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Warren Farrell is doing an Ask Me Anything on Reddit today. Some suggested questions for him.

Ask him anything!
Ask him anything!

Warren Farrell, the intellectual grandfather of the Men’s Rights movement, is doing an AMA on Reddit today at 1 PM Eastern time. UPDATE: It’s started, and it’s here.

AMA, in Reddit-speak, stands for Ask Me Anything. So I would encourage you to ask Mr. Farrell questions about anything he has said or written in the past that you find troubling, or even just confusing.

Here are some suggestions. Seriously, ask him any of these, as I’m not sure I’ll be able to be online when the whole thing goes down.

1) Mr Farrell, in your book The Myth of Male Power, you wrote that:

It is important that a woman’s “noes” be respected and that her “yeses” be respected. And it is also important when nonverbal “yeses” (tongues still touching) conflict with those verbal “noes” that the man not be put in jail for choosing the “yes” over the “no.” He might just be trying to become her fantasy.

Are you suggesting that if a woman clearly says no to sex, but does not stop kissing a man, that he is entitled to have sex with her anyway because she has given him a non-verbal “yes?” If not, what specifically do you mean? What sort of non-verbal “yes” would outweigh a clear verbal “no?” Why doesn’t her verbal no mean no?

Source: Myth of Male Power, page 315.

Screencap here: http://i.imgur.com/cwSoc.png

2) Mr. Farrell, regarding your research on incest in the 1970s, you told Penthouse magazine that:

“When I get my most glowing positive cases, 6 out of 200,” says Farrell, “the incest is part of the family’s open, sensual style of life, wherein sex is an outgrowth of warmth and affection. It is more likely that the father has good sex with his wife, and his wife is likely to know and approve — and in one or two cases to join in.”

Were you actually suggesting that there are “glowing, positive cases” of parent-child incest – that is, child sexual abuse?  How can child sexual abuse be “glowing” or “positive” for the child?

If this is not what you meant, what did you mean?

Penthouse also quotes you as saying that you were doing your research

“because millions of people who are now refraining from touching, holding, and genitally caressing their children, when that is really a part of a caring, loving expression, are repressing the sexuality of a lot of children and themselves. Maybe this needs repressing, and maybe it doesn’t.”

As I understand it, you’ve said you were misquoted and that you did not say “genitally,” and that what you actually said was “generally” or “gently.” But even with the word replaced, you are suggesting that parents are repressing their sexuality and their children’s sexuality if they don’t “caress” their children. What did you mean by this?

Sources:
Transcript of Penthouse article: http://nafcj.net/taboo1977farrell.htm

Scanned pages of original article from Penthouse: http://www.thelizlibrary.org/site-index/site-index-frame.html#soulhttp://www.thelizlibrary.org/fathers/farrell2.htm

3) Mr. Farrell, why did you choose a photograph of a nude woman’s ass for the cover of the new edition of The Myth of Male Power? Do you really think that male power is somehow negated by female sexuality?

4) Mr. Farrell, why have you chosen to associate yourself with the website A Voice for Men, a site that frequently refers to women as “cunts,” “bitches,” and “whores?” If you are not aware of this, would you disassociate yourself from the site if given clear proof of the site’s frequent misogynistic attacks on women?

If you’re looking for more ideas on questions to ask him, check out my posts on him in the archives.

These might be good to start with:

The Myth of Warren Farrell: Farrell on Rape, Part One

Warren Farrell’s notorious comments on date rape: Not any more defensible in context than out of it

What Men’s Rights guru Warren Farrell actually said about the allegedly positive aspects of incest.

MRA founding father Warren Farrell responds to questions about his incest research with evasive non-answers. And a smiley. (About his last AMA appearance.

Warren Farrell on Unemployment, Salesmanship, and Other Things That Are Like Rape, Supposedly

Also check out the excellent Farrell’s Follies series on Reddit.

