Heartiste: Men need to be able to hit their mates in order to “retain” them
A better way to retain your mate: Be a sharp-dressed man.
You may know Heartiste as a reactionary, misogynistic, proudly racist dispenser of manipulative, sometimes abusive dating advice to would-be “alpha males.”
Did you also know that he was an open advocate of domestic violence against women?
Well, I didn’t, until a friend pointed out a strange little exchange on his Twitter account the other day.
Last Tuesday morning, apropos of nothing in particular, Heartiste made the following pronouncement:
When someone asked what sort of threats he meant, he elaborated:
The latter three items on the list (“Abandonment. Shame. Ostracism”) are standard techniques in Heartiste’s dating strategy, but the open advocacy of violence is, I think, new.
In addition to being repugnant, Heartiste’s argument here doesn’t even particularly make sense. Essentially, he seems to be saying that men need to be able to hit women to keep them in line so that they won’t have to … hit women to keep them in line.
Also, the phrase “mate retention strategy,” apparently popular with Evo Psych types, gives me the creeps. I’m pretty sure the best “mate retention strategy” is to be the sort of person your “mate” wants to be in a relationship with.
I did a quick search for the phrase, and found numerous references to two academic studies. One suggested that some women fake orgasms as a “mate retention strategy.” Another possibly more revealing one claimed that men of “low mate value” often insult their mates to lower their self-esteem so they won’t feel confident enough to leave. That seems more or less in line with what Heartiste’s general approach. And certainly, by any reasonable definition of the term, Heartiste and his followers are some pretty “low value” people, both as “mates” and as decent human beings generally.
I also found this reference to research by Evo Psych big daddy David Buss suggesting that violence — surprise! — isn’t actually a particularly effective “mate retention strategy.”
Also, beating up your mate is, you know, just generally a pretty shitty thing to do.
If Heartiste takes his tweets down, I’ve got screenshots.
EDITED TO ADD: Heartiste has really been going wild with the Twitter lately.
Here he claims to have invented the term “hivemind.”
After I pointed out that this belief was delusional, he suggested that I kill myself. Very alpha!
He’s also been on a bit of a racist rampage, posting lots of stuff like this:
See also here, here, here, here, and here.
Phrasing your racism in pseudoscientific terms doesn’t make it right, dude. It just makes you a pretentious racist.
Posted on June 24, 2013, in advocacy of violence, alpha males, creepy, domestic violence, douchebaggery, evo psych fairy tales, grandiosity, heartiste, men who should not ever be with women ever, misogyny, PUA, racism and tagged domestic violence, heartiste, misogyny, pick-up artists, pickup artists, PUA. Bookmark the permalink. 801 Comments.
@lowquacks – that’s Maddie. I’m sure she agrees about being pwiddy! :)
I don’t know what chibi is, but OMG clean lines! That’s something I never managed.
dancers
Kitteh, that’s a lot more like what I usually draw. I’ve been trying to ink stuff lately so I’ve been working hard on trying to make the lines cleaner, especially since I want to eventually do really detailed ink work.
I’m even more impressed, then! You’ve got really clean lines there. Have you any of your usual work that you’d like to show?
Yea, let me find my other sketchbook.
You folks have some fine skills. I’d draw more if I had more inspiration, but I think I’ve run dry or something. >_> I haven’t drawn anything seriously (as in, anything that isn’t doodling or other mundane stuff) since the age of 14.
It gets like that, doesn’t it? I can go for years without drawing, or writing, or sewing – I very rarely do all at the same time, and since my first scanner died years ago and I couldn’t scan drawings, I got into the photo composites by default. The pics are so much more satisfying than my drawings ever were. Right now my writing’s getting verrrry dried up, but I’m knitting.
Here Kitteh. Uh, link is a bit NSFW… and fair warning, I draw mostly depressing things. This one is called starvation of the soul, so yea…
I write a lot. I’ve written prolly 20,000+ pages in the last decade. It’s pretty much my go-to creative outlet. Drawing is next when I can’t think of anything that isn’t going to be horrible to write. I also make felt dolls, when I’m not interested in drawing or writing. Those are fun.
That’s a great picture, SittieKitty – it makes me think of how someone with anorexia might see themselves, alongside what their body’s become, as well as the soul-starvation idea (which it conveys very well).
I did a whole book years back, but painted myself into a plot corner in the second half and never got out, lol. It wouldn’t have been publishable – not cohesive, very episodic, and since the whole point of it was to create an alternative history with a happy ending, there wasn’t going to be anything like a huge drama between the principals (lovers, one real, one imaginary).
