach. The high school environment merely rubbed it in his face. Yes drugs to treat ADD might’ve eroded many of the impulse control functions in the teen, but the rage against the high school was still the gasoline.
[citation needed]
He might’ve had a picture or two taken with a girl next to him, but oftentimes those high school girls lie and simply eat up the male’s offerings without granting sexual access, but grant it to a random stud.
How dare young women choose who to have sex with, and who not to!
I’m not saying the girl he killed deserved it, it’s only that when you are in that frame of mind you cannot tell who is having more sex than others and you simply fill in the gaps with rage.
Wait, so if she had turned him down he would have been justified in killing her?
The beautiful girl simply represented everything that the teen couldn’t get. The steady love and wild sex of a valuable young girl.
Yeah, I think you’re confusing high school with porn again. His rampage lasted roughly a minute and a half. He shot her because she was there.
All the other theories posted on this site seem comical, self-righteous and weirdly off-point. It’s like you’re assessing the situation as an asexual senior citizen or righteous prude.
Not a lot of “prudes” here. Just people who find the “women need to have sex with ‘nice guys’ or these ‘nice gys’ will kill you all” to be a somewhat problematic argument.
Generally men want sex with young thin beauties who validate their existence.
Some men do. But most men, among those who are sexually attracted to women, aren’t as neurotically fixated on this small slice of the female demographic – women in their teens and early twenties who are somehow both virginal and sexually “wild” – as manosphere men seem to be. And most people don’t base their entire self-worth on whether or not they’re having sex with beautiful people.
Some men prefer women older than them. Some like women who are fat. Plenty of men don’t fixate on a particular physical type and are attracted to all sorts of different women. Believe it or not, whogoesthere, there are lots of men who are more interested in what’s in a woman’s head than they are in whether or not she matches up with some particular checklist of physical attributes.
If society removes all of the social pathways to attaining such a beauty, such as making prostitution illegal, increasing shame for men who seek sex, rewarding females and males called manginas who identify and mock the sex seekers and so on… this will lead to depression in men and all of the behaviors surrounding it, including shootings. Sounds pretty much like a logical line of reasoning to me.
And that’s the problem. It’s not actually a logical line of reasoning at all. It’s more like a sort of blackmail.
Men don’t kill women because they can’t have “the steady love and wild sex of a valuable young girl.” Sometimes men kill women because they feel entitled to have sex with these “valuable young girls” and become bitter and enraged when they can’t find a “valuable young girl” who agrees with them on this particular point.
It’s not the lack of “sexual access” that’s the problem. It’s the notion that your desire for “sexual access” means more than the right of that person to say “no.” It’s the notion that society has done you wrong because you can’t (at least at the moment) get laid. It’s the idea that your desire to have sex with a particular kind of woman somehow trumps the right of other people to live.
I mean, what the fucking fuck.
Oh, by the way, there’s no evidence that the shooter in question – Karl Halverson Pierson – was motivated by sexual frustration. His intended target was the school librarian, who is also the school’s debate coach. Pierson was obsessed with debate, and had some sort of grudge against the coach.
Posted on June 22, 2014, in Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink. 2,219 Comments.
No no, I are totes serious supporter of feminism who has sadly accepted the inevitability of women not fucking me because they all want Christian Grey. Why u no believe me? I is sincere person.
I really don’t see how that’s so had to believe.
Speaking of women needing to be a “reasonable level of physical fitness,” this comic?
Really undfreeland? You can’t comprehend why we’d be skeptical of your feminist chops? After vomiting pseudo-science, confusing your preferences for universals, and demonstrating you’re very creepy and heinously sexist? I don’t like to play “No True Scottsman”, but when a person considers women little more than walking Vaginas he’d like to fuck I don’t generally consider that person to be a supporter of feminism.
Y u no c how sincere I am? I am smart troll, totes convincing.
Ooh hey undfreeland I want to hear more about how open-minded I am, because that didn’t skeeze me the fuck out or anything.
undfreeland:
No, life is not a bar fight. It just, it really isn’t. If that is all your life is, well, that’s actually really fucking sad. I’d probably pity you if you weren’t such an asshole.
See, the thing is, people aren’t “adjusting to lower and different expectations” when they have sex and/or relationships with people who you deem unattractive. It’s not settling, it’s people being attracted to who they are attracted to.
No you didn’t. You talked about your exes like they were things and not people.
