Antifeminist crusader Erin Pizzey bravely tells Redditors that “never in the history of the world have men been so unprivileged, if you think about it.”
How Erin Pizzey imagines most feminists live, apparently
Longtime antifeminist crusader Erin Pizzey recently did an “Ask Me Anything” session on Reddit. Here are some highlights — by which I mean lowlights — from her answers.
Ms. Pizzey wants to ban feminism as a hate movement:
Personally, I would like to see the feminist movement described as a hate movement, so that we can then ban them from the government, from university faculties, from anywhere where they can destroy the minds of young women and men.
It’s just a teensy bit ironic, I would say, that she characterizes feminism as a hate movement at the very same time that A Voice for Men, a site she has very publicly aligned herself with, is leading a hate campaign against an individual feminist activist. (More on this to come tomorrow.) Indeed, Pizzey herself adds to the vilification of the activist here.
And speaking of A Voice for Men, she apparently agrees with AVFM’s Paul Elam that feminists are only interested in the issue of rape because they have rape fantasies and are angry that they’re not getting enough attention from men:
If you’re referring to Paul’s statement that many or most women fantasize about being taken, I’m sorry but that’s the truth. That doesn’t mean they want to be raped, but it’s a fantasy I think almost all women have. And I think he went on to say that feminists like Andrea Dworkin who were and are so obsessed with rape are really projecting their own unconscious sexual frustration because men don’t give them enough attention. Andrea was a very sad lonely woman like this–I didn’t know her but I knew of her, and I knew Susan Browmiller and you can just read her stuff to see it there.
Yeah, I’m thinking that Dworkin’s “obsession” with rape might have had less to do with her wanting “attention” from men than it did with the fact that she had been raped.
In response to a question about using Title IX to increase the number of women in science, technology, engineering, and math (STEM), Pizzey argues that most women’s brains aren’t equipped to handle all that sciencey stuff, and that most women would rather be raising children:
what will happen is that a few women will come out of that world in those areas that suit men’s brains better than women’s, and do well, but most of them won’t, and they’ll just leave and go on to other professions or to have children or family. That’s what’s been happening all the time when they’ve had quotas.
But what about the men who get excluded because of that? That’s the tragedy isn’t it, and the waste of money. Harriet Harman has proposed quotas for women in parliament, quotas for women in all the high-status fields, and women have flocked in but do not want the gruelling hours that men are willing to put into their professions because most of them–MOST of them–want to be spending time with their children at home, and that God for that.
Pizzey believes that most feminists are “mental patents” who deserve only condescension:
Personally, I don’t get into arguments with mental patients, which is what most feminist women are. Look at them with pity and compassion if you can, speak the truth as you know it.
But if you want a real reaction, pat her on the head and tell her not to worry her pretty little head about it. That’s what I do! I think men have to start using their sense of humor as a weapon. You must get past any sense of anger when you do such things though!
She believes most prominent second-wave feminists were feminists mainly because they hated their dads:
One of the early mantras of the feminist movement was to make the personal political. Therefore, those women who had bitter and violent experiences of the first male their lives (e.g. their father) then branded all men as violent and dangerous. They are also what I call the walking wounded. As far as I’m concerned the prominent feminists of the day virtually all had appalling relationships with their fathers. So if feminism grew out of a justified sense of grievance, and created a platform where they did not attempt to heal their own damage, but to project onto all men… so yes it’s very cultlike that way. But it’s any cult group that works that way, they all have either a figure they adore or a hate object that keeps them together. And their hate is against men, even when they deny it.
Yes, that’s right, she says all this and somehow does not notice the hatred of women amongst the MRAs she’s aligned herself with.
While she dismisses feminists with “daddy issues” she urges those who have been abused by their parents to forget the abuse they’ve endured, forgive their abusers and “move on.”
[T]each yourself that the past is truly the past, it is done and you cannot change it, all it is is a loop in your brain that needs to be closed down so that you can move forward. Because those patterns are deep within you, it takes a lot of hard work, but in the end you FORGIVE YOURSELF and you FORGIVE YOUR PARENTS and move on.
Meanwhile, she thinks that it makes sense for men who don’t like feminism to “head for the hills” and Go Their Own Way.
