Reddit Shitlords Give Other Reddit Shitlords Prestigious Shitlord Award
Art borrowed from Casey Nelson of SeeBeautifulIndiana.com. (Click pic to go there.)
Today is an auspicious day. For the Men’s Rights Subreddit, which we often write about here on Man Boobz, has won the prestigious World’s Greatest Shitlord Award. Oh, sorry, I mean it won the Subreddit of the Day award on Reddit. Which is, in this case, pretty much the same thing.
Here are some highlights from the official announcement , which I am totally not making up. No, really, you can go look. Someone – that being XavierMendel, one of the mods of r/subredditoftheday — actually wrote these things. And meant them. I AM NOT BEING SARCASTIC THIS IS REAL HOLY SHIT.
The topic at hand today takes a generous turn from our amusing and lighthearted articles of the month. On this, the last day of January, we look at something a bit more worthy to be called an article. /r/MensRights comes up a lot across reddit and, indeed, across the world as being one of the few centers for men’s help. It’s often attacked, and is always the center of one controversy or the other. My questions reflect that. MensRights is, undoubtedly, the home of great activists.
Again. I am not making this up.
There were some people close to me that suggested I not run this article. That the repercussions of doing so would be unreasonably bad. Well, here you go, people. This is my way of saying that a good reporter doesn’t care. A good reporter reports. It’s not in my job to care about consequences.
I’m not sure that Mr. Mendel quite understands the difference between “reporting” and “asskissing.”
/r/MensRights. Never in our society could the uninitiated imagine such a place. A place where feminism is questioned, and our culture is deconstructed to find what it’s really up to.
Hahaha, what? I was not aware that feminism wasn’t ever questioned on the internet, or anywhere else in “our society.” I mean, it’s not like I run a blog that features nearly 500 posts detailing people attacking feminism on the internet, most of them nastily and ignorantly and sometimes using the word “cunt,” and the vast majority of them not on Reddit. And it’s not like this only barely scratches the surface of the subject.
/r/MensRights is one of the last fortifications of free thought to exist on Reddit.
Yeah, that’s why I was banned – not for trolling or harassing or calling anyone names, but for politely if persistently disagreeing with the denizens until then-moderator ignatiusloyola threw a fit.
“Surely you jest,” one might tell me, “when you mean they’re alone in this regard?” No, hypothetical 19th century British gentleman, I do not. I truly mean it when I say that. What other subreddit openly questions feminism? None spring to mind, and I make it my duty to catalog various subreddits. Most end up banned or run down within a month. Only /r/MensRights remains.
Reddit: Bastion of Internet Feminism.
Nobody can say for sure whether or not they’re correct in any single regard. It’s certain that, due to the laws of probability, they’re not correct in every regard. However, it’s also certain that they’re correct in most of them. Occasionally a wackjob or two will suggest that feminism is behind Cinnamon Toast Crunch (The taste you can see!™). The accuser latches onto those wackjobs to denounce the whole movement.
Yeah, it’s not as if comments suggesting that a man allegedly wronged in divorce court should turn to murder got literally dozens of upvotes in r/mensrights, or anything.
Oh wait, they did.
Yeah, it’s not as if Men’s Rights Redditors gave literally hundreds of upvotes to a post about a t-shirt suggesting that men could be convicted of rape simply for being in a room alone with a woman.
Oh wait, they did.
It’s not as if Men’s Rights Redditors regularly give dozens if not hundreds of upvotes to posts from unhinged hate sites like A Voice for Men or Angry Harry,or fall all over themselves praising an internet-famous female MRA who thinks that many abused women “demand” their abuse.
It’s not as if they think “spermjacking” is a real thing in the world that should make all men think twice about ejaculating in the general vicinity of women.
It’s not like … oh, you can find many, many more examples for yourself.
