The Daily Beast takes on the Men’s Rights movement — and takes down A Voice for Men’s John Hembling
Posted by David Futrelle

John Hembling, possibly lying about something
The bad publicity bonanza for Men’s Rights activists continues — and it couldn’t happen to a worse group of people.
Yesterday, the Daily Beast published a long-awaited piece on the Men’s Rights movement, and it’s a doozy. If you’re a regular reader of this site, trust me, you’ll want to read the whole thing, like now. The piece, by R. Tod Kelly, is long — some 6000 words — but worth it.
It’s mostly on the money, but with a few notable flaws.
Here’s what it gets right:
1) It captures the pervasive misogyny of the Men’s Rights movement in general, and of A Voice for Men in particular.
2) In an extended section, it profiles AVFM’s John Hembling, and tears apart some of his most blatant lies — including the now legendary box-cutter incident, in which Hembling claims to have stared down a mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters.
As Kelly notes:
Vancouver police records show that there was indeed an altercation in September of 2012 between Hembling and others seeking to tear down men’s rights posters. However, according to the police, Hembling was arguing with two or three people, not being accosted by a “mob” of any size. When questioned by the authorities, neither Hembling nor witnesses mentioned seeing any weapons. …
Curiously enough, Hembling actually videotaped the events and had his AV4M Radio partner Karen Straughan post it online. The discussion with the police has been conveniently edited out, but the rest of the video clearly matches police records and not Hembling’s story. There are only a few young men taking down Hembling’s posters, and the video shows them choosing to ignore him except when he engages them in conversation. One of the men is seen using a box cutter to take down the flyers, but at no time does he use it as a weapon, raise his voice, or threaten Hembling in any way.
Kelly found some troubling, er, discrepancies in another story told by Hembling. Kelly writes:
According to Hembling, sometime around 1995 he was on his way home at 2:00 am after working a night shift when he came upon [a sexual] assault in progress. He says he used his steel-toed boots as weapons to chase off the perpetrator. When the victim was too distraught to speak with him, Hembling says he contacted the police, waited until they arrived, and then quietly left without speaking to them. He says they later tracked him down at his home, where he gave a statement.
It’s hard to know whether this event actually occurred or not. There is no record—at least, not in the Vancouver police files—of Hembling being a material witness to a rape, and police blotters from that time period do not show a crime that matches Hembling’s description. However, this does not necessarily mean the event did not occur. Vancouver police did not fully computerize their data until 2002, and it is possible the police never reported the incident. Hembling claims the incident took place at a specific hospital, where he says he worked as a contractor for 18 months. The address he gives, however, is for a different hospital in a completely different part of the city. This raises the curious question of whether Hembling forget the name of the hospital he contracted with for 18 months, or whether he forget what part of the city he worked in for that same period of time. The real truth of the matter is anyone’s guess, because Hembling wouldn’t comment to The Beast on that or any other matter.
In other words: Cool story, bro.
3) Another thing the story gets right: it makes clear just how little the Men’s Rights movement does to actually help men — and how in many ways it can actually be terribly damaging to men who need real help. As Kelly writes,
the movement’s radicals might … do … immediate damage to those who most desperately need the MRM to succeed.
“When we talk about recovery from trauma and abuse, there were two things that helped me,” says Chris Anderson, executive director of the male-victim advocacy group Male Survivor and a sexual abuse survivor himself. “The first was realizing that I’m not alone; the second was hearing that recovery was possible.” Anderson is quick to dissociate himself from the men’s rights movement: “In [the MRM] people get that first message, that they’re not alone. I don’t know that they ever get the second message. And when they don’t get that second message, it turns into an endless feedback loop and eventually they say, ‘Oh my God, all of society is f**ked.’”
Indeed, Kelly writes:
It is telling to note that of the professional male-victim advocacy organizations I spoke with, every single one specifically asked that I not allow readers to think they were in any way related to the MRM.