So, we’re expanding the definition of “conventional attractiveness” to include a wide range of traits that includes just about everyone? That’s convenient.
Except, of course, for those who’s relationships weren’t built on an initial physical attraction.
These two sentences contradict each other. If attraction is subjective, and different people find different things attractive; then, no, you can’t say physical attraction can be quantified on some sort of objective scale.
No, are issue with Nice Guys ™ is that 1) they believe they are entitled to a woman and 2) they think if they put enough niceness coins into a woman, sex will fall out an 3) they think friendship with a woman is some kind of shitty consolation prize rather than valuable in and of itself.
Really? Are you serious? “R*tard?” What are you, like 12. Fuck off wit your ableism.
It’s because you aren’t influenced by media, Viscaria. It’s a magical power that only bi and pan people have. Yay, we’re awesome because we’ll fuck anything with a pulse! Go team go!
I would bi-five you (JOKES) but I’m too busy having sex with men I’m not attracted to. Or something.
undfreeland: For the record, I think evo psych is bullshit. If we disagree about the realities of the dating market, it is because I have a more realistic and objective attitude about it than than most, which is why I won’t address the supposed counter examples to my claims.
Aren’t you special. So much self-valorisation in so small a package. It is nice, however, for you to so blatantly admit your intellectual dishonesty.
The essence of what I’m saying is, you want to ruin the manosphere, legalize prostitution.
Which is where there isn’t any MRA activity in Britain?
Oh, wait, fuck…! there is! Shit, another good theory ruined by facts.
Undfreeland,
Here’s a secret for you. Nothing you’re saying is original or even remotely thought provoking. It’s a very exaggerated and distorted view of hetero-normative social pressures. One used by PUAs and MRAs in general to excuse their actions and basically the fact that they are horrible human beings. In real life people are individuals. They have their own tastes, feelings, desires, keys… etc that don’t really resemble the actual pressures the media pushes on people, much less what you and the PUAs are insisting everybody has.
So please stop thinking you know how the world works. It’s a misogynistic view. That’s why people don’t believe you are really a supporter of feminism.
Let’s borrow Woody’s pompoms and go find Russell Brand, I hear all women want to fuck him.
There is nothing wrong with having a type and that type can totally be tall, thin and gorgeous.
More power to you.
But don’t tell us you respect or are capable of loving the women you want when you are willing to emotionally abuse and manipulate them for the sake of your ego and your boner.
That’s just bullshit and it makes me feel sad for those women that they have to deal with men like you who don;t care about their happiness one bit.
Well, I am. LGBT rights, reproductive rights and access, equality of in the workforce, equality of pay, title XI, sexual harassment laws, recognizing the existence of rape culture, I support all those things. I like this site because it calls out terrible examples of misogyny that I believe are dangerous to society.
I don’t see how I could be any more of a feminist. I suppose like most ideologies, those that don’t tow 100% of the party line, or point out consequences of their beliefs, consequences that far outweigh the benefits, were just never true believers.
*benefits that far outweigh the consequences.* Ha ya’ll are going to give me hell for that.
OMG, Mammoths, how did you MISS halfeatengod a few pages back?
a toxic combination of narcissism, stupidity and entitlement (sadly a triumvirate of attributes I see a lot of lately in Millennial-age folks
Gee, thanks. I’m sure YOUR generation was the type where all the women were pretty, the men were intelligent, and all the children above average.
Do people take psychedelics anymore? I feel like questing after cosmic truth had a lot to do with my own and a lot of my contemporaries’ awakening to different perspectives and developing true empathy.
…are you for real? I thought you were a joke the Golden Generation made!
Somehow the dividends of the feminist movement seem to have fallen on deaf brains. I am still trying to figure out why this is.
I dunno. You tell me, buddy, you’re the generation what birthed us.
RE: undfreeland
To experience it frequently, and uncomplicated for prolonged periods… I can’t even imagine such bliss.
GEE I WONDER WHY. YOU BEING SUCH A NICE GUY AND ALL.
I don’t see how I could be any more of a feminist.
Dude, you admitted you mocked a woman for her engineering degree and see her sleeping with you as proof you should be an asshole to women. That’s, like, the antithesis of feminism right there.
“I don’t see how I could be any more of a feminist. I suppose like most ideologies, those that don’t tow 100% of the party line, or point out consequences of their beliefs, consequences that far outweigh the benefits, were just never true believers.”
