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Paul Elam of A Voice for Men: In His Own Words

Paul Elam on 20/20
Paul Elam in a web-only clip from the 20/20 segment that never ran on television.

Paul Elam, the founder and primary animating force behind the website A Voice for Men, is probably, for better or worse, the most influential figure in the Men’s Rights movement (or, as he prefers to call it, the Men’s Human Rights Movement).

Elam is also a fierce misogynist with a penchant for angry, violent rhetoric full of only-slightly veiled threats. But don’t take my word for it. Perhaps the best way to get to know Mr. Elam is through his own words.

So here are some of Elam’s thoughts on a variety of issues, taken from postings on his own website.  I have linked each quote back to its source on A Voice for Men.

Paul Elam on Domestic Violence

In the name of equality and fairness, I am proclaiming October to be Bash a Violent Bitch Month.

I’d like to make it the objective for the remainder of this month, and all the Octobers that follow, for men who are being attacked and physically abused by women – to beat the living shit out of them. I don’t mean subdue them, or deliver an open handed pop on the face to get them to settle down. I mean literally to grab them by the hair and smack their face against the wall till the smugness of beating on someone because you know they won’t fight back drains from their nose with a few million red corpuscles.

And then make them clean up the mess. …

Now, am I serious about this?

No. Not because it’s wrong. It’s not wrong. Every one should have the right to defend themselves. …

But it isn’t worth the time behind bars or the abuse of anger management training that men must endure if they are uppity enough to defend themselves from female attackers.

Here, courtesy of the Wayback Machine, is the post as it originally appeared on A Voice for Men in 2010, where it was illustrated with a picture of a woman with a black eye, captioned “Maybe she DID have it coming.”

Elam now says this was “satire,” though its hard to see how it is “satire” when he clearly says that he doesn’t think his allegedly “satirical” solution is wrong. When Swift wrote his Modest Proposal he didn’t think that eating babies was actually a good thing; if so, it would not have been a satire.

Paul Elam on Rape

I have ideas about women who spend evenings in bars hustling men for drinks, playing on their sexual desires … And the women who drink and make out, doing everything short of sex with men all evening, and then go to his apartment at 2:00 a.m.. Sometimes both of these women end up being the “victims” of rape.

But are these women asking to get raped?

In the most severe and emphatic terms possible the answer is NO, THEY ARE NOT ASKING TO GET RAPED.

They are freaking begging for it.

Damn near demanding it.

And all the outraged PC demands to get huffy and point out how nothing justifies or excuses rape won’t change the fact that there are a lot of women who get pummeled and pumped because they are stupid (and often arrogant) enough to walk though life with the equivalent of a I’M A STUPID, CONNIVING BITCH – PLEASE RAPE ME neon sign glowing above their empty little narcissistic heads.

Elam, apparently trying to project a more respectable image, has replaced the original A Voice for Men post containing these passages with a disingenuous disclaimer. But the Internet never forgets. An archived copy of the original post can be found through the Wayback Machine here. The quote is not any better in context.

Paul Elam on Why He Would Vote to Acquit All Rapists

Elam feels that courts are “patently untrustworthy when it comes to the offense of rape” and so, he explained in one post:

Should I be called to sit on a jury for a rape trial, I vow publicly to vote not guilty, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that the charges are true.

Original post here.

Paul Elam Explains How the Thought of Harming His Critics Sexually Arouses Him

No, I’m not making this up. Here are the strange, threatening remarks he addressed to an opponent of his Register-Her website (on which, more below).

Do you think I am going to stop?

It’s a serious question, because the answer to that question … should inform you of what will work for you or not work for you in dealing with me.

And the answer is, of course, no, I am not going to stop. You see, I find you, as a feminist, to be a loathsome, vile piece of human garbage. I find you so pernicious and repugnant that the idea of fucking your shit up gives me an erection.

Original post here.

Paul Elam on the Necessity of “Inflicting Pain” on Opponents

Progress for men will not be gained by debate, reason or typical channels of grievance available to segments of the population that the world actually gives a damn about. The progress we need will only be realized by inflicting enough pain on the agents of hate, in public view, that it literally shocks society out of its current coma.