And Fibinachi has a series on Farrell as well.

 

 

 

 

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cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Does Farrell realize that the way he structured his comment about whining versus sympathetic responses to kids makes it sound like he thinks that when boys complain about something it makes women horny? I mean, given his views on incest I guess it’s possible that he did mean that, but complete linguistic incompetence seems like the more likely explanation.

marinerachel
marinerachel
6 years ago

I’m fat and conventionally fairly unattractive. I’ve experienced more rejection than the average dude, I’ll wager. I pretty much expect it. I have no self-worth. That doesn’t make it a fucking human rights violation to turn me down. It’s just bad luck (and a love of eating re: being fat.)

Fear of rejection isn’t a men’s issue. It isn’t even an issue. It’s a reality. None of us is entitled to dates or sex from anyone else.

Kootiepatra
Kootiepatra
6 years ago

Re: the “Schrodinger’s no” gem that Auntie Alias quoted…

Dear Reddit-Dude-Who’s-Not-Actually-Here, if you’re getting a Schrodinger’s no, you have total, complete right to say, “You know, I’m not comfortable with this,” and stop. In fact, the wise thing to do is to stop. Don’t agree to have sex with anyone whom you know or suspect isn’t being forthright about what they want and what they want to do to you. If you are not sure you have the green light, assume that you don’t–for your safety and for hers.

Seriously. This stuff is not rocket science. Sex is not an accident that your hormones drag you into kicking and screaming. Self-control is a really nifty thing. Use it. Benefit from it.

And also, it might be helpful to deal with reality a bit more and shelve the far-fetched hypothetical situations.

Egads.

Ally S
6 years ago

What if I am sure, even after she’s said ‘no’?

Then you still respect it, unless you two have agreed beforehand that “no” is not a safe-word between you two.

Contrary to popular belief, your libido is infinitely less important than not potentially raping her.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Feminism is responsible for the rise of “BRA” (“Black Run America” – yes, yes) because black men have higher testosterone levels than white men, and feminism is responsible for giving women all those birth control pills, which caused a higher level of estrogen to enter the water system and thus emasculate the white male who has a naturally lower level of testosterone. Thus women, who in spite of feminist lies want a True Alpha Male, now turn to The Black Alpha Male and have all become liberal Obama voters and the white man is oppressed and can’t stand up for himself anymore, or get a girlfriend.

Oh, how did I miss this earlier? Yeah, what a Grand Unifying Theory, all right. Gosh, it’s like blacks and whites don’t even drink the same tap water, in the same city! Must be that naturally lower testosterone on the part of Whitey.

Or just that naturally lower brainpower, on the part of MRAsshats.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

So, the whole birth control pills in the water supply lowering testosterone thing doesn’t work on black men because?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

(And yes, I know that expecting logic from a racist is like expecting my cat to learn to play the piano.)

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

So, the whole birth control pills in the water supply lowering testosterone thing doesn’t work on black men because?

…black men don’t drink water? Beats the hell outta me.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

PS: Did you say “cat playing the piano”?

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

o, the whole birth control pills in the water supply lowering testosterone thing doesn’t work on black men because?

Because, according to WTF, black men have higher testosterone b and so have a higher tolerance. i.e long after white men have become feminised, black insert racist dogwhistles are still able to resisting the effect of the estrogen.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

My cat really will learn to play Rachmaninov before these people learn to logic.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

“Black Run America (yes, yes)”

In one of Vonnegut’s novels (I think Cat’s Cradle) there’s a minor character who’s a mentally disabled elevator operator. He is depicted as having a sort of tic: he’ll say something odd (e.g., ‘babies full of rabies ‘), then grab his own buttocks and say “yes, yes!”

Wonder what made me think of that just now.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

When I returned to NYC, I was noticing the anger toward returning Vietnam soldiers rather than appreciation for their service, and even though I was opposed to the War in Vietnam, I began to feel a gap in our compassion for men.