After claiming that “people have died” after being called misogynists, while “nobody ever dies after being called a misandrist,” Mr. Mendel winds up his speech with this stirring conclusion:
I support the struggles of people who are in bad positions. I respect it, in a way, for I have also seen great struggle. My struggle is not over, nor will it end until my death. For I struggle with something that will not go away through legislation or social change. The Men’s Rights Movement, however, struggles with something very changeable. Very malleable, able to be fixed within a generation if so desired. So I will support them, for they have a fighting chance. …
/r/MensRights is controversial for a reason. In the same sense as Jews of the 1890s, Irish of the 1850s, Hispanics of the 1350s, and many more. Each generation has their controversial improvement in society. We’ve gotten off easy so far, but we have to make it happen eventually. As far back as anyone living can remember, the table has been imbalanced in one way or another, favoring men or women. It’s time the table stays level for once. We need equality.
And that’s what /r/MensRights is trying to do.
Oy yoy yoy. There’s so much ridiculousness to unpack there that it makes me tired. I think I’ll go take a nap.
Mr. Mendel followed his stirring introduction with some questions for the denizens of r/mensrights. And there was some discussion. I can’t even. Not right now. I’ll get to all that in a future post.
In the meantime, Skepchick’s Rebecca Watson – who has been on the receiving end of r/menrights’ heroic activism more than once — has her own reaction to the Men’s Rights is the Subreddit of the Day announcement.
Posted on January 31, 2013, in a voice for men, advocacy of violence, all about the menz, antifeminism, dozens of upvotes, excusing abuse, FemRAs, GirlWritesWhat, grandiosity, hundreds of upvotes, misogyny, MRA, narcissism, oppressed men, playing the victim, reddit, spermjacking and tagged antifeminism, men's rights, misogyny, MRA, reddit. Bookmark the permalink. 1,090 Comments.
Cheatress?
I think cheatress is supposed to mean cheater, not really sure why it has to be gendered though…
But whatever, yeah, her options are to stop fucking him or let him continue to abuse her, obvious thing is obvious? Not sure it’s really that simple, but yes, those are the obvious options (not sure it’s that simple because of things like blackmail, but since she doesn’t mention that, probably not relevant)
And this is totally not the thread for “but why didn’t you leave?”
Discussing abuse in the context of “incentives” for abusers to stop abusing is really fucking gross, fyi.
Yeah there’s that, and fuck, even if she does stop “satisfying his needs”, that’s only going to make him more abusive, not less (in my experience anyways)
Also, humbly, can we take this to the proper thread? It’s over this way — http://manboobz.com/2013/01/28/the-mens-rights-subreddit-a-net-exporter-of-hate/
Of course, it’s just such an obvious (and obnoxious) way to demonstrate that, in your mind, the individual is defined by two traits: Cheating and being female.
Just to update everyone, I bought the Lamb Chop pattern. It was stuck in my head and I knew it wouldn’t leave until I bought it.
Also, this is factually incorrect:
Apparently you don’t understand either feminism or Marxism.
katz — I appear to have misread your confusion again, thinking it was straight confusion when you were having confusion (or at least a head tilting owl) of wtf? nature. I apologize and shall retreat to the corner of shame!
I really must learn how to interpret head tilting owls! (Wtf is this nonsense? Wtf do you mean? Wtf does Argenti have a working brain…)
Lamb Chop was stuck in your head?
Argenti, it was supposed to be a “did you seriously just use the word ‘cheatress?'” owl. But head-tilting owls are indeed ambiguous. We’d better return to stable-headed owls instead.
LOL, you evil person! I see your video and raise you Mouth and MacNeal. The chorus can be sung ad infinitum (as I did, as a child, in the car, to my parents’ annoyance).
Bwhahahahaaha
I am so glad Purple Star came here to clarify their thoughts and display their ignorance. I feel truly blessed to have been here for it.
@katz, there was a link to Sexual Marmite in your second video clip. I looked. I wish I hadn’t.
There was? I…have no idea what that is about.
As I pointed out last time when Purple Star said
he doesn’t just want sex. If he did, he wouldn’t abuse her. He wants to abuse. So, by continuing to blame her for “giving him what he wants,” you are blaming her for giving him the ability to abuse her. That is victim-blaming.
And please let’s not pretend that she can stay or go are somehow equal or easy choices. I can stay with or leave the boyfriend as well, but I am both financially dependent and disabled. (I also don’t want to leave, but that is irrelevant here.) We have no idea how the choices of the ABUSE VICTIM may be constrained. It is almost unthinkable that they are completely unconstrained. So don’t pull “she can stay or go” especially while implying that, if she stays, she is somehow then responsible for the actions of her abuser.
(This is my second try posting this, I dealt with Purple Star’s bullshit last time, and I am almost out of spoons so apologies if something is unclear or oversimplified.)
Or shitwaffle!
Thanks for that marmite warning!
katz — Rotate your Owl! Yes, always a good fallback owl! Still, sorry if my attempt at clarification came off sounding like a know-it-all.
And I’m still going to the corner of shame, cuz I left my violin over there and have a date with some dead composers :)
Yay for Lamb Chop and owls. Is anyone here familiar with Lamb Chop’s Nutcracker Suite? I grew up with it and alway sing the words in my head whenever I hear the music.
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=qCtFKP79LRI&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DqCtFKP79LRI
It is true that we use the term “troll” differently here than it is used elsewhere. If you prefer, The PurpleStar, I can just call you an asswaffle.
katz, I loved that first owl. (I loved the 2nd one too, but I had seen it before.)
Some Gal — that was clearer than my attempt at guessing why she might stay!
@Argenti
Thanks. I just hate when victim blamers try to pull the “I am not blaming the victim for how they were victimized, I’m just blaming them for this thing that cannot be separated from it.” It is one if the things that makes me really angry because it is either thoughtless while pretending to be thoughtful or dishonest while pretending some momentous truth-telling. Ugh.
Lamb Chop was the only show I was allowed to watch as a kid. We went over to a friend’s house to watch it. So much nostalgia!
I loved Animal Farm right away, but a. I read it of my own free will and b. I already had a geeky interest in communist history, so I had fun playing Spot That Historical Allegory. 1984 is a better book overall, I think, but Animal Farm is a great intro to Orwell.
@ Falconer
Far From the Madding Crowd is a much, much more interesting book than Jude the Obscure. Still depressing, but more interesting.
RE Wool alternatives for people who’re allergic (represent!), I love the Babysoft sweaters from French Connection. Warm, not too heavy, and not itchy at all even for people like me who’re such babies that even cashmere causes us pain.
I really like the Lion Brand and Mary Maxim acrylics as I find them nice to knit and wear. So far, I’m not impressed with Red Heart Super Saver as it feels really harsh, but I’m only making a snuggle sack thing in it for partner, in camo and brown. :)
I now have a zucchini loaf in the oven, so that has dealt to the free zucchini I got from a work colleague. It also has sultanas in the recipe, it really is looking like a carrot cake copy. I think the recipe is American, as it has called for oil and not butter.
For lovers of weird slang and prison novels involving homemade hot air balloons, I’d like to recommend the book On the Yard by Malcolm Braly. For lovers of stories about octogenarian widows in Florida who get involved with drug kingpins and roommates who enjoy coffee enemas, I recommend Mrs. Ted Bliss by Stanley Elkin.
I realize those are sort of specific genres, but those are two books I read recently and loved.
Sexism is endemic to all of the worlds major religions, especially those that are monotheistic. The bible say that God create Man in his image, and by “man” it specifically means MEN(read male humans). Woman was made in the image of men with a few physical alterations but you get the idea.So if you are a woman and you wanna be with Jesus when you die, you had better be a submissive housewife and mother. But ya don’t have to take my word for it! Read your bible(but only the authorized King James version).
Because… the KJV isn’t the last word on monotheistic scriptures. It’s not the first word.
It’s completely irrelevant to the majority of monotheists in the world.
When you take the other major religions (buddhism in all its flavors, for one) the prime tenet of your “SMRT” Atheism falls apart; because “The Bible” isn’t relevant to but a few of them; and the specific bible you mention to only small slice.
Not only wrong, but stupidly wrong.
Wrong the way down the stack to the last turtle.
Purple Star:
While the Flying Spaghetti Monster certainly is trolling here on manboobz, I’ve noticed that anyone who disagrees with the particular interpretation of feminism(along with overall socio-political paradigm) is conveniently branded a *Troll*.
Really?
While I am not completely sympatico with the way troll is used here, what I see is that bad-faith arguing is the trigger point, not disagreement.
I suspect my variance to usage has more to do with my preferring to think people ignorant, or stupid, more than mendacious. I am often disappointed.
I’d like to follow up about my comments regarding the cheatress with the abusive lover: I was not insinuating that she deserved to be abused. What I was pointing out is that her lover has no respect or empathy for her. Therefore, as long as she satisfies his needs he has no incentive to be concerned with her needs nor to stop treating her so bad. I hope she has finally come to realize that she cannot change him and her only options are to dump him and never fuck him again, or suffer his abuse for the sake of sex.
1: How do you know he had no empathy? How do you know he was, “treating her so bad”? What makes you think abuse is ongoing?
2: Who cares? The post wasn’t about her. It was about douchecanoes who thought ripping into her was justified.
3: It was about how a “safe” community allowed it to happen.
4: You didn’t give a rat’s ass about that, and still seem to think it was about her. It wasn’t, it isn’t and that makes you a douchecanoe.
If he is still abusing her, that factors into things too, as abuse isn’t cut and dried.
Since we don’t know the specifics, going about who should/could do what, and the meaning of what we do know… douchecanoe cubed.
For anyone who liked lots of books which are thought of as, “Classics”, I commend “Silverlock”.
I didn’t like most of what I had to read in my high school lit class (hated Grapes of Wrath), though my other half my english classes were quite good. Gatsby was ok. Catcher in the Rye was terrible. Lord of the flies wasn’t bad. The Jungle, Horrid. Johnny Got His Gun was heavy handed. Hemmingway…. sucks. I think what gets me is the books which are taught to standard, rather than investigated as if they were new.
Teachers who did that made even things I didn’t like interesting. Those which had, “right” answers were only interesting insofar as I could enjoy the prose.
“Therefore, as long as she satisfies his needs he has no incentive to be concerned with her needs nor to stop treating her so bad.”
So, she’s responsible for his behavior? He could, with his on free will, stop being an abuser and tell her the relationship is over. It’s just a thought. Why are you trying to normalize the abuser’s behavior?
Why is it that whenever asswaffles complain about all major religions they always seem to quote the Bible, as if it was somehow a Hindu holy text, or some shit?
They never seem to quote the Bhagadvad Gita, though. Go back to comparative religions, asswaffle!
Oh also pretty much anything by Flannery O’Connor and Zora Neale Hurston.
At least Hemmingway can shorten your pants.
Speaking of religion, Pecunium, you do the various saint days? If so, send some of that Brighid feast my way? Haven’t decided wtf I’m doing yet.
For the rest of you in the northern hemisphere: half way to spring!
Yay Brigid, Ireland’s first abortionist.
http://choiceireland.blogspot.ie/2008/02/happy-st-brigids-day-irelands-first.html?m=1
And yeah, seconding the hatred for basically everything read for class — particularly my 11th grade lit teacher, but all of them really, had a magically ability to make the interesting horrible (Ethan Frome’s pickle dish anyone?)
One exception, I took classical mythology in college, with a prof who’d been teaching over 60 years at that point, and maybe it was that he had a tangent for everything, but he made things I’d read and hated into interesting pieces of history. He did treat everything like it was being examined for the first time, assumed we had no Roman or Greek background, and *gasp* presented the history and whatever tangents he was in the mood for, and asked wtf we thought!
@katz
I read the “pants” in your comment as “penis” and started to wonder how Hemingway would accomplish THAT. o.O
Argenti: No one can do all the saint’s days. But I shall think good thoughts for you.
Some Gal — +1 internet, in the category of “things I did know and am now glad to know”…is that 1 xp point in the knowledge category? Whatever, thank you :)
Pecunium — fair enough, but you cook and feast day so I thought you might be cooking for this one :)
Thanks though, and maybe direct them at my plants, they’re definitely in need of some blessing! (Seriously, wtf is my cactus’s issue?!)
Argenti: I’m the only catholic in the house (one atheist, one jew). Worse yet, Irish cooking is hard on my partner with the dairy/nightshade issues.
Oh, didn’t even occur to me that zir dietary issues might be relevant! Just kind of figured you’d take any excuse to cook up a feast :)
And hmm, think a Scottish lament counts as an um, sacrifice is clearly the wrong word…devotion? To Brighid? My Irish jigs are too summery…
There’s a certain type of Atheist who, having developed a (entirely legitimate) beef with conservative Christianity as expressed in the US/UK, decides the problem must be “religion”, not “those assholes who are religious”. Attempts to point out that their tendency to extrapolate from a particular cultural context to the entire world are ignorant and possibly even racist are dismissed as “NARALT” or pro-religion apologia.
I like the ones, like our noodly pest here, who try to use the vague mention of “women’s rights” to get people on their side, even though they otherwise give no indication of actually giving a shit about women. Indeed, their willingness to use women and our oppression as a tool to get what they want ends up making them look like sexist asshats.
“Attempts to point out that their tendency to extrapolate from a particular cultural context to the entire world are ignorant and possibly even racist are dismissed as “NARALT” or pro-religion apologia.”
It’s at moments like these at I prefer Latin…
Because yes, their attempts at extrapolation often do end up being racist and/or ignorant. My personal “favorite” being how Islam apparently teaches that salt water and fresh water can’t mix and thus Muslims are teaching false science just like creationists. I’ve yet to have anyone prove that this isn’t a strange translation of “should not / must not”, which would make utter sense considering that salt water is Not Drinkable. /aside
Oh lord, that book almost made me throw up. I was so disgusted by the conditions the immigrants were living and working in that I didn’t pay any attention to the language.
Falconer: It wasn’t the subject matter: I knew all that, it was that the pages had more depth than the characters and that Sinclair; after putting Jurgis through 12 kinds of hell makes him happy and then removes him from that happiness as a plot device to show that true happiness will only come from a socialist system.
Which is fine, as a message, but to engage in that kind of cheap, needless, jerking around. Jurgis goes out to the countryside, is on a farm, living the sort of life he led before they left Europe, and gets a “vision” for want of a better word, that he must go back to the city and work for the saving of the world: Sinclair could have had that happen in the city.
It was cheap, and I was pissed off.
Yeah, that’s the thing, I’m totally open to critiques of how religions tend to handle women’s rights (very poorly) from someone who’s clearly interested in women having rights in general. But when someone who doesn’t appear to give a shit about women in general tries to appropriate feminism in service of their grudge against various religious groups? GTFO my movement, asshole, and one your way out the door take a moment to consider how deeply you’re insulting the intelligence of the people whose movement you just attempted to appropriate.
I feel the same way about people whose main critique of Islam (always Arabian Islam only, of course) is how the women are treated, who think feminism is finished in the West because we’re so much better.
@Karalora
Oh, that dragon looks gorgeous!
I am a really slow cross-stitcher, and I also tend to get distracted and leave projects dormant for weeks at a time, so I don’t dare try anything ambitious. (There was the Great Tigger Blanket Debacle of 2011, where I learned this the hard way.) I do a lot of funny sayings and things – I own the Subversive Cross-Stitch book, have you poked around on their website?
Are we talking faux-gressives who grate on the nerves in general? Because I just got a promo email talking about a certain German industrial band who have declared their support for FEMEN because…fuck it, I’ll just let you read their nonsense for yourselves.
Yeah, man, I’m a fan of FEMEN in that they show their boobs instead of just complaining like those other whiny feminists!
Again – dudes like this, you’re not helping, so do be so kind as to go fuck yourself.
(Putting “fan” in scare quotes was a particularly nice “it’s not like I actually care about the issues” touch.)
So the latest movie version of “Jane Eyre” was on this afternoon, the one with Michael Fassbinder.
I blame you all for my watching the latter 2/3 of it while making dinner. :p
What about people who use the phrase “[holding/setting] back feminism”? Because for whatever reasons that phrase never seems to be used about people who are actually setting back feminism in any way.
Actually that phrase mostly seems to be used to mean that the person in question is setting back feminism by being a feminist.
You know what sets feminism even further back? Advocating for equal rights for women! We need to stop!
I’ve mostly heard it from conservative-ish adolescent nerdy types of either gender accusing some poor women of setting feminism back by partying, or taking some sort of drug, or or wearing revealing clothing, or taking photographs of herself, or being traditionally feminine, or not being traditionally feminine, or…
Dressing “like a slut”…slutwalks…dressing “like a prude”…shaving…not shaving…wearing makeup…not wearing makeup…taking her husbands name…not taking her husbands name…
On one hand, you have the “any cultural narrative is patriarchy so doing any of the things society expects you to do is supporting the patriarchy and thus setting back feminism” group, on the other you’ve got the “not following cultural narratives makes feminism look inaccessible and gives feminism a bad name” (shaving supports the patriarchy! // hairy legged feminists!)
