Voices of Hatred: A look at the noxious views of six of the speakers at A Voice for Men’s upcoming conference
Posted by David Futrelle
Curious about the views of the people scheduled to speak at A Voice for Men’s “Men’s Issues” conference next week? Here’s a little video guide. CONTENT WARNING: Domestic violence, rape, incest.
If you’d like to have their quotes in writing for future reference, here’s a transcript of the quotes used in the video. I’ve linked to the source of each quote (or to posts of mine that discuss the quotes in greater detail). Enjoy!
Mike Buchanan has said:
I believe girls learn at a young age that whining gets them what they want, especially from over-indulgent parents who might later wonder why their daughters became Entitlement Princesses. Inevitably these girls continue whining into adolescence and adulthood because they continue to get what they want. It’s up to men to break the cycle …
Men living in houses with cellars can put a sign on the cellar door, ‘The Whine Cellar’, and politely direct whining women towards it. In houses without a cellar, the smallest room in the house – or possibly the garden shed – could be designated ‘The Whine Box’.
Mike Buchanan is a speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men
Mike Buchanan is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Buchanan’s quote
Stefan Molyneux has said:
Women who choose the assholes will fucking end this race. They will fucking end this human race, if we don’t start holding them a-fucking-ccountable. … Women who choose assholes guarantee child abuse. Women who choose assholes guarantee criminality, sociopathy. Politicians, all the cold-hearted jerks who run the world came out of the vaginas of women who married assholes.
And I don’t know how to make the world a better place without holding women accountable for choosing assholes. Your dad was an asshole because your mother chose him. Because it works on so many women. If “asshole” wasn’t a great reproductive strategy it would have been gone long ago. Women keep that black bastard flame alive. They cup their hands around it, they protect it with their bodies. They keep the evil of the species going by continually choosing these guys.
If being an asshole didn’t get women, there would be no assholes left. If women chose nice guys over assholes we would have a glorious and peaceful world in one generation. Women determine the personality traits of the men because women choose who to have sex with, and who to have children with, and who to expose those children to. …
Your dad is who he is fundamentally because your mother was willing to fuck him and have you. Willing and eager to fuck the monster. Stop fucking monsters and we get a great world. Keep fucking monsters, we get catastrophes, we get war, we get nuclear weapons, we get national debt, we get incarcerations … Women worship at the feet of the devil and wonder why the world is evil. And then you know what they say? We’re victims!
Stefan Molyneux is a scheduled speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men.
Stefan Molyneux is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Molyneux’s quote. NOTE: The text above is a more complete version of the slightly truncated quote used in the video, which was edited for clarity, for length, and to remove some repetition.
Erin Pizzey has said:
If you’re referring to Paul’s statement that many or most women fantasize about being taken, I’m sorry but that’s the truth. That doesn’t mean they want to be raped, but it’s a fantasy I think almost all women have. And I think he went on to say that feminists like Andrea Dworkin who were and are so obsessed with rape are really projecting their own unconscious sexual frustration because men don’t give them enough attention. Andrea was a very sad lonely woman like this–I didn’t know her but I knew of her, and I knew Susan Browmiller and you can just read her stuff to see it there.
Erin Pizzey is a scheduled speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men
Erin Pizzey is a voice of hatred
SOURCE of Pizzey’s quote. NOTE: The text above is a complete version of the slightly truncated quote used in the video, which was edited for clarity.
Karen Straughan has written:
I used to live under a young couple with a baby. I’d listen as she followed him from room to room upstairs, stomping, slamming things, throwing things, screaming. After about an hour, he’d eventually hit her, and everything would go quiet. An hour after that, they’d be out with the baby in the stroller, looking perfectly content with each other.
A man I know who has experience with men in abusive relationships would get his clients to answer a questionnaire. Things like, “after the violence, did you have sex?” “If so, how would you rate the sex?” 100% of men in reciprocally abusive relationships said “yes” to the first, and “scorching” to the second.