But there are also some things that I think the article gets wrong.
1) I think it gives Men’s Rights activists way too much credit for their supposed good intentions. While there are some MRAs who do seem to be motivated at least in part by a sincere desire to help men, most of the MRAs I’ve encountered in the 3 years of doing this blog have clearly been motivated primarily by anger and hatred of feminists — and women in general. They don’t really seem to give a shit about doing anything to actually improve the lives of men — and the paucity of their accomplishments reflects this. In its relatively brief lifespan, AVFM has raised many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Has it set up any shelters or hotlines or helplines for men? Not a one.
2) It wildly exaggerates the importance of Hembling to the MRM – especially ironic given that Hembling has been more or less AWOL in recent months, producing only a few short videos and one article for AVFM.
3) It paints a picture of The Spearhead’s WF Price as a Men’s Rights “moderate.” Really? While it’s true that Price is not an AVFM-style hothead given to rants about “fucking your shit up,” his views are anything but moderate. This is a guy who thinks higher education is wasted on women, who blames the epidemic of rape in the armed forces on women, who celebrated one Mothers Day with a vicious transphobic rant, who once used the tragic death of a woman who’d just graduated from college to argue that “after 25, women are just wasting time.” He published posts on why women’s suffrage is a bad idea. Plus, have you met his commenters?
I was, however, kind of amazed to learn that Price is married … and to a feminist. No, really.
4) The article, while solidly researched, contains some small errors and simplifications that will no doubt give MRAs and others the excuse they need to dismiss the whole thing. Kelly refers to Reddit subreddits as Reddit “threads!” He refers to Matt Forney as an MRA! Oh no!
Still, whatever its flaws, this is an important piece, and one that tells a lot of truth about the Men’s Rights movement. Again — go read it!
Posted on October 20, 2013, in a voice for men, are these guys 12 years old?, johntheother, lying liars, misogyny, MRA and tagged a voice for men, antifeminism, daily beast, men's rights, misogyny, MRA, R. Tod Kelly. Bookmark the permalink. 1,986 Comments.








Alice – I doubt that’s what was meant. Though whether “most men” actively want that (as in having thought about it and come to the douchebag sexist’s conclusion) or just haven’t given it a moment’s thought/don’t consider housework “work” (even though they totes don’t want to do any, cos they work, don’t they?) is debatable.
But seriously – someone claiming to be a feminist shrugging this off?
Fish babies count! Fish babies count DOUBLE!!
(Because, cute as human babies are, fish babies are less icky and loud.)
That makes sense! I’m much the same with Louis.
And yeah, skin tags are the. feckin. worst. I hate ‘em!
Speaking of human babies, anyone heard from Falconer? He hasn’t been online for a while.
*blushes even more furiously* I’ve got something in common with A King!
Srsly, though, basically how it pans out for me is that anywhere I’m normally ticklish is an erogenous zone when I’m horny. And I’m really ticklish, so… yeeeaaaahhhh :D
Jesus, man. So according to Bill’s Wife (which is a great moniker for a self-professed feminist, implying that she has no personality or agency beyond being that internet creep’s wife), feminism is largely a luxury of a decent economy, to be made completely irrelevant if the jobs dry up and the whole works goes sideways. Then I guess “white knights” swoop in bearing mammoth meat and the gods’ gifts of fire and fish knives (in America, of course; European women will be on their own. Or maybe they’ll have to double or triple up on their rare ‘nice guys’). If that’s a thought that actually crossed your mind, “Bill’s Wife” and you’re not just pulling our chains here, you don’t know the first thing about feminism. Beyond that, you have absolute shit taste in men.
Yeah, that is odd. And it’s sad, because the ideas that the MRA espouses isn’t harmless. It can and has hurt people.
I think Falconer dropped by (very briefly) last night or this morning? I recall there being a link to his album of <3BAYBIEEEESSSS<3 that I saw today.
