Reno calls a domestic violence hotline: The MRA Reality Distortion Field in action [UPDATED with transcript]
Today, a fascinating – and infuriating – case study in how Men’s Rights Activists twist reality around in order to fit their peculiar ideology. Obviously, they do this all the time, but it’s hard to find a clearer example of the MRA Reality Distortion field in action than the video I’ve pasted in below from A Voice for Men.
The video features a recording of one of AVFM’s regular commenters calling a domestic violence hotline, pretending to be a man named “Reno” who has been abused by his wife. In reality, Reno is Ian Williams, a puckish Australian who has made himself AVFM’s go-to guy for prank calls; you can find several other prank calls from him on his AVFM contributor page.
Here’s what Williams, who also goes by the pseudonym Dr. F, has to say about the call:
If you’re a man and you are a victim of violence from your partner you may face difficulties finding help. Don’t listen to me, here’s the guy himself who called. His name is Reno.
Reno calls a battered women’s shelter and is denied help.
He is denied help, even though he tells the person on the other end of the phone that he is worried his wife will return with a cricket bat.
That sounds pretty damning, and, in the comments, the regulars at AVFM responded with predictable outrage.
“No concern for a beaten man or a boy that could also be a victim and, only able to help(willing) women,” wrote Raven01. “It makes the hate filled ideology apparent to all.”
“[Go] feminism- the humanitarian justice movement brought to you by the modern KKK!” Perseus added. “Sieg Heil, cunts!”
Not one of them seemed to care that everything Williams says about the phone call is false. “Reno” was offered help many times. He was the one who refused it.
If you listen to the call, here’s what you’ll find:
Williams, pretending to be “Reno,” called a Domestic Violence counseling line, not a battered women’s shelter. He told the counselor he’d been attacked by his wife and that he needed a place to go. The counselor explained to him that he’d called a counseling line and that she personally couldn’t arrange for shelter, but that if he called the men’s help line, they could arrange for him and his 6-year-old son to get free hotel accommodations at a location unknown to his wife. The counselor offered several times to connect him directly to the men’s help line.
Williams also told the counselor that he was thinking of calling the police. She told him she could connect him directly to the police, and would be happy to explain his situation to them and to make sure he reached an officer who specializes in domestic violence.
Ignoring all her offers to assist him in getting shelter and further help, Williams insisted that he wanted to be housed in a battered woman’s shelter instead. The counselor, naturally, was puzzled by this strange insistence on his part, and explained to him again that he could get free shelter at a local hotel for as long as he needed. She again offered to connect him directly to someone who could get him immediate help.
Having refused all of her offers of assistance, Reno abruptly ended the call — to the obvious distress of the counselor, who despite the patent weirdness of his behavior on the call had been patiently trying her best to get “Reno” the help he claimed he needed. (I suspect she sensed that his story was phony, but tried to help anyway in case it was true.)
Listen to the call yourself. It’s utterly surreal. What’s even more surreal is that Williams would make the bald claim that he had been “denied help” — and then put up a recording that clearly reveals that this claim is complete and utter bullshit. And I can’t tell if he’s lying or delusional.
That’s always the question with MRAs, isn’t it?
EDITED TO ADD: A commenter here has prepared a rough transcript of the call. There are a few moments where it was impossible to figure out a word or two, but otherwise this seems to pretty accurately match my memory of the call, which I’ve listened to several times. Let me know if I need to make any corrections.
Recorded message:
Family Violence Counseling Line. Please note for training and quality improvement purposes only, your call may be monitored. If you do not want your call to be monitored, please let the counselor know. If you wish to listen to ? regarding our privacy policy if you are already speaking to a counselor press one now, otherwise hold on the line for next available counselor.
[Ringing sound]
Counselor: Hello, this is *redacted* speaking, how can I help you?
“Reno”: Oh, hello. I um, was speaking to someone a short while ago called Maria,
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: And, and my name is Reno. And, um…
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: I was explaining, I was explaining to her that my, my wife, uh, is violent towards me with a cricket bat and other things.