It was many years ago I was talking to a very eligible bachelor, who was a lawyer, and asked him about American feminists. He laughed and he said “what they never banked on was that men would get together and take to the hills.” This is where that expression comes from. He and his male friends would get together and have a wonderful time, they did not make permanent relationships with women, because they realized they would have too much to lose: their homes, their children, and their money. I always remember this. When 40 year old feminists complain that they can’t find any men to commit themselves, why is it men’s fault? I can’t blame men who feel this way in today’s legal environment. If the so-called women’s movement, the feminists, want men, they have to care equally about men’s desires and men’s need for protection.
This sort of makes sense, given that Pizzey seems to live in an imaginary world in which women, not men, are the truly privileged.
The actual irony of this situation is there is nothing more privileged than white middle class women, who are most of feminists. Very very privileged, because they know when they are born that either the state or a man will take care of them if they do not choose their own career. Men on the other hand are born underprivileged, particularly now, even as small boys they are demonized and discriminated against. …
I cannot see how sane sensible educated intelligent woman can consider that men are privileged. It has always been rich and middle class women who have been protected, and they are the truly privileged.
Indeed, she’s managed to convince herself that “never in the history of the world have men been so unprivileged, if you think about it.”
Naturally, all of her comments were happily upvoted by the Reddit masses, and her “Ask Me Anything” post itself got more than 1200 upvotes. Evidently pandering to Reddit’s collective fantasies about the oppression of men pays off big in the upvote department.
Posted on April 14, 2013, in a voice for men, antifeminism, evil women, harassment, hate, hundreds of upvotes, imaginary backwards land, imaginary oppression, ladies against women, MGTOW, misogyny, MRA, only men pay taxes apparently, oppressed men, patronizing as heck, paul elam, playing the victim, rape, rape culture, reddit, straw feminists and tagged antfeminism, erin pizzey, reddit. Bookmark the permalink. 547 Comments.
Gack.
I’m sure this advice helps 99% of all abuse victims. Not.
Also, I find it amusing (and horrific) that she claims to be an advocate for abuse victims yet 1) completely lacks empathy (as shown in that quote) with abuse victims 2) accuses abused women of liking abuse in abusive relationships and 3) is extremely ableist. I’m glad she’s not a feminist ally.
Did anyone else read this and think of Serena Joy?
Also, her asking abuse victims to forgive their abusers is one of the most disgusting things I’ve read this weak.
Well, she managed to be both boring and pretty offensive at the same time :/
Nice ableism to go along with your misogyny
I’m trying to think of a scathing comeback if a guy ever used this on me…
I could swear I just mentioned this earlier today, how people with misogynistic views are often like oh, well all women who say they don’t believe x (normally pertaining to childbearing/mommy instincts, being obsessed w/ men, w/e) are just lying
It’s like,if you walk around like that you’re never going to see anything because of your massive confirmation bias.
AKA now, in some ways, men are losing (part of) their male privilege and that’s awwwwfuuul
I said it in the other thread–she’s an asshole and a sellout. Have fun with Paul, Erin. When you get kicked out of the clubhouse, don’t come running to us.
I hate it when stuff like this happens because its just another take in the heart of legitimate conversation about a legitimate school of thought. Nope, instead we get people saying “Hah, feminism? Thats just made up stuff. The reality is that everybody is a crappy human being (especially women) and that men are just really misunderstood and are incapable of doing wrong by default since reasons.”
@fade
Sadly, I couldn’t think of anything that wasn’t violent. :/ My best guess would just be to laugh in their face and tell them to fuck off.
Is she conflating having any sexual fantasy as a woman with wanting to be “taken”? By golly, I think she is.
Stupid lady libidos making the feminist movement illogical. Luckily, we’ve got the men’s rights movement to set us straight. None of their points are ever influenced by sexual frustration. Not even once. And that’s real.
The thing is, it’s true that most men (like most women) are suffering, because of poverty, disease, environmental disasters/climate change. Not like “never in the history of the world,” but the suffering is real and it’s terrible. It’s just that the MRM has no plans to reduce any of that suffering; they just want to increase suffering for women. At the end of the day, as long as more women die in shipwrecks, they’ll call it a victory.
Human rights movement, my ass.
Wow, the fact that the feminists she used to work with didn’t indulge her narcissism still really bothers her, huh?
NOOOO my whole comment was deleted.
I love genderswap though.
“As far as I’m concerned the prominent masculists of the day virtually all had appalling relationships with their mothers. So if masculism grew out of a justified sense of grievance, and created a platform where they did not attempt to heal their own damage, but to project onto all women… so yes it’s very cultlike that way. But it’s any cult group that works that way, they all have either a figure they adore or a hate object that keeps them together. And their hate is against women, even when they deny it.”
I read the AVFM article and was really impressed with the description “sheer tits in your face gumption.” I want that. I need to present that way. All the time.
And the quasi-archaic pseudoscientific gobbledygook writing style is still confusing me most of all. I get that it obfuscates the utter nonsense (if you’re dimwitted enough) but just…what is that all about? I’m just glad it helps alert me to potential MRA-material.
I’ve always liked “It’s cute that you think I’m listening to you” as a comeback. (The comment is not original to me but I can’t remember where I first heard it.)
@ Hippodameia
I kind of like that comeback.
Quick! Everyone, supply me with your comebacks so that when the day comes I shall be ARRRRMMMED
*MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA* /evil laugh
Translation: Be a condescending, misogynistic dipshit if you want change.
Hippo, she IS Serena Joy. Actually, I can’t believe she’s a real person.
Will feminism be thought of as a hate movement? Naw. She’s too stupid to forecast the future. I hope she sleeps better at night, knowing that a bunch of sexists support her incomprehensible ideas. If she were on a panel of experts who actually study the things she prattles on about, she’d just look like a complete hater and totally out of touch.
Once again, they use Dworkin as ammo. *headslap*
Whenever I can’t think of a snappy comeback, which is often, I just stare at the person totally deadpan. It seems to unnerve people. :D
Shiraz: right? She can’t even name a current feminist. Not only is she laughably out of touch, but like Cassandra said, she’s still really fucking bitter that the second wave feminists didn’t indulge her.
LOL
Bravo, bravo.
Thing is, Shiraz, I think that’s part of her issue. Her work with the battered women’s shelter movement brought her into contact with lots of feminists, and Pizzey is…well, she’s not too bright, and doesn’t come across as very well read or well educated. Since she’s also a narcissist with a personality like a scouring pad, that plus the “wow you’re an idiot” response she tends to provoke in more serious people seems to have left her with a hell of a grudge.
Derailing….but I got the most misogynistic piece of shit email from an ex today and I need to vent. I hope the community can tolerate this stuff from me, it just took me so long to actually commit to posting. This is actually relevant, though…he told me he found college mementos of us. He’s now stationed abroad in Germany. These mementos were from 2006/20070ish. The email explains this then goes… “holy shit, you were so hot” (of course now I’m over 19, so probably no longer hot) “why weren’t we having sex all the time? oh it was probably that crying thing. you were motherfucking crazy. also, i was a huge dick to you when you were abroad. And I wasn’t even cheating on you.” No apology.
he was the first person I told about my first boyfriend raping me. at the time, i thought he was supportive. made me cry, tried to brush it off. :/
When you can’t think of a snappy comeback an appalled look and “wow” tends to work.
bahumbugi, I’m so sorry you had deal with such an asshole. May he sit on a cactus and spill coffee on his lap. Internet hugs if you want them!
@cloudiah
I need to practice my deadpan glares then ;)
@bahumbugi
There’s nothing wrong with venting here, and internet hugs if you want them.
yay, cactus butt! what a toadstool.
@ Bahumbugi
Jedi-hugs if you want them. And I don’t ever mind people posting about their personal lives or rants, unless they end with “And that’s why women should fuck me” or other MRA fare.
And yuck on your ex. He sounds…like what’s whether you are/were hot have to do with returning momementos.
So he found old photos and decided to email you to inform you of his regret that you didn’t fuck more back then? For no apparent reason other than that he felt like sharing? That’s a case where deploying the appalled “wow” would be fitting.
yeah. wish i were making it up. he also used the words “quite enjoyable” to describe pictures of me. (to my knowledge no nude or obscene ones were ever taken, with my permission, at least.)
@bahumbugi
Wow, that guy is such a douchenozzle.
“I’m glad that you enjoy creeping me out. It’s nice to have a hobby.”
everyone said not to give him the satisfaction of a response. it’s kind of funny seeing the steps i took in relationships (huge jerk — still huge but not explicitly abusive-type jerk — emotionally distant — now overall happy and loving and equal!). so in that way i’m trying to spin it as personal growth.
also, POMSKIES and golden retriever-dachshund mix. i have objections to this kind of dog breeding but just…sheer cuteness….i die.