Alice, I want to believe that, but…
Bill’s wife is just giving me way too strong of a vibe of “The worst possible extreme isn’t happening now, so what’s the problem?” Nobody is getting rid of DV laws, so what’s the problem? Women aren’t all going back to being housewives, so what’s the problem? People aren’t abolishing higher education for women, so what’s the problem?
Which, it really doesn’t matter what ideology you subscribe to, that’s just terrible thinking and it’s hard to believe any grown-up could have that complete a lack of grasp on subtleties, practical outcomes, and societal attitudes.
Plus if that’s the logic, you’d really have to can all the men’s rights issues. If a state’s laws don’t explicitly say that only the mother gets custody, then there must not be a custody problem. If doctors and hospitals don’t refuse to treat men, then there must not be a health problem. If boys are allowed to enroll in schools and colleges, then there must not be an education problem.
I think we scared her away…
I’d say you’d HAVE to have a pretty lax grasp on subtleties to stomach being married to Price, in addition to being pretty immature.
I bet Price would get off on that combo.
*yawns*
Hey, are there photos of Price anywhere? Just curious.
You are being massively generous, but she said men want a housewife “and for the wife to work on top of it”.
No way to slice that to mean “equal share of work and chores.”
@kittehserf
LOL…I just don’t want to be a jerk about someone’s relationship no matter how vile I think one of them is. It just sounds like she’s describing two different people. If it’s true, I just can’t believe someone who calls themselves a feminist can be with someone like that. I mean fuck, if anyone has a rationalization hamster it’s her.
It’s not like I think one who is a self described feminist needs to be partners with another self described feminist either. Disagreeing on things is relationships is common, but I think for a relationship to work out in the long run, the couples can’t have radically differing views. For me personally, my only requirement is that a man I’m with to not be anti-feminist or MRA. He doesn’t have to be feminist either. As long as he believes in equality. Actually someone who is rather neutral to feminism is probably best for me since discussing these issues can be quite stressful and I don’t think I’d like debating them all the time.
But a feminist who not only marries and MRA, but one as extreme as him AND manages to handwave away all his shitty views because he likes history, has a high IQ and is broad shouldered? Does not compute. At all.
It’d be funny if this would all cause a shitstorm like the Mark Minter thing lol.
In fairness, I’m guessing she picked the handle “Bill’s wife” to clarify who she is in relation to this discussion.
I believe she’s female– if you got acculturated to American society within one of its many weird subcultures it’s not surprising you’d pick up a lot of the lingo without knowing it’s odd. (I’m reminded of a Japanese girl my brother met whose idea of American culture was largely formed by an exchange year with a Mormon family in Utah. ha)
“Top ten percent in physical attractiveness” made me blink a bit; when have you ever heard a woman describe a man like that?!”
“Yeah, Kevin is a pain in my ass, but when he was younger, he was in the top ten percent for physical attractiveness!” :p
@Quackers
That’s pretty much how I feel. I honestly don’t want to be rude to her (if it is her) and I hope I haven’t been. It’s just… such a huge WAT, and the explainations we’re getting are pretty weak.
Not that she has to explain herself, but she did come to us trying to do just that.
So, I don’t know, Bill’s Wife, if you’re still here. I don’t think you’re going to convince us of anything. I hope you’re honestly happy and stuff, but I don’t get it. We don’t get it. Just… be careful? I don’t know. I can’t type that enough. I do not fucking know.
@ceebark
That top ten percent comment was another red flag for me, as it reminded me of that okCupid study MRAs keep citing to prove hypergamy. Because the study said women on the site considered most men to be below average in looks. However what they failed to mention was that men on there will send messages to only the most attractive women.
So in reality, it’s actually men who are the hypergamous ones, choosing the hottest women. Women on OkC might think most men are below average, but they will still message them, giving them at least a chance.
Study is here btw: http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-looks-and-online-dating/
Top ten percent? I missed that in the wall o’ text.