He also posited that the much-quoted cycle of violence–the build-up, the explosion, the honeymoon period–correlates with foreplay, orgasm and post-coital bliss.
Erin Pizzey called it “consensual violence”, and said in the main, that was the type she’d see at her shelter. It is also the type that results in the most severe injuries in women, surprise surprise, likely because our “never EVER hit a woman” mentality has those men waiting until they completely lose control of their emotions before giving their women what they’re demanding.
Karen Straughan is a speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men
Karen Straughan is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Straughan’s quote.
Warren Farrell has said:
The worst aspect of dating from the perspective of many men is how dating can feel to a man like robbery by social custom …
Evenings of paying to be rejected can feel like a male version of date rape.
If a man ignoring a woman’s verbal “no” is committing date rape, then a woman who says “no” with her verbal language but “yes” with her body language is committing date fraud. …
We have forgotten that before we began calling this date rape and date fraud, we called it exciting.
Somehow, women’s romance novels are not titled He Stopped When I Said “No”. They are, though, titled Sweet Savage Love, in which the woman rejects the hand of her gentler lover who saves her from the rapist and marries the man who repeatedly and savagely rapes her. …
It is important that a woman’s “noes” be respected and her “yeses” be respected. And it is also important when her nonverbal “yeses” … conflict with those verbal “noes” that the man not be put in jail for choosing the “yes” over the “no.” He might just be trying to become her fantasy.
Warren Farrell is a speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men
Warren Farrell is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Farrell’s quote.
Warren Farrell has said:
Incest is like a magnifying glass. In some circumstances it magnifies the beauty of the relationship, and in others it magnifies the trauma. …
When I get my most glowing positive cases, 6 out of 200, the incest is part of the family’s open, sensual style of life, wherein sex is an outgrowth of warmth and affection. …
[M]illions of people who are now refraining from touching, holding, and … caressing their children, when that is really a part of a caring, loving expression, are repressing the sexuality of a lot of children and themselves. Maybe this needs repressing, and maybe it doesn’t.
Warren Farrell is a speaker at the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit organized by A Voice for Men
Warren Farrell is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Farrell’s quote. I have removed a word that appears in the original interview but that Farrell insists he did not say.
Paul Elam has said:
In the name of equality and fairness, I am proclaiming October to be Bash a Violent Bitch Month.
I’d like to make it the objective for the remainder of this month, and all the Octobers that follow, for men who are being attacked and physically abused by women – to beat the living shit out of them. I don’t mean subdue them, or deliver an open handed pop on the face to get them to settle down. I mean literally to grab them by the hair and smack their face against the wall till the smugness of beating on someone because you know they won’t fight back drains from their nose with a few million red corpuscles.
And then make them clean up the mess.
Now, am I serious about this?
No. Not because it’s wrong. It’s not wrong.
But it isn’t worth the time behind bars or the abuse of anger management training that men must endure if they are uppity enough to defend themselves from female attackers.
Paul Elam is the central organizer of the “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit, and the founder of A Voice for Men
Paul Elam is a voice of hatred
SOURCE for Elam’s quote.
For a detailed look at the homophobia of Anne Cools, another speaker at the conference, see here.
Big thanks to everyone who helped with the video!
Posted on June 20, 2014, in a voice for men, a woman is always to blame, antifeminism, antifeminist women, erin pizzey, evil women, excusing abuse, FemRAs, GirlWritesWhat, imaginary oppression, men who should not ever be with women ever, misogyny, MRA, paul elam, playing the victim, rape, rape culture, warren farrell and tagged a voice for men, antifeminism, conference, detroit, men's rights, misogyny, MRA, warren farrell. Bookmark the permalink. 869 Comments.
FIRST !
okay ….. all of the people that feature in this video have said mean things about women. obviously no one has ever said mean things – or generalised about men.
the argument starts here.
Have a cookie.
You have no argument. “BOTH SIDES!” is no argument.
Iiiiiiiiii think I need to go scrub my brain out with cute pictures of marmoset polyandry now.