Like most cults, feminism expects absolute conformity even on the details. It’s about social control as much as about policy.
undfreeland: For those denigrating my inclination not to address anecdotal examples of couplings, it is only because those examples generally involve loved ones, and I do not wish to accidentally insult anyone here.
So you’ve been doing it by intent? Good to know.
However, I question every ideology. Pragmatism, not dogmatism, is the correct path,
Which is why you don’t bother to examine the presented arguments which contradict the dogmatic pronouncements you’ve made.
These are just a few examples.
Cool stories, bro.
Well, not really. Either they are true, in which case you are so pathetic that you need to brag about being an abusive shit to get laid, or you are willing to lie about being an abusive shit to get laid; in the strange belief this will somehow validate bullshit claims.
So, which is it… honestly a shitstain, or eager to make people falsely believe you are a shitstain?
Either way, just a glop in the diaper of life.
And out comes the feminist hive mind bullshit.
You are getting even more predictably stale.
So get the fuck out, troll. No one invited you and no one wants you here. I don’t give two shits how watered down you think your views of women as people should be allowed to be to still be called a feminist. Thinking that my body really is mine own does not make you a super special ally. That should be a given.
You opinions are ill formed and utterly worthless.
Keep them to yourself or go back to whatever PUA cesspool spit you up and frolic with the other douchebags. You ain’t getting any cookies here for not being the worst misogynist ever. That’s like being the least rotten tomato in the compost pile.
Shut up, Woody.
“I mean, isn’t one of the complaints amongst ya’ll about Nice Guy dipsticks that they only want to sleep with very attractive women them despite not being attractive themselves?” – Undfreeland
No, this is not our argument. This has never been the argument, though some people might personally say it, because we are not all one “feminist” monolithic block.
Nice Guys only want to sleep with very attractive women despite not being DECENT HUMAN BEINGS WHO CARE MORE ABOUT PERSONALITY THAN LOOKS, LIKE THE REST OF THE HUMAN RACE. Heck, even the worst patriarchal societies at least care if the woman can cook and comes from a reputable family.
That is our complaint.
You were with that beautiful woman for a month. Had you treated her as a person, not as just a beautiful thing to take your breath away when she walked in the room but also as a brilliant woman who took your breath away when she spoke, you might still be with her. At minimum you’d have been with her a lot longer.
The most conventionally GORGEOUS man I knew, who was loaded and Brad Pitt esque, was also a necrophiliac. Seriously, he could only get boners by reading police reports. He stayed single because he’s a decent guy who’s just a little f’ed up in the head, and would turn down gorgeous women all the time because he didn’t want to deal with that conversation. Like everyone out there with a fetish, his tastes predated his attractiveness.
And yet again you say “rarely,” yet everywhere else it is black and white. Either conventionally attractive, straight women will only ever date conventionally attractive wealthy straight men and vice versa, or you were wrong to assume that Wetherby was lying about being poor or conventionally unattractive.
Now, if you were to come in here saying “Most people in our culture seem to be like x,” we would probably still refute it, but we’d not be attacking you like this because you’d at least be acknowledging that this is mostly sociological (obviously, since Khoisan culture selectively bred themselves for enormous butts and long labiae, and most pre-industrial societies glorified pudgy, untoned women, this must be true). You’d also be acknowledging that humans are NOT a monolithic block, and that many, many people that you find beautiful are attracted to body types that you don’t consider so. And that even more– actually, most– will overlook any physical flaw, including full-body burn scars, paralysis preventing sex, even atypical genitalia (such as a man without a penis, or a woman with one), if the personalities mesh.
I are totes feminist until it interferes with my boner, at which point feminism becomes the thing that has made my boner sad – bad femism, bad! Bad boner-oppressing consequences!
100% feminist, me.
Woody! Awwwwwww, there he is. Wookit at how cuuuuute!
Yeah guiiiiiiizzzzzzz, how come we won’t let undfreeland into our Feminist Clubhouse!? He’s totes a real feminist cause he says so! No, no, stop reading into the things he says. He isn’t a misogynist, he likes to mock them too! He said so! Ssssshhhhh…. ignore that stuff he wrote about the sexual marketplace and how negging women is good. If you don’t let him into the cult- I mean Clubhouse!- you’re all a bunch of mean meanie pants!