@Bahumbugi
Okay, that’s just creepy. Creepier, I mean.
Lol, I posted that before you posted the comment with the dachsund picture, I could swear.
And it is cute!
Strewth, I thought she’d passed over years ago.
(Zombie Pizzey? That’d be all we need.)
I feel a little sorry for Erin Pizzey. She started out in life wanting to do good, but she seems to have been losing her bearings. Time will tell, but I suspect she’s starting to show signs of dementia.
@myoo — i’m laughing you use that term. it makes-a-me-laugh!!
@Marie – same here, I couldn’t think of anything that didn’t involve biting or kicking.
La Strega: I’m not going to diagnose her as anything but an asshole. Dementia is no excuse.
She’s been saying ridiculous stuff for quite some time, so if it’s dementia it’s not new.
I suspect that the explanation is more grudge/offended ego than anything else. When she associated more closely with feminists she rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way, which they still remember. Apparently she does too.
bahumbugi – nthing what everyone said, no problem venting here.
Seconding what Aaliyah said: “May he sit on a cactus and spill coffee on his lap.”
(Best curse ever!)
And OMG that puppy! The cuteness, it’s adorable!
::melts in puddle of squee::
PS have you blocked creepy ex on your social media, email and so on? I’d be inclined to do that.
I have no idea why some asshats feel compelled to update their ex on the fact that they are still an asshat. One of the mysteries of asshattery, I suppose.
I am sorry he did that to you.
I say “indeed” a lot, with a raised eyebrow. It works a treat.
“Really?” works too.
It just occurred to me that if anyone tried patting me on the head, it might be worth saying “Did I tell you I have head lice?”
More hugs for bahumbugi. What an asshat.
I would have posted that sooner, but I was busy trying to set fire to my kitchen. 0_o
(Not really, but some oil warming up on my stove inexplicably caught fire. It wasn’t that hot, so I don’t know what happened.)
When peeps attempt physical contact I usually put my fingers up making the sign of the cross and say “no touching”.
You’ll all be glad to hear that NWOSlave also made an appearance on that AMA thread. I can’t remember what his question was, but someone replied hinting that gay men might be human beings, and he devolved into frothing rage pretty quickly.
“they did not make permanent relationships with women, because they realized they would have too much to lose: their homes, their children, and their money.” Um…?
I don’t even know what to say…
Bwahahahaha, Owly being true to form!
He could never sock, that bloke. His, ah, issues, are all too close to the surface.
Also, her asking abuse victims to forgive their abusers is one of the most disgusting things I’ve read this week.
Right up there with her asking abuse victims to forgive themselves — which, under all the New Age fuzziness, is really just a way of telling abuse victims to blame themselves, because why they hell else would they need forgiveness?
The first paragraph in the comment above should be blockquoted. (Damn, my third comment here and I fucked up the blockquotes already!)
I hate the “you’re a feminist cos you hated your father!” idea – because my dad was super awesome (not perfect, he was close to a functional alcoholic, but never violent) and has raised two feminist daughters and four feminist sons. My dad was a good guy, who mostly managed not to pass on the shittiness from his own father (who passed it on from WWII)
@Bahumbugi: May all the asshole jerk exes of the world be stranded on a tiny, barren desert island, surrounded by a sea of Legos that stretches as far as the eye can see.
WeeBoy: Yeah, I don’t hate my dad. He’s pretty awesome, and quite the feminist his own self. I would love for one of these MRA knobs to call HIM a mangina.
My dad is everything that society thinks a man should be, and he did a pretty good job of raising a feminist daughter.
legos and cactus comments make me feel better.
i like the lice idea.
@weeboy et al. –
my partner is not only the son of an abusive douchey dad, but also a programmer. and a feminist. and that’s real.
if guys touch my ass or grab me in bars (which i virtually never go to, fortunately) i try to punch them/do punch them, as does my sister. and then we tell the bouncers. who kick them out. MISANDRY! MISANDRY! MISANDRY!
also i’m going to watch tv and pass out, but if anyone hasn’t played around with the genderswap app, and is bored, its pretty entertaining. it’s an app that will replace all pronouns, also will replace feminism with masculism, misandry with misogyny, i believe.
http://hooplaha.com/corgi-puppy-vs-tennis-ball/
corgis for all. best part of having a dog in a dog-dense urban area is getting to mush on OTHER PEOPLE’S DOGS. like corgis. oh my goodness. and a tiny bulldog who i found out is 55 lbs. other dogs her size would be about 15-20. THE DENSITY OF THE BULLDOG. i hugged her.