Where are the nonviolent MRAs? You never provided any.
So the fact that there are humans out there somewhere who may or may not have at one time said something bad about men (you provide zero sources, so we’re going to have to take your word for it) excuses a self proclaimed human rights conference hosting six open, vocal misogynists? And one homophobe. Thems some interesting logicks, you got there, fella.
All MRAs advocate for violence. Some advocate for rape, some for domestic violence, some for child rape or for all of the above. No mainstream feminists have ever advocated for violence the way the mainstream of the MRM does.
No one has ever shown anyone a nonviolent MRA.
“Mean”? “Mean” is maybe insults at the worst. This is a bit too fucked up to be just “mean”.
Also, why the punctuation abuse?
@ auggziliary – Im a man – I abuse everything – including punctuation. grrrrr
These are not fringe members of the MRA. These are speakers at AVFM’s conference. If you want to argue “both sides”, we need quotes from speakers at a major feminist conference, not Tumblr or RadFemHub.
False equivalence, AGAIN.
Not ‘some feminists say’ … it has to be ‘some feminists PICKED TO BE THE SPEAKERS AT A LARGE FEMINIST GATHERING say.’ Something equivalent. Bannerholders! Handpicked! The ones getting the accolades and attention!
Wait, ellipses with five dots aren’t a thing?
Well as Im your resident MRA for the day – and, as such the general absorbent for your abuse and anger, I must say – Im a strong supporter of all the people featured in this video.
take them out of context as much as you like – I really do agree with their respective points of view – and I do follow them on their channels and blogs.
what do you think about that, manboobz ?
Woody red,
Mean things?
Saying a mean thing is when you say that someone’s haircut looks like it was done with a weed wacker or that they look like they got dressed drunk with the lights off.
Stating that their is a class of people who deserve to be raped, beaten and otherwise abused and blamed for all the bad things, is hate speech.
You just defended hate speech.
You’re a dim witted bigot who doesn’t know that the “First!” thing was never funny and that even kids know was played out last year. You read about bigots suggesting that raping your own children was “sensual” and “affectionate” and that men should slap their wives around and your first response was to tell a bad joke. You think your clever, but the failure mode of clever is asshole. You failed. You’re an asshole.
“Mean things about women.”
Karen Straughan saying women want to get beaten and bring abuse on themselves is saying mean things about women.
Erin Pizzey and Warren Farrell saying women want to be raped is saying mean things about women.
Mike Buchanan saying that men need to treat women like whining children is saying mean things about women.
Paul Elam “satirizing” violence against women is saying mean things about women.
Stefan Molyneux completely blaming women for all bad things that have happened ever – even the bad things that men have done – and blaming women for the destruction of the human race is saying mean things about women.
None of that is hatred of women, misogyny if you will. It’s saying “mean things” about women.
And it’s perfectly ok that a movement calling itself a human rights movement has invited all these people to speak at their “international conference,” – which to MRAs, seems to be a pretty important thing and a big deal – so, inviting all these people who have said these “mean things” about women is perfectly ok because sometimes random people and random feminists say mean things about men.
That’s woodyred’s argument here, right?
You all have lovely voices. Also, woody is a fucking idiot.
woodyred:
How is Molyneux being taken out if context?
In what context is blaming women for all the evils of the world perfectly understandable?
@Ally S ~ ♥
Per the video, is the desire to get the conference cancelled based on these quotes? If so, the very people those quotes are addressing are the protesters themselves, that is – feminists. That could be the reason so much of the blog rhetoric out there have phrases like “butt hurt whiners” or similar. In this case, wouldn’t it be better for the protesters to include many others who merely don’t like the quotes on principle but are not the ones being attacked by the MRAs?
Are you, like, trying to behave like a YouTube commenter for the sake of being likable? I hope not.
@woody*
This is why the “it was satire” argument falls flat.
