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MRA icon Zed: Let little girls drown, because they’ll probably grow up to be terrible women

girlmonster
What kind of monster will she become?

“Zed,” also known as “The Zen Priest,” was one of the originators of the Men Going Their Own Way “philosophy” and is treated as a wise elder by many longtime MRAs.

WF Price of The Spearhead described a compilation of Zed’s writings as “really quite profound as well as a great read” and used to give it out as a bonus for everyone who signed up for his email newsletter. Paul Elam of A Voice for Men laid it on a bit thicker, saying of the man he described as both a mentor and a friend:

[H]is writings have taken him to iconic status in the minds of many men who have been at this for a while, this writer included. This has happened despite the fact that he has eschewed the path of self promotion and opted to speak from behind the persona of an archetype, maybe because of it.  Either way, he has wielded a sharp sword from his underworld den, and worn the uniform of a warrior in the battle for sanity between men and women … .

So what kind of fellow is this Zed?

Well, as I learned from a recent thread over on MGTOWforums.com, where he is officially an “elite member,” he’s the sort of person who thinks you should’t bother to save a four-year-old girl from drowning, because then she’ll grow up into a woman, and most of them are just terrible.

The regulars on the forums there were discussing the case of Michael Patterson, a Georgia man who was paralyzed after diving into a creek to rescue a four-year-old girl from drowning, and who has now died after several weeks in the hospital.

While a few suggested that Patterson was a hero, others made clear they wouldn’t have done the same thing themselves. 0kool put it like this:

i know i would never save an adult CUNT….and i know that as sure as i breathe air. however, i would be hard pressed to save a female child knowing what she might have the potential to do in the future. My hat’s off to the guy. Let’s hope his death isn’t in vain and the child doesn’t become a CUNT piece of shit!

Zed, that grand underground warrior for gender sanity, that icon of the Men’s Rights movement, argued the same thing in slightly more restrained prose. In one comment, he warned of the dire possibility that the seemingly innocent little girl you save could grow up to be

another Amanda Marcunt, or Jessica Valenti, or Betty Friedan? Do we think it is worth a man giving his own life to save the life of a woman who will spend it being totally destructive?

In another, he raised the specter of an even more hated figure, at least amongst MGTOWers and MRAs:

Given the evidence around me, it does appear far more likely that a girl will grow up to be another Sharon Osborne – who thinks it is “fantastic” when a woman cuts off the penis of her husband, or the audience of women who cheered that statement – than a woman who contributes much, even to her own family.

I really can’t think of any woman in the public light who the world would be much worse off without.

When a female is in trouble, if I don’t know her, I don’t see her.

This is the kind of timeless wisdom that makes you an icon in the Men’s Rights movement, I guess.

NOTE: Thanks to @taylerlp on Twitter for the tip.

EDITED TO ADD: When I wrote this post, there were 13 or so comments in the MGTOWforums thread; there are considerably more now, including a number from MGTOWers who say they WOULD try to save a little girl. But Zed only doubles down on his position.

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Darth Conans
Darth Conans
7 years ago

On the same logic, you shouldn’t save little boys, because you can’t be sure they won’t grow up to be Hitler/Stalin/Obama/Beck (Delete as applicable).

leftwingfox
7 years ago

Not even two years and an apology later can dull the pain of Sharon Osborne’s phantom knife across their genitals. Surely, this makes joking about letting women and children drown PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE. This does not make them look terrible people at all. 🙁

Side-note: A few years ago, we were tubing down a local river, and stopped by a sandbank for BBQ. I spot an ownerless tube starting to float away, so I ran after and grabbed it, much to the appreciation of the young woman who lost it. I was still feeling like a big damn hero, when not 5 minutes later, one of the other guys I was with spotted something thrashing in the bushes; a young girl had fallen out of her tube, and was snagged in the bushes by her safety jacket.

Now, I like to think that most men, if they had a choice between saving an inner tube for an attractive young woman, and saving a child, would choose the latter every time. These “men” would lift a finger for neither, laughing at the woman for losing the tube, blaming the mother for losing the child, and telling themselves it’s the _women_ who are terrible.

WalkingStickBug
WalkingStickBug
7 years ago

I am truly sorry for the family of Michael Patterson who lost someone they loved.

I’m pretty sure he would want nothing to do with these hateful individuals based on his actions and I am horrified at this discussion. I didn’t think they could get any more foul, but I am again proven wrong by their vile rhetoric.

Ally S
7 years ago

I really wish these people were just cartoon villains. But they’re not, and I have to deal with that fact.

eseldbosustow
7 years ago

You said it, leftwingfox.

cloudiah
7 years ago

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you the most important human rights movement of the 21st century! [throws up in mouth a little]

eseldbosustow
7 years ago

It’s kind of funny that the Okool guy capitalizes cunt. I hear that’s a sign of veneration in religious literature, like Christians capitalizing LORD in English Bible translations. Maybe something of a “Freudian capitalization”, if you will.

SittieKitty
7 years ago

eh, I can’t bring myself to be “shocked” anymore that the MGTOWs use death of other men as a sensationalized jumping board to talk about their own platforms. They don’t see death as a tragic event, but rather an excuse to start throwing out their shitty opinions without having someone call them out on it.

And I’m with you WalkingStickBug. It’s very sad that the man died after doing something so wonderful. I feel heartily for all his loved ones.

anadiomene122
anadiomene122
7 years ago

Ally, what’s scary to me is how these attitudes seem to be pretty prevalent in the college age crowd… I wanna blame the internet but I think ultimately a broad cultural backlash to the gains women and minorities have made is to blame.

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
7 years ago

This zen master went to the river for enlightenment and only found rage, resentment, and despair. What we see in nature is a reflection of ourselves.

Ely
Ely
7 years ago

Wow. I can’t even…what horrendously awful people. Reading that made my poor hungover stomach do some unpleasant things.

I think I might have to go offline, hug my daughters tightly, and then give my wonderful husband a big kiss.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

What. An. Asshole.

You know damn well if a woman said that no one should bother saving little boys because you never know what they’ll turn into, these shitheads would apoplectic with rage.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

^be apoplectic.

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
7 years ago

@Anadiomene A lot of these are the frustration of young men who are seeking love and fulfillment and finding it difficult. School was far more gender policed to me than work or social life. Then again, I have far more control over who I interact with now.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

leftwingfox: Tubing? Are you in TX as well?

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
7 years ago

And Dogen said “let the evil little bitches drown before they get the chance to divorce rape anyone”.

(Actually, no, he did not say that, and if reincarnation is real then Zed is coming back as a maggot in his next life.)

SittieKitty
7 years ago

A lot of these are the frustration entitlement of young men.

FTFY.

rutile
rutile
7 years ago

What a pathetic lot.

Amanda Marcotte (@AmandaMarcotte)

I have to object, on the grounds of humor. They called me “Martwat” in high school, which is exponentially funnier than “Marcunt”, because at least “Martwat” kind of rhymes.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

Amanda: I was going to say that “Marcunt” is pretty low on the originality scale. Then again, these jackholes are almost too stupid to breathe on their own, so I’m not expecting much.

Karalora
Karalora
7 years ago

So Going Their Own Way isn’t enough anymore? They have to arrange a passive gendercide against women?

I’d be interested in hearing the response from non-MGTOW MRAs, particularly those who feel there isn’t enough “quality pussy” to go around. How would they feel about the MGTOW wishing to restrict the supply yet further?

Xen
Xen
7 years ago

And yet…these men supposedly don’t support abortion.

Marie
Marie
7 years ago

Well, as I learned from a recent thread over on MGTOWforums.com, where he is officially an “elite member,” he’s the sort of person who thinks you should’t bother to save a four-year-old girl from drowning, because then she’ll grow up into a woman, and most of them are just terrible.

Gah. What a shitstain.

@eseldbosustow

It’s kind of funny that the Okool guy capitalizes cunt. I hear that’s a sign of veneration in religious literature, like Christians capitalizing LORD in English Bible translations.

I lol’ed to hard. XD

Bee
Bee
7 years ago

It’s kind of funny that the Okool guy capitalizes cunt. I hear that’s a sign of veneration in religious literature, like Christians capitalizing LORD in English Bible translations. Maybe something of a “Freudian capitalization”, if you will.

Nah, it just means that 0kool and cunt have a binding contract now.

rabbitwink
rabbitwink
7 years ago

Oh, right- because if it’s written in all-caps it means it’s a corporation. Wasn’t that the “logic”?

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
7 years ago

Maybe that’s it. Vaginas simply need to be incorporated, then Republicans would see them as people.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

According to MRA (or was it PUA, I forget) logic, the vagina needs communization.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
7 years ago

Which troll was it who kept nattering on about that? I know it was one of the ones who thinks that anime is the best source of advice on how society should work.

leftwingfox
7 years ago

hellkell: Nope, Canada.

That incident was out in New Brunswick, where tubing was run by a local family, who also ran a cheap grill on that sandbar half-way down the river. You could get mini-tubes for a cooler if requested, alcohol allowed as long as it was in plastic bottles or cans: no glass containers.

Here in Ontario, the closest tubing resort is a little more expensive, and requires a deposit for the tube, and mandatory helmets and lifejackets. No alcohol since it’s in a government park. That’s for the entire day though, so you can do multiple runs for one price.

I hear that’s a sign of veneration in religious literature, like Christians capitalizing LORD in English Bible translations.

Oh dammit, now I have a mental image of Sam Jackson delivering Ezekiel 25:17 with that substitution.

tedthefed
tedthefed
7 years ago

@Darth: Hey, what’s wrong with Beck?? Beck’s awesome! I would totally save little child Beck. He’d probably do some kiddie breakdancing to thank me.

Lady Mondegreen
7 years ago

Surely, this makes joking about letting women and children drown PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE.

What makes you think they’re joking?

leftwingfox
7 years ago

What makes you think they’re joking?

Hope.

Argenti Aertheri
7 years ago

“Which troll was it who kept nattering on about that? I know it was one of the ones who thinks that anime is the best source of advice on how society should work.”

That was abnoy. Who, btw, either isn’t in Thailand or didn’t take the survey.

Gods, I’m too tired to make coffee. I may have to resort to instant (my usual fresh ground French press brew, which means work, or instant, decision to be made upon determining if anyone did dishes and whether that including the press).

Re: college age — the majority of us are 25-29 (sorry to make the rest of you feel old!)

respectsexwork
7 years ago

Reblogged this on respectsexwork.

The Spider from Mars
The Spider from Mars
7 years ago

These men are amoral scumbags. Men have a duty to protect women.

cloudiah
7 years ago

It’s okay, Argenti, I knew I was one of the graybeards around here. 😉

velveteenrabid
7 years ago

The scary thing about this type of mouthbreather is they’re not passive.

I worked new high rise construction for 15yrs. I know a woman that was deliberately electrocuted. Another who was riding a golf cart and was intentionally crashed and tipped, nearly killing her. I was threatened with rape on a regular basis.

When you start invading what these guys think is sacred space, they get downright dangerous.

I would LOVE to see more women in the trades, but it isn’t for the feint of heart. You literally put your life at risk, and not just because trades are dangerous to begin with.

Yep, dudes like this won’t merely walk by, they actively cheer, and in some cases, caused the girl/woman to fall.

auggziliary
auggziliary
7 years ago

I feel like the only way these men would save a little girl is if they thought it entitled them to sex and love(and by love I mean being pretty much a servant, since they hate any woman who isn’t like that).

rabbitwink
rabbitwink
7 years ago

I just stumbled on a disturbing story I’m sure the MRA’s would champion as a great example of justice for fathers. And as in this current thread, I’m sure their attitude would be “who cares what happens to the 6y/o girl?”
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/society/convicted-sex-offender-nicholas-elizondo-gets-sole-custody-his-6-year-old-daughter

auggziliary
7 years ago

My picture changed… Hmm

theladyzombie
theladyzombie
7 years ago

Yes. Let young girls drown because they might grow up to be the kind of woman a MGTOW hates, which as we all know is pretty much every woman alive.

No. They’re not a hate movement at all.

auggziliary
7 years ago

Wait, got it. Nvm. Sorry for spam.

Anyways, rabbitwink, Jesus Christ that’s horrible. Knowing the MRM, they probably would have that reaction. Even if its not “who cares”, its still probably going to be the same old “of course this is bad, but I think you people are over reacting, she’s only 6 so she won’t remember. You guys need to stop shaming male sexuality.”

auggziliary
7 years ago

Also, I wonder what feMRAs think of this, that they’d be better off dead since they have the potential to be evil wimmin.

auggziliary
7 years ago

Watching feMRAs trying to cover up stuff like this almost makes me feel bad for them.

Historophilia
Historophilia
7 years ago

No, Spider from Mars, men don’t have a duty to protect women. People have a duty to treat other people decently. Can we not with the patriarchal bullshit. Attitudes like that frame women as fragile and without agency, as prizes to be fought over and guarded by men.

bodycrimes
7 years ago

I wonder why women would want to divorce men like this and take their children away? It’s very perplexing.

leftwingfox
7 years ago

These men are amoral scumbags. Men have a duty to protect women.

Heck, I’d even leave gender out of it completely: people have a duty to protect each other.

blauregen
blauregen
7 years ago

Every movement has it’s clowns.

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