Aren’t double standards delicious? Here, have actually delicious things, confetti cake with vanilla frosting! Enjoy!
I usually see it in the “tone troll” way, telling some person they aren’t doing the group they support any good, because they are alienating people by being vocal about the injustice they want fixed.
“If ‘X’ just weren’t so hostile/militant/vocal about it, then ‘Y’ would be more willing to support them.”
Which is, of course bullshit. If “Y” were supportive, then “X” wouldn’t need to be activist.
I’ve also seen it about not being anti-abortion by an odd young woman whose idea of feminism focused around third-world aid (but not contraceptive aid!), opposing abortion, not liking pink children’s toys, and making it well-known that not all women sleep around or anything.
She took (reasonably mild) a gender studies course at my uni, and I’d be interested to see her how tutes turned out.
Just looked those up, and lord are they colourful!
Ah yes, the old “don’t alienate the majority because you can’t change anything without them!” argument.
Turns out the majority didn’t fix the problem and that’s why we’re doing it.
Unless there’s some massive unforeseen catastrophe or social shift that’ll change things. That’ll happen someday, right?
lowquacks — the weirdest part of that weirdness? Pink was associated with boys a century or so ago. (For no particular reason, I’m going to blame Mr. Kitteh’s red shoes)
In the West, yeah. Because it was a light shade of the very military red, apparently. This particular fact seemed to be a big favourite in my first-year sociology/cultural studies classes for whatever reason.
Did anyone see what the 49ers did about the cornerback who make the anti-gay statement?
It’s not just that they gave him a talking to…, it’s that they making it clear they expect him to keep it up.
NEW ORLEANS — Jed York, the 49ers CEO, said Thursday he was embarrassed and frustrated by cornerback Chris Culliver’s “very dumb” anti-gay comments at a recent Super Bowl media session.
“I saw him this morning and told him, ‘It’s up to you to live up to your apology,’ ” York said. “He made a bold statement of wanting to get to know the LGBT community.”
Culliver apologized Wednesday night in a statement and expanded on that Thursday morning amid an intense and massive media session.
It lasted up until the 193os,with books on rearing children saying girls ought to be in blue, because pink was too masculine a color for them.
Urgh, fauxgressives.
I wish I had a dollar for every tumblr slacktivist who made some vague statement about oppression, said they weren’t going to do a damn thing about it, then patted themselves on the back for their rebellious spirit. I’d be able to pay a rent.
The idea that one can set back feminism by being too overtly sexual is pretty common amongst a certain group of Brits. They’re never feminists, or even vaguely femininist-friendly.
English teachers. Got a nasty surprise when our English teacher left in the middle of a term. She’d always taught us poetry by reading the text aloud first, then getting us to understand the general gist of the thing, then finally getting down to the nitty-gritty of techniques and devices. Replacement teacher’s first lesson. Starts to read a poem aloud, gets to the middle of the second line …… and pauses to ask the person she’s standing beside whether ‘that’ was alliteration or onomatopoeia (or some other challenge). Poetry instantly, and for the rest of the year, lost all its interest, let alone sparkle.
Kiwi girl. Next time you get a zucchini, just hit the google for chocolate zucchini cake. You will get eleventy gazillion hits of which all but a mere thirty odd are for much the same recipe. Oil instead of butter? Not so much American as avoiding the cream butter and sugar process in order to throw the whole lot in a bowl and stir. I often substitute half the oil with melted butter anyway.
The Daily Mail set? Because that view seems reasonably common in the constantly Poe-worthy letters page of our Mail-esque Daily Telegraph.
Pecunium — thanks for that, I just vaguely remembered it as a Victorian thing, which is ever so helpful >.<
Cassandra — really? I’m used to seeing it from radfems (maybe a subset, but still identifying as feminists) — then again, I’m extra touchy about that subset, seeing how they’re all “women born women identifying as women” and all *sigh*