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Vox Day: Women working is worse than rape

Keep popping out those white babies, ladies; it's all you're good for.

Keep popping out those white babies, ladies; it’s all you’re good for.

Even after all the time I’ve spent on this blog, I can still be astounded by the appalling hatefulness of the manosphere. The latest example? This post from the influential far-right manospherian who calls himself Vox Day, in which he argues, seriously, that encouraging rape is better for society than encouraging (white) women to work.

No, really.

Vox, you see, is racist as fuck, and he’s worried about the evil brown people outbreeding the good white people. He figures that

two-thirds of [women] have to stay home and breed in order to prevent society from either collapsing into demographic and economic ruin or being transformed by the imported replacement workers into a third world society.

Now, you might think that some men could stay home and take care of these kids, but that’s clearly not an option since, you know, dudes don’t like changing diapers.

[T]here are a number of reasons that a man cannot stay home and provide childcare.  The three most important are that a) most men don’t want to provide childcare, b) most women don’t want to work to support a man, and c) doing so significantly increases the probability that his wife will stop being attracted to him and his marriage will fail.

And all this leads to his jaw-dropping conclusion:

The fact that women may wish to work and are very capable of working no more implies that they should always be encouraged to do so anymore than the fact that men may wish to rape and are very capable of raping means that they should always be encouraged to do so.  The ironic, but logically inescapable fact is that encouraging men to rape would be considerably less damaging to a society than encouraging women to enter the workforce en masse.  Widespread rape makes a society uncivilized.  Widespread female employment makes a society demographically unsustainable.  History demonstrates that incivility can be survived and surmounted.  Unsustainability, on the other hand, cannot.

Skimming through the comments to this piece on his site, I saw mostly rape jokes. I didn’t have the stomach to read further.

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Posted on February 24, 2013, in advocacy of violence, all about the menz, entitled babies, men who should not ever be with women ever, misogyny, MRA, oppressed white men, racism, rape, rape jokes, rapey, vox day and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 117 Comments.

  1. Neurite: add “Lawless” and “Monster” to the list of movies with rape that MacFarlane decided to have a giggle about. That guy skeeves me out.

    @Kittehs': I have not seen Argo, but this article makes me quite leery of it:

    http://www.wideasleepinamerica.com/2013/02/oscar-prints-the-legend-argo.html?m=1

  2. being transformed by the imported replacement workers into a third world society.

    There’s standard xenophobia there, but does anyone else feel that people who say that realise that slavery has basically just shifted from the first to the third world and want to keep those foreigners and their awful working conditions as far away from their minds and labour markets as possible? “Seeing something vaguely true and coming to the absolute worst conclusion” seems to be reasonably common around the more paranoid libertarian elements of the US right.

    ALSO

    Re: Vox Day’s haircut

    Dunno what you people see, but I’m in the trendier parts of Sydney (a hip-ish place, certainly hip for Australia) and while Newtown’s stuck-in-the-’70s mix of shaggy-haired bearded men in flannos/thongs as weather dictates and Thai restaurants remains largely consistent, the more cosmopolitan men all seem to favour basically that haircut, or other extreme variations on a short back and sides. Corny middle-class rapper Macklemore is massive right now and sports something similar, too.

    Everything (kinda) old is new again!

    Hello Tigtog! Haven’t seen you around here but you seem to have popped up over my latest Man Boobz break and it’s always nice to see new faces/gravatars. Welcome to the Australian-bird-piccies club too.

  3. On an unrelated note, scented fucking candles now come in the aroma of space, courtesy of NASA. Does this count as super-misandry since it’s such a manly smell put into candles?

    http://news.discovery.com/space/private-spaceflight/space-smelling-candle-130221.htm#mkcpgn=fbsci1

  4. G’day lowquacks! I know Kitteh and Xanthe more from other blogs than here, although there’s a few more familiar faces encountered elsewhere over the years here too. I mostly tend to lurk here, although every now and then I’ve stuck my oar in.

    You and I are even nearly neighbours in Sydney by the sound of it. Crikey!

  5. @Tigtog

    I’m in south Wollongong but went to Universty of Sydney, which I’m suspending this year to do some non-profit work, learn to drive, make some money, and so on.

