About these ads

The Daily Beast takes on the Men’s Rights movement — and takes down A Voice for Men’s John Hembling

John Hembling, possibly lying about something

John Hembling, possibly lying about something

The bad publicity bonanza for Men’s Rights activists continues — and it couldn’t happen to a worse group of  people.

Yesterday, the Daily Beast published a long-awaited piece on the Men’s Rights movement, and it’s a doozy. If you’re a regular reader of this site, trust me, you’ll want to read the whole thing, like now. The piece, by R. Tod Kelly, is long — some 6000 words — but worth it.

It’s mostly on the money, but with a few notable flaws.

Here’s what it gets right:

1) It captures the pervasive misogyny of the Men’s Rights movement in general, and of A Voice for Men in particular.

2) In an extended section, it profiles AVFM’s John Hembling, and tears apart some of his most blatant lies — including the now legendary box-cutter incident, in which Hembling claims to have stared down a mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters.

As Kelly notes:

Vancouver police records show that there was indeed an altercation in September of 2012 between Hembling and others seeking to tear down men’s rights posters. However, according to the police, Hembling was arguing with two or three people, not being accosted by a “mob” of any size. When questioned by the authorities, neither Hembling nor witnesses mentioned seeing any weapons. …

Curiously enough, Hembling actually videotaped the events and had his AV4M Radio partner Karen Straughan post it online. The discussion with the police has been conveniently edited out, but the rest of the video clearly matches police records and not Hembling’s story. There are only a few young men taking down Hembling’s posters, and the video shows them choosing to ignore him except when he engages them in conversation. One of the men is seen using a box cutter to take down the flyers, but at no time does he use it as a weapon, raise his voice, or threaten Hembling in any way.

Kelly found some troubling, er, discrepancies in another story told by Hembling. Kelly writes:

According to Hembling, sometime around 1995 he was on his way home at 2:00 am after working a night shift when he came upon [a sexual] assault in progress. He says he used his steel-toed boots as weapons to chase off the perpetrator. When the victim was too distraught to speak with him, Hembling says he contacted the police, waited until they arrived, and then quietly left without speaking to them. He says they later tracked him down at his home, where he gave a statement.

It’s hard to know whether this event actually occurred or not. There is no record—at least, not in the Vancouver police files—of Hembling being a material witness to a rape, and police blotters from that time period do not show a crime that matches Hembling’s description. However, this does not necessarily mean the event did not occur. Vancouver police did not fully computerize their data until 2002, and it is possible the police never reported the incident. Hembling claims the incident took place at a specific hospital, where he says he worked as a contractor for 18 months. The address he gives, however, is for a different hospital in a completely different part of the city. This raises the curious question of whether Hembling forget the name of the hospital he contracted with for 18 months, or whether he forget what part of the city he worked in for that same period of time. The real truth of the matter is anyone’s guess, because Hembling wouldn’t comment to The Beast on that or any other matter.

In other words: Cool story, bro.

3) Another thing the story gets right: it makes clear just how little the Men’s Rights movement does to actually help men — and how in many ways it can actually be terribly damaging to men who need real help. As Kelly writes,

the movement’s radicals might … do … immediate damage to those who most desperately need the MRM to succeed.

“When we talk about recovery from trauma and abuse, there were two things that helped me,” says Chris Anderson, executive director of the male-victim advocacy group Male Survivor and a sexual abuse survivor himself. “The first was realizing that I’m not alone; the second was hearing that recovery was possible.” Anderson is quick to dissociate himself from the men’s rights movement: “In [the MRM] people get that first message, that they’re not alone. I don’t know that they ever get the second message. And when they don’t get that second message, it turns into an endless feedback loop and eventually they say, ‘Oh my God, all of society is f**ked.’”

Indeed, Kelly writes:

It is telling to note that of the professional male-victim advocacy organizations I spoke with, every single one specifically asked that I not allow readers to think they were in any way related to the MRM.

But there are also some things that I think the article gets wrong.