You can see this quote in context here.

Paul Elam, the World’s Strangest “Pacifist”

From a post on family courts:

I am a pacifist. I do not advocate violence. But I tell you this. The day I see one of these absolutely incredulous excuses for a judge dragged out of his courtroom into the street, beaten mercilessly, doused with gasoline and set afire by a father who just won’t take another moment of injustice, I will be the first to put on the pages of this website that what happened was a minor tragedy that pales by far in comparison to the systematic brutality and thuggery inflicted daily on American fathers by those courts and their police henchmen.

It would not even so much be a tragedy as the chickens coming home to roost.

You can see the comment in context here.

Paul Elam on Mothers’ Day

To all you mothers of the world, please give your Mother’s Day flowers and give them all generously. Most importantly, give them where they will do the most good. Place a bunch of daffodils at a dumpster near you, perhaps one in which one of you, or one of your kind, has tossed an unwanted baby, leaving it there to slowly die alone in a pile of trash.

Perhaps you could lay a single rose at the base of a bridge that has been used by a mother to throw her baby into an icy river. Perhaps you can lay it there with hands that have beaten or shaken a baby to death. …

Inspired? Good. Now perhaps some of you could place large, colorful arrangements at the abortion centers where women go to have children cut out and laid to rest in those colorful and attractive biohazard containers that are all the rage in the clinics.

He continues on in this vein for some time before getting to this:

This is not a request for some mothers, or a percentage of them, but all of you. In fact, you don’t even have to be a mother. If you have a vagina, the blood of all those children, who are abused far more at the hands of women than men, has stained your skin and caked around the cuticles of your fingers.

And he continues on for several more paragraphs of abuse, until this:

In Daffodils for Dumpsters the gash gets you in, and you don’t really have a choice.

After several more paragraphs of this he makes clear that this time he’s not even claiming he’s writing satire:

Now, do I really mean all this? Yes.

You can read the whole remarkable thing here. He also wrote a similarly unhinged post about Valentines Day, which I wrote about here.

Now, Elam not only says many terrible things; he also does terrible things. Here are a few posts detailing some of these things.

Here’s a post about his website Register-Her, a fake “offenders registry” where feminist writers and activists are vilified alongside female murderers and child abusers, and threatened with the exposure of their personal information, in an attempt to silence them.

Here’s a post about A Voice for Men’s glorification of Thomas Ball, a disturbed man and self-admitted child abuser who set himself on fire on the steps of a courthouse in hopes that his death would inspire Men’s Rights activists to launch a campaign of firebombing attacks against courthouses and police stations.

Despite Elam’s claims of non-violence, A Voice for Men published Ball’s long terrorist manifesto — including his calls for firebombing — on its website, in its “activism” section. It was only after the Boston Marathon bombings that AVFM finally took the manifesto down.

Here’s a post about the time Paul Elam (along with a ragtag team of online misogynists and white supremacists) viciously attacked a young woman as an anti-male, anti-white bigot, resulting in threats directed at her and at her alma mater, Georgetown University. As it turned out, all the attacks on her, from Elam and other, were based on bogus information — as Elam would have known if he had taken ten minutes to fact check his sources.

These quotes, and these articles, are really only the tip of the iceberg. I invite anyone interested in finding out more about what Paul Elam believes to look through my archives at some of my other posts about him, and about A Voice for Men more generally.

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magicunicorn
6 years ago

However, I must say – the level of outrage against the Jezebel people seems miniscule in comparison to the outrage against Elam.

Reflective of an attitude that while it is horrific to beat on women (an attitude I agree with), it’s not so bad, and even entertaining, when a woman beats on a man.

Compare the reaction to Elam’s comments, which were deservedly outrageous from what I gather to the reaction to the Jezebel people, which is essentially “Well we’ve already said that _any_ kind of violence is bad, regardless of gender”.

That’ll teach Jez to promote violence!