That it’s a little sad that, in your attempt at reconciling problems facing men with your understanding of the world, you choose to support people who will throw you under a bus to inflate their egos and rip and tear at everything pretending at decency.
It appalls me that someone claiming abuse cycles are like sex, or that women marrying assholes means they are to blame for wars, catastrophes and suffering is thought of as a person worthy of “strong support”.
It appalls me that someone thinks Warren Farrell – a guy who literally claims in his literature that avoiding the draft means you’ll be raped and get aids by deviant homosexuals in prison – is worthy of your “strong support”.
It surprises me you choose to stick with this view. I wonder why. It’s almost as if the ideas don’t matter, who they are don’t matter, as long as you get to claim that they’re fighting the good fight against dastardly feminists then, hey, Paul Elam’s “Fucking whores” or Mike Buchanan’s “Entitlement Princesses degrade the financial performance of companies because women are too stupid to be board members” is on the same level as a given feminist saying that men are bad.
I think you use their atrocious view points to prop up your own lacklustre world, because you don’t actually like women, or men, or people, and pretending that you live in a world as hollow, empty and cold as these people claim is a soothing balm that allows you to say stuff like “I’m a man, I abuse everything” and a) mean it and b) not wonder how fucking wrong that is.
That’s what I think. I also have opinions on the world debt, proper feng shui and just what constitutes the right equipment for a knightly joust (No, Steve, you can’t fucking bring a zweihander to our sword and shield match? ARE YOU TAKING THE PISS? What is that stuff on your legs? Chain-mail? Plate or hate! Don’t bring your rings, you’ll lose your digits and things!).
So yeah. Contempt.
I listened to hundreds of hours of Stefan Molyneux’s podcasts back in the day, and I never heard him say anything like that. He said sexist things, to be sure, but, well, wow. He’s really gone off the deep end. I’m so glad I made my way away from people like him.
@woodyred:
Do you think you’re somehow “more special” than any of the other trolls that come through here? As if you are somehow more clever or witty than any one that came before? You aren’t. You’re playing from the same exact playbook and just about as intellectually lazy – if not moreso than usual. It’s tiring to have people like you comment at all, as none of you add anything of significance, and not just let everyone else have an actual discussion. You’re like a fly that annoyingly keeps buzzing around a person’s head that you need to constantly swat at to get rid of, only to come back to only agitate further.
“But feminists are just as bad!” doesn’t mean a goddamn thing when you don’t provide examples (probably ’cause there isn’t) and white-wash some pretty horrific statements as only “mean” (as if they were throwing schoolyard insults). Even if you were to scramble for some quotes they would, like most other anti-feminist quotes by MRAs, be utterly misattributed or taken out of context. I mean, shit, the last list of “feminist quotes” I saw had fictional characters – not actual feminists – as examples for “misandry.” My guess is you’ll claim that the incompetent fathers from sitcoms are some kind of example of “oppression” men experience that, somehow, is greater than the mistreatment women have experienced in the past (and even now). Cry me a fucking river…
@ Fibinachi – you know, you think Im crazy, right ? – well I think youre crazy – “avoiding the draft means you’ll be raped and get aids by deviant homosexuals in prison” – when did Warren Farrell say this ?? can you please cite a source.
I do solemnly swear never to type in anger before at least one cup off coffee ever again.
I apologize for the sloppiness of my comment.
It’s hard to believe, I know, but even I have standards and that was beneath them.
coffee now
coffee good
What the frak is Molyneux even trying to say? This is a bad evo psych argument right? Apparently he thinks there is an asshole gene. It must lie on the Y chromosome because his argument seems to be that asshole fathers pass the asshole gene down to their asshole sons (and that’s women’s fault somehow).
I don’t suppose he has actual evidence an asshole gene exists?
Haha. Of course not. Of course it’s assfax.
Has he not met nice people raised by assholes? Or assholes raised by nice people? Has it not occurred to him that some of asshole behavior comes from socialization and not genetics?
There is nothing more annoying than pseudoscientific bigotry.