Gee, it’s nice being an outlier. I googled Mr Tall Handsome Broad Shouldered 10% and … meh. Just another dude.
dustydeste:
LOL!
I hadn’t even thought of the ticklish/erogenous crossover. (Thinks: no, m’lord, that does not mean tickling my feet is a good idea.)
Hmm, he says he’s not ticklish there, but that spot always gets him.
As a famous person said, the human body is weird!
I don’t have the mental energy to respond to Bill’s wife. Just 1) I’m going to assume she is who she says she is, and I do respect the fact that she came here with her side of the story. 2) I disagree with her assertion that the MRM et al are harmless, and lots of other folks have explained why they are not harmless better than I can. And I still think Price is wrong in everything he’s written. And I think we have different definitions of feminism, or maybe espouse two different schools of feminism; but the “white knight” comment kinda gets my sensors on alert, y’know? But whatever.
As far far as lip gloss/lip balm: For me, a good (relatively) cheap lip balm I can get at the drug store is Eos. But it’s just a lip balm and doesn’t have any pigment in it (but it does protect your lips well!)
Higher price tag lip gloss? This:
http://www.josiemarancosmetics.com/shop/lips/lip-treatment-duo
@baileyrenee Like you said, she came here to explain herself. This isn’t a safe place for professional misogynists or their apologists. If she’s actually this dude’s wife, she’s married to a hateful, harmful, regressive douchebag. I don’t think being nice to these people should be a priority. We get nothing from the exchange with her other than a lot of weak-sauce, middling, MRA half-stepping. She’s a fool and reading her crap here makes my skin crawl.
Or, if they’re the NiceGuys(TM) of OKCupid, they’re so far below the average – and I’m not even talking about looks here – they don’t even get into the stats!
@sparky
I’d love to try that lip balm….but poverty is my curse.
As far as okcupid goes…..most of the guys that message me are 30+……and they try to convince me that age is just a number and blah blah blah.
$34 lip gloss? Holy hell! I grumble at paying about six bucks for a chapstick.
@Joeseph Crumbles – well said.
Have you had your Welcome Package yet?
Fame at last!
Joeseph Crumbles, you’re probably right. I’m just so damn Canadian.
LOL glad you saw that bit!
baileyrenee – if that makes you Canadian, then what does my charitability call me?
Is it possible to be nicer than a Canadian? *is joking*
Ha! To be fair, it’s $34 for two pots, but yeah, it’s pricey. But it does work wonderfully and it does last forever.
sparky – that is some nice lip gloss. Too bad I can’t color coordinate pigments for the life of me (and can’t afford any).
@kittehserf :3 Thank you! I do need a cat avatar and the spinning seal made me just about fall off my chair. Man, I’m in the right place.
@Bill’s wife
Yup. Economy should be our biggest concern. Not people with uteruses getting denied their rights to bodily auntomy, not systematic racism, not trans* people getting murdered way more often than cis people. The fucking economy.
You may be a feminist, but your priorities are pretty fucked.
::snortle:: I must have been watching the wrong mitt romney…
@Ceebarks
bleh that sucks :(
Alice, I dub thee an hounourable canuk. Your maple syrup, hockey jersey, Trailer Park Boys DVD, and beaver will be sent to your home address.
Kittehserf, I felt special :D
hostilitboy: How relevant am I? I’m completely irrelevant, which is why male genial mutilation is so going on in my country. It is the reason men have a much lower life expectancy. It is the reason children are beaten by their parents.
I see, it would all be fixed if you were in charge?
As to the actual claims that those things are because of some “hostility toward men. Prove it
Sitting there and merely claiming you ‘do advocacy’ for this and that group from one corner of your mouth and from the other corner claiming that MRAs ‘don’t do anything’ to confront social injustices is not going to get you anywhere. None of these identity politics trolls on the internet can prove either way that they do anything, so let’s not go down this road.
