Reddit Shitlords Give Other Reddit Shitlords Prestigious Shitlord Award
Art borrowed from Casey Nelson of SeeBeautifulIndiana.com. (Click pic to go there.)
Today is an auspicious day. For the Men’s Rights Subreddit, which we often write about here on Man Boobz, has won the prestigious World’s Greatest Shitlord Award. Oh, sorry, I mean it won the Subreddit of the Day award on Reddit. Which is, in this case, pretty much the same thing.
Here are some highlights from the official announcement , which I am totally not making up. No, really, you can go look. Someone – that being XavierMendel, one of the mods of r/subredditoftheday — actually wrote these things. And meant them. I AM NOT BEING SARCASTIC THIS IS REAL HOLY SHIT.
The topic at hand today takes a generous turn from our amusing and lighthearted articles of the month. On this, the last day of January, we look at something a bit more worthy to be called an article. /r/MensRights comes up a lot across reddit and, indeed, across the world as being one of the few centers for men’s help. It’s often attacked, and is always the center of one controversy or the other. My questions reflect that. MensRights is, undoubtedly, the home of great activists.
Again. I am not making this up.
There were some people close to me that suggested I not run this article. That the repercussions of doing so would be unreasonably bad. Well, here you go, people. This is my way of saying that a good reporter doesn’t care. A good reporter reports. It’s not in my job to care about consequences.
I’m not sure that Mr. Mendel quite understands the difference between “reporting” and “asskissing.”
/r/MensRights. Never in our society could the uninitiated imagine such a place. A place where feminism is questioned, and our culture is deconstructed to find what it’s really up to.
Hahaha, what? I was not aware that feminism wasn’t ever questioned on the internet, or anywhere else in “our society.” I mean, it’s not like I run a blog that features nearly 500 posts detailing people attacking feminism on the internet, most of them nastily and ignorantly and sometimes using the word “cunt,” and the vast majority of them not on Reddit. And it’s not like this only barely scratches the surface of the subject.
/r/MensRights is one of the last fortifications of free thought to exist on Reddit.
Yeah, that’s why I was banned – not for trolling or harassing or calling anyone names, but for politely if persistently disagreeing with the denizens until then-moderator ignatiusloyola threw a fit.
“Surely you jest,” one might tell me, “when you mean they’re alone in this regard?” No, hypothetical 19th century British gentleman, I do not. I truly mean it when I say that. What other subreddit openly questions feminism? None spring to mind, and I make it my duty to catalog various subreddits. Most end up banned or run down within a month. Only /r/MensRights remains.
Reddit: Bastion of Internet Feminism.
Nobody can say for sure whether or not they’re correct in any single regard. It’s certain that, due to the laws of probability, they’re not correct in every regard. However, it’s also certain that they’re correct in most of them. Occasionally a wackjob or two will suggest that feminism is behind Cinnamon Toast Crunch (The taste you can see!™). The accuser latches onto those wackjobs to denounce the whole movement.
Yeah, it’s not as if comments suggesting that a man allegedly wronged in divorce court should turn to murder got literally dozens of upvotes in r/mensrights, or anything.
Oh wait, they did.
Yeah, it’s not as if Men’s Rights Redditors gave literally hundreds of upvotes to a post about a t-shirt suggesting that men could be convicted of rape simply for being in a room alone with a woman.
Oh wait, they did.
It’s not as if Men’s Rights Redditors regularly give dozens if not hundreds of upvotes to posts from unhinged hate sites like A Voice for Men or Angry Harry,or fall all over themselves praising an internet-famous female MRA who thinks that many abused women “demand” their abuse.
It’s not as if they think “spermjacking” is a real thing in the world that should make all men think twice about ejaculating in the general vicinity of women.
It’s not like … oh, you can find many, many more examples for yourself.
After claiming that “people have died” after being called misogynists, while “nobody ever dies after being called a misandrist,” Mr. Mendel winds up his speech with this stirring conclusion:
I support the struggles of people who are in bad positions. I respect it, in a way, for I have also seen great struggle. My struggle is not over, nor will it end until my death. For I struggle with something that will not go away through legislation or social change. The Men’s Rights Movement, however, struggles with something very changeable. Very malleable, able to be fixed within a generation if so desired. So I will support them, for they have a fighting chance. …
/r/MensRights is controversial for a reason. In the same sense as Jews of the 1890s, Irish of the 1850s, Hispanics of the 1350s, and many more. Each generation has their controversial improvement in society. We’ve gotten off easy so far, but we have to make it happen eventually. As far back as anyone living can remember, the table has been imbalanced in one way or another, favoring men or women. It’s time the table stays level for once. We need equality.
And that’s what /r/MensRights is trying to do.
Oy yoy yoy. There’s so much ridiculousness to unpack there that it makes me tired. I think I’ll go take a nap.
Mr. Mendel followed his stirring introduction with some questions for the denizens of r/mensrights. And there was some discussion. I can’t even. Not right now. I’ll get to all that in a future post.
In the meantime, Skepchick’s Rebecca Watson – who has been on the receiving end of r/menrights’ heroic activism more than once — has her own reaction to the Men’s Rights is the Subreddit of the Day announcement.
Posted on January 31, 2013, in a voice for men, advocacy of violence, all about the menz, antifeminism, dozens of upvotes, excusing abuse, FemRAs, GirlWritesWhat, grandiosity, hundreds of upvotes, misogyny, MRA, narcissism, oppressed men, playing the victim, reddit, spermjacking and tagged antifeminism, men's rights, misogyny, MRA, reddit. Bookmark the permalink. 1,090 Comments.
@cloudiah
It wasn’t me, but does the recipe call for nutritional yeast? Because that is absolutely wonderful on popcorn and is also, if you can eat cheese, delicious in addition to cheese in things like mac and cheese.
“Yeah, that’s why I was banned – not for trolling or harassing or calling anyone names, but for politely if persistently disagreeing with the denizens until then-moderator ignatiusloyola threw a fit.”
You run a website where you cherry pick the worst of MRA’s to paint them all as assholes, and you are surprised that they don’t want you there?
Holy shit I have never seen such a big sense of entitlement before.
Think carefully before you move to New Zealand…
“Yeah, that’s why I was banned – not for trolling or harassing or calling anyone names, but for politely if persistently disagreeing with the denizens until then-moderator ignatiusloyola threw a fit.”
You run a website that cherry picks the worst of MRA internet commenters to paint them as jerks and you are surprised that they don’t want you around?
New troll doesn’t seem to understand how the icons work. Or anything else, really.
:( Poor birds. And poor kitties, I’ve rarely encountered cats that liked being cooped up all day.
I guess I’ll just have to look for places that do Spanish chocolate round here then.
Not sure if this guy can’t tell when he’s posted, or if he’s trying to pretend to be two people.
I saw that business mentioned in the paper here, katz. Notice how whenever someone (always seems to be a man) calls for getting rid of cats for environmental reasons, they have to phrase it in such a blamey,anthropomorphic way? ““That little ball of fluff you own is a natural born killer,” makes it sound like cats just go out saying “I am going to wipe out an endangered species today, mwahahahaha!” They’re animals. They’re carnivores. They do what is natural for them to do. But humans, the ones who introduced them in the first place, talk as if they’re morally culpable. I sometimes wonder if this sort of thing is as much about hating cats as it is about (rightful) concern for native species.
“It’s not as if Men’s Rights Redditors regularly give dozens if not hundreds of upvotes to posts from unhinged hate sites like A Voice for Men or Angry Harry,or fall all over themselves praising an internet-famous female MRA who thinks that many abused women “demand” their abuse.”
That’s guilt by association. You can’t just pretend that because they said something stupid EVERYTHING they say will equally as stupid.
On Rockidol and fathertime89: Terrible minds think alike or someone didn’t read the comments policy? :)
Although, since expecting them to read and understand the posts is too much to ask (as they amply demonstrate in their comments), perhaps I should give them credit for reading the comment policy and just not understanding.
CWS, indoor cats can be perfectly happy.
CWS – the Spanish chocolate chain is here in Australia, I don’t know if they have it in NZ. Come visit us in Melbourne!
With cats living indoors, it depends on how much room you have, how much attention you can give ‘em and how young they got accustomed to it. I keep my two indoors all the time, more for their own safety than anything else (and I’ve never been confident that Mads would come in when called).
Third comment by the same handle as the second, so probably couldn’t figure out how commenting worked (rather than trying to sock).
Mr C told me about the proposed cat ban the other day. The guy behind it does sound a bit suspiciously passionate in his attempts to make cat owners see that they all own a Greebo.
“It’s not as if they think “spermjacking” is a real thing in the world”
It has happened, they even have links to it. Here it took me less than 10 seconds just by searching sperm on the subreddit.
http://www.mommyish.com/2011/11/23/woman-steals-ex-boyfriends-sperm-has-twins-sues-for-child-support-836/
Actually I could do with an angry troll rant as a distraction from all the pretentious twaddle I’m reading for work (I’m going through promo emails). I mean honestly…
>On Rockidol and fathertime89: Terrible minds think alike or someone didn’t read the comments policy?
It logged me out and logged me in as someone else and I couldn’t see my old comment so I assumed it wasn’t posted. Sorry.
Weeeeee!! Dumb troll!! First comment I read is he is disputing the proportion of the stupidity of each of his comments. He’s probably right, I imagine one of his comments was probably stupider than others. Perhaps he’d like some sort of metric of stupidity to be applied to everything he’s said so that we are all clear on exactly how stupid he is being at any given time.
@cloudiah YES! The popcorn recipe is me. And now I want it myself but it’s late and BoyFantastic is in some kind of mood so won’t make it for me :(
@SomeGal Yeppers, nutritional yeast FTW!
BoyFantastic is watching Spin City at the moment, there is proper out and out spermjacking in this episode, maybe this is where the MRAs got the idea? However, in the last episode it had one of my favourite exchanges ever: “C’mon Mike, we’re a dying breed. Who’s looking out for the middle class, heterosexual white male?!” “…Congress?”
Having an outdoor cat can be very unsafe for the cat, depending on your area. I have some friends who have barn cats and one goes missing about every year or two. I would always keep my cats inside because I would worry about them.
But everyone’s circumstances are different.
Cassandra – good grief. What a pretentious tosser.
Heheh if I owned a Greebo I’d put him in a box and hand him to Mr Cats Are Killers and say “Don’t open the box …”
All this cheese talk. So much cheese talk. ::nom nom nom::
Fathertime/crawled out from under a rock/whatever your name is: don’t whine about cherrypicking. The MRM sites have plenty more than the gems David quotes here. The links demonstrate it. These guys (and presumably you, since you’re whining about them being treated so badly) hate women and are pro-rape, pro-pedophelia and pro-violence. Nobody’s impressed with you or your claims (you personally and the MRM in general).
@CassandraSays
The last band I had to deal with refused to acknowledge they were influenced by any bands ever; they were far too unique. But some people said they sounded like Evanesence or Lacuna Coil.
I’m like… yeah, I can see that from LOOKING AT YOU. GIVE ME SOMETHING THAT’S NOT ABOUT HOW ‘YOU ARE THE NIGHT’.
Blahdeeblahblah, we are not entirely made up of rape apologists whose few acts of activism serve to stop funding to domestic abuse shelters- well guess what, dude, when that is the sentiment in an overwhelming majority of the sites dedicated to your ‘movement’, it’s time to find another movement.
Ah, most of the cats I’ve known have been free-roaming cats and have been very unhappy when they have to be locked inside.
I guess a better solution would be to bell the cats?
On cherrypicking: Many of the worst things I quote come from some of the most prominent MRAs out there. Most of the comments I quote from r/mensrights have numerous upvotes, sometimes dozens or hundreds, and when I post comments that have been downvoted, I note that they’ve been downvoted. Also, I generally ignore the worst of the worst in the MRM, like those who consider Marc Lepine to be a hero. Please point me to the completely reasonable MR sites that aren’t full of misogyny that you think I’m somehow ignoring.
On the rest: r/mensrights can ban whoever they want. It just seems a teensy bit hypocritical for MRAs to describe it as a bastion of free speech when they regularly ban people who disagree with them.
Meanwhile, I let people who disagree with me post here and only ban them if they’re abusive or otherwise really badly behaved.
@thenatfantastic
I’ve started putting nutritional yeast in almost everything we eat. The boyfriend had low levels of vitamin B so it seemed like a good strategy (and he may not be able to get it from anything but injections, but it can’t hurt to eat more yeast). Recently, I discovered that it goes great with rice and/or black beans.
@Katz
BoyFantastic’s sister lives in the middle of the countryside. She rescued five cats a few years ago, only one is left :/
My kitties weren’t allowed out of the front garden at all, but Jemima* once escaped through the attic window, ran along the terraced roofs and was thrown out of the house she intruded on, which ended up with me lying underneath a hedge in that house’s front yard for 45 minutes shaking a box of cat treats trying to get her back.
(*My terminally dim kitty. She used to trip over her own paws, try to lick cheesegraters and fal over backwards trying to chase flies)
“don’t whine about cherrypicking”
This is cherrypicking. He’s pointing out their worst behavior and pretending this represents all of them. That is the definition of cherry picking.
“These guys (and presumably you, since you’re whining about them being treated so badly) hate women and are pro-rape, pro-pedophelia and pro-violence.”
Seriously?
You realize these are actual people and not cartoon characters right?
Someone get that person an exorcist! :P
@ nat
Working with bands and trying not to laugh when they say hilariously pretentious things has given me a great poker face. The PR people are sometimes even worse, though. I just did an interview with a lovely older Mancunian gent who was in two of the most influential bands of the 70s/80s, and he was perfectly reasonable, but his PR person? Oy.
The rule of the lower down the food chain someone is the more pretentious and prone to wanky diva behavior they’re likely to be tends to hold true in most parts of the music industry.
Yes, fathertime, yes they are real people. Real people who hate women. They exist. Dude, you will get no traction here. Better to discuss an actual issue that affects men and see people’s reaction to it (also, what cartoons were you watching as a child? Egads!).
“Many of the worst things I quote come from some of the most prominent MRAs out there.”
Read: Most of it is commenters, but yeah you’ve done enough that “many” are prominent.
“Please point me to the completely reasonable MR sites that aren’t full of misogyny that you think I’m somehow ignoring.”
This is a pointless challenge. Any website that allows comments will have trolls on it no matter the subject matter. I’ve seen individuals who call themselves MRA’s that seem reasonable. They still count even if they don’t have a blog.
Perhaps this is a generational issue? Because the cartoons of my childhood (70s-early 80s) did not feature angry dudes ranting about how the age of consent should be done away with and how divorce is rape.
“Yes, fathertime, yes they are real people. Real people who hate women.”
If you honestly think that it’s nothing but pro violence pedophiles then I bet your only experience with MRA’s comes from other people telling you how horrible they are (like this site).
OK… so, can you point us to an MRA with a consistent record of insightful, reasonable, non-frothy-bigoted commentary?
Have you ever read Elam’s shit, for instance? Or Ferdinand Bardamau? Roissy? Roosh V? They talk about rape, they brag about it. The trolls we have had here like NWO slave actually want women beaten on the street for wearing clothes said trolls disapprove of. These men hail the child abuser and suicide Thomas Ball as a hero and martyr. They want women’s voting rights removed. One of them actually called for baby girls’ larynxes to be removed and was upvoted for it
Go fuck yourself. You’re defending men who want to, or have, commited rape and gods know what other forms of abuse against women and children.
This troll has a socky smell about him.
@SomeGal
We don’t use it that often, but in the places we do it’s a total lifesaver. I can make cheese sauce! And popcorn that tastes like Wotsits/Cheetos!
It’s pretty funny actually, my mum gets bare paranoid about my vitamin levels and whatnot because I’m vegan. She emails me once a week with something she’s convinced herself I’m not getting enough of, and the DIRE CONSEQUENCES if I don’t. Always forgetting I’m a vegan who makes all her own food from scratch, paying attention to a vitamin chart I have pinned up in my kitchen, and she’s a pescatarian who lives off ready meals. The last time was her being convinced I was DYING because I didn’t get enough B12, so I made her a list of what I’d eaten in the past 24 hours which was fortified with B12 (nutritional yeast, vegan butter, soya milk, etc, etc.), then asked her what she’d had – nothing at all. Possibly the best part was the reason she’d convinced herself I was DYING – lack of B12 – was because her friend had just been diagnosed with something to do with lack of B12. Where lack of it was a SYMPTOM – her friend’s body couldn’t absorb it – not a cause. But yeah, me making food fresh from vegetables every night is sooooo unhealthy *headdesk*
Naturally, if you cut a cat off from part of her territory, she will be upset about it. Like if we shut our bedroom door, Mot will whine and put her paws under the door, but she does that at the front door, because outside isn’t part of her territory.
Bells are helpful to most birds, but obviously they are not much help to kiwis!
I’d think that on average vegans probably eat better than most people in that unless they’re lucky enough to live in a major metropolitan area they’re likely to have to make most of their food themselves.
I think a sock would know how WordPress commenting works. Also, he’s throwing all the absolute most basic points at us, and most socks have evolved beyond that point. I think he’s new.
WE’VE BEEN VISITED BY FATHER TIME AND NO ONE TOLD ME?!!??!?!!!?!
“Go fuck yourself. You’re defending men who want to, or have, commited rape and gods know what other forms of abuse against women and children.”
Do you know why I compared them to cartoons? Because the whole idea that everyone in there is there because they love rape and pedophile is insane. They are not a league of villains or a group dedicated to evil. It’s not that black and white.
And I say that as a devoted omnivore. I could probably construct an entirely vegan diet from prepared foods here, but I don’t think I could have done so in Scotland without putting a lot of time, effort, and money into shopping.
@ fathertime- See, I didn’t say the MRM was all pro-violence pedophiles. I said it`s a group whose prominent heroes are rape apologist misogynists. And I’ll go further and say the dialogue of this group serves to propagate and re-enforce rape apologist, dv apologist discourse, and their only ‘activism’ has been to cut funding for women’s services. When the ideology of a group is based around misogyny, being a member of a group effectively identifies you as a misogynist by your tacit support of misogynists. Sort of like how your membership of the clan doesn’t guarantee you enjoy acts of violence against ethnic minorities, but it indicates you are supporting it.
In the Middle East? Impossible, there’s dairy in almost everything. In Thailand? Impossible, there’s fish sauce in everything that isn’t a dessert.
Y’know something, Crawled From Under A Rock? I don’t give a fuck if there are “moderate” or “reasonable” MRAs out there. Because if there are (which I doubt) they’re not doing anything about the ones who want women abused and enslaved. They’re not saying anything like “Hey, this isn’t what men’s rights is about! We’re looking for better healthcare and more help for men who are victims of DV or sexual assault!” They’re not calling out Warren Farrell for saying incest is good and any women who say they didn’t like being raped by their fathers must be lying. No, they’re making up lies about him being set upon at a university campus.
But you know, if genuine men’s issues are the sort of things you are concerned about, there are groups out there who are trying to help. They’re called feminists. Because all the MRM is about is pushing women into a worse situation than the one we were in a century ago. These cretins talk about Saudi Arabia as a matriarchy. They complain about pedophilia being frowned upon. They complain about women having any control over when or if we will reproduce.
Amen to that sister. My last two reviews: One band on their debut album, where I pointed out where their production values may have been improved in order to make them sound more awesome, and one guy who’s been recording since the 70s, where I slated the sound half his album because the production values sucked.
Guess which one took the trouble to find me on Facebook, thank me for the good review and offer me a place on a tour and which one banned me from their gigs?
Hm, I’m looking for the place where David said that everyone in the MRM is there because they love rape and pedophilia. Not finding it. Citation?
*70s guy was bezzies with Crass too.
“OK… so, can you point us to an MRA with a consistent record of insightful, reasonable, non-frothy-bigoted commentary?”
You think I keep a record of everyone I talk to on the internet?
Eh, I can’t be bothered to go over 101 issues with the troll. We need a site devoted to debunking MRA myths from a 101 perspective that we can point people at so we don’t have to keep going over the basics.
fathertime, here’s an easier challenge for you: give me the names of half a dozen reasonably prominent MRAs online who are decent people and not misogynists.
You’re still not rocking that cartoon analogy- a rape apologist pedophile who tried to take over the world by blowing up the moon (or something) is a super villain. A rape apologist asshole who writes hateful crap in the internet is an asshole.
thenat – “and she’s a pescatarian who lives off ready meals”
If those ready meals are anything like the ones we get here, I can only imagine what your mum’s salt levels are like! I had to cut those things almost entirely out of my diet when I was diagnosed with NAFLD.
This one isn’t even bothering to point us to Fidelbogen or whoever. He’s just out-and-out admitting that he’d need to keep studious records of every MRA he ever talks to in order to have a snowball’s chance of finding one who isn’t despicable.
I like hanging out with you guys! This is nice.
” Because if there are (which I doubt) they’re not doing anything about the ones who want women abused and enslaved. ”
There’s nothing they really can do. Anyone can call themselves an MRA and make hateful rants which fall under free speech. Same is true of people who call themselves liberals or conservatives.
I mean, there must be at least one person who calls himself an MRA who’s not horrible out there. Said person would probably be very new to the whole thing and not have encountered some of the more, um, interesting characters yet.
@Cassandra I’ve wanted to be vegan since I was about 14, but lived in Bradford until about 18 months ago. Basically I met BF and needed to cook for him (we were doing long distance at the time) so I learned how to cook vegan, but it was bloody hard. I moved to Bristol 18 months ago and was on the dole, so I could only spend about £7/week on food shopping, so I couldn’t afford eggs, cheese or milk, and I needed vegan substitutes in for when BF would come to stay – and they were cheaper – so I’d just use them, until I realised I’d managed 6 months totally vegan without even realising. Now I live in Brighton it’s amazing. We can go *anywhere* and eat vegan, because people understand it here. When I go home to Bradford it’s still difficult, but I do struggle through. However, if I still lived there I doubt I’d have made the change from veggie to vegan, if I did I’d be living on potatoes.
Well, if there’s a non-anon commenter on a blog I frequent who gives lots of good, interesting, or funny comments then I tend to remember their name because I enjoy their commentary.
So, y’know, this kind of indicates that you don’t make notes of the ‘reasonable ones’, they don’t exist, or that prominent MRA sites freeze them out…
Pecunium — tempting me to play with fire! …think a wide mouth nalgene would work?
Cassandra — milk substitute for coffee? I use coffee mate’s hazelnut. Honey does work though, did that and sugar in the raw when I was working at this hippie co-op (lol shortest job ever, I’m not same enough for being left in charge with no extra hands on my second week >.< )
>This one isn’t even bothering to point us to Fidelbogen or whoever. He’s just out-and-out admitting that he’d need to keep studious records of every MRA he ever talks to in order to have a snowball’s chance of finding one who isn’t despicable.
Is it really that hard to believe that I don’t remember the usernames of everyone I spoke to on the internet?
I don’t even go to MRA sites. I ran into them on random threads on the internet so pardon me if I don’t have their names memorized.
But oh well I guess if you only talk to the same people all the time it’d be easier to remember their names.
“So, y’know, this kind of indicates that you don’t make notes of the ‘reasonable ones’, ”
I don’t take notes of anyone I meet on the internet, because I go to large websites where there’s 100 or so people on at any given moment.
I’m sorry if I don’t obsessively write down the names of everyone who seems interesting, I have much better things to do with my time.
We need a site devoted to debunking MRA myths from a 101 perspective that we can point people at so we don’t have to keep going over the basics.
I’d do it except I think my debunking would come down to “get out of your computer chair, go into the outside world, and just experience it for once, please, before the vitamin D deficiency gets to you”
One. Just one. Someone you’ve met who seemed cool. You don’t even have to do this from memory; you can go check.
Anything I’m putting in coffee is being put in there to counter the acidity, which my stomach doesn’t react well to. I can drink really good espresso straight sometimes, but that’s mostly because it’s such a small quantity.
You should see DadFantastic! He is a meat eater who puts salt on all his food – including curry* and BACON SANDWICHES. In his ‘defence’ he’s smoked for 40 years so can’t really taste anything but yeah I’m basically bracing myself for having to rush up to visit him in hospital.
(*He lives in the curry capital of England. Any curry he gets is proper home-style Pakistani/Bangladeshi/Indian food)
Sorry I have turned this thread into a rant about my parents’ eating habits.
New troll is rapidly slipping into lulz troll getting frustrated territory, I wonder how long it will be until meltdown.
@ nat
I have an uncle who puts ketchup on everything. I feel your pain. He puts it in soup! He also drinks Irn Bru with his whiskey, and adds soy sauce to all Chinese food before even tasting it.