Oh, Woody.
You do give me a chuckle.
Still think a troll hoop would be fun for him (um, us) though.
Cassandra,
Remember, according to his comments upthread feminism is only good because it helps men like unfreeland get with hotter chicks and gives religion a sad.
Empathy, how does it work?
No, I’m pretty sure without feminism liberating women’s sexuality I would have been laid a lot less. Nothing in feminism keeps me personally from getting laid, I don’t think, but it does break down monogamous expectations that once benefited the very lowly in industrialized societies.
My own complaints, which are directed more at fate and my own and other’s susceptibility to social programming that hasn’t kept up with feminism, are not about about not getting laid at all. They are about not being attractive to the women who I’d most like to have sex with most and whose presence in my life would fill me with purpose. I do not count myself amongst the dregs.
What I don’t understand is why he expects us to care.
(Especially when he’s making less sense than most people make when they’re high as kites.)
That makes one of you.
So… It’s about having sex, then? (aka, getting laid, btw)
Does anyone else smell that? What is that SMELL? I can’t quite put my finger on it…
It isn’t just classism, but it seems… related. Somehow.
That’s a shame. A bit of self-knowledge might do you some good.
Decent people have a purpose of their own.
Fuck off.
Look, everybody! Woody said something that wasn’t effusive praise of some other MRA! Let’s give him a hand for showing some individuality, yeah?
RE: B
The most conventionally GORGEOUS man I knew, who was loaded and Brad Pitt esque, was also a necrophiliac.
Wow, damn. That’s… that’s one hell of a cross to bear. Eesh. I feel bad for that dude.
RE: undfreeland
it does break down monogamous expectations that once benefited the very lowly in industrialized societies.
You do realize that monogamy is a not the standard in the world as a whole, right? Polygamy is.
They are about not being attractive to the women who I’d most like to have sex with most and whose presence in my life would fill me with purpose.
Dude, you’re an asshole. You say you’re a feminist, but I don’t care about your beliefs; I care about your actions, and you’re a confessed asshole. No shit you’re not attractive to the women you want most. Most women are not attracted to assholes, and they certainly don’t want to keep long relationships with them of their own free will.
I do not count myself amongst the dregs.
If it means being far away from you, I am HAPPY to be dregs.
Do most people have a specific set of sexual characteristics they find attractive in the opposite sex? Sure. For you, it’s pretty broad– physical fitness. For me, it’s a willingness to put up with my shit, beards, long hair, and effeminate faces on stocky bodies. For some women, it’s the ability to provide for them. For my conventionally attractive coworker, who only dates men who make less than her, it’s someone who needs to be cared for. These are all valid things to be attracted to, and I am not wrong for not liking chiseled jaws, and you are not wrong for not liking overweight woman. That is not why you are acting misogynistic.
You are misogynistic because you think that ALL women want a specific, culturally-reinforced ideal despite all evidence to the contrary. You are self-centered because you believe that all men must share your sexual preferences despite all evidence to the contrary.
Again:
“Most women in Western society seem to be attracted to fit, tall, strong-jawed, well-dressed men with money, and most men seem to be attracted to any woman who is slim, toned, and healthy looking, though of course there are exceptions”– maybe inaccurate (hard to tell without studies), but okay. Not inherently misogynistic, qualifies the statements (most instead of all, defines physically fit, includes that there are exceptions), uses “seems to be” because you don’t have non-anecdotal evidence.
“All that is required for a women to be attractive is a reasonable level of physical fitness. Men must be fit, tall, have good facial structure, style and economic status.” Bad. No qualifiers. Does not allow for exceptions. Does not consider that our culture has it’s own idea of what are attractive traits in men and women, different from other cultures (the fact that you fail to acknowledge culture is why you are accused of being an evo-psych type). Irrational, since it denies fetishism, non-Western culture, and dealbreakers (for example, no matter how fit she was, you would probably not be sexually attracted to a woman who refused to shower or brush her teeth until she smelled like moldy cheese, or one who spent the whole time you were having sex talking about a conversation she had with your mother about your childhood potty-training).
Can you understand the difference?
I just picked some grape tomatoes from my garden and can’t decide to dress them with a little olive oil, salt, pepper, basil & a few dried chili flakes
Or
add some radishes and dress them with sesame oil, rice vinegar, soy, scallions & (fairly mild) shaved jalapenos
I have some young arugula & lettuces I was going to serve them on with a little crusty bread.