1) I think it gives Men’s Rights activists way too much credit for their supposed good intentions. While there are some MRAs who do seem to be motivated at least in part by a sincere desire to help men, most of the MRAs I’ve encountered in the 3 years of doing this blog have clearly been motivated primarily by anger and hatred of feminists — and women in general. They don’t really seem to give a shit about doing anything to actually improve the lives of men — and the paucity of their accomplishments reflects this. In its relatively brief lifespan, AVFM has raised many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Has it set up any shelters or hotlines or helplines for men? Not a one.

2) It wildly exaggerates the importance of Hembling to the MRM – especially ironic given that Hembling has been more or less AWOL in recent months, producing only a few short videos and one article for AVFM.

3) It paints a picture of The Spearhead’s WF Price as a Men’s Rights “moderate.” Really? While it’s true that Price is not an AVFM-style hothead given to rants about “fucking your shit up,” his views are anything but moderate. This is a guy who thinks higher education is wasted on women, who blames the epidemic of rape in the armed forces on women, who celebrated one Mothers Day with a vicious transphobic rant, who once used the tragic death of a woman who’d just graduated from college to argue that “after 25, women are just wasting time.” He published posts on why women’s suffrage is a bad idea. Plus, have you met his commenters?

I was, however, kind of amazed to learn that Price is married … and to a feminist. No, really.

4) The article, while solidly researched, contains some small errors and simplifications that will no doubt give MRAs and others the excuse they need to dismiss the whole thing. Kelly refers to Reddit subreddits as Reddit “threads!” He refers to Matt Forney as an MRA! Oh no!

Still, whatever its flaws, this is an important piece, and one that tells a lot of truth about the Men’s Rights movement. Again — go read it!

About these ads

Posted on October 20, 2013, in a voice for men, are these guys 12 years old?, johntheother, lying liars, misogyny, MRA and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 1,986 Comments.

  1. hellkell – it was news I read months’n’months ago, could have been last year, maybe on Raw Story? There was an incident where the fire department wouldn’t work on a house that wasn’t paid. I don’t know how it turned out to be in the end, but the original story at least was that they knew there were pets inside. I hope it’s apocryphal, but it’s in the Nothing Would Surprise Me folder at the moment.

  2. I can see that. I just happen to like police procedurals.

    Oh yeah, it’s very good as a procedural. I don’t like them much as a rule so I suppose that watching a whole bunch of Elementary indicates that it’s very good indeed.

  3. thenatfantastic

    I don’t want to sound drama-y, but Kittehs and CassandraSays, could you just please trust me and realise that when I mentioned caveats and property damage I wasn’t talking about any instance where a person or animal could get hurt? So, you know, excluding damage if you don’t know who’s there, or some kind of damage where it could spread and hurt people?

    Katz, you know that’s not what I’m advocating for. I clearly said that I don’t think one incident of property damage destroys a movement. You don’t think that. I appreciate that, and I understand that my POV isn’t to other people’s tastes. There’s no need to be quite so passive aggressive about it. Yes, you think that my ideas could backfire and end up with things I support having the same done to them, I get it.

  4. @themaskandrose

    If a voice for men is so hateful towards women, why are half of its featured writers and editors female? The question, I suspect, will always remain unanswered by the likes of you sick fucks.

    1) I’d like to see a citation. I know it has some, but I’m doubting all.
    2) women can be hateful toward other women. Internalized misogyny. It’s a thing.
    3) have you ever read anything they typed? They’re ridiculously hateful.

  5. Kittehs” Oh, I remember that story. It wasn’t insurance, I think the person hadn’t paid whatever FD fee their community had.

  6. The thing is, though, how can you be sure that a building is completely empty? I’m talking about arson specifically.

  7. LOL @ ‘internalised misogyny’

  8. If a voice for men is so hateful towards women, why are half of its featured writers and editors female?

    Because these women hate women almost as much as the men there do — and sometimes, it seems, more, as the quote from Driversuz in the other thread suggests. Whether this is self-hate, or whether these women basically classify themselves as special snowflakes”not like other women” I’m not always sure, though GWW at least puts herself in the latter category.

  9. thenatfantastic

    Thanks for the police procedural recommendations. When I end up a Law and Order zombie and unable to function in the real world I’m blaming you lot.