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

So, magicunicorn, where is the part where you say that you’re not ok with violence, regardless of the gender of the perpetrator & the victim? ‘cos I see a lot of you demanding that we confirm that we are anti-violence but nowhere do you say any such thing. Can we therefore, by your logic and based on the astonishing silence from you in this regard, assume that you are in favour of gendered violence against women?

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

And have you read the comments, Magicunicorn, before you shat all over us with your accusations of bigotry? Have you seen how many fucking times we’ve had trolls just like you demand exactly the same condemnation from us? And accuse us of being ok with violence against men? Because it’s fucking old.

marinerachel
marinerachel
6 years ago

Jezebel is super hyperbolic and polarising at times. Lots of feminist people will tell you they’re disappointed by it.

magicunicorn
6 years ago

@titianblue

Oh brother. [face palm] Because you have not come out and said that you’re not ok with Hitler, am I to assume that you’re a Hitler supporter? Or would that just be ridiculous?

Look at the comment just above yours where I say “Reflective of an attitude that while it is horrific to beat on women (an attitude I agree with)”

Yes, I know – dissenting views attract hostility. Would you prefer it if I left? Just ask me and I will if my views are not welcome.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

However, I must say – the level of outrage against the Jezebel people seems miniscule in comparison to the outrage against Elam.

Yeah, you’ll find something to be outrages about. Just keep looking.

One of those things is not like the other. If you don’t know why, STFU and go think about it before you try to ‘splain any other great wisdoms to us.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Oh brother. [face palm] Because you have not come out and said that you’re not ok with Hitler, am I to assume that you’re a Hitler supporter? Or would that just be ridiculous?

Are you conscious of your double standard and trolling or are you seriously that vacuous?

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

*outraged*
Argh at bad typing!

marinerachel
marinerachel
6 years ago

Jezebel says all kinds of stupid shit. Paul Elam advocates hatred and harm of women.

Yeah, the level of anger is going to differ.

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

@magicunicorn,

Look at the comment just above yours where I say “Reflective of an attitude that while it is horrific to beat on women (an attitude I agree with)”

OMG, I didn’t refresh before posting. Well take me out and shoot me now for not being psychic and mind-reading your post. Well done, you’ve proved everything you wanted. We’re all bigots and your dissenting opinion is the most stunning revelation to us all We should crawl away and sob because we can never match your brilliance.

TL:DR Gods, you’re a smug, entitled idiot!

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

Just ask me and I will if my views are not welcome.

Please leave. Your unoriglnal views, misoginy-apologia and faux-anger are not welcome.

marinerachel
marinerachel
6 years ago

And we’re not mad enough at Jezebel. D:

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Bye!
Buh-bye!
Adios!
Shoo.

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Magicunicorn, I wouldn’t object to your departure. I question the veracity of your words, and am disenclined to appreciate your defense of a person with such loose ethical standards.

Feel free to make good on your promise to flounce.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Yeah, just piss off, magicunicorn. We’re sick to death of trolls coming in with their but what about teh menz shit every time men’s violence against women is talked about, not least in the wake of mass murder committed by a misogynist.

You want to call me a bigot for despising misogynists? Fine by me. I’ll happily be called a bigot by racists and homophobes and trans phobes too.

magicunicorn
6 years ago

@Marinerrachel – thanks for your comments about that. I did not realize that, so thanks again.

@titianblue – I don’t believe I shat all over you with accusations of bigotry. I merely wondered where the outrage was about that Jezebel article, but since I haven’t had a really good look around the site, perhaps they’re there somewhere, I just didn’t say any right here in this thread. That’s not the same, in my book, as accusing you of being bigots, for one thing you haven’t really had time as I only just brought the topic up.

I take it by “fucking trolls” like me, you mean people with dissenting points of view?

I have to admit that’s one thing that really does get my goat.

There is a difference between expressing a dissenting point of view and trolling. If I was on here to troll, I’d probably take that as a compliment, but that’s not my purpose. You however have every right to see me that way if you so desire.

@Lea

“Jezabel is not the voice of feminism and if you had been paying any attention to this issue, you’d know that Jez get’s plenty of criticism from feminists.”