Help me decide?
(I’m testing to see if blockquote is the right tag for quoting here… If it fails or summons a monster into your home, I’m sorry.)
How is a complaint about “not being attractive to the women who I’d most like to have sex with” not one about “getting laid”? I assume you want to be attractive to them so they will have sex with you… Or do you just want them to want you so you can stroke your… ego.
And you know, making women something whose presence in your life would fill you with meaning isn’t a good thing. Find purpose in yourself. And see women as people and not symbols of your self worth.
I would run away so fast from someone who wanted me to be the one thing that gave their life purpose. Eek.
Undf doesn’t seem to have any theory of mind. Which admittedly, seems to be a failing in a lot of the bigots we see around here. Undf, you should try the smarties test and see if you pass.
undfreeland: I must admit. I envy you sir. The admiration of a beautiful woman brings about the most sublime and joyous feelings in life. To experience it frequently, and uncomplicated for prolonged periods… I can’t even imagine such bliss.
Good grief. Love can be sublime. But the “beauty” is arbitrary. I’ve dated women who run the conventional gamut, from “ugly” to “model”. They were all, to me, attractive. I would say I found most of them beautiful.
That isn’t what made it sublime. That was the love aspects of it.
But truth be told, I’ve had some of the same sorts of feeling from doing archery, or riflery. I’ve had it from playing pennywhistle in a jam-session (Skynard’s “Gimme Three Steps” and “Sweet Home Alabama” are kick-ass tunes for freewheel whistling). Watching the sunset on the Pacific, as the tide comes in at Pelican Cove, or sitting on a BTR, with a couple of Ukranian soldiers while eating a sandwich and shootting the shit as the birds flit about the steppe; looking at the night sky through a set of Night Vision Goggles and seeing so many stars the constellations couldn’t be seen (while meteorites No One Else Could See were streaking across that panorama), or going to sleep in the Iraqi desert while Scorpio was dragging his tail in the Milky Way… all of those were like that too.
The reason you can’t imagine such bliss is your stunted view of what’s worthwhile.
Piratejennie: I’d go with the former.
RE: cassandrakitty
I would run away so fast from someone who wanted me to be the one thing that gave their life purpose. Eek.
My rapist was of that type. One of the things that got me through the recovery process was the knowledge that cutting him out of my life made me sob like a baby and claim I’d broken his belief in love. (Seeing what he believed loved to be, I can only hope that without it, he never tried to groom a teenage girl again.)
RE: pecunium
But truth be told, I’ve had some of the same sorts of feeling from doing archery, or riflery.
Ditto. I love my husband dearly, he’s my man, but if our relationship were to end one day, I can still feel bliss. I feel it with my other system members, being happy and having a dance party together. I feel it when I write a good story, or make a comic that helps people. Hell, I’ve felt it while hiking mountains, by reading a good book, by laughing so hard I keeled over and cried.
@ LBT
Yeah, I was going to say, a lot the stuff this dude is saying was making my think of the way you’ve described your rapist. It seems to be a feature of the type that they have no idea how creepy their fixation is for the people on the receiving end, or how unfair it is to put that sort of burden on someone’s shoulders.
@katz
Thanks! I think that’s what I’m going to go with since I just found the first cucumber hiding & I can add a little lemon juice.
Sorry if that was a ham-fisted attempt to talk about something else, I was just so dreadfully tired of the roundabout I thought I’d inject a little levity.
Not trying to step on anyone who still wants to bat the chew toy, I’m loving the responses.
Shoot, posted before I saw your comment LBT.
I apologize for my insensitivity.
@undfreeland
You could be more of a feminist by treating women as people and not as sexdolls whose only value is their appearance. This is not a small detail, treating women like people is like the most basic notion of feminism, and if you can’t agree on that then no, you’re not a “true believer”.
@ piratejennie
Changing the subject when the trolls get boring is totes encouraged.
I 2nd the rec for the former, btw :D
I had soft boiled eggs with asparagus and a horseradish and dijon sauce for dinner myself. Washing it down with a nice chardonnay.
It brings me more bliss than undfreeland’s relationships brought him.
undfreeland: I really would like to know what it is that pisses you off so much about me. I support every major feminist initiative, I don’t feel entitled to sex with women. I just describe the world as I see it, in a way that harms no one.