    @Kittehs I have seen some of the UK ones but I think I like the proposterousness of the US ones more. ENHANCE!

    Although that’s not to say that Midsomer Murders does not have its own uniquely British proposterousness.

  10. @Ahostileworld

    LOL @ ‘internalised misogyny’

    Elaborate, fool.

  11. Marie: we’re about to start season 8. Gotta be better than 7!

    If a voice for men is so hateful towards women, why are half of its featured writers and editors female? The question, I suspect, will always remain unanswered by the likes of you sick fucks.

    We’re the sick fucks? We’ve never advocated for baby girls’ voice boxes to be cut out, so fuck you. We’ve never said October should be Bash A Violent Bitch Month, so again, fuck you.

  12. thenatfantastic

    @CassandraSays

    This is my bad for not specifying that I wouldn’t support any kind of PD that had the potential to spread (so fire, bombs etc).

  13. Didn’t this troll get banned, or was it just modded for being a rape apologist on another thread?

  14. (I’m thinking in more general terms here – I really don’t see Nat setting fire to any buildings.)

  15. thenatfantastic

    @ahostileworld

    QUICK QUICK ANSWER MY QUESTIONS ABOUT F4J

  16. @hellkell

    Marie: we’re about to start season 8. Gotta be better than 7!

    Good luck :) I just started season 8, so can’t say how good it is, other than (like season 7 :() I’m constantly waiting for Castiel to come back. I swear half the reason I keep watching the show is for the Dean/Cas interactions. And to see if they ever continue with Sam’s demon powers. I liked that plotline :(

  17. I really wish David had a “banned for boring the crap out of everyone” policy sometimes.

  18. thenat-

    @Kittehs I have seen some of the UK ones but I think I like the proposterousness of the US ones more. ENHANCE!

    LOL!

    Though … more preposterous than Midsomer Murders?

    Can such things be? ʘ_ʘ

  19. thenatfantastic

    IIRC the founder of the first fire service in Ancient Rome used to turn up with the means to put the fire out (slaves + buckets of water) and bargain to buy the house from the owner. The longer they took to sell it to him, the less of their house would be left, and the lower the price would get. He’d then rebuild the house that he’d bought for pennies and sell it on. He ended up being one of the richest men in Rome.

  20. @ neuroticbeagle

    The fuck is this shit? Generally speaking local government should try to avoid running protection rackets.

  21. Okay, differently preposterous. That’s what I get for skimming. :P

  22. Seconding the Criminal Minds recommendation, and watchseries has all of it for free streaming (you’ll have to google watchseries, their hosting changes frequently)

  23. I got ninja’d while looking up the story.

  24. neuroticbeagle is queen of links again!

    thenat – didn’t early fire services in London run similarly? Not the standing-haggling bit, but it being an insurance thing.

  25. thenatfantastic

    @Kittehs

    You are right. Although can anything truly beat Cold Case? Everyone they want to talk to about long-past murders* is a) alive, b) lucid, c) remembers EVERY DETAIL about the night/week/month in question, d) tells their stories in chronological order, never lying, but merely missing part of the chronology until a later interview when the gap has been filled in and e) confesses upon request, without any physical evidence.

    (*Up to and including 70 years ago)

  26. thenatfantastic

    @Kittehs other comment

    I’ve definitely studied tort cases which involve uninsured people seeing their houses burn down then trying to sue the person who started it.

    Speaking of which, I’m doing a ridonkulous amount of tutoring at the moment and need to read 100 pages of a textbook before tomorrow and it’s 3am. I should probably do something about that :/ *procrastination face*

  27. The fuck is this shit? Generally speaking local government should try to avoid running protection rackets.

    Agreed. This is the whole purpose of having taxes to fund stuff like roads, police and fire fighters. If the fire department needs more money either 1) do fundraisers or 2) raise taxes. Don’t like option number 2? How about we decrease some politicians salary instead?