Good thing that’s not the argument.
The argument you are strawmanning is that feminism does things for women, and the MRM does jack shit for men.
Is it just me? Or maybe it’s the gin?
But @Bills wife is taking me right back to the nineties with all her bollocks ’bout her lurvely husband.
@Bills wife, sweetheart, I’m sorry but, he’s an asshole!:
“He says women are just wasting their time after 25. He says women shouldn’t get higher education. You really think that’s harmless? You really think that’s a joke, or just stupidity, or what?”
And why do you have to listen to it and take it into account and apply to your own life? You don’t have a brain of your own to make your own choices? I get where he’s coming from about the age 25, but I myself didn’t get married until 35. Neither did my grandma. So what? Even if she or I hadn’t gotten married at all, we still would’ve made the choices we wanted to make, regardless of what other people think. People can say all they want that “women should marry” young, and, yes, it is annoying to hear that but it will be WOMEN THEMSELVES who will decide whether to marry at 23 or 33 or 42. Frankly, a lot of what MRAs write, sounds like, as if they’re just resentful that things aren’t the way they want them to be. Tough luck. They can shove their opinions.
And Bill will have his opinions, they’re not all great, but it is worth it for me because I gain from this relationship in other ways. It may not be ideal to reward a “misogynist” with your presence in his life, but I wouldn’t do it if there was nothing valuable in it for me. I’m mature enough to know that love doesn’t happen often in life and when it does happen it’s better to embrace it.
I don’t use my own moniker because I want to protect my identity and for the sake of this discussion because I am relevant as his partner in this case and in no other way, that’s all.
Oh, we don’t do feet. Mostly because I have an issue with feet. All feet. Don’t like ‘em. Don’t like looking at ‘em. Don’t like touching ‘em.
As Dr. Husbutt says, “The first rule if this house is NO PIEDI!“
baileyrenee, you are special!
And Alice is an honorary Canuk. ::is jealous::
Joeseph – moar kitties! There can never be too many kitties. Or spinning seals. :)
ceebarks, I agree with your stance and I kinda liked you from the beginning (I lurked in here a bit before).
About fiat money, who knows how that will turn out, with regards to money issues, I prefer to be on the conservative side. But the US economy actually seems pretty sound in many ways, in fact, there are a lot of internal resources and it is self-sustainable, my point was mainly along the lines that “don’t take the welfare state for granted” because it is much harder for single women to have children in a more libertarian, anything goes environment or the frontier type of environment. I’m not saying women’s independence cannot exist there, it exists even during the war. I’m not saying it’s a luxury, I already mentioned that a 100 years ago in Europe it was already there, even though there was no welfare state. Women want to be free and respected in any environment. However, when you don’t have the welfare state, you can’t fulfill all your choices, you have to settle with just a few.
I’m using this discreet moniker because I don’t want this to turn into the shit storm that Minter’s affair did, yet I still wanted to explain myself because not that much was said about me in the Newsweek article.
EVERYBODY!!! A.S.S.H.O.L.E, A.S.S.H.O.L.E……there’s not enough air in the world…
Bill’s Wife tl:dr: if the misogynistic hatred my husband spouts doesn’t hurt YOU personally, why do you care?
You’ve a funny idea of feminism, social justice, or any sort of concern for others, madame. You’re also sadly confused if you think that’s the only reason anyone reacts to anything ever. Sounds like you had the same empathy bypass your husband did.
Pecunium – speaking of hostilityboy, did he ever explain what genial mutilation is? It’s not mutilating clowns, is it?
“In his youth was in the upper 10% of men in terms of physical attractiveness”
[citation needed]
I kid. Love is a many splendored thing and she doesn’t have to explain why she married a git who rants endlessly on the internet against women. I personally couldn’t take someone who subscribes MRAs overall conspiracy of feminist overlords ruling/ruining the world seriously, but that’s me.
I’m glad the unnamed European country you came from is a gender equality wonderland. Has racism, xenophobia and anti-Muslim bias been eliminated there too? It sure sounds like a swell place.
But you seem to know very little about American social and political history, which is understandable if Bill is your primary source. Also, the fight for women’s rights is global, so I’m not sure sitting back and admiring the rights and privileges enjoyed by some Western women is a good way to contribute.
@bill’s wife
Don’t try to excuse his crappy behavior with ‘but you don’t have to listen to it!’ We aren’t following his advice, you’ll have noticed. We just still think he’s a horrible, sexist jerk…because he is.
…yeah social standards have no affect on them. Please explain to me why the average age for getting married has been getting higher, then, if women can just choose to do what they want whenever. Fact is, people’s choices are still influenced by society, what others think of them, whether they’ll be able to afford a damn roof over their heads, ect.
LOL I can go with that! Not that I’ve a thing against feet, but mine get persistent itches all on their own, I don’t need anyone messing with ‘em.
You could make a really bad pun about Hamelin with that “No Pied” line. ;)
hostilityboy: LBT – in the interest of fairness, I should tell you that I am not easily baited
Pull the other one, it’s got bells on it. Anyone who moves goalposts like that, is easily baited; usually by doing what happens here; quoting their words back to them.
I do not answer for American men’s rights advocates. I do not expect anyone on here to answer for anyone who isn’t them.
Yes you do. You demanded we provide evidence of one single person who was helped by the idea of rape culture. That’s expecting us to answer for all of feminism.
You have to learn to do better than that if you want to play in the big leagues.
I never brought up the topic of feminism.
Liar.
There’s always that little margin of people who consider themselves part of a social justice movement but consider every other issue on the planet to be more important. Like GOProud, the Republican gay-rights group that was too conservative to even be part of Log Cabin Republicans, whose agenda is a flat tax, repealing Obamacare, privatizing social security, wanking about activist judges, small government, the war on terror, states’ rights, gun control, states’ rights again, and charter schools. But they phrase everything like “standing strong against radical regimes that refuse to recognize the basic human rights of gays and lesbians,” so that makes them a gay-rights group, I guess.
@kittehserf Thanks again. Got a new cat, a new name and I’m shaking the Fresh Step off my paws.
How about you talk to the survivors who have benefited from feminist anti-rape discourse? Feminism is what gave a name to the system of prejudices that marginalize victims of sexual violence. One that they have always lived with. At the very least it opened up dialogue regarding the marginalization of sexual violence victims, and that itself is significant.
Say, everyone: Cassandra mentioned a Scottish troll who used to be on here. It wasn’t someone calling himself Andy Mansfield, was it? He just got his MRA arse kicked of Pharyngula. Be a nice coincidence if it was the same one.
Are you playing “terms a feminist would never use” BINGO?
baileyrenee – I get a Canuck welcome package? :D Accomplishment achieved!
Bill’s wife – Is it alright to call you Ms. Price? I feel uncomfortable just referring to a person by their relationship to their spouse, it feels dehumanizing to me.
Anyways, I’m aware that I shouldn’t care about what people like your husband says. I don’t apply it to myself. But nevertheless, you can’t be apathetic to these things; apathy and thinking “this doesn’t affect me, I’m not like that” is dangerious, especially if the effect is advocating the idea that women are only good for sex and making sandwiches and looking pretty. Such dehumanization of half the human population is unacceptable. And while I do know that your husband has the right to say theses things, it doesn’t make them any less wrong.
Also, I hate responding on my iDevice. Apologies for typos.
re: BW comment about hanging onto love bc it’s rare: Please stop watching Hollywood romance movies and reading Harlequins. I love shellfish in a way I have never loved any other type of food, but if I develop an severe allergy that means I’ll suffocate and die if I eat it, I won’t end my brief existence eating it while watching Indecent Proposal.
Oh man, I now have a new goal in life: Being nice enough to get a Canadian welcome package!