The reason I am hostile to you is that you aren’t, “harming no one”. You are spouting misogynist, (and racist) tropes, which hurt women, and minorities (and also encourage other people to be more racist).
No, you can’t wipe that clean with trite assertions you are really are Mr. Uber-Feminist. The actual meaning of the words you use is such that you insist women have harmed the world with feminism; and that’s just the way it is. You also assert that the only way to “fix” the non-problems you are obsessing over is to have women surrender some of their autonomy; “for the menz”.
As to the racism… it’s foul. I’m “an unimpressive” white guy (to look at), and I’ve lived in parts of town which are infamous for being dangerous (and rightfully so). When I was living in E. Palo Alto it had just stopped being the city in the US with the highest rate of murder. We had a kid gunned down 60 meters from my front door (he had won some money in the illegal dice game next door to our house). Gunfire was audible about twice a week.
And yet… I didn’t worry about it. My housemate didn’t worry about it (and less when I taught her how to tell which direction the shots were going). One of the reasons she chose to live there was that the rate of rape was a lot lower than it was in Berkeley. Thing is, unless one happens to be travelling in circles where violence is common, even in the “bad” parts of town, you aren’t likely to encounter much.
The rates of truly random crime in the poor parts of town aren’t any higher than than they are anywhere else (it’s been argued that random crime is probably lower; because the crooks go to where the money is).
But you, you blame your, “my white ass ain’t safe,” on some convenient POC.
That’s racist dude. Goes right up their with the lies/not lies you told about being a shitheel. Just a glop of shit in a diaper-pail.
@fromafar2013
Oh, you best believe there will be a wine pairing with this meal.
Your dinner sounds lovely, I am a big horseradish fan and a nice runny yolk with asparagus is a thing of beauty.
Bliss indeed. The kind that when described doesn’t make my skin crawl.
How can you be more of a feminist Undfreeland? How about you refer to or describe a woman in terms other than your physical attraction and your standards of bodily beauty. Just once. Because you have not yet done that. Not once. Considering the repulsive anecdotes you shared about how you feel totally justified manipulating women into sex without nary care about them as anything but sextoys I gotta say you don’t really strike me as an ally to women. Predator seems a better adjective.
Woody: shut up.
I know charismatic, conventionally handsome, swell guys with great personalities who go out with charismatic, conventionally pretty, swell women with great personalities. So, yes, attractive people often go out with other attractive people. That isn’t caused by feminism, that isn’t immoral, and that isn’t a social problem that needs to be addressed because it makes non-conventionally attractive men sad rage (not women, of course, because it’s their own fault and who cares about them anyway).
You have reiterated that point approximately five thousand times and people here are still not biting. Feel free to stop doing this over and over and over.
The undfreeland posts, the creepier and more pathetic he sounds.
I mean, this?:
He’s contradicting himself and getting all creepily possessive with that “give my life purpose” thing.
I don’t even expect the trolls to be consistent across all comments, but you’d think they could at least manage not to put sentences that contradict each other in the same paragraph.
Bullshit.
Highest bliss my ass.
LITERAL elven princess models ( capitals for emphasiz) call me handsome. I sleep with them.
It’s fun. We have fun.
The said, that same bliss I get from painting. Archery. Making children laugh. Writing. Solving 4d equations. Making someone cry as I dungeonmaster a roleplaying game.
People who only dream of sex are empty human beings.
The admiration of beautiful ( model! ) wonderful ( highest grade average in 17 years ) is fun, great, wonderful. So is so, so many other things.
Like making someone believe in magic momentarily or reading about human interactions in economic systems.
Look, in my day job? I play a LITERAL knight in shining armor. Sometimes on a white horse. Really. The admiration of beautiful (“young”, “unspoiled”) girls? Sure it’s fun. It is. But… It isn’t some magical force, which in the years I did not have it made me suffer.
Get over your penis. Get a hobby. Women are just people.
Oh, woody.
http://m.memegenerator.net/instance/51593297
It’s all chuckles and laughter until my half-elf ranger dies.
::much sobbing::
I miss you most of all Gwenhwyfar!
::still more tears::
I didn’t even go into the bliss I get when doing things with other people… oh wait, not true.. the pennywhistle: that was a memory from this weekend.