@saintnick86 – Im still reading through your post – but in response to the opening sentence – yes, I am more witty than the trolls that pass through here. if we agree on nothing else today, we should at least agree on this point.
one MRA vs 20 feminists. ha. I’ll do my best guys – I cant field all your criticism at once. cut me some slack
Isn’t it cute that Woodyred was bragging about progressive his country (the UK) is in the other thread when he’s in this thread proclaiming support for a bunch of regressive reactionaries?
Dude, learn to read – I didn’t say you were wittier than other trolls. I’m saying you are just as childish as all the other ones, under the delusion you are somehow different.
So, no, it is not something we should “at least agree on this point.” Because it isn’t the case at all.
@ woodyred — “I’m in out of my depth, and that’s the fault of the water!”
“yes, I am more witt-”
No.
Like Ally said, the voices in the video are lovely. Makes me want to hear them say much lovelier things.
Well – I’ll tell you what – I havent even watched this video – but each of the speakers – I have watched pretty much every video they have made – they are not misogynists – or women haters – or racist – or homophobic – I’ll tell you what – I will watch the damn video – brb
He said it in The Myth of Male Power. You support the man but never read his most well-known book?
Quoted from here
I don’t have access to the book, which is why I’m pointing you to David’s article. I know you don’t believe him, but he does provide page number and edition so you should be able to find it in Farrel’s book.
From here.
Farrel really seems to like this argument.
Why – the – fuck – do – you – keep – using – dashes – ?
http://giphy.com/gifs/Zao5Pr0qlJg2s
Just out of curiosity Woodyred; what would qualify as misogynist or homophobic to you? You keep denying that blatantly bigoted things are bigoted. I’d really like to know what constitutes going over the line for you.
@ Lea
I’m working from home today, so I skipped the coffee.
Went straight for the wine. ;D
Typing up linux server documentation while drunk! It’s a good Friday!
Sadly, I can’t spend too much time on chew toy trolls today. Have fun, ya’ll!
No no no no no – you people cant be serious with that video. you people are insane. thats brainwashing – do you people sit and listen to and watch video like THIS all day ?? thats insane. please one of you explain to me – what that video I just watched was. tell me now.
Ooh a Mystery Science Theater gif! Those guys are from my metro area. My heart always swells with pride when they get internet references.
That video needed a trigger warning for the incest quote that it did not have! I feel sick to my stomach now. >__< Thanks for the flashback. All those people can go jump off a cliff.
While I don’t agree with everything in the quotes in this post, they do bring up several inconvenient truths for feminists – that the dynamics of human nature, relationships and how women behave and respond often do not conform to feminist theory.
@Woodyred is from the UK, where everyone is witty by default. I’ll bet he’s doing the fish slapping dance as we speak.
@ Ally S – dashes ….. I dont know why I use them – I try to write like how I would like it heard in someones head – or if I was speaking. the dashes – and the ……. dots – are pauses or punctuations. idk
I would rather watch a 10-hour fish-slapping tournament than hear woody try to act like he’s witty.
Why are trolls always so ableist?
So, woodyred, please explain how quoting people, in their own words, is brainwashing?
That video is literally reading out loud things that the speakers at this conference has said.
How is that brainwashing? How is directly quoting someone brainwashing?
Shorter Woody red: I support all of these people. I’ve never read any of their publications, listened to any of their speeches, and I am not at all familiar with any of their opinions or positions on the issues that I pretend to care about. But they hate all the same people as me, so, I’ll just go ahead and defend them and the things they say.
@ weirwoodtreehugger — Awesome! The MST3K Movie was a perennial favourite amongst my circle of friends back in the 1990s. It wasn’t until a few years back that I got access to the series as a whole. Friggin’ genius!
@sparky – quotes completely out of context – and not even in the original speakers voice. you people are f**king lunatics – I’ll tell you that
Sparky,
Because holding misogynists accountable for their words is misandry! Didn’t you know that?
I cant believe what I just watched. I really cant.