  6. Thanks for posting those links, Neurite, Tulgey.

    I went to Argo knowing nothing more than that there was the hostage crisis in 1979-80. It’s quite something to see how very far Affleck was from the facts. I didn’t expect it to be 100% accurate – films never are – but cor, he really took the barest bones for his story, didn’t he?

    It’s a damn shame in a minor sense – that a film I still think told a ripping yarn IS just a Ripping Yarn – and in a major one, because it’s so far from what happened.

    I’m divided on how the Iranians and Americans were presented. Looking at it as a total outsider … I didn’t see the Iranians as barbaric or foolish or childish. Yes, scary, but revolutions are, all that fear and anger coming out, it brings fanaticism with it. The hostage crisis did happen.

    I didn’t read the Americans from the embassy as being innocents abroad – whether or not they had actually been spying I don’t know, but I saw them as part of this whole mucky business of diplomacy/espionage/corrupt regimes/you name it. Not heroes, not innocents, but by this time a group of frightened people. Not much related to their real reactions and dangers, I know: I’m talking about them as presented and how they came across to me.

    I did wonder at the time about Affleck being Antonio Mendez – not that I knew the man, but in a sort of “Whut?” way. At best it seemed like, “Okay, he has presumably Mexican ancestry on his father’s side, but doesn’t look it …” I thought his acting was fine, but yes, he shouldn’t have cast himself in the role.

    I rather suspect I wouldn’t have gone to see it if I’d known that stuff first …

  7. Heya, tigtog, lowquacks, you two okay after that drenching Sydney got today?

  8. I’m fine, but I’m been in Dapto. We did have a lightning strike very near the house last night, and a mini-tornado ripping through a town just south, and several floods nearby just recently, and that catastrophic bushfire risk, and a duststorm not too far away, I think, but somehow I’ve always managed to be in the right place.

    Plague of locusts next maybe?

  9. The rain and wind was much worse yesterday, Kitteh. I am often v. glad that we live on a hill, so the potential for flooding more than just a low bit of the garden is minimal.

  10. Glad to hear you’re both okay!

    I hope they don’t get more floods in Queensland. My sister moved back to Gympie last month. Only went and arrived the day of the floods, didn’t she?

  11. We flooded again…the storms on Friday were quite something. Our neighbour was out during calm bits hammering his garage roof down.

  12. Has the town been cut off, BigMomma?

  13. Yeah, the river peaked late Sunday and the pacific highway closed. It’s not as high as a month ago (last month peak 3.3m, this time 2.4m, with the levee wall being 3.4m). It’s all good, we should reconnect with outside world in a couple of days. Nasty lot of rain sitting inland though…3 floods maybe?

  14. Cripes! :(

    I’d better get to bed, it’s 10pm. Niters all!

  15. Night..watching Q&A again.

  16. I skimmed a bit of what was linked, written by Vox. He’s a Christian Libertarian. Isn’t Libertarianism Ayn Rand’s baby? She hated religion. Anyway, same old nonsense that’s been around for years. As to this post, even either Elam or Esmay (not sure of spelling) knows and admits that women have always worked. Vox and his readers/commenters truly believe what they say. They believe that men are superior and women are nothing but breeders. What is with this obsession with breeding?

  17. Diogenes The Cynic

    Tina

    Ayn Rand came up with a philosophy called objectivism. Some call it rational ethical egoism. Same thing. It is not the same as libertarianism.

    Some objectivists are libertarians, and some libertarians are objectivists. But thats it. Being one does not mean being the other.

    lowquacks

    libertarians=/=conservatives

    If someone is conservative, they stand against libertarian values.

  18. Naïf: I see you have changed threads, as per norm. Those ongoing conversations you were in before not interesting anymore?

    libertarians=/=conservatives

    If someone is conservative, they stand against libertarian values.

    A no true scotsman defense I see. So which are the Pauls? Not conservative, or nor libertarian?

  19. If someone is conservative, they stand against libertarian values.

    Except insofar as the modern Republican party calls itself conservative, and is focused on cutting the federal government down to just the military, as far as I can tell, and that includes deregulating everything, which is something the libertarians want very much, isn’t it?

  20. Ayn Rand came up with a philosophy called objectivism. Some call it rational ethical egoism. Same thing. It is not the same as libertarianism.

    It is selfish, sloppy, “fuck you Jack, I got mine” thinking that is just wrong headed about so much. If any of it were implemented, it would make us truly second rate.

    You know a person is a jackass when they are a Randroid. Case in point, Diogenes.

  21. Ayn Rand came up with a philosophy called objectivism. Some call it rational ethical egoism.

    Those who examine it with a critical eye call is self-centered egoism, with a total lack of ethics and reason.

    Shorter objectivism, “It’s immoral to not fuck you over to get mine”.

  22. libertarians=/=conservatives

    If someone is conservative, they stand against libertarian values.

    Except for the opposition to welfare, taxes, regulation, the federal government, civil rights legislation, business regulation and the bodily autonomy of women. Not to mention a fanatic devotion to the second amendment.

    Aside from that, completely different.

    (FWIW, I also used to think libertarianism and Christianity were incompatible, but then I realized not all libertarians are Randian objectivists, and not all Christians care about Christ’s messages of charity, compassion and wealth redistribution.)

  23. Those reconstructions of the faces of the English Kings are amazing. I love those reconstructions, it suddenly hits you that these were REAL people, not just names in a history book.
    L
    and does anyone else think that Henry IV looked like Jim Broadbent? Like scarily so: http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BOTY4ODgzMTg3MV5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTYwMDE4NTc0._V1._SX214_CR0,0,214,314_.jpg

    Just give him the whiskers and beard he had in Moulin Rouge but make them grey. Spitting image, I swear.

  24. Glad the Australian manboobzers are okay! Not so glad that DtC keeps popping up like a hard to shake infection.

  25. Except for the opposition to welfare, taxes, regulation, the federal government, civil rights legislation, business regulation and the bodily autonomy of women. Not to mention a fanatic devotion to the second amendment.

    Aside from that, completely different.

    He’s right if you take “libertarian” to mean “anti-authoritarian communists” and not “American fiscal conservatives who often have socially conservative views.” The former kind of libertarianism, which is actually anarchism, is entirely antithetical to conservative attitudes (both fiscally and socially).

  26. @mxe: so if we allow him to just treat the vague term libertarianism as a grab-bag we can totally almost in some circumstances avoid Diogenes being wrong?

    As long as we ignore the original context he used it in?

    That sounds just right for DiogenesThinking! (patent pending)

  27. What howardbann1ster above said. There is no set definition for libertarianism and both left and right use the term for their own ideologies. Context is key here.

  28. Context is key, but Diogenes uses vagueness as a weapon. Every post he puts up is padded on every side by it. Specificity is kryptonite to him.

    Of course, so are WORDS…

  29. He’s right if you take “libertarian” to mean “anti-authoritarian communists”

    Do any anti-authoritarian communists actually call themselves liberterian though? That thought tends towards “anarchist” or “anarcho-syndicist”. Most of the left-leaning folks who use the term “libertarian” I know of emphasize the personal freedoms and abuses of state police and military power over issues of financial regulation, but nearly everyone who has described themselves to be as liberterian also identifies as capitalist.

  30. Beloved and I heard about what Affleck did to the story of Argo we won’t be going to see the movie. Too many problems on too many fronts.

    Also, I love that Carter is trying to set the record straight.

  31. I thought his acting was fine, but yes, he shouldn’t have cast himself in the role.

    The eternal problem of actor-directors. Although arguably directors who insist on acting are worse than actors who insist on directing (like Affleck).

  32. a horrifying Lincoln assassination joke

    This is the only one I’ll defend – it was tremendously black humor, but for once it was clever black humor rather than MacFarlane’s more typical “I’m being offensive for the sake of being offensive without any actual joke here” schtick, and it was not targeting anyone alive today to be hurt by it. The rest ranged from “stupid and mediocre” to “downright awful,” but the Lincoln joke did make me laugh in that “oh god that’s terrible” sort of way.

    I’d say the low point was the Rihanna domestic violence joke, followed up by him smugly chortling about, “This is what you were all afraid of, right? I’m so NAUGHTY!” Ugh.

  33. Historophilia – those recreations are marvellous, aren’t they? I didn’t know who Jim Broadbent was, but yeah, he could pass as Henri in his later years, though he might be older. Henri was only 56 when he was murdered.