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: And, uh, she gave me a phone number to call, and uh…
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: I called them and um…
Counselor: A phone number for what?
“Reno”: Uh… Uh, it was to help, it was a, um… Pardon me, it was 1-800-015-188. It was a…
Counselor: I don’t know what that number is, so what is it for?
“Reno”: Uh, it’s a helpli-, it’s a possible, it’s a place where they might be able to tell me where I can get some shelter for the night. But there’s none of the… DV places ? are gonna help me, because I’m a man, you see.
Counselor: Have you called the men’s line? ‘Cause they’re the ones who specialize in, because in Australia unfortunately most of the, um… Services. Well not unfortunately, fortunately though, most of the services are for women, because 95% of domestic violence is perpetrated by men. So that’s why they don’t really have um… They don’t really have… So many refuges for wom-, for men. They do have places where men can go, but they’re normally um, like overnight men’s, um, places, like… Which state are you in?
“Reno”: Victoria.
Counselor: Victoria. I don’t know the ones in Victoria but there’s quite a few, for example, in Sydney um, that provide um, overnight accommodation but they don’t call them refuges as such because um… It’s the different situation only for women ’cause often they’re, well normally they’re fleeing with children. So um, normally the men’s ones aren’t, they’re not called refuges, they’re called like, a men’s hostel or an overnight, um, men’s overnight um, shelter, or they’ll call them different names but they don’t call them refuges. So, um, if you’re looking for men’s refuge that’s probably not in existence, but there are a lot of men’s shelters.
“Reno”: Will they take me and my boy?
Counselor: If you’ve got a child, um, they’ll probably prioritize you, I would say. Um, have you rung men’s line? Because they’re the ones who really have this type of information, um because they specialize in helping men. While general lines, like, we’re a counseling line, so we don’t actually have access to phone numbers for, um, directly for refuges. We can connect you to the refuge line. How old’s your, how old’s your son?
“Reno”: Six.
Counselor: How old?
“Reno”: He’s six.
Counselor: He’s six. And where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s with me. My wife’s gonna be coming home in about three hours, and she’s gonna, she’s gonna beat me.
Counselor: And he, and your son’s not asleep now?
“Reno”: No, he’s with me now.
Counselor: Why isn’t he in bed at 8.40, 8.48 in the-… Sorry Reno, but why is he awake at this time of night?
“Reno”: Because we’re about to just go somewhere, anywhere, out of the house because we just… We’re terrifed. He, we’re ready to go, so. We, we’re ready to go.
Counselor: Reno, this is really concerning me. Is he listening to you as you’re speaking on the phone?
“Reno”: No.
Counselor: Where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s got some headphones on. He’s watching…
Counselor: What’s he doing?
“Reno”: He’s watching television now, he can’t hear any talk. I made sure of that.
Counselor: Yeah, I’m really concerned that he’s um, awake at this time of night. Um, the other organization that could most likely help you find accommodation and probably would be your best option would be ? Community Services, because they deal especially with children and families in crisis, and so they would definitely keep you together, they would probably actually put you in, normally they pay for a hotel or motel. A men’s shelter wouldn’t be the appropriate place to go with a child, definitely not. So, um, ? they give you, they have a lot of motels and hotels that they deal with, and put they in those instead of accommodation until they can find you permanent accommodation.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: Like, normally they’d pay for a flat or something instead, they wouldnt, they don’t continue to keep you in a, you know, holding pattern in a hotel. Sometimes they make you stay for, like, two weeks in a hotel.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: That would be a good option for you, wouldn’t it?
“Reno”: Yeah. And they wouldn’t let my wife know that, where I’m living? Staying?
Counselor: No, they wouldn’t do that.
“Reno”: ‘Cause she’s really violent. Really violent.
Counselor: They definitely wouldn’t. Um, they definitely wouldn’t let your wife know where you’re staying. I can help you with the phone call. I can introduce you, explain the situation, and see what they can do for you, if you’d like.
“Reno”: Hmm… Possibly, tha-, thank you. I think I might, actually what I might do is call the police now and then see how it goes in there.