I love seeing dogs out and about too, bahumbugi! The park I walk through going to work has lots of dogs out for walks, and it’s great fun seeing them playing. :)
Urgh, I’ve got to say, this stuff has been really frustrating to me lately. I just don’t get it, and I hate the fact that I can’t get away from it. So I need to say some things.
My mother says misogynistic stuff all the time, really vile, awful stuff sometimes. That there are too many young women in university, that they waste space. As someone doing a PhD, how do you think that makes me feel? Once she said to me, after I told her about the person with the highest marks in our class, ‘it’s a guy, right? It always is.’ I took great pleasure in telling her it wasn’t*. Then there is one of my best female friends, who is constantly saying how men should be in charge of everything, and chides me if she thinks I have been to mean to one of my male acquaintances, since if men are criticised by women, they fall apart completely. And then don’t get me started on what some of my male friends say. I know that in my mother’s case, it is partly self-hate, that these people all care about me, that it’s nothing personal, blah blah blah. But I’m so tired of it: Is there never any hope of them changing? What I don’t get is: How are men, as a group, both strong, better at everything, and supposed to be in charge – and at the same time delicate victims? One thing I’m glad of is that my father is not like that. Ironically, he would probably have more reason to be than most guys. He has to pay for my mother, even though they have been divorced ten years, because she refuses to work and kicked him out of the house several times (yes, she thinks men are superior, but treated her own husband like shit, because he wasn’t ‘manly’ enough).
I think what’s saddest to me is that ‘nice’ people can say awful things too.I used to think sexism was caused by religion, or just really conservative belief systems, but I don’t think that’s true anymore. Look at the online atheist community. Most people I know (90 percent?) are ‘liberal’, whatever that means. Doesn’t stop them from being small-minded, sexist, hateful idiots. I know a few really conservative Christians. I have never discussed gender issues with them, and I’m kind of scared to, because I’m afraid that what they say will be even worse. And I’m not sure how much worse I can take.
I like being a woman (girl?) 99 percent of the time, but occasionally I think if I were male, I would never have to deal with any of this stuff. Really, I never did anything to deserve this, but I feel like I’m a magnet for these people. I can imagine some MRAs and afore-mentioned friends reading this and thinking ‘wow you’re bitter, you would only be posting on here if no guy wanted you’. No, I have no problems getting along with the majority of men. I’ve had my fair share of bad dates, of course, but so does everyone. Nope, I’m just baffled really.
As for Erin Pizzey- don’t feel like reading that tonight.
*not me
For me, it’s not my dad who’s a feminist (almost the exact opposite, though not in the MRA sense), but my mom. She is a little bit spineless when it comes to her views, but at the very least she’s always had a problem with victim-blaming, rape culture, misogyny, domestic abuse, etc. Not surprising since she herself has faced abuse from my dad and had to get a restraining order from him when he threatened to murder her and my siblings. Now they’re divorced. I’m very happy to have a mom like her and I love her very much. I don’t think I know anymore more supportive than her.
lol Reddit is all “FREEZE PEACH”, except when it’s not.
@la strega
No. Whether she has dementia is not relevant. Not all assholes have dementia. Not everyone with dementia is an asshole. Sometimes assholes are just assholes.
@kittehs
That’s a good idea XD It’d work well for me doubly much on the offchance someone who knew me tried it, as I do try to warn people when they’re about to do something that might result in getting contagious stoof from me.
@weeboy
My dad’s pretty cool too, and both me and my sister ended up being feminists. So seconding (or whatevering at this point?) that there isn’t really a correlation.
@carelyblue
Internet hugs if you want them. :(
Carleyblue – I’ve nothing sensible to suggest (if you were looking for suggestions at all anyway) but lots of internet hugs to offer if you want them.
@Aaliyah
Yay for your mom :) She sounds awesome.
I wasn’t really looking for any suggestions, I’m just happy to communicate with people I know will understand my frustration.
She definitely is. The only thing that irks me sometimes is that she’s very much fixated on new age stuff. I needn’t say anything more than the fact that she’s a unitarian universalist who hates vaccines and believes in “life energy” and stuff like that. She’s also very fond of raw veganism. I still love her, though. And I have to say that even that weird stuff about her makes her likable in a way.