LOLwut? First off, feminists had fuck-all to do with that. Secondly, the whole “spitting on Vietnam vets” thing was a myth. Read Jerry Lembcke’s The Spitting Image, you moran. Thirdly, it was the CIA and the BRASS, not civilians, feminists and peace activists, who pissed on the returning vets (metaphorically, not literally), because this was their war, it was for their own glorification, and they didn’t like those underlings losing it on them. And they made sure the punishment kept on flowing by refusing to acknowledge the damage done by Agent Orange, PTSD, etc. — and by cutting VA services, too.

Christ, Warren, you are SUCH a fucking jackass.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Cassandra,
If Hollywood has taught me anything, it’s that black people are magic. Thus, our evil slut pills cannot harm them.

katz
6 years ago

If anything, I imagine it’s mostly yuppie white boys who drink nothing but bottled water and never touch the tap water.

But mostly I’m concerned about all these women who are apparently peeing into the water supply.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I’m going to need a citation on the black men have more testosterone thing. It sounds to me like an extension of the racist stereotype that black people are more primitive, savage and are sexually out of control.

Racist right wingers really need to get their reasons for hating President Obama straight. Is he a scary and angry black man who is luring all the white women into his clutches with his alphaness? Because I’ve been hearing a lot of people on the right lately saying that Vladimir Putin is alpha maling all over the pointy headed intellectual Obama who is too wimpy to scare Russia into submission.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

There actually are hormones from BC and other medical waste in the water and it is changing male frogs into females and resulting in less reproduction because there’s a shortage of males. Sorry I don’t have a citation on that, I read about it years ago.

However, amphibians not identical to mammals and I have never seen anything to suggest that there are enough hormones in drinking water to effect human males, let alone change them into women entirely. Pthlates (sp?) in plastics on the hand can the human male reproductive system when baby boys put plastic toys, cups and bottles in their mouths. I haven’t MRAs get up in arms about that though. Probably because environmental and consumer safety regulations are for wussy liberals.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I’m guessing that it’s more because it’s hard to blame the existence of plastics on women.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Pthalates are indeed hormone/endocrine disruptors, as well as cancer causers; however, women didn’t invent those. And they cause just as much harm to female children as male. Not exactly a feminist conspiracy. Eco-feminists, in fact, are leading the charge AGAINST the use of pthalate in plastics.

As for birth control pills, the idea that men are emasculated by drinking Pill-laced water is laughable. It’s not like they’ve all suddenly gone impotent; Viagra has a vast marketing department, but there is no actual impotence/infertility epidemic among males. A healthy guy can get by fine without the blue boner pills. It’s not like their own bodies produce no estrogen, nor that estrogen levels don’t vary a fair bit between healthy males. Any excess, I imagine, would be excreted, as it is in women. Most of the diagnosed physical impotence in men is due to diabetes (either type) or heart disease; it’s a circulatory problem, not a hormonal one.

And it’s not like estrogen is actually emasculating, let alone in the dosages found in birth control pills today. Back in the early 1960s, when the Pill was new and not enough was known about proper dosage levels, doses were high enough to cause serious side effects, mostly stroke, weight gain, and clinical depression in those already more than usually predisposed to those conditions. Most women tolerated the Pill well, high dosage notwithstanding. But not a peep came out even then about men being “emasculated” by those hormones in the water supply, even though there must have been vastly more of them then, per capita. Maybe the odd misodge claimed it was “emasculating” for women to be freed from the fear and danger of unwanted pregnancy (and consequently, male social control), but that was not exactly a side effect of hormones in drinking water. Female reproductive autonomy, not pesky lady hormones entering the bodies of males, is the real “emasculator” here.

katz
6 years ago

Plastics were invented to make bottles for flavored water and hard molded chairs.

Ally S
6 years ago

When I first came out to my mom as trans, she was looking for possible explanations for me being trans. She one time showed me a documentary about how all the men and boys of the world are becoming emasculated because the world’s water supply is being poisoned by estrogen. Or something like that. (I did a bit of research, though, and it turned out to be nonsense.)

And speaking of birth control, my dad recently started panicking because he thought I was ordering Plan B from China in order to break it up and make my own estrogen doses using the resulting powder. Even my brother and my mom started believing that. What’s with these ridiculous moral panics about estrogen? X_X

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Clearly, it’s a fear that nasty ladyhormones will TAKE OVER THE WORLD!!!

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

Why does Warren Farrell think that his obsession with women’s asses: a) is universal and b) constitutes scientific proof of something?

From Fininachi’s post:

FARRELL:When we think of burning witches at the sake, we often think of the Salem witch trials and men burning women. In fact, the Salem witch trials were a direct results of two girls who experienced epileptic convulsions and blamed their convulsions on the “witch-craft” of several women in Salem. The Salem witch trials were a results of the community believing the girls without question and trying to save the girls. When a community condemned a woman as a witch, they did not believe they were condemning a woman: they believe this woman was a nonwoman – that she was supernatural

And he knows absolutely nothing about the Salem witch trials or the history of witch trials in general. Talking about witch trials in general, it was usually the outcasts and powerless in society that were often accused of witchcraft, women making up most of those accused and killed. With the Salem trials there was a whole confluence of politics, economics, religion and prejudice that came together during the panic Hell, ergot poisoning has even been floated as a theory explaining accusations of witchcraft. So, no, it wasn’t a case of the community automatically believing and trying to “save” the girls.

Sorry for the tangent. There’s just so much wrong.

This thread is awesome, though.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: Arete

OMG JTT! Haven’t thought about that guy in a loooooooong time!

I know, right? He pretty much disappeared at the turn of the millennium. Apparently he’s an okay adult? (There wasn’t any horror stories on his Wiki page anyway.) He just seems to be living his life, which I figure is a good thing for any child star.

RE: Fibinachi

No matter how garbled and odd my thoughts are: They are not this vile spawn of hatred, filth and disregard for the human race

Congratulations! You now know EXACTLY why I read and snarked fifteen chapters of Fifty Shades of Grey. Godspeed, young voyager!

RE: Ally

She one time showed me a documentary about how all the men and boys of the world are becoming emasculated because the world’s water supply is being poisoned by estrogen.

Wow, that’s up there with the “edamame made you trans” a couple other women I knew encountered.

my dad recently started panicking because he thought I was ordering Plan B from China in order to break it up and make my own estrogen doses using the resulting powder.

Your family needs to get a fucking grip on their fucking imaginations. Jesus Christ. I swear, I could make them believe War of the Worlds was a documentary.

tcwill00
tcwill00
6 years ago

Cassandra, I am on my phone so I have limited patience to tap out a reply, but I imagine the logic of the slut pills leading to Obama resembles the following:

Black people : estrogen :: communists : fluoride (sorry, “fluoride,” my bad),

Therefore

Communists : vodka :: black people : forties.

Calling, of course, upon the respected research of that eminence gris, Gen. Jack D. Ripper.

closetpuritan
6 years ago

Does anyone else find it weird that the question is about tactics for getting adult male issues heard – not by women specifically mind, just people in general – and WF immediately starts whacking on about what turns women on and off? As though sexual attention is the same thing as respectfully listening to someone else’s point of view? As though being aroused by someone is the same thing as empathizing with them? I feel like this says so much about Farrell’s attitudes to women, men issues and sex in general, but it’s so convoluted that I can’t even begin to unpack it. Any thoughts, Mammotheers?

Nothing much to add, but I agree. It says a lot about how central he thinks dating/impressing women is to a man’s emotional life, and life in general.

***
The birth control pill actually accounts for less than 1% of estrogen in drinking water, according to this source. A large amount of it is from livestock waste. All humans also excrete estrogen.

I suspect that the focus on the birth control pills comes from some combination of fear of women’s sexuality, technophobia/fear of Big Pharma, and MRA-style “let’s blame stuff on women”.

***

men do “cheat” but for each man who cheats, a woman cheats with him.

At first I thought it just meant “men and women cheat in roughly equal numbers”, but the word “with” does make it sound like the woman having sex with the cheating man, rather than a woman similar to the cheating man, is also cheating. Maybe, as Noadi says, it is a case of him assuming that people who hook up with a cheater always know that the cheater is not single. Maybe “with” is a mistake and he’s just a crappy writer.

pecunium
6 years ago

So much fail: Feminism is responsible for the rise of “BRA” (“Black Run America” – yes, yes) because black men have higher testosterone levels than white men, and feminism is responsible for giving women all those birth control pills, which caused a higher level of estrogen to enter the water system and thus emasculate the white male who has a naturally lower level of testosterone.

So… Black men have more testosterone. And because there is estrogen in the water, white men (being less testosteroney) are more affected than black men. Which makes women go for black men.

1: This is bad because? Oh, right, you are white, and can’t get laid.
2: Why didn’t women go for black men before? After all they, innately, have more testosterone.
3: Don’t all those middle-class white folks drink bottled water?

Thus women, who in spite of feminist lies want a True Alpha Male, now turn to The Black Alpha Male

So now we see the blatant racism (as opposed to the sort of racial essentialism, with it’s sotto-vocce, deniable, racism). Only the White Man can be the True Alpha Male.

and have all become liberal Obama voters and the white man is oppressed and can’t stand up for himself anymore, or get a girlfriend.

And here we have the real issue. This white boy can’t get a date.

Ally S
6 years ago

@LBT

Your family needs to get a fucking grip on their fucking imaginations. Jesus Christ. I swear, I could make them believe War of the Worlds was a documentary.

They also thought that, during my run from my dad’s house, katz kidnapped me and brainwashed me into being trans and are supplying me estrogen prescriptions. I know that they’re just worrisome because they care a lot about me, but they really, really need to get a grip already.

katz
6 years ago

Wait, they all thought that? o.O

Ally S
6 years ago

At one point, yes. Fortunately they seem to be listening to me more now (except for my dad and my older brother).

vaiyt
6 years ago

Would they all just starve and dry up if we utterly ignored them

No. They’d just be able to spew their bullshit unchallenged. There’s plenty of people outside to pay attention to them.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: Ally

I know that they’re just worrisome because they care a lot about me,

No. Hon, that’s controlling behavior that they’re BLAMING on caring about you. My husband cares a lot about me, and was worried about how my top surgery would impact my health. You know what he didn’t do? Claim that someone had kidnapped me and brain-washed me into transness.

Ally S
6 years ago

@LBT

You have a point, but I’m giving them slack mainly because no one expected me to do anything as drastic as running away from home. I’ve always been seen as the “baby” of the family, so when I do something unexpected naturally everyone gets worried and starts imagining the worst.

My sister, for example, hated katz at first (without even knowing anything about her) because she was afraid of katz being just as deceitful and exploitative as so many other people in our lives. That’s because my sister has a history of being in relationships with guys who have treated her like trash. So I wasn’t too upset when my sister expressed how worried she was about me.

katz
6 years ago

I think I’d be a bad kidnapper. I’d be all “So…you wanna go to Disneyland or something?”

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: Ally

I’m giving them slack mainly because no one expected me to do anything as drastic as running away from home.

Like I said. Controlling behavior. You were out of their control, and so they freaked out, because you’d never done that before. That’s exactly what I mean. They weren’t freaking out because you did something drastic; your dad does drastic shit all the time. They freaked out because you GOT AWAY.

My parents pulled the same shit when I refused to come to a Christmas party, only instead of kidnapping, it was claiming I was schizophrenic and couldn’t recognize reality. They CLAIMED they were concerned for my mental well-being… but they were talking about things that were patently absurd!

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

I’m sorry that I keep harping on this, Ally, it’s just that I see you in the situation I was in a few years back with my family.

Okay, say you’re right. They’re concerned about your well-being.

If that’s so, why aren’t any of them doing anything about your father? Your mother divorced him to get away from him. You’ve mentioned that he’s hit you, screamed abuse at you, and threatened graphic violence on your mother.

Your family seems to be somewhat aware of this. So why is it such a big surprise that you ran away from him? Why is their answer, “You must’ve been kidnapped and brainwashed,” and not, “Your father’s an abusive terror?”

That seems a whole lot of leaps of logic to go through to avoid confronting your dad’s behavior.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Does anyone else find it weird that the question is about tactics for getting adult male issues heard – not by women specifically mind, just people in general – and WF immediately starts whacking on about what turns women on and off? As though sexual attention is the same thing as respectfully listening to someone else’s point of view? As though being aroused by someone is the same thing as empathizing with them? I feel like this says so much about Farrell’s attitudes to women, men issues and sex in general, but it’s so convoluted that I can’t even begin to unpack it. Any thoughts, Mammotheers?

I personally found it hilarious. The old coot is whining about not being able to get sex from pretty young things (who might even be his own daughters by blood, ick), and then he turns around and says that women are “turned off by whining”. No shit we are! And we’re especially turned off by creepy old coots who whine that pretty young things aren’t having sex with them, and who whine that their daughters are “too repressed” to sleep with them.

If this is WTF’s idea of “men’s issues”, it’s no wonder that the movement is a laughingstock.

Ally S
6 years ago

@LBT

I suppose I wasn’t being very clear. They knew that I ran away from my dad’s place because my dad was treating me like garbage, and they empathized with me. It’s just that, when I was with katz, no one knew where I was, and I persistently ensured that they could never figure out my exact location.

Also, as soon as I got to her house, I called my older brother to tell him that I left, and though he admitted he was worried he also assured me that he still loved me and that I was “brave” for going through with that plan of mine. Once he talked to katz over the phone, he realized that I wasn’t at some abuser’s home and that she was someone I could trust.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: Bina

I’ve mentioned before how I’ve encountered a lot of guys who really don’t seem to understand “rape” or “sexual abuse” except as “sex that I didn’t entirely love.” Farrell is a really good example. He seriously doesn’t seem to understand what the fuck it’s about, so all he can do is bemoan the boners.

I sometimes wonder how many guys could be that clueless. But then again, I can’t imagine my life if rape WASN’T a formative event.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

I sometimes wonder how many guys could be that clueless.

I quit wondering a long time ago. When every TV set is constantly bombarding you with images of “desirable” that you’re supposed to want and work your butt off to get, and you combine that with a cis-male’s privilege of expecting it all to fall into your manly-man hands just because you were born with a penis, it’s only natural to want what you’re told to want, and expect what you’re taught to expect. The fact that what one wants may in fact be an individual with wants and expectations of her own, on the other hand, never occurred to them because they were never taught to regard women and girls as such. Only as prizes for being A Man. The fact that the “prizes” don’t behave obediently and comply happily is the root of all their misogyny.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

…and the fact that they haven’t progressed mentally beyond a childish “BUT I WANTS IT!!!” is the root of all their inability to get taken seriously. Other men have grown up, faced facts, and outgrown ridiculous expectations, or at least learned to put them in their proper perspective. These guys could sure use an old-timey feminist consciousness-raising group. Or, if they keep insisting on “having” women who could be their daughters, a therapy group. Because that shit’s not healthy, and it’s sure as hell not “sensual”, as WTF early on insisted it was.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: Bina

Yeah, that too. I also guess they just live in such a padded world that they can’t actually FATHOM getting raped, except as some sort of racist prison porn scenario. It’s really weird and confusing to me.