Counselor: But your best option is calling the police and then asking to speak to a domestic violence officer.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: They’re the ones that are the most specialized in this, so they deal with this day in and day out, and that’s probably stationed… Are you in area, in an open area? Are you in Melbourne, or are you in a town, or…?
“Reno”: Uh, I’m in Melbourne.
Counselor: Well, if you’re in Melbourne, most Melbourne police stations will have a domestic violence officer, and they specialize in domestic violence, and um, what you can get is to get a detective to come over, or a domestic violence officer, and say that you’d like to um, that you have um, fear of, um, harm of your wife who’s been abusing you. And what they’ll do is, they might um, even try and get an AVO so that she has to move out of the house and you guys can stay in the house.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: They’ll try probably to do that so that you and the child can stay there. Or um, if you move, they’ll um, it would be, that she can’t actually have legal contact with you.
“Reno”: Yeah… No, we have to actually get away from her, we can’t stay here. So there’s nowh-, there’s no um, women’s shelter I could stay in, we could stay in tonight?
Counselor: Well, women’s, women’s shelter’s don’t take men.
“Reno”: They don’t take men.
Counselor: Why don’t you ring men’s lines? They would be able to tell you where you can go. Why don’t you ring the men’s line? Do you want me to connect you through to the men’s line? They deal with men. Men and women’s shelters are two totally different issues. Why do you want to go [to] a women’s shelter?
“Reno”: I just need somewhere where I can just get away from her, somewhere whe-
Counselor: Yeah, but why wouldn’t you, why wouldn’t you wanna go? Why aren’t you accepting this offer that ? will pay for hotel accommodations for you and your son?
“Reno”: Oh, because I…
Counselor: Why do you…
“Reno: Because I need to get out now.
Counselor: Yeah, but they would organize it now, they’ll probably organize someone to come and get you now. People work 24/7.
“Reno”: Oh, okay. I didn’t know what. Okay.
Counselor: ? Services work 24/7, or do you want me to put you through to your local um, police station and explain it to the domestic violence officer so that I can introduce you and explain your situation and see how they can help you?
“Reno”: No, I’ll, I’ll give them a call myself. Okay, thanks.
Counselor: Are you sure?
“Reno”: Absolutely.
Counselor: I’m happy to do it, Reno. I’m very concerned about your son.
“Reno”: No, that, that’s okay. I, I’ll go now.
Posted on April 2, 2013, in a voice for men, antifeminism, domestic violence, facepalm, imaginary backwards land, imaginary oppression, lying liars, misogyny, MRA, shit that never happened, the c-word and tagged a voice for men, antifeminism, domestic violence, men's rights, misogyny, MRA. Bookmark the permalink. 1,158 Comments.
Just nit-picking, but Martin Luther had 95 these, not 99. It bugged me.
The effect of adding the photos isn’t really what they were going for. When viewed from outside their weird little bubble it just reads as “look, there are abused men who need help, and instead of actually helping them MRAs are pulling weird publicity stunts while ignoring or refusing actual help”. Doesn’t make them look good at all.
Anyone ever get the sneaking paranoia that going to MRA sites will give your cmputers viruses? Because i am super curious about about the article somoene linked to (with the whiny christian guy) but I do not want me computer to become infected with manosphere.
Want to hear something really weird? There’s a site that I was perusing and posting links here from the other day, and I’ve been reading that site for ages with no problems. Within a day of posting links here my antivirus decided that the site in question was hosting malware and blocked it. Could be a coincidence, but…
@emmy
Jedi hugs if you want. It always sucks when depression is being worse.
@princessbonbon
Of course you should share the muffins! Muffins are yummy!
@cassandrasays
I feel really dull, because I so don’t follow… /computer ignorant. If you want me to understand you’d probably have to spell it out* XD
*note, you don’t actually have to do this, if you don’t want to.
Since there seem to be a lot of younger MRAs who’re IT guys I wonder if they’re deliberately seeding malware anywhere that they think feminists might encounter it. So yeah, I’d suggest avoiding their sites, and definitely avoid commenting there unless you have a reliable way to mask your IP address.