    It made me laugh a bit that different branches of the Bourbon family are arguing over whether it’s him. The reconstruction was done from a skull believed to be his, rescued when the royal tombs were desecrated during the Revolution. I’m going with what the people who did the reconstruction said: if it’s not him, he had a double walking around!

    He doesn’t present as that age now, btw. The beard’s not grey and he has teeth! :D

  34. of course vox day. i become much less attracted to men who participate actively in their children’s lives. i am sure men are totally willing to support a SECOND adult human on their dollar due to the preachings of some whacked-out tradition. women working is a totally new phenomenon! not like precious aryan farmwives ever did anything other than pop out white babies Back In The Day

  35. >>>If someone is conservative, they stand against libertarian values.

    In so far as libertarians will shake their heads and tut-tut with a bit of disapproval in their voice when conservatives seek stronger government interventionism (like corporate welfare, eminent domain for oil pipelines, more military spending, etc) and howl at the moon the second somebody takes a fraction of that corporate welfare and decides to give it to the poor instead.

  36. You’re right, folks – I missed the context. I really hate the word “libertarianism” >_>

    Do any anti-authoritarian communists actually call themselves liberterian though?

    Some do – especially the early ones. However, because of the rise of what we call libertarianism today, it’s not a common synonym for “anti-authortiarianism” these days. And I’m glad it isn’t.

  37. alice's restaurant

    I have to delurk for a moment to say I’m really hung up on him referring to rape as problematic because it leads to “incivility”.

    We’re not putting red wine in white wine glasses here for chrissake….incivility is making fun of someone’s appearance, incivility is shoving someone out of the way to get a better spot on a bus, RAPE IS A DEHUMANIZING VIOLENT CRIME.

    And what’s this about how society can recover from it? I’m sorry, I’m pretty sure rape is frequently used as an act of aggression by plenty of warring factions looking to decimate their opponents. You never hear someone say “alright, first lets kill the men, then send the women in to the workplace so they never breed at replacement rate again!!!”.

    Ugh. Argh. Ugh.

  38. It’s funny, this new thing they’re doing where everything they want to complain about is worse than rape is supposed to force people to take them more seriously, but in fact it just ends up demonstrating that they don’t deserve to be taken seriously because they have no sense of proportion. Not to mention that all these analogies could basically be summed up as “I don’t see why women being raped is such a big deal”, and even the average person who doesn’t much like feminism will tend to side-eye misogyny that obvious.

  39. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    Exactly – it’s not simply overstating their complaints, which they could do with all sorts of comparisons. It’s that they minimise rape’s existence and consequences, and they do it all the time.

    No surprise, given they’re the abusers’ lobby. I suspect a lot of their complaining would disappear if rape were legal.

  40. We’re not putting red wine in white wine glasses here for chrissake….incivility is making fun of someone’s appearance, incivility is shoving someone out of the way to get a better spot on a bus, RAPE IS A DEHUMANIZING VIOLENT CRIME.

    Spot on.

  41. LBT: I have to laugh, because only someone incredibly naive and douchey could think these ideas would actually be practical. (Economic ruin? Sure, dude, just try removing HALF THE WORK FORCE. I’m sure our economy will do FABULOUSLY.)

    Well… the reason is you can take the non-white folks and pay them less than the going rate; everyone wins (who is well off and white, which is all Theodore Beale cares about).

  42. Hi David and All: I made a spite donation in Vox’s name. Here’s the link to the video about it. http://youtu.be/yIXKNMteJqg

  43. I would not call Vox a christian. He thinks the sole determinate of how christian a church is how much it teaches that women should obey their husbands (according to his standards of obedience and submission). He never mentions the next verses about how men are to be, that they should love their wives just as Christ loved the church and died for it. Vox does not appear to understand the gospel (Christ died for sinners such as him – and me – and that he freely offers forgiveness and eternal life to those that would believe in him). He mocks what he calls Churchianity and him and his followers appear to believe in not attending church at all (a practice that is condemned in the Bible).

  44. @Christian, I hear he’s not a real Scotsman either

  45. You make one little typo and you don’t get logged in. David, I promise that was me and not an impostor (or false god)

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