More recently I started memoirs with Louis and got bogged there, too – disinclined to write about my very boring earthly past, and no idea about writing for themes or suchlike. Disinclined to any writing that seems like work, too.
I’m seeing a pattern here … :P
:) I liked the idea that you can decide which side to see, which person is being presented and how much you lose when you start to suppress yourself… Think I’m going to finish it up and post it to DeviantArt (What else is there to do this early in the morning but finally make an account!)
I’ve got over 30 stories (I think they average 200ish pages, with about 2 dozen other shorter 10-25 page ones) and I think that maybe 4-5 of them are “completed” in some sort of fashion – and not completed in a cohesive manner enough that it would be publishable. I’ve gotten stuck on one of them, for the same reason – contemporary life is hard to make interesting! It’s been a source of frustration for me. I finally figured out what to do for another one, but it’s this one story I keep circling back to that I simply can’t get working for me…
What time is it in your neck of the woods, SittieKitty? It’s 8pm here.
6am. I’ve been up all night. Not really that uncommon for me, but frustrating since I’m not really tired, just kinda …blank. Hard to make my brain work on the art. Although I do think I’m getting a better face down, so that’s a plus. On the other hand, I keep getting distracted by the idea of my cream coloured walls upstairs, I really want to paint all over them.
For what it’s worth, I do agree that the episode of The IT Crowd we’re talking about *tried* to make the joke more on Douglas than anything, but I think they failed a lot of the time. To me, the “manly” hobbies came across as them joking that she wasn’t really a woman, although I’m not sure that was what they intended. And the fight at the end was just way sketchy because of how much violence trans* people really do face. IIRC she does sort of start it by slapping him, but then he hauls off and punches her. I think the fight was also trying to be a joke on Douglas and what a terrible person he is, but a)I wasn’t sure that they’d show him fighting a cis woman like that; and b)I wasn’t sure that most viewers would see it as a joke on Douglas rather than a joke about beating up someone who is “really” a man (in their eyes).
The only part of that story that actually worked in my opinion was the bit where you’re all surprised because she comes out to Douglas and he’s cool with it, and then you find out later that actually he’s just as stupid and terrible as ever because it’s pretty clear there that his reaction to finding out that she’s trans* is ridiculous. I did actually laugh at that, but then it veered right back into problem territory.
It’s been a few years since I’ve seen it but I still remember it clearly (I think, anyway), and until we started talking about it and I started thinking more about it, all I could remember was the fail.
I think Heartiste means “[threats of] violence, abandonment, shame, ostracism” are the mate retention strategy. If he meant -actual- violence & abandonment then the comment doesn’t make much sense. Abandoning someone is exactly the opposite of training them; if you’re truly abandoning it cannot be part of a training exercise or that is not abandonment, just threatening or pretending at it.
… But who knows. It’s not like the rest of his shit makes any more sense to me. Twitter is shit for expressing ideas for reasons like this. Hope people are aware how shitty they sound in 20 words or less.
AK, yeah, that was a good analysis.
@Faint Praise
But the whole point is that the threat be credible. When I threaten to turn my cat into a hat and catburgers, she can safely ignore me, because she knows I would never do that. (Hypothesis 2: she doesn’t understand English.)
And in order to make a threat credible you have to do what you threaten once in a while. Abusers are very capable of temporary abandonment and only hitting “a little”. Until they aren’t, natch.
Wait, we went on a journey through space and time AND DIDN’T INVITE ME?
*pouts*
Love the Mighty Boosh.
And the IT Crowd.
The episode with the trans* woman is horrible, but the piece that makes the episode almost trangressive in a good way is when you realize that Douglas and this woman are really, truly happy together. And he throws it away out of bigotry and narrowmindedness, and you can see that he’s never, ever, going to find another woman who makes him as happy as this.
That part puts the laugh squarely on his own horrible, horrible head.
But then they surround it with completely not-funny lazy jokes that are just the same bigotry they were making fun of a second ago.
Ugh.
One of the best IT crowd eps is the one where Jen pretends that she can speak Italian. *S*
My personal favorite is the trivia show/Matrix mashup. :D
I can draw, tolerably. I can barely write.
Most of my creative energies these days go into making RPG adventures, and even then I like to use official campaign settings because all the heavy lifting’s been done.
I guess my problem is, I’m lazy. (Right now I’m also responsible for two little adorable, absolutely helpless babies.)
@LBT: Who’s this Orion jerk? I’m sorry he’s being a jerk to you. I loved “The Ship of Dreams”!