Fade, I viewed a bunch of MRA videos on youtube linked from here and was subsequently getting lots of recommendations for more and I felt like my computer was infected. I was all, “Quick, delete the cooties, I mean, cookies! Ahhh, that’s better.”
Emmy, sorry you’ve been depressed! Hugs if you want ‘em. And thanks for pinpointing what was creepy with that post. Does anyone see ever see posts that long and find themselves unable to read them because you know it’s bullshit, just because of the length? The truth rarely requires that many words, in my opinion.
The possibility of malware or viruses generally is one reason I won’t go to any MRM sites. I don’t know if they can track who visits (I’ve no idea about that sort of thing) but it’s another reason to stay away. Plus, I don’t want to give those bastards hits, and most importantly, I’ve better things to do than read their hateful shit; like I said to Quackers yesterday, it’s much better to read it here in what amounts to a safe space, where there are so many better things going on, like shoes and kitties and the David Q&A sessions.
(He seems to have gone inactive, but I’d particularly suggest that people not post on GGGs blog unless they’re sure they can hide their IP and use a fake email address, because that guy is sketchy as hell.)
@ Marie
Thank you for that; it’s been a really depressed and triggery week for me, but I’m hoping that partner will understand and that my coursework is still up to snuff. To tell the truth, I’ve been obsessively refreshing this page because I’m so nervous about getting a negative response and I want to be ready for it.
I hope so. This is a new recipe and I have been having terrible luck lately with cooking. My crock pot chili was a disaster.
I’m not sure if they can track who visits, but almost all sites can track who comments, so I hope people are being careful about that.
Yeah, even if I visited those sites I’d never comment. I don’t know how to mask my IP address, for one thing, and it would be the most pointless waste of time, for another.
Plus, honestly, if I did comment on those sites it would essentially be trolling, and I don’t want to be a troll.
@Emmy
Good luck with your courses and things (hoping your partner is understanding, but saying good luck w/ your partner just sounds weird). And I don’t think you’ll get a negative response… But anyway. Hope you feel better soon.
Emmy – I don’t think any regulars here are going to give you negative responses! Internet hugs if you want them.
Here’s an adorable beagle puppy trying to breakdance his way out of his coat. (NB the coat was because he was very small for his age and it was a very cold winter: the breeders told the owner to put a coat on him, they didn’t do it to annoy him.)
Emmy, sorry about the bad week. It might help if you took a quick nap with these little guys.
Hugs if you want them.
That puppy reminds me of when I had to put cones of shame on both Hazel and Buster, and they both tried to back their way out of them. I should have filmed it.
@Cloudiah
*spontaneously combusts from cuteness*
@Emmy.
I hope your school is going fine, too. I just got hit with a depression patch recently myself, and am trying to catch up (from how far I got behind) over spring break.
@Emmy
I don’t know you, but I want to send Jedi hugs in your direction anyway if wanted (and if not, just send them on their way)
and oh my god so many tiny pandas!
So, random – there’s this Chinese actor/model who I think is really hot but never paid much attention to in a non-work/gossip sense because a.not really interested in that stuff and b. I can’t read Chinese characters. But then I found out that he has 2 pandas, and now I kind of want to marry him.*
(*Not really, because it would make Mr C sad, but if I was single, sure!)
So there you go – apparently the way to attract ultra evil hypergamous women is to adopt pandas and publish photos of yourself hanging out with and feeding them.
I had bacon and eggs, it was delicious. Totally made up for sitting in hellish traffic for an hour only to go three miles.
Raise your hand if you care what Roscoe thinks. About anything.
Hug, Emmy. Depression sucks.
But even the most hardcore MRA has to admit (if only to himself) that “I married him for his panda!” seems to be a good enough reason.
“Fucking alpha males with their fucking pandas, of course women would go for that. Blah blah, something about thugs and neanderthals.”
How does he have two pandas? Now that is rock star.
Pictures! Where are the pictures of this guy and his pandas? How can we judge his alphapandaness if we can’t see pictures?