But fencing, having a good session on the mat; when one is in the moment, and the energy is flowing and the uke/nage relationship is centered and the end is inevitable. Or doing some free-form and being able to reverse the pin and heave the black belt who was grappling with you over; and seeing her smile because it was a perfect moment, even though she, “lost”.
A carefree gallop up the trails of the Eucalyptus Forest of Montana de Oro, when the gum trees are sweating their heady scent and then the trees are gone and the meadows are green with grass and Leus is demanding more head and your seat is solid and the only thing to do is trust him to navigate the path because he’s going faster than you can see. And the slow walk back, where the 6-point Muley is across the draw, just staring at you; and it’s a freak of fate you saw him, so still was he that only his nostrils moved.
Or the creak of leather, in the dark of the night, with the moon completely gone and nothing but Northern Light, and the dark beneath the trees of Point Reyes is Stygian, and again you have to trust in the horses as they walk, you and your companion talking softly, and breathing the cold green air.
Playing chase in the hills, on Skyline Drive, Petes’s bike ahead, Amy’s bike behind: the twisties putting distance between us all, and then the straightaways letting us catch up again. Or having someone riding behind, as you pass a slow car on a narrow road in the Gatineau; dropping to third and rolling on the throttle; with the speedo showing 130 kph, and the tach snarling at 8,000; before the nose of the car passes behind the midline of the bike.
Walking with the dogs, and seeing a kite fail to catch a sparrow for dinner. Lying on my back and taking a photo of a magpie, just as it hit a Red-tailed hawk it thought ought to leave the neighborhood.
Fuck… the amount of bliss in my life is so vast I could go on for hours.
Hah!
Heheh.
In this case a cult was stealing bits of peoples soul to ressurect their diety. The party came across a room full of “hollow” (formerly “hallow”) men in their beds, comatose. No one actualle died, but the one dwarf cried, seeing his countrymen almost dead.
undfreeland: I don’t see how I could be any more of a feminist.
Oh.. how about seeing them as people, with all the variation, foibles, strengths, rights, privileges, and virtues as everyone else.
Rather than as shallow gold-diggers who only like some mythically attractive men, and who are responsible for men killing women; because they have the audacity to not want to fuck Nice Guy™ assholes.
“I don’t see how I could be any more of a feminist.”
I know this was said already, but it bears repeating — you could try treating women as people.
As for attraction…I go for the skinny guys (sorry pecunium, I’m guessing you were gorgeous in your youth, skinny redhead? Yes please), girls…legs. I’m a legs person. What really gets me though? The sorta skater or goth androgynous look. Which is, pretty much by definition, neither busty nor man muscle.
Current relationship? Pharm student’s about my height (not impressive) and weight, not really “conventionally attractive”, a goddamned grad student so POOOOOR, and busy…who shares so many of my strange interests that I had to email zir when I found one of our shard bands had gotten a FB page, also, hilarious, brilliant, and takes my insanity in stride.
BF? Tall, like, 8″ taller than me tall, beanpole thin, poor? Wealthy? Are we counting money tied up in his business that’s not quite breaking even? Also hilarious, and brilliant, and has his own experience with some of my breed of crazy. Oh, and he’s mostly grey at 30~. Looks damned good in a three piece suit with pocket watch and everything though!
BF’s on the side lady, which may end up a poly thing with all three of us? Shorter than me, thin, also a very busy grad student. Gorgeous.
Me? Meh. I’m the size of the average 14 year old. Welfare poor, crazy, but hey, I got looks on my side.
Someone math out who here belongs with whom by troll boy’s standards?
But fencing, having a good session on the mat; when one is in the moment, and the energy is flowing and the uke/nage relationship is centered and the end is inevitable. Or doing some free-form and being able to reverse the pin and heave the black belt who was grappling with you over; and seeing her smile because it was a perfect moment, even though she, “lost”.
Yes! So much yes.
*rubs his rug burn and old wounds*
people, if you give them the chance are WONDERFUL, 99 times out of 100
RE: cassandrakitty
It seems to be a feature of the type that they have no idea how creepy their fixation is for the people on the receiving end, or how unfair it is to put that sort of burden on someone’s shoulders.
Well, my rapist took a little far, even by that standard. Seriously, what kind of twenty year old man places responsibility for fixing and motivating his life on the shoulders of a sixteen-year-old child who barely knows how to sweep a floor? (What’s even more horrifying was that apparently it WORKED. Apparently it was only us that got him to get a job, go back to school, and move out from his parents place… so he could have more access to us, but still.)