Good point on the overall story arc, Howard. I think that’s part of why I dislike that episode so much, is it came really close to dealing with trans* issues in a really great way, but then had to go and muck it up so badly.
As for my favorite episode, I’m casting my vote in with the Jen speaking Italian episode too. Really, there were so many great episodes…now I’m thinking I may have to rewatch the series. ;)
::sees title::
::desires brain bleach::
@AbominableSnowPickle
Welcome :D Love your name XD
@melody
Yay :) Glad to here things are going good-ish for you.
@LBT
Quick everyone, MAAAAKKKKEEE MOOOORRRRREEEE BBBAABBBIIEEESSSS!!!!!!!!!!!ELEVEN!!!
/sorry coffee just hit me.
@Argenti Aertheri
Sorry to hear things are rough for your fishies :(
@AdominableSnowPickle
:D I have little mouth/brain filter too! ::offers high five:: Though moreso in meat space then online.
Zomg, you montesr!!!11 YOu’re stealing their manliness!
And posting this now cuz my computer scared me, making me think it’d freeze!
(…No! No my freeze peaches!)
@Bob Dole
NOOOOOOOOOOOOO BLOCKQUOTE MONSTER
Re: artistry
I am one of those pencil people who cannot do clean lines for crap. I like sketch my own picture, glance over at my sister’s paper and I’m like “BUT IT LOOKS DONE HOW DO YOU DO THAT”. So I use the tablet to clean up (and color!) everything.
And, I’m finally caught up on the thread.
@Opium4themasses
OUch XD when my sister told me about the Roissy/Envy comparison I was appalled (I actually like Envy, as a character, though he’s totally evil) but I can’t argue with this XD
@fade
Me? Utilize the earaser :P Though I think you’re too hard on your sketchies. And don’t ask me more, cuz my style tends to err on the ‘pretend it’s stylistically messy’ side.
That’s my style usually too. I always want to be clean and look polished …but it rarely works out that way unless I’m doing cartooning of some sort.
From the twitter sidebar thingie right there:
Shit, these guys. What a never-ending whirlpool of shitty things they say.
@SittieKItty
Pretend it’s stylistically messy buddies? (I wasn’t trying to say you were asking me, in case it wasn’t clear, I was snarking cuz fade brought me up and mentioned my ‘neat’ lines when they really…aren’t XD)
Haha, yes. I can always use more art buddies!
@SittieKitty
Sweet! Art buddies :D
*whistle*
See, the great thing about inking is that your lines no longer have to be neat. The pencils can be a total mess and then you ink it and just erase them all. (I’m a terribly careless lefty, so the left side of my sketches always turns into a smear.)
Ditto katz! I do like that about inking. I’m still getting used to it, the whole drawing black and then having to do highlights since the black is all monochrome is something for me to get used to, since I’m just so used to being able to vary pencil shades.
(And yea, I’m a prolific writer ;^.^)
Yet another artist here that’s managed to not draw for a while. *sigh*
Well, I’ve still got all my old supplies, and my grandparents let me have an old drafting table (which is in amazing shape for being over 50 years old).
@Marie and Fade
Stylistic messy peeps unite! Although in my case, I can make it work with oil paints. Never got into painting until college when they introduced us to oil (YU DRY SO FAST, ACRYLIC?!) but then I loved it.
@Amnesia
STylistically messy peeps! :D I draw about as much as I want to, but have been writing longer (since I was 12) and have a hell of time doing that consistently now :( For some reason my depression makes me draw more and write less :/
I’m more likely to do good art, like giant paintings, when I’m hypomanic, than when I’m depressed. When I’m depressed I read things I’ve written, and generally feel too apathetic to write anything. When I’m swinging up or down though, I’m a writer. I can’t help it. It’s like a compulsion… and I feel awful when I’m unable to do it because I’m lacking in motivation or ideas. Lacking in ideas = so frustrating…
@SittieKitty
When I’m depressed I feel worse about my work (too? Sorry it was hard to tell). I just draw to blow off steam, so that’s when I do it the most. :/
@SittieKitty I tend to write on the upswings (and during my manic phases), when I am full of ideas and racing to get them out and don’t much care how they sound. I edit on my downswings when I have a tendency to hypersensitivity and will pay more attention to the words and details.
When I’m under the cloud itself, I sit at my laptop eating crackers and reading comment sections and reddit threads.
I’ve been lacking in motivation many, many times. Ideas, I have plenty. I can sign anyone up and for a small fee, I’ll send you ideas on a regular basis (weekly? daily? hourly?). Some of them will be hairbrained and half-baked, some will be grandiose and impossible, but I’ve got a billion of them!