Because obviously the ownership of panda indicates a fertile and wealthy male. If he also owns a new born giraffe or a lumbering little rhino, well, the ladies just faint within his radius!
Not so much with cats for some reason. Apparently, cats have a negative effect on fertility or something. Because everyone just knows that cat owners are lonely people.
Probably has to do with cats warming up places that are supposed to stay cool…
I hold you totally responsible for the strange snorting/wheezing noises I just made at work.
And I’ll gladly accept responsibility, with full knowledge of all consequences. But if your boss (assuming there is one) decides ze wants to call me in order to make a complaint, please have zir know that it is 3 am at my place and I have no idea why I’m not sleeping yet.
Pandas!
http://pic.yule.sohu.com/group-175360.shtml#g=175360&p=1424473
mocking men who are domestic violence victims good job Davey
I wonder if yoursexymaster is on Fetlife?
I hope your co-workers will accept my apology for this disruption in form of a terrible picture of a (then) freshly rescued baby swift.
http://i.imgur.com/1qJ8Pei.jpg?1
Cutenessssssssssss!
Defintely puts him in alpha category (or pandagory in this case). Say, don’t MRAs think Asian men by default can’t be alphas, because of whatever-their-racist-schtick is? HA to that. I mean HA anyway, but this is the Panda Wipeout.
TomBcat – my boss is used to me making weird laughing noises. Come to that he makes a fair few himself.
yoursexy didn’t even try to aim, did he?
Baby swift! <3
Hahahaha, unsexyloser demonstrates his inadequacy – this time it's reading comprehension fail.
Not that that's new for him, or unusual among trolls.
Yoursexymaster is trying and failing at domly domness.
Hey, notmysexymaster, can you read for comprehension? Like, at all?
Speaking of that, I ran across some hilarious MRA dude who was shocked and outraged by some site aimed at women in Singapore’s 10 Hottest Men list, particularly the fact that the # 1 was this guy.
A site based in Singapore picked an Asian guy as their #1? I am so shocked. They’d be even more outraged if they’d seen this one.
Oooh, do you think he’s one of those domly doms who
humps people’s legsthinks he’s a sheepdog?I don’t think he’s domly at all, but I think he knows that.
Kitty pic fail.
It’s kind of awesome how dom fail dude’s name has 3 distinct elements, and every single one of them is wrong.
Actually I like this pic better, kitty is chilling out in a proper catlike manner.
“I’m not sure if they can track who visits, but almost all sites can track who comments, so I hope people are being careful about that.”
…yes. At least on the version of WP I was running I tracked IPs (stalker ex avoidance) — impossible to match the IP to a nym without more info, but yeah, IPs are generally logged. A site like AVfM or manboobz probably never looks at that in detail though, too much noise to see much besides “lots of people in the US, EU, etc”
If you comment though use ToR or a proxy — IPs could be anyone — a lurker, soon-to-be commenter, troll, anything. Comment and piss them off? Hide your IP, I don’t care what they say “fuck their shit up” is a threat.
Emmy — yuck, that sucks. Can I offer a fish viewing? They make a good distraction.
I’d say be careful even clicking on links if your location is a. known and b. unusual in some way. Those two things together might be enough for someone with malicious intent to track you down.
That guy is beautiful indeed. What’s his name?
The MRM would loathe Takeshi Kaneshiro. I had a friend who posted pics of him in his younger days with all her poems – he’s another remarkably beautiful man. :)
The second guy is Godfrey Gao. Just to add more fuel to the fire, he’s ridiculously tall too!
I’ve been a huge fan of Kaneshiro ever since Chunking Express. It’s really a shame that he’s mostly known for House of Flying Daggers here – he’s a great actor and that wasn’t a particularly good performance.
NB if anyone’s wondering about me saying “beautiful” rather than “handsome,” it’s because handsome doesn’t really cut it for me; a beautiful man – and yes, that does imply something feminine in his looks, regardless of his race – is waaaaay further up the scale for me. I don’t think of Mr K as handsome; I do think he is beautiful.
Yeah, my friend used to tell me abou Kaneshiro’s films. I can’t recall if she runs his fan club or just belongs to it.
I definitely prefer a certain amount of androgyny, facially at least. I can look at the kind of men usually described as handsome rather than beautiful and see why other women are attracted to them, but they don’t really do anything for me.
Also when using Tor/proxies I’d recommend testing if they work first. Disposable Email if one is requested of course.
Just a general FYI(I assume not everyone knows this): when posting without any safety measures and they keep track of the IP one can see what OS and browser you have and the general area you live in depending on your provider. I suppose most people wouldn’t have much use for that information, but it’s still a little creepy.
(can be useful though, Facebook hacks and stuff)
This is what I was getting at earlier – if someone has that info it’s really easy for them to send a nice, perfectly targeted virus your way.
Or worse, they know you and recognize you *shudder*
All the more reason to deny them the traffic.
Yes, a lot of the men described as handsome don’t do it for me – especially very square-jawed guys. I do not care for faces that look like they were drawn with a ruler and T-square!
Or just act like they do and try to scare you. I think that is something MRAs are really into…
XD Just because panda’s are so cute! <3
@yourannoyingmaster
mocking men who are domestic violence victims good job Davey
Now now, I know trolls tend to have little reading comprehension, but if you read the post you’ll notice the guy wasn’t actually a victim, and was just calling the line to ‘prove’ he couldn’t get in a women’s shelter, even when the tried to direct him to men’s shelters, or a hotel room.
Whoa! Teh Unmanly Unmanliness will make the world explode!
Kaneshiro is also one of only a very few actors who’ve had the backbone to call Hollywood out on its racism in public. He gets a lot of respect from me for that, especially since he did it in such a polite way that there’s really no way to challenge his statement without going “yep, we sure are racist”.
Y’know it’s funny, but all that unmanly stuff … sewing, knitting, gardening, cooking, playing with or caring for [insert name of preferred cute animal here], ditto children or anyone who needs care, are the hottest things. Of course they are good in themselves, and doing them doesn’t actually relate to or depend on anyone’s opinion of them; that’s not what I’m saying. But HOT DAMN is it sexy. I adore seeing Mr K doing any of that stuff, and if I felt attracted to other guys that’d be exactly what would catch my eye.
Would the MRAs ever, ever grasp that idea? Not in an infinity of infinities. Because aside from their cretinous ideas about gender roles, and their terror of their pwecious pwecious masulinity being undermined, those activities are about love, affection, concern for others, or simple pleasures.
And I don’t think these guys know jack shit about any of that.
I didn’t know he’d done that.
::applauds::
::whistles::
::cheers::
@CassandraSays, Those pictures. … I’m fanning myself. :D
cloudiah, I have a feather ready to burn if you swoon away entirely. :)
There are few things that catch my eye quicker than a hot guy cuddling a cat. It increases their hotness exponentially. Ditto babies, dogs, and so on. If the dude can cook too then he’s pretty much in.
Actually in terms of cooking and other basic self and household maintenance stuff not being able to do those things reads as not a competent adult to me. I’ve never understood why so many guys are proud of their inability to take care of themselves.
Undoubtedly.
Hedgehog guy!
We just like hedgehog guy because he’s so thuglike. [swoons again]
Also, I got tired of my b&w avatar so now I am canned kitties with watermelons.
Fair warning I have not read all the comments since the first page. I just got off work and I am going out again soon: so no time.
Depression sucks. One of my clients is suffering with it and I’m trying to supportive (since I know my client isn’t getting it at home). I hope you find the support you need.
I agree this person clearly did not read what was posted. Confirmation bias
All the doxxing I’ve been reading about has freaked me out from commenting a lot of places. I just couldn’t deal with that.
Off topic since you all seems to have a wide range of experience. I have to fix the scrapes on my car. I’m thinking about getting a kit, but I can’t tell which ones are the best or what I really need. I need to fix it soonish because I need another layer of wax on my car asap. No big if nobody has any advice on this particular issue. Oh, good news my insurance will pay out and I don’t have to pay anything out of pocket for the other vehicle.
Hedgehog guy. *swoon*