Who is more tedious: Good or woodyred?
Woodyred,
How are the quotes out of context? What is the proper context for those quotes that make them inoffensive?
Good. But Good was more fun, bc we could respond to him from Greater Good, Greatest Good, etc.
@woodyred fish slapping dance, seriously. Try it. You’ll get +3 wit.
Nice disablism there, woody. Now shoo.
@woodyred are you attending the conference? Genuine question. Whether you are or aren’t, which topic presented at the conference are you most interested in, and why?
@woodyred Tell me. Please tell me, the incest survivor in what context is a quote glorifying incest not sickening and insanely wrong. I’m listening. And it’d better be damn good. I’ll tell you right now, there is NO situation in which incest is good. Never. At all. Ever. No. And the other quotes? I can’t think of a context where describing beating someone’s head against a wall becomes anything but a terrible act of unforgivable violence. It’s not justified.
woodyred: You keep saying those quotes are “out of context” as if that is some kind if magical charm that is going to somehow change the meaning of what the speaker of the quotes is actually saying.
So yes, please provide the context in which those quotes aren’t completely hateful.
@weirwoodtreehugger – what are you ? a sick maniac ? surely their original context was not to be snipped out of conversations to purposefully make them look like … women haters or whatever – and then compiled into a video by the biggest feminist fruit loop on youtube – and even then – read by other people. you people are absolutely insane- and yes – call me ableist – you f**king lunatics.
@woodyred
I don’t know what “Manboobz” thinks, but I really don’t care if you follow misogynistic cranks on their channels and blogs. I think everyone realizes and accepts the fact that lots of people read and watch all sorts of stupid shit on the internet.
LOL about you describing these statements as “mean thing” however. That’s some keen critical reading on your part.
if this is modern feminism – and this is the true nature and substance of your opposition to the mens rights movement – you people are in for a f**king big shock. Im sorry – but its true. you people are having a laugh.
Anyone else starting to smell sock?
Ablist slurs?
Woody, be honest, are you trying to get banned or are you just too lazy to read the posted rules?
Could you brave defenders of MRM please explain to me how you plan to end the draft, make work places safer or ensue men are considered capable caregivers by the courts by raping and beating more women and abusing and raping more children? Exactly how does claiming that women cause men’s bad behaviors by fucking them help male victims of rape and domestic violence?
Seriously, how do you have the gall to pretend you care about male survivors of child abuse by encouraging their parents to rape them? How does it help boys to tell their dads to beat and rape their moms? How exactly is claiming that abused women are asking for it or that raped women are “begging for it” supposed to help men and boys? How does that work?
It doesn’t. Just like “white rights” is really about raging racist asshats who aren’t very bright putting down POC in order to excuse their hatred and make themselves feel less like the pathetic losers they are, “men’s rights” is only about hating women and encouraging misogyny.
@woodyred anything you can point us to that might change our minds?
So I see woodyred can’t answer a basic question and has instead resorted to
ableist slurs.
woodyred: Can you answer this or not? In what context would these quotes be anything other than woman-hating? What is the context that makes them understandable and reasonable.
I mean, geez, those are whole paragraphs there, not tiny little snippets.
But anyway, I shall now brainwash you all into becoming chefs by providing some quotes from chefs:
I think careful cooking is love, don’t you? The loveliest thing you can cook for someone who’s close to you is about as nice a valentine as you can give.
Julia Child
What nicer thing can you do for somebody than make them breakfast?
Anthony Bourdain
Never be a food snob. Learn from everyone you meet – the fish guy at your market, the lady at the local diner, farmers, cheese makers. Ask questions, try everything and eat up!
Rachael Ray
@Woody, none of those quotes are out of contents, you can go read everything in full. And if you support that clown Stefan molyneux there’s something seriously wrong with you.
Woodyred,
Calling me a sick maniac isn’t a real answer. If you are so certain those quotes are taken out of context, surely you can provide the real context for them. Explain why we are wrong. Explain the proper context. Do it without name calling.