By the way, sorry I goofed up my link earlier. I linked to yahoo rather than the HuffPo. I tried twice to give the right link, but both of the comments disappeared. So if anyone wants to read the little MGTOW thing, just google Huffington Post 8 reasons straight men do not want to get married.
Agh, I messed up again. This is the wrong thread, so I’ll go put that in the correct thread.
Gillian, I use the mania to paint. I have cream walls and they are slowly getting re-coloured with (mostly half-finished) paintings. I don’t usually have a lack of motivation to write, the compulsion is too strong. When I edit I usually can tell how happy I was when writing by how much I emotionally torture my characters – darker story = more depressed. If ya ever want to send me ideas I wouldn’t let them go to waste!
Marie, yea, I’m a lot more critical about my work when I’m depressed. It’s hard not to look at all the mistakes and get annoyed by it. I try not to stress over it and put my supplies away instead of continuing to focus on it.
RE: Falconer
I’m glad you liked it!
RE: SittieKitty
Your prompts have been uploaded! Thanks for the participation. Hopefully I can get a hold of you at some point and set up what you’d like for your bonus sketch.
RE: trans women episode
Man, my whole reaction is just “NOPE NOPE NOPE.” I’ve reached the point that any time I see a cis person say, “it does a GREAT representation of trans issues… almost,” I just flee screaming into the sunset, because I know it will INFURIATE me. (I got snookered into reading most of ‘Almost Perfect’ because of a rec like that–sons of bitches.)
If I want good trans representation, I read stuff like this. (Though I haven’t read the last in a while, and apparently there was a clusterfuck? So be aware.)
Oooh, super exciting! I’mma read them after my dinner. Thanks LBT!
@Nepenthe:
“(Hypothesis 2: she doesn’t understand English.) ”
Nah, cats understand exactly as much English as they need to. They’re also very good at 1) getting humans to understand Cat and 2) giving humans a hard time for not understanding Cat.
Cats, turning human brains to mush since Ancient Egypt.
@Marie – “my style tends to err on the ‘pretend it’s stylistically messy’ side.”
Can I join that club too? :)
More the merrier kitteh!
Yay!
Although, on the clean lines side of things…
That’s a cute one. Those look like digital lines; do you use a tablet?
That is clean!
No, that’s hand drawn, just my scanner makes it look like that.
closest I got to clean lines
In that case, those are *very* clean lines.
Kitteh, it’s fun seeing your drawings since I’ve really only seen your photoshops.
That looks great Kitteh! So much detail…
Thank you both! :)
Right, I’m off – catch anyone who’s awake later!
Sleep well! I hope dearly I am not here when you get back or I’ll need someone to force me to go to bed.
You’re all so talented, I am jealous. Just for the record, I am a very talented painter* but unfortunately my work doesn’t scan well.
* You should probably insert a “not” in there somewhere.
Painting generally doesn’t scan well. You could take photos though, I’d love to see it!
(I love how we turned this thread into the Art thread)
I can’t get up. I have a cat on my lap. No wait, now she’s kneading my shoulder — oh wait, she’s on my lap again. Wherever she is, she’s purring and the laws of the universe say that though shalt not disturb a purring cat.
I know that to be the truth. I would never want to risk arising the ire of the Furrinati by advocating the movement of content kitties.
“Though” should be “thou” of course, but the sleeping cat makes typing & spell-checking difficult.
I’m digging these real kitty avatars, cloudiah and Kitteh =D
Turns out that Heartiste says horrible/ridiculous shit on his Twitter pretty regularly. I added some more examples to the post.
Hey David, can you edit the survey post to say it closes tomorrow? Midnight EST works for me, but anything before that works, give at least 12 hours notice though? For people in various time zones and schedules.
Thanks!
Thanks, Ally! :)
Heh, I hope you’re not up, SittieKitty, given it’s mega-late across the pond. (6pm here, I got home a little while ago but I’ve been reading about Mick Aston’s passing.)
Heh, excellent segue. ^_^ Weirdly, in that episode I was all of sad when they split up because they were so cute. But otherwise yup, that episode was awful.
Well the part about The Internet was freaking epic. But the trans part… nopenopenope. Don’t even go there, people.
I am eternally amused by Moss because I think of him first and foremost as Saboo, which is pretty much the opposite character to Moss. “You know nothing of the crunch!” I love it when Moss and Roy practice Moss responding to the hecklers. “Nice hair, innit!” Hehehe. Stopping now…
I am no good at drawing, but I can paint. Walls, ceilings, dropcloths, pants. I can cover them all.
What I can do is photograph.
Saboo!!