Sorry, but I haven’t read every post on this thread. Do some of them criticize Jez?

“It’s adorable how you are sure you know more about feminism than we do and need to ‘splain it to us for our enlightenment.”

Well I do love being called adorable, so thanks for that, but I’ve never purported to knowing more about feminism than you do, in fact I’m sure I know considerably less.

The main two things I was trying to ‘splain were:

1) I believed that Elam’s article was in response to the Jez article I mentioned earlier. Given the feedback I’ve received about this, I will suspend this assertion, as its validity has been challenged to the degree that I wish to look into it some more.

However I do not support violence, and if Elam truly condones violence against women (or men for that matter) then I strongly agree with this position.

2) I wanted to make it known that Jezebel had posted this article which condones female to male violence.

magicunicorn
6 years ago

OK, so long and thanks for all the fish (Whoops there I go again!) 🙂

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

And Magicunicorn gets an automatic 2 point penalty for failing to stick the flounce.

I take it by “fucking trolls” like me, you mean people with dissenting points of view?

Nope. No problem with dissenting views. Big problem with idiots coming on here defending Paul “fuck your shit up” Elam and his abusers’ lobby.

I don’t believe I shat all over you with accusations of bigotry.

However, I must say – the level of outrage against the Jezebel people seems miniscule in comparison to the outrage against Elam.

Reflective of an attitude that while it is horrific to beat on women (an attitude I agree with), it’s not so bad, and even entertaining, when a woman beats on a man.

We can scroll up and read what you wrote, you know.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

“Sure, I’ll leave, but not before crapping a little more on the rug!” – Every troll ever

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

How is one terrible Jez article from 7 years ago (by an author most of the commenters on there hate) equivalent to the hatred that comes out of the MRAs every day?

Can’t the MRM come up with anything besides that Jezebel article and the Canadian protesters? They just recycle the same shit again and again. It’s almost like feminists aren’t as violent and misandrist as MRAs are violent and misogynist.

pecunium
6 years ago

Horny: Oh brother. [face palm] Because you have not come out and said that you’re not ok with Hitler, am I to assume that you’re a Hitler supporter? Or would that just be ridiculous?

It’s what you did. You came to a post decrying violence and said, “yes, but you didn’t condemn this example of violence: If you refuse to jump to my tune I shall have to assume you approve of it.”

Fuck off.

Sorry, but I haven’t read every post on this thread. Do some of them criticize Jez?

If you’ve not read them, how can you say, with a straight face: However, I must say – the level of outrage against the Jezebel people seems miniscule in comparison to the outrage against Elam.

Dishonest much?

Fuck off.

1) I believed that Elam’s article was in response to the Jez article I mentioned earlier. Given the feedback I’ve received about this, I will suspend this assertion, as its validity has been challenged to the degree that I wish to look into it some more.

So you make a habit of assuming things without checking the actual facts.

And we should give credence to your opinions because?

As I said, bugger off.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

The logical fallacy of pretty much every troll on this site: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Tu_quoque

brighterthanbefore
6 years ago

I see the original post with Paul Elam’s rant on rape and women begging for it is no longer there, they have updated the page. Is there any way of finding it in google cache?

kittehserf
6 years ago

Cue Pauly claiming he never encouraged men to commit rape wrote that piece of blistering satire.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

No one is going to forget what Elam wrote, no matter how much he’d like them to.comment image

kittehserf
6 years ago

What’s the cartoon refer to, Lea?

magicunicorn
6 years ago

I just felt the need to clear up a few things here.

Firstly, when I said their didn’t seem to be much outrage against that Jez article; I was not referring specifically to the people on this site. That’s just an assumption people seem to have made: “Call us bigots will ya!”

Secondly ok, I’m a troll. I don’t swear at people and I don’t call them names and I try to stick to the topic rather than abusing people, so I’m obviously a troll.

I’ll even admit when I’m wrong, which a non-troll would never do.

And it’s ok to abuse us trolls, as we are in fact sub human.

So go ahead, swear at me some more, call me some more names, and negate me by labeling me. After all you might listen to a human being, but why would anyone listen to a troll?