  28. Eek! Textbooks at 3am sound like a sure cure for insomnia. :(

    I’ve never watched Cold Case – the US shows are all on commercial stations here (blech) and I find I can’t get into them much anyway. All those cloned pretty stars with a dozen extra teeth apiece …

  29. THE DARK LORD HATH STRUCK

    Troll is gone!

  30. You know, I can’t remember if I banned themaskandrose the last time he was here, or just put him on moderation. But looking back over some of his earlier comments, and considering the namecalling and complete lack of substance of his comments today, and the fact that one contained a slur, I think I’ll just put him on the ban list.

  31. Although can anything truly beat Cold Case? Everyone they want to talk to about long-past murders* is a) alive, b) lucid, c) remembers EVERY DETAIL about the night/week/month in question, d) tells their stories in chronological order, never lying, but merely missing part of the chronology until a later interview when the gap has been filled in and e) confesses upon request, without any physical evidence.

    True. But it is well written ridiculousness with awesome music.

  32. One of my favourite crime stories was In The Red – satirical and very weird. Alun Armstrong, Rebecca Front, Warren Clarke, Rachel Fielding, Rik Mayall, Siobhan Redmond, Richard Griffith, Stephen Fry … perfect. Bank managers being murdered, a political party with about two members, plotting at the BBC – what more could you want?

  33. @thenatfantastic, are you in the UK too? If so, have you seen the new one with David Tennant and Olivia Coleman? Womdered if it was worth a punt. :). Also, shouldn’t you be in bed, it’s 3.25 FFS? Yeah, I don’t sleep much either :(

    Okay, sorry OT, but @argenti, OMFG, I can’t believe I’ve never listened to Emilie Autumn!!

    The last hour: Me, Youtube, Emilie Autumn.

    Can you pretty please recommend the best album?

    Also, I WANT that corset!

    Does anyone drum here? I’m sure a corset would help my back, I got a new drum throne and wrist gauntlets, but my hand still keeps going numb!

    Anyway, corset, even if it doesn’t help, it would look great with my new black hickory sticks. :)

    See this is why guys don’t want feeeemale drummers!
    (Or as the guy on youtube called me, ‘fat, fucking, feminist c*nt drummers’.)

    Also, @argenti, FUCKING iOS 7!!! Thank you for being an Ally in my pain.

  34. thenatfantastic

    I’ll have to look that one up Kittehs :) WRT textbook, I’m taking it in 10-page stages, which served me well as a student. Reading it at 3am, panicking with cider and black is just adding to the retro ambience.

    @neuroticbeagle – since you brought up the music, I must say that ‘AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH’ at the beginning of the theme tune scares the bejezus out of me every time.

  35. ophelia – do you mean Broadchurch, or have Tennant and Coleman done another?

    I watched the first three eps of Broadchurch, then tuned out. It was very good but a real downer. I think it was Argenti who called Tennant’s Who “depression on legs”, and he was Mr Chirpy compared with his character in Broadchurch.

  36. thenatfantastic

    @OpheliaMonarch

    Shouldn’t YOU be in bed? I was going to comment earlier about your hilarious comment about the bloody new years magazines but the convo had moved way on, so I hope you’ll accept one chocolate gift wrapped internet.

    But to answer your question, yes, I am in the UK. I live in the city on the South coast that’s about the most stereotypical city for hippie punk vegan feminist pansexuals to live in.

  37. thenat – if you know the Stephen Fry/John Bird series Absolute Power, In the Red is where their characters came from. :)

  38. thenatfantastic

    Honestly Kittehs, I think you’ve watched more British TV than I have! My knowledge basically extends to comedy series and quiz shows.

  39. Alright, thought the gin I was drinking was bad, but I haven’t had cider and black since I was 18! Ooh, the pain!

    Only 20/20 was worse. (Not the US TV program, the drink.)

    Just listening to Mary Beards audiobook on Pompeii, she said wealthy people wouldn’t touch welfare ’cause they’d get bumped off by fellow wealthy people for being too popular.

    Also loved the new pic, @kitteh :)

  40. @nat
    I was referring to the music that they use during the episode (whichever year/artist they go with) not the theme. But now that I think about it, the theme is kinda creepy (in a good way, imho).