RE: piratejennie
Shoot, posted before I saw your comment LBT. I apologize for my insensitivity.
Don’t worry about it. It happened a long time ago and doesn’t hurt anymore.
RE: Fibinachi
I play a LITERAL knight in shining armor.
I thought you were an economist, Fibs?
Wow. There’s nothing like someone spouting SMV doctrine to make a thread go nuts.
One of the smartest things I ever saw on human sexuality was a t-shirt with the slogan “I AM SOMEBODY’S FETISH”. The gag is that it doesn’t matter a damn who wears the t-shirt, the statement is always true.
Human attraction is a weird thing. Probably the most successful ladies man I ever knew was a former housemate of mine who looked like Sideshow Bob and Frank Zappa had been merged in a transporter malfunction, and smelled like a brewery that allows smoking. But then, maybe the big $$$ he made at the call center sweetened the deal.
Bliss? The moment all other moments strive to compare to? Standing atop a mountain looking out over the valley. Feeling like I was standing on top of the world, while being just this tiny little speck in the grand scheme of things.
Sunrise over Pittsburgh’s rivers, and the lights on them at night. Those come close to that moment, but not quite there.
Being nibbled on by my fish, snuggles with furry critters.
There’s something somewhat circular about the whole “status” argument:
One must have “status” to have sex.
Yet one of the marker’s of “status” is having sex.
The best part is that it doesn’t even matter if he gets along with this hypothetical hot babe, just that she’s hot and she worships him. Why doesn’t he just get a pin-up calendar and a dog?
@piratejennie – So jealous of your fresh cucumber!I can’t grow those to save my life. Every year the bacterial wilt gets them just as the fruit sets. I finally gave up this spring and planted extra bell peppers instead – cukes are just too much heartbreak. Hope you enjoy(ed) your salad. :)
@fromafar2013 – Your dinner sounded great, too. Love asparagus and yolks, though I usually go lazy and fry my eggs.
The FM family had strawberry pancakes (at the kids’ request) and bacon. Good, but not terribly seasonal or sophisticated.
Then I had to figure out what was wrong with the dishwasher. I was going to do it by myself, but husband insisted that two heads are better than one on that kind of thing. Turns out the drain hose is clogged. It was vile, the kind of thing where you laugh and gag as you do it because the alternative is crying and gagging.
Being with a guy who will stop trying to recompile his kernel on Linux just so that he can scrape slime into a dishtub while you hold a flashlight – that’s not at all sexy or validating. But it is pretty darned blissful.
Omg flying mouse! My dishwasher is acting up too! The water was off for a split second and I guess the air in the pipes confused it cause now it will go through the washing motions but no water comes out. So mad.
Ugh. My problem is entirely too much water, and nowhere for it to go. I would say we should trade off, but the water I have is repulsive and of no use to anyone. :b
I have to go get a new hose for the darned thing tomorrow. Hopefully that won’t be followed by shopping for a new dishwasher; Mr. FM has concerns about the motor in ours, which is almost nine years old and not the nicest model to begin with.
The joys of being an adult, right?
Fibinachi, pecunim, ya’ll have pretty amazing lives, it seems. And you wonder why you don’t worry about women?
As to those using my past experiences with women to say I’m not a feminist. As I said, I did not intentionally “neg” them. I was just being kinda an ass and they happened to like it. When I’m humble and polite, women tend to ignore me. I do not blame them. I am boring, unattractive and lead a life no where as interesting as some on this forum.
I also think it’s bizarre that anyone would assume I ever mention any of the thoughts I’ve expressed here to anyone but highly cynical men. Jesus. I understand that my views run counter to pretty much everything that is EXPLICIT in our culture. The typical network television watching slack jaw isn’t any likelier to agree with me than other feminists.
@sparky
Come on, undfreeland already said
Stop twisting his words by quoting him.
@undfreeland
So, you’re going to continue to dodge the fact our criticism actually focuses on how you think that non-conventionally attractive men getting frustrated over not being granted their own Helen of Troy is a recently developed social crisis that must be addressed by legalizing prostitution or those frustrated men will become misogynist and, inexplicably, racist reactionaries. Plus, you wave off any unhappiness experienced by non-conventional women as inconsequential and their own damn fault.
You are a non-rational, self-pitying egocentric crank. And boring as fuck.