I promise I won’t do the same back to you, as trolls don’t do that kind of thing.

Well not this troll anyway.

BUT – I will admit it when I’m wrong.

I had originally seen an article suggesting that Elam’s article was in response to that Jez article.

Having looked at what Paul had to say, via that Wayback Machine link above, I now say that I don’t care whether or not his article was in response to Jez’s.

I condemn it.

I am totally against violence, and rape is one of the worst kinds of violence. And before someone gets their back up – Yes, I know that’s obvious!

Violence against anyone, man woman or child is appalling, unless in actual self defense; and I do not support Paul Elam’s call for violence in any way, shape or form.

So feel free to kick the dirty troll one more time, if it makes you feel better. I will not fight back.

magicunicorn
6 years ago

@pecunium

“So you make a habit of assuming things without checking the actual facts.”

No. Usually I’m a lot more careful about checking my facts. This time around my fact checking before jumping in efforts were way below sub-standard.

“And we should give credence to your opinions because?”

There is no reason. I am rightfully discredited on this.

fromafar2013
6 years ago

@ magicunicorn

Having looked at what Paul had to say, via that Wayback Machine link above, I now say that I don’t care whether or not his article was in response to Jez’s.

I condemn it.

“So you make a habit of assuming things without checking the actual facts.”

No. Usually I’m a lot more careful about checking my facts. This time around my fact checking before jumping in efforts were way below sub-standard.

“And we should give credence to your opinions because?”

There is no reason. I am rightfully discredited on this.

Makes me want to do this:comment image
Then this:comment image

But this:

And it’s ok to abuse us trolls, as we are in fact sub human.

So go ahead, swear at me some more, call me some more names, and negate me by labeling me. After all you might listen to a human being, but why would anyone listen to a troll?

So feel free to kick the dirty troll one more time, if it makes you feel better. I will not fight back.

Makes me want to do this:comment image
And this:comment image
Then this:comment image

That is all.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Just out of curiosity, why is the unicorn pasting a “kick me” sign on his own back?

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Magicunicorn,

It’s good to admit when you’re wrong and everything, but that’s not the best way to go about it. A simple apology would suffice. Instead you’re whining about being abuse. Really?!?

We get misogynist trolls on here all the time. When you use they same arguments they use, it will be assumed that you are trolling.

That’s why when you’re new to an online community it’s always good to lurk in the comments and peruse the contents of the site before just jumping in. There’s plenty of evidence that Paul Elam is a virulent misogynist and it’s all cataloged here. You can go to the right of the screen and select a tag to read up on a specific topic.

We’re not interested in patiently making the case again and again that the MRM is misogynist because it is self evident. This also isn’t a social justice 101 site. It’s a mocking misogyny site. So that’s what we do.

Nobody abused you. We were contemptuous of your argument because we’ve heard it before. Often. I’ve only been here about 6 months and I’ve already the “it’s satire” argument a million times.

If you want to stay and comment on good terms apologize sincerely. It isn’t that hard.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

Cassandrakitty, he wanted to be absoLUTEly sure we noticed him leaving this time.

Woody
Woody
6 years ago

This post, of course, does not mention that virtually all of these quotes were explicitly designated as satire by Paul. If you find the satire in bad taste, then fine, but they do not paint an accurate picture of Paul’s views.

Tulgey Logger
Tulgey Logger
6 years ago

Ah yes, Paul Elam, the noted satirist. Was keeping Thomas Ball’s call to violence under the “Activism” tab on AVFM’s front page up until the Boston Marathon bombing also an act of satire, Woody? Is the whole Men’s Rights Movement just satire?

Ally S
6 years ago

That victim-blaming post was definitely not satire. And it doesn’t really matter whether the rest of his stuff is satire because very little of it doesn’t actually reflect his own views.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Ffs. Why do misogynists have such little understanding of what satire means. Woody, here’s some help.