  41. Could well be! I’ve watched almost entirely British telly for decades. Jeez, we watched The Bill before they blew up the older cast and turned it into a feckin’ soap.

    /neverforgavethemforkillingoffAndrewMonroe

  42. ophelia – thank ‘ee, I like yours, too!

    Even though there are NO KITTIES in it …

    Also: I am old enough to remember the original series of The Forsyte Saga. Well, a couple of scenes from the final episode, anyway. :P

  43. @kitteh, oookay, maybe not on my watch list, I had heard it was a bit ‘Murphy’s Law’ but wasn’t sure. (Although, every time I said I wasn’t gonna watch Murphy’s Law, somehow I did.)

    Thenatfantastic, why thank you :)
    Got drunk in your neck of the woods quite often when I was a yoof, although, can’t remember it very well, binge drinking fucks with the memory. Us Brits love our bing drinking.

    I’m in the place people serve mushy peas and mince sauce and call it food, though I’m originally from the border of South Wales.

  44. MINT SAUCE, MINT SAUCE!
    FUCK YOU iOS 7!
    *shakes hands at the gods*

  45. What’s the difference between mint and mince sauce? :P

  46. @kitteh, which one? I sent you a lot, and most had kitties. You mean the one of me? That one was just awful!

  47. thenatfantastic

    @Ophelia

    I think I’m from where you are now then! Do they have a special pudding?

  48. thenatfantastic

    @neuroticbeagle I do quite like that too :)

    I am three seasons in and still baffled by Lily’s hair.

  49. I really wish David had a “banned for boring the crap out of everyone” policy sometimes.

    Me too. I would also be in favor of a “Banned for being just as tedious and obnoxious as The First Joe” policy.

  50. Sorry, ophelia, I thought you were talking about our gravatars! :P

    But that one you emailed was not awful. Okay, dark, but not awful!

  51. Ally – that would be a great policy name. :D

  52. @Alice, one would be sauce made out of the mint herb, and the other would be made out of meat.

    Where I come from, but not all over the UK, on bonfire night, November the fifth, they serve mushy peas sprinkled with mint sauce (mint sauce is vinegar and mint.)

    Yeah, weird! But surprisingly nice.

  53. “as tedious and obnoxious as The First Joe”, that’s a stringent standard to meet.

  54. I noticed people talking earlier/yesterday about being embarrassed to have trolls from the same geographical region as them, and I would like to take this opportunity to apologise, on behalf of all the citizens of the UK and her maj, for The First Joe.

    In Other News What I Meant To Tell Boobzers, I’m currently doing an online course in non-avian paeleobiology 101 (dinosaurs n shit) which is based in Edmonton! Their local dinosaur, I was surprised to find, was the Edmontosaurus (of which there have been numerous finds in the local Dinosaur National Park), and not the Patriarchy Party.

  55. @ophelia – Now I want pie and peas and it’s 4am and it’s ALL YOUR FAULT.

  56. @thenatfantastic, oh sorry, no, not far away though. We have a famous outlaw, alright that was a bit obvious! Oh, never mind. :)

    @kitteh, sorry, that was me being stupid, I meant the pic of Louis you linked to earlier.
    I love your gravatar also!

    Also will work on getting over the photograph nerves, how ’bout one with me drumming. :)

    My gravatar is of Hamlet’s Ophelia, It’s where I got my online name from. Used it for years everywhere else. It’s eyes don’t exactly follow you around the room, but I think they Convey a certain something.

  57. thenat – that’s cos Edmontosaurus is more advanced and smarter than the Patriarchy Party. :)

    No, not mint and peas! If I’ve got to eat peas I’ll have ‘em plain, thank you. (Mum loves mint peas, but we don’t do mint sauce, thank goodness.)

    While we’re apologising for trolls etc, I’d like to apologise for Copyright Nolan. And Tony Abbott … and Bill Heffernan … and … oh, fuck for all our politicians, really. They’re trolls writ large.

  58. Mmmm, I have never heard of this “cider and black” concoction until now, but now I have to find a place to try it! Not sure if I like blackcurrants, having never had anything currant-y at all, but I sure love cider :D

  59. “as tedious and obnoxious as The First Joe”, that’s a stringent standard to meet.