Lolwait, I’m an awfully mean, vindictive person and will never live up to Canadian standards of niceness. I mean, I chewed some asshole out on Canada Day for being a douchebag during the fireworks display. I think there’s just no hope for me…
JohnTheOtter apparently thinks it’s super-cool that he was exposed as a compulsive liar who hates women. He added some comments about the piece to his original post in which he predicted he’d be called a loser who couldn’t get laid, Now he says of Kelly:
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/jto-goes-under-bus/
Well, I guess if you’re a compulsive liar who’s part of a movement that hates women and that men who are truly trying to help want to have nothing to do with, then an article that portrays you as a compulsive liar who’s part of a movement that hates women and that men who are truly trying to help want to have nothing to do with is a win?
I’m using this discreet moniker because I don’t want this to turn into the shit storm that Minter’s affair did, yet I still wanted to explain myself because not that much was said about me in the Newsweek article.
I think staying anonymous is a wise move. While the commentators on this blog are a skeptical about a feminist married to Bill Spearhead, many of the posters on the MRM/MGTOW boards will flat-out hate your guts after reading this article. Once they learn that your not some submissive 20-year old breeding stock/hottie, that you disagree with some MRM talking points and you’re a self-described feminist, they will say some very nasty shit about you.
[I'm taking your word that you are really Bill's wife rather than someone pulling a very dreary hoax.]
The first paragraph was a quote from Bill’s wife post. Blockquote fail.
“The Superstar characterization was obviously over the top” says John the Otter coyly while fluttering his eyes, “Am I blushing? Oh, do go on Mr Kelly!”.
I mean, honestly, Bill’s Wife, I have no idea how to talk to you. You seem to have no conception that social environments exist, or culture, or for that matter communication, and if you don’t understand that, then it’s awfully hard to explain and I’m not sure if it’s even worth trying.
Maybe you could think about advertising. Now, you’re probably one of those people who thinks “Ha ha, I’ve never seen a Chevrolet ad and then immediately felt the need to go out and by a car, I’m advertisement proof!” But advertisers spend billions every year on advertising and they have for a long time, so obviously it must have some effect, and it’s not just because people see the ad and then turn around and compulsively buy the product. Advertising does many other things. It increases name recognition, a huge factor. And even if you’re deliberately trying to not be affected by advertising, it’s influencing the sort of ideas you have about a product: Whether it’s fancy or everyday, whether it’s healthy or indulgent, what associations you have with it. And then those unconscious associations influence your decisions and make you more likely to buy a Chevrolet and so the company makes money from their advertising.
But that doesn’t just happen with advertisements. Every time there’s any kind of communication, the same sorts of things happen: You may not consciously turn around and forbid your daughter to go to college, but the more people hear something like that, the more parents are going to consciously or unconsciously focus not as much on preparing their daughters for college, the more girls are going to feel like higher education is maybe not that important, the more admissions people are going to favor male applicants over female, the more professors are going to neglect their female students because what does a woman need a college education for anyway, and so on.
Of course probably nobody totally believed in equality one minute and read your husband’s post and then suddenly change completely and think that women should have no education whatsoever, and lots of people like us will read the post and just be disgusted and not won over at all. But there are plenty of people out there who are, for one reason or another, are possibly influenced by that sort of argument: Misogynists who are looking for justification, misguidedly “moderate” people who feel like every argument deserves to be considered, young people who don’t know any better. And your husband has influenced them a little bit and nudged each of them a little bit closer to having feelings and making decisions that are opposed to women’s education. And so he’s made the world a little bit worse.
I hope this helps!
Mitt Rommey had binders of women (created by a Mass woman’s group he didn’t bother to credit), so clearly he is woman friendly. Just make sure you can fit in a binder.
As for the analysis of rape culture not being helpful… As a rape victim, raped by someone I loved, having a broader context to understand the fucked up thing he did to me, and why he didn’t see it as a problem despite the fact I was upset, helped a lot. I’m deeply grateful for the feminist analysis of rape culture and how rape within relationships occurs.
@katz, Very well said.
!!Massive trigger warning for rape and child sexual abuse.!!
When certain arsehole MRAs are claiming rape culture doesn’t exist they’re only one step away from saying victim blaming doesn’t exist and that fucks me off!
My uncle and father were raped on a daily basis for at least 15 years by my grandfather, who also raped a local child.
My uncle’s wife died suddenly from Anaphylactic Shock when I was fourteen and his sons were seven and thirteen, he was not eligible for a widower’s pension as, at the time, only women were eligible, he was very poor.
One year later my dad (his younger brother) got cancer and within two years was dead.
It was a few days after the funeral when my uncle broke down and talked for hours to me about what his father had done to him.
He and my father had never talked about it, and I never told my uncle that his brother had followed in their fathers footsteps. I think it would have ended him if I had.
One of the most meaningful moments I have had was when my uncle chose to confide in me.
Sadly, instead of doing so to gain comfort, he was still not thinking about himself, he was worrying about me.
My uncle had stopped seeing his father years before, but my dad had not. Instead of gaining comfort, this lovely man took responsibility, he apologised for not protecting me or his little brother from this evil man.
How could my poor uncle be responsible? He was so broken by what had happened, so unable to see that he hadn’t caused it. He had spent years trying to talk to my dad, trying to stop his brother taking his kids to see this man.
He didn’t feel sorry for himself, he just fretted for me, he blamed himself for everything.
And even though I could see he was not to blame, somehow I still, predictably, absorbed the same crap myself, and blamed myself for not being better, not stopping my abusers. Hell I STILL kind of think I should have said no louder, done more to stop it!
At the time my uncle told me about his childhood I had no words for him that would have helped to explain why he felt that way, and why he was wrong. If I had the concepts of rape culture and victim blaming back then, it might have helped him see that it was not his fault.
I have little patience with men who shout about men’s rights for their own ends, when I know my own history is littered with abused men who needed real help.
My uncle has had a hellish existence, but never once has he hated! I am sick and fucking tired of them using men like my uncle as excuses for their hate and propaganda.
@ahostileworld, you fucker! Rape culture does fucking exists, but then you know that don’t you?!?
Rape culture exists, that is why I’m repeating such a personal story here. This stuff has to be talked about, it has to be said.
If highlighting it at every possible opportunity helps just one person feel a little bit better and maybe know that the abuser was to blame, that they couldn’t have done anything any different, that it wasn’t their fault, then the concept of rape culture is worth it.
Truly though, no matter how many MaleRapeApologists try to say otherwise, I KNOW simply talking about rape culture helps everybody, that is, unless you have a vested interest in blaming the victim.
JtO was pleased that someone ripped him a new asshole? Well, that’s something I’ve never expected.
I wonder what would have happened if a female reporter wrote the exact same thing. Would JtO be equally delighted or outraged that someone implicitly called him a liar?
Sounds to me like he just didn’t read very far; he got as far as “superstar” and assumed it was saying something good about him.
Nice comment, katz. I agree completely.
*gives Ophelia and uncle all the hugs* I’m sorry that that happened to you, and I’m sorry that it happened to your uncle and your father.
Interesting reaction from JtO when this was in the article (in fact, these were my favorite four sentences in the whole thing. Especially the BBC’s reaction to the query).
@Alice Sanguinaria God, I hadn’t thought of that. I was just assuming he scanned the article for his name and squee’d till his nose veins burst that someone outside of his creepy little tribe called him a ‘superstar’. You’re absolutely right: if that piece was written by a woman, it would be hair-on-fire, bombs-away bullshit and crying like the sky had collapsed. So gross.
opheliamonarch, you are very brave to share your story. Internet hugs if you want them, and thank you.
Jedi hugs if you want them, ophelia. :<