Satire is a technique employed by writers to expose and criticize foolishness and corruption of an individual or a society by using humor, irony, exaggeration or ridicule. It intends to improve humanity by criticizing its follies and foibles. A writer in a satire uses fictional characters, which stand for real people, to expose and condemn their corruption.

A writer may point a satire toward a person, a country or even the entire world. Usually, a satire is a comical piece of writing which makes fun of an individual or a society to expose its stupidity and shortcomings. In addition, he hopes that those he criticizes will improve their characters by overcoming their weaknesses.

http://literarydevices.net/satire/

Paul Elam is a misogynist. How can he be satirizing misogyny if he doesn’t believe it is a shortcoming or weakness? Unless the entirety of AVFM is a parody of misogynists, the “it’s satire” excuse doesn’t hold up at all.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
6 years ago

Satire! –> Shut up, Woody.

magicunicorn
6 years ago

Excellent points about satire, Tree Hugger.

There is a book “SCUM Manifesto” book, by Valerie Solanas, which argues that men have ruined the world and that women should overthrow society and eliminate the male sex.

Solanas denied that the work was “a put on” and insisted that her intent was “dead serious.”
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Solanas

Despite this, a lot of feminists have claimed that this book was a satire.

What’s the position of the people on this site, regarding that?

Does the “It’s satire” excuse hold up?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Learn to internet search, lazy unicorn. This subject has been discussed here before, and there’s really no reason for us to rehash it just because you can’t be bothered to look for those conversations.

(Also, trololol. If you think we can’t see what you’re trying to do you’re sadly mistaken.)

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

The MRAs are awfully obsessed with something that was written nearly fifty year ago. My parents were still in high school when that was published. What does it have to do with anything?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Well, you see, if a feminist wrote something horrible 50 years ago, that would mean that it’s OK for MRAs to write horrible things now. checkmate, feminazis!

It’s extra funny when they’re all disingenuous about it like our horned friend here.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
6 years ago

It’s either that, the defunct RadFemHub, or dastardly fire alarm pulling. They don’t have much material to work with.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

Sort of half-relevant here, a post linked by PZ Myers today (I think it’s today, timezones are not my friend):

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/06/13/a-definitive-ranking-of-the-weirdest-people-on-the-internet/

Bostonian
Bostonian
6 years ago

Well, as we know, quoting the actual words that misogynists say every day, many times a day, is misandry.
Because of Valerie Solanas and other women who are no longer alive.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Pallygirl,

Oh wow. The comment section.

From an intactivist named Lawrence Newman

I’m more an eye for an eye sort of guy. You take my sexual pleasure from me, I take your life. At least in my dreams. Just as well there are laws protecting the mutilator and not me, the victim, eh?

What. The. Fuck.

Woody
Woody
6 years ago

Valerie Solanas’ work was clearly not satire, as she actually tried to act out her violent manifesto. Paul has done no such thing.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

OK. One more turd from Lawrence and then I promise I’m done.

Here is what he was telling circumcised men

Your opinion is irrelevant. You are a victim with a dysfunctional, mutilated penis devoid of erogenous tissue. this isn’t up for debate.

Wow.

That’s why intactivists creep me out so much. They constantly make invasive remarks to other men about their penises and think they more about other people’s genitals than the owners of those genitals do.

Just no. Ick.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Not the point Woody. The point is you have to reach back decades to ‘prove’ feminists are so violent towards men that we have no place discussing violence against women.

Elam himself hasn’t to my knowledge killed anyone or tried to, but men kill women, beat women and rape women every day. Yet MRAs obsess about Valerie Solanas who has been dead for 25 years.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I’m more an eye for an eye sort of guy. You take my sexual pleasure from me, I take your life.

Isn’t that more of a life for an eye kind of thing? These guys can’t even do analogies properly.

The other bit is fairly typical of intactivists. Try telling them that your penis seems to work just fine for you and that you’re quite enjoying your sex life with it and they’ll just post more stuff like that. I’ve tried asking them if they shouldn’t maybe back off a bit on the whole shaming other men’s bodies and potentially making them feel bodily shame that they’re free from so far, but apparently it’s OK to make other men hate their bodies if it serves the cause.