    Stringent, yes. But TFJ is another dimension of terribleness, so being like him is most definitely ban-worthy.

  60. @thenatfantastic, oh sorry, no, not far away though. We have a famous outlaw, alright that was a bit obvious! Oh, never mind. :)

    You mean … Dennis Moore? :O

    Dennis Moore, Dennis Moore
    Galloping through the sward
    Dennis Moore, Dennis Moore
    And his horse Concorde
    He steals from the rich
    And gives to the poor
    Mr. Moore, Mr. Moore, Mr. Moore

  61. Oooo, pie!

    Damn it, only got peperami! Somehow gin, lemonade and peperami sound like a bad idea.

    Nope, munchies win!

  62. I really don’t recommend the cider and black thing unless you enjoy puking dark purple liquid. It’s kind of a teenage rite of passage in the UK though.

  63. Ophelia – Sounds nommy! :)

  64. @deste – It’s basically cider (if you’re in the US, I mean the alcoholic stuff) mixed with a wee smidge of blackcurrant cordial. It’s very sweet, takes away the taste of the cider and a legendary student drink. The next level up is snakebite and black, which is a 50-50 mix of lager and cider with the aformentioned smidge. Try at your peril, up from that you stick a shot of vodka in the mix.

    @Kittehs – when you say ‘we don’t do mint and peas’ do you mean your household or your country? I haven’t had it since I moved DAHN SARF but I think I may have to rectify this tomorrow…

    @Ophelia – Ah, I get you now, BoyFantastic used to live there for uni, and I have one of my most ridiculous going-out-and-acting-like-a-ninny stories thanks to your county town.

  65. “Okay, sorry OT, but @argenti, OMFG, I can’t believe I’ve never listened to Emilie Autumn!!

    The last hour: Me, Youtube, Emilie Autumn.

    Can you pretty please recommend the best album?”

    I iz good plague rat, I spreaded the plague! (That’d be my talking-to-fuzzy/cute-things voice)

    Best album…now that is a tough one! Enchant is an odd mix, it’s her first proper album and as such is a bit of a mish mash — What If has a very Celtic feel, Heard it All is probably the most “hard core” but not really. Then came Laced/Unlaced — dual disc, Laced is classical, Unlaced is her own instrumental pieces and *swoons* that violin! And then there was Opheliac, which may be the best from a technical standpoint, and certainly has some amazing tracks (listen to Thank God I’m Pretty if you haven’t yet!). And Fight Like A Girl is the most recent, but a lot of it refers to her book, rumor is she’s turning the book and album into a musical, I am very excited.

    So all total, Unlaced for the violin, Opheliac for the mixing and lyrics, but the rest are also awesome in their own ways.

    Songs, that I haven’t yet mentioned, Liar, the remix with ASP, and Swallow, flilthy Victorian remix, How Strange, the title track on FLAG, Time for Tea, and Take the Pill. As far as Unlaced goes, Manic Depression might be my favorite, but they are all excellent.

    As for corsets, I have a Georgian, unboned besides the busk, corset and yeah, it does wonders for my back.

  66. …lager and cider sounds pretty good actually…

    Pecunium, should I get down there again before, idk, April >.< Can we make this happen?

  67. Ophelia – that’s him! :D

    thenat – both, really. Mint sauce isn’t much of A Thing here generally, though you might get it with roast lamb in some restaurants. Specifically, we don’t have it in our house. Took me long enough to get past “mint = toothpaste” and eat chocolate mint biscuits; I ain’t puttin’ it near meat or veg!

  68. I don’t like beer (me & hops aren’t friends), but I do like boozy cider (not that the soft stuff’s bad, either), and I like sweet stuff, so I still think I’ll keep it on my to-try list, though not in a keep-taste-testing-it-til-I’m-so-drunk-I-puke kind of way. Also I’m only 23, so student drinks are fair game, I think :P

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

Follow

Get every new post delivered to your Inbox.

Join 8,501 other followers

%d bloggers like this: