Is Reddit’s Feminism subreddit run by MRAs?

Oh, Reddit, where the demographics are so skewed that virtually every discussion amongst and/or about women ultimately gets taken over by dudes doing the old “what about the dudes” routine. It’s no secret that the TwoXChromosomes subreddit has long been overrun with MRAs and FeMRAs. And now it’s become pretty clear that the Feminism subreddit has gone MRA as well.

If you want all the details of the drama, here’s a thread in the subreddit in which the feminists who’ve stuck with the subreddit take on the MRAs and MRA-symps amongst the mods.

Check out the Feminisms and SRSWomen subreddits if you want to discuss feministy stuff on Reddit without having to deal with endless derailing from MRAs and other shitlords.

EDITED TO ADD:  More links:

SRS takes on the whole mess (lots of useful links).

SRS links to r/feminism mods defending MRAs

An r/feminism thread about the recent Captain Awkward posts about creeps that is, naturally, full of endless hang-wringing about the evils of “creep-shaming.”

(Thanks, Cliff, for the links.)

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Posted on August 15, 2012, in antifeminism, feminism, FemRAs, MRA, reddit and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 181 Comments.

  1. Vanessa Emma Goldman

    SHITLORDS!!!!! yes, this is the PERFECT term for MRAs and others of their ilk!!!

  2. It’s disappointing that these asses have chosen to infect every corner of Reddit with their slime, but thanks for linking SRSWomen — “where mens get bens.” It’s very entertaining to see how they deal with the trolls.

  3. That little boy in the page gif is a little shit. Look at him laugh.

    Asshole.

  4. For those who don’t mind pages of Internets Drama, SRS has a bit more detail on the whole situation here:
    http://www.reddit.com/r/ShitRedditSays/comments/y8b9x/meta_rfeminism_just_updated_their_related/

    And the result of all this is threads like this one, in which 90% of the posters are “anti-creep-shaming,” and one is defending attraction to 16-year-old girls:
    http://www.reddit.com/r/Feminism/comments/y7ofz/the_c_word_captain_awkward_talks_about_creepy_and/

    SO FEMINIST.

  5. Or, oh God, this [TW for rape] shitshow:
    http://www.reddit.com/r/Feminism/comments/y6ysk/no_means_no/

    It’s like, yeah, there are feminists in the discussion, but they’re swamped by guys saying things like:

    yeah, except a lot of those don’t actually mean “no”
    some of them mean “I do want to, but I also want protection if I don’t like it or if I regret it tomorrow.”

    but, if the women is drunk and says yes, and you are intoxicated and unable to think correctly, it isn’t rape.

    (Why do MRAs always think “what if you’re both drunk?” is going to break our brains like telling a computer “this statement is false”? If you’re both smashed drunk don’t have sex, and if you have sex anyway, it’s rape by whoever initiated it. This shit isn’t that complicated unless you don’t really believe in consent but are just looking for loopholes.)

    every time I start to kiss a girls, even if it’s my girlfriend, I’ll write down a contract saying that I can advance into her panties then
    I swear to god, some people really want it to come to this

    Not being sure and regretting it afterwards does not a rape make.

    Mention SRS on r/feminism? Instant delete, those people are evil bigots. Defend rape on r/feminism? IMPORTANT ALTERNATE VIEWPOINT, WE MUST ADDRESS IT POLITELY.

  6. can we go burn some fedoras on Reddit’s lawn

    srsly

  7. Oop, one more link and then I’ll give it a rest:

    http://www.reddit.com/r/ShitRedditSays/comments/wksar/meta_an_%C3%A9xp%C3%B3s%C3%A9_rfeminism_is_run_by_mras/

    In which there are screencaps of basically every r/feminism mod vigorously defending “men’s rights”, or outright saying they’re an MRA.

  8. Why do MRAs always think “what if you’re both drunk?” is going to break our brains like telling a computer “this statement is false”?

    They all think they’re God’s gift to logicians. They also think a “gotcha!” is an argument winner.

    I think I’ve posted this before, but they all think they are the young woman in the feather boa in this video, and feminists are the poor computer she busts:

  9. every time I start to kiss a girls, even if it’s my girlfriend, I’ll write down a contract saying that I can advance into her panties then
    I swear to god, some people really want it to come to this

  10. “what if we are both drunk” is such a stupid question. Its like asking if its okay to drive drunk if the pedestrian you hit is drunk too. Somehow I think their tiny brains could figure out how meaningless that question is.

  11. so just what does r/feminism think feminism is?

    “we defend a woman’s right to apologize to men when they make them slightly uncomfortable”

    “we recognize women are first and foremost human beings with their own needs, unless some dude is afraid of a rape accusation”

    “we support equality for people of all genders, but most definitely equality for men because otherwise we’d sound like gross lesbians”

  12. creativewritingstudent

    And the result of all this is threads like this one, in which 90% of the posters are “anti-creep-shaming,” and one is defending attraction to 16-year-old girls:
    http://www.reddit.com/r/Feminism/comments/y7ofz/the_c_word_captain_awkward_talks_about_creepy_and/

    Ugh. It’s people like that who make me want to scream “I don’t care if Benedict Cumberbach was hypothetically hitting on me, if he was doing it in an inappropriate place/time/manner, he would be creepy. And I’d stop thinking he was attractive afterwards.”*

    * I was creeped on by guys I would otherwise find attractive on a couple of occassions. However, what sticks in my mind is that they were creepy!

  13. The backlash to the Captain Awkward post is so weird. I mean, neither letter was anywhere near a “maybe he’s just shy and didn’t know he was making people feel uncomfortable” situation. Both guys were so clearly over the line, had been told they were over the line, and kept on creeping.

    I seriously have no idea why “Knowingly making people around you feel uncomfortable is bad” is still a controversial idea anywhere in society.

  14. Don’t ya just hate when men think for themselves? Women herd so easily. Why can’t men do the same?

  15. SRSWomen is more of a safe space for women, not a place to talk about feminism per se. The newly created SRSFeminism might be a better place to link especially for male readers, who aren’t welcome on SRSWomen.

  16. See, I want to defend reddit here, but at this point I’m pretty sure it’s just a knee jerk reaction left over from my neckbeard days. It’d still be nice if I could be unbanned from SRS though.

  17. creativewritingstudent

    They just want an excuse to continue to make people feel uncomfortable and scared. I mean, most people realise that “you’re making me/other person feel uncomfortable” generally means “your bizarre medical history is not good casual conversation” or “not everyone wishes to subscribe to your mental issues”* et cetera et cetera.
    These guys’ response is probably “YES! I made someone uncomfortable!” but they know that doing a butt-wiggling victory dance in public is somewhat unacceptable*, so they just point at everyone else and say “but they’re being oversensitive! And mean! I’m just socially awkward, but I’m a good-natured person really!”

    * I have a slight oversharing problem which I am working to rectify
    ** and lose them creep-targets

  18. Aw, NWO, your stock phrase doesn’t even make sense here.

    If men want to “think for themselves” about whether feminism is a good thing, they can do it somewhere besides a dedicated feminism forum.

  19. It’d still be nice if I could be unbanned from SRS though.

    I hope I don’t regret asking this, but how in the world did you get banned from SRS

  20. SRSFeminism sounds promising, but there aren’t any posts there yet.

  21. Isn’t it odd how an aggressive, predictable herd of interchangeable dolts who all sound exactly alike are independent thinkers according to Owly?

    I suspect this may have something to do with how Owly’s definition of Marxist includes Ayn Rand.

  22. Kladle – SRS bans people a lot. I got banned once (got unbanned by apologizing to the mods and asking nicely) for sarcasm-indistinguishable-from-real-bigotry. It’s their style of moderation, and considering the constant influx of Redditors providing extremely-real-bigotry, it’s understandable.

    Honestly, I think some of their rules are too strict, but I respect the fact that they enforce them fairly and zealously, and that the ultimate point of the rules is “no, you can’t be even a little bit sexist/homophobic/ableist here.”

  23. Ah, Reddit drama.

  24. I hope I don’t regret asking this, but how in the world did you get banned from SRS

    Well wayyy back when I was slowly starting to come out of my MRA phase and learning about feminism, I was confused by much of the drama between SRS and the rest of reddit. On the one hand most of reddit holds some disdain for SRS for having a somewhat overzealous banning policy, or so they said, I’d never seen anything there that validated any of the hate, so I went on SRSmeta and posted questioning exactly why there was so much hate. A bot then informed me that my post was brought up on antisrs, and having considered myself a neutral party at the time, I went over to that thread to clarify that I was merely trying to make sense of everything that was going on. Turns out posting in antisrs at all results in an autoban, which somewhat upset me at the time, and started to reinforce some nasty aspects of my beliefs back then which I would really rather not dig up. I was also banned from SRSmeta due to the controversial nature of my post. Since then I’ve figured out exactly what I did wrong and have been trying to get myself unbanned.

  25. I’ve really come to the conclusion that I was being admittedly a bit of a shitlord, though I was trying to be somewhat benign.

  26. So, WTF is going on exactly? Did an MRA become a mod of an established subreddit, or is this the culmination of their brilliant “let’s make fake feminist blogs and write unfeminist things and giggle” plan?

  27. This is just depressing. Feminists should storm The Spearhead and other MRA spaces and bombard them with messages that women are people.

    I usually don’t spend much time on Reddit. It’s just a confusing, nasty place.

    @aworldanonymous

    Good for you. You give me hope that MRA shitlordery doesn’t have to be permanent.

  28. I got banned from SRS once because I posted in antiSRS — even though I was arguing with someone there, SRS does indeed have a bot that automatically bans everyone who posts there. I messaged the mods and was quickly unbanned.

  29. I was banned from SRS too! Same reason as aworldanonymous, although I was just arguing with anti-SRS. I just made another account for SRS porpoises; the original was for r/mr and shit like that in the first place, and SRS is just a sweet, sweet bonus to the general malaise of reddit.

  30. What I took away from the “creep” discussion can be summed up as follows:

    “I want sex but I keep getting called creepy by the hot chicks I want sex with. They’re oversensitive and bad by calling my behavior creepy. Nothing I do is wrong so the problem is with the oversensitive hot chicks I want sex with. Just because I behave like a disturbed douchenozzle is no reason for them to creep-shame me. Now stop creep-shaming and give me sex.”

  31. @Freitag

    It’s amazing how entitled some men feel when it comes to “pussy.” On the RooshV blog and forum they constantly refer to “pussy” as if it is some nonliving commodity, just floating out there ready to be taken.

    Some tool over there blames women for the Oklahoma City bombing for not giving Timothy McVeigh any “pussy.” Sickening.

    http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-15118.html

  32. At the time I was kind of caught up in the being confused by all of the references I didn’t get, the drama, and the banning policy, now I’m less bothered by the former things, and understand the reason for the third.

  33. I will bet a million dollars without even clicking the link that someone in that “anti-creep shaming” thread is saying “But creepy guys probably have Asperger’s! How dare you be creeped out!”

    I see Reddit is the same shithole as always. That’s depressing.

  34. Feminists should storm The Spearhead and other MRA spaces and bombard them with messages that women are people.

    I think this sometimes. I do like the idea of making them as uncomfortable in their own spaces as they want us to be in ours. But I figure:

    1) The Spearhead and the like are so insignificant in the grand scheme of things, it’d be a total waste of time. MRA-baiting is entertainment, not activism, and I never want to lose sight of that.

    2) They might lash out at the feminists involved. We limit our responses to MRAs here to angry comments and the occasional ban–nobody tries to dox them or start long campaigns of harassment on their Facebooks/personal blogs/etc. I don’t trust Spearheaders to do us the same courtesy.

    3) We can’t really hurt them without violating our own principles. We can say “women are people,” but we can’t say “men aren’t people.” We can say “rape of women is real,” but we can’t say “most male rape is false accusations.” We can say “women deserve to control our own bodies,” but we can’t say “women deserve to control men’s bodies.”

    We can’t deliver the real gut-punching attacks and still be decent people, so we’ll never really be able to make them feel the way they make us feel.

  35. @fembot, one of the saddest things I ever read was a comment made shortly after the Sodini killings. The poster opined that the message everyone should take away from this senseless bullshit was that women ought to put out more often, and include the creeps. I’m paraphrasing, of course, but that was the gist of it. Sodini, who IIRC claimed to have been rejected by 30 million women, was the real victim and women should take the shootings as a lesson to give up more pussy.

    Ugh. I’ve made myself sick now. I’ll go watch the news and cheer up.

  36. And before some troll can call me ableist: I have Asperger’s. My voice is near constantly monotone, I tend to stare without realizing it or avoid eye contact all together, and my special interests include horror movies and medieval torture devices. I know damn well what it’s like to unintentionally creep people out, and guess what? It’s my own damn fault when I do, and those I’m upsetting shouldn’t have to put up with it just because of my disorder.

  37. Lauralot – I think calling people “creepy” for having AS is a wrong usage of “creep,” not proof that “creep” should never be used.

    It’s like how saying “women who have abortions are murderers” is wrong, but doesn’t mean that the word “murderer” is itself sexist and should never be used.

  38. Ok, I apologized and now I’m unbenned.

  39. Sorry if I was unclear: I’m not trying to say that people with ASD are creeps, I mean that, while we can creep people out unintentionally due to misunderstanding social cues and what not, it’s still not an excuse. The “creepy guys just have Asperger’s” complainers are trying to say that it’s fine to invade someone else’s space and upset them if you have the disorder, and it isn’t.

  40. @Cliff Pervocracy
    “If men want to “think for themselves” about whether feminism is a good thing, they can do it somewhere besides a dedicated feminism forum.”

    Men can say what they want where ever they want. Don’t ya just long for the pre-internet days where there were no comment section in articles? Oh those days of carte blanche where women ridiculed men without having to be ridiculed in return. Ahhh, the good old days.
    ————–
    @Tulgey Logger
    “I suspect this may have something to do with how Owly’s definition of Marxist includes Ayn Rand.”

    I’ve never read any Ayn Rand. Maybe I will.
    ————–
    @fembot
    “This is just depressing. Feminists should storm The Spearhead and other MRA spaces and bombard them with messages that women are people.”

    Of course women are people, but that doesn’t mean your opinions are worth anything or have any value. Ohhhh, you expect to be taken seriously “because” you’re a woman. This seems to be the problem with modern day women. Men are ridiculing you not because you’re women. you’re being ridiculed for the things you say and do.
    ————
    @skeptifem
    ““what if we are both drunk” is such a stupid question. Its like asking if its okay to drive drunk if the pedestrian you hit is drunk too. Somehow I think their tiny brains could figure out how meaningless that question is.”

    How is it a stupid question? If both parties are drunk, then both parties are either guilty of rape or neither is. Otherwise what you’re saying is the man is responsible for both their actions.
    ————–
    @Ugh
    “Both guys were so clearly over the line, had been told they were over the line, and kept on creeping.”

    Who cares? I mean really, who cares? If a woman feels a guy is being creepy, but the guy doesn’t feel he’s being creepy, why are her feelings correct and his feelings incorrect. Are we defaulting to woman is correct? That’s exactly what you’re saying.
    ————–
    “Honestly, I think some of their rules are too strict, but I respect the fact that they enforce them fairly and zealously, and that the ultimate point of the rules is “no, you can’t be even a little bit sexist/homophobic/ableist here.”

    HAHAHAHAHA. Sexist is whatever any woman feels at any point in time, therefore it has no meaning. Homophobic is a non-existant. If someone finds the actions of gays repulsive that’s there choice and they have every right to voice it. What’s next? Do I have to love brussle sprouts as well and swear to adore them? On no, abliest!!!
    ————–
    This is why modern day women are ridiculed. Not because you’re women, but because you make no sense.

  41. “But creepy guys probably have Asperger’s! How dare you be creeped out!”

    I have Aspergers, and what I decided to do about it is to start living in residence at university in order to force myself to be in a social environment 24/7 so that I can force myself to learn how to be the adorable quirky kind of awkward instead of the creepy kind of awkward.

  42. Now my only worry about SRS is that I’m not witty enough…T_T.

  43. But yeah, Aspergers isn’t an excuse for creepiness, Aspies can learn to not be creepy, hell, I already sort of have, I’m just really really shy most of the time.

  44. @Lauralot: if liking horror movies and weird shit (you should see some of my old dermatology books) is wrong/creepy, I don’t want to be right. Those jackholes are using AS as cover for their bad behavior.

    How the hell did MRAs come to run r/feminism?

  45. To be fair, I’m sure my love for torture methods would have gone over better if I didn’t to start conversations with strangers in the past by saying “Hi! What’s your favorite form of torture? I like the pear, but there’s debate about whether or not it was really used. How it worked was…”

  46. creativewritingstudent

    @lauralot89

    Can we be friends? :D

  47. creativewritingstudent

    I have a mild historical interest in torture and executions… and that sounds like an awesome conversation opener.

  48. When I moved countries, because words have different meanings and some are offensive in some countries and not others, I made a general rule that if someone finds a word offensive then I shouldn’t use it within reason. I can understand why men don’t like being called a creep, even if they are behaving in a way that makes people uncomfortable. I am happy to stop using the word creepy, however I worry that the people who are against it get very angry at comments like “please don’t do this it makes me uncomfortable”.

    I think the word creepy is ambiguous, it can often be difficult to articulate what exactly you don’t like about somebody because that would be unacceptable so it is sort of a go to word. It kind of covers things like they wouldn’t leave me alone when I dropped strong hints, they were overly forward when we first talked etc. Mentioning that you don’t like these things isn’t likely to go down well as you will be encouraged to give them a chance.

    Interestingly, very few of the comments seem to refer to people being called creepy to their faces, in fact most creep shaming seems to be people not responding well to being talked to. However, that may be misinterpreting others experiences.

    I have definitely been creepy before and it is something I’m trying to work on in future. Acknowledging your behaviour is wrong and trying to change it can be difficult.

  49. Well, if they don’t like “creepy,” how about, “lecherous,” “deranged,” “overbearing,” “tiresome” or “obsessive.”

  50. C, if they haven’t said they find them offensive then I’m happy. Actually I think they are better alternatives because they highlight the different aspects of behaviour that are making the person uncomfortable.

  51. Pear_tree – I’m uncomfortable with the idea that people who are feeling threatened by someone else are required to explain that threat in only the most polite and helpful ways.

    When I say “dude is creepy,” it’s not always because I have his best interests at heart and want to help him learn and grow. I may just want him to keep his creepery the hell away from me and mine.

  52. I have a really close friend who has Aspergers and one of the things that we have both learned is that what makes our friendship work the best is when we are overtly clear and direct with one another. To some extent, this is why we hit it off in the first place. I hate being ambiguous in my words and actions because that is how my mom perpetuated her abuse on me. So when I met him, I actually was relieved that both of us preferred a direct and open dialogue because even though I do not have a spectrum disorder, my preferred method of communication is very open mainly because most of the creeps and abusers use unclear situations and language to their advantage- in essence, constructing “plausible deniability” even though you know exactly what they are doing and feel rightly creeped out.

  53. The dude who went down in my memory as Mr. Creepy (I mentioned this on the other thread–he was in my Spanish class and harassed me the whole year, including stealing my homework when my back was turned so I would have to deal with him) was in no way socially awkward and/or a person with Aspergers. He was a class clown, and all the boys thought he was great and the girls thought he was creepy as all fuck. I’m a hell of a lot more socially awkward than he was, which just made it hard for me to deal with his behaviors.

    Pear_tree–I think “creepy” is a good word for the intrusive behaviors that Mr. Creepy did because it does have bite and they hate it, and most of the creepers in the sexualized, female-targeting style that Captain Awkward was talking about know what they are doing. Fighting back on using “creeper” for them just means denying people, usually women, the right to label their own experiences and decide what they will and will not put up with.

  54. Monsieur sans Nom

    I have Aspergers, and what I decided to do about it is to start living in residence at university in order to force myself to be in a social environment 24/7 so that I can force myself to learn how to be the adorable quirky kind of awkward instead of the creepy kind of awkward.

    Best of luck to ya. But keep in mind that there are NO guarantees. Some people in that residence may find you creepy or “weird” and not wish to associate with you so that’s something you’ll have to learn to cope with.

    “Creepy” is very much a subjective term rather than an objective one as those who define it always have their own personal definition. If you have abnormal neurological ticks like I do, there’s always going to be someone who finds you creepy no matter where you go and what you do.

    Lastly, I choose not to have the slightest bit of sympathy for those women who label any guy they don’t like or find unattractive as “creepy”. You don’t have to like everbody, but you do have to learn to get along with people whom you are repulsed by and who even make you a little uncomfortable.

  55. Yeah, pear_tree, I’m going to disagree. If a guy is upset at being called creepy, perhaps he should look at the behavior that caused him to be called that. Most creepers know exactly what they’re up to.

  56. When I moved countries, because words have different meanings and some are offensive in some countries and not others, I made a general rule that if someone finds a word offensive then I shouldn’t use it within reason.

    That’s understandable. “C**t” is used differently in the UK and the US.

    AD&D had a whole boxed set in the 90s that was written in a faux-Cockney kind of argot. The term “berk” was thrown about with abandon, as a term for “adventurer” (“cutter” was another, more violent one). The problem with “berk” is that it’s short for “Berkeley hunt,” rhyming slang for that word I done used up there.

    Trying to cut down on those words, I can understand and support. I’m less convinced when it comes to words and phrases with murkier histories (there aren’t many, but they are there).

    There are some web sites out there where the commentariat have taken it upon themselves to excise language that might be stepping on someone’s foot, or otherwise problematical.

    The textbook example is the phrase “rule of thumb.” There are a couple of different origin stories for the phrase. One of those is that it summarizes the quick-and-dirty shortcuts experienced carpenters can use — measuring short distances with one’s thumb, from the tip to the first joint.

    The other one is that it was once English law that a man could beat his wife with a rod no thicker than his thumb.

    Now, that’s a disturbing story, and there is some documentary evidence for this idea, largely resting on a judgment which doesn’t seem to have been preserved. By no means do I want to erase the history of domestic violence, but I don’t think it’s quite fair to excise the phrase and never use it based on a story that could well not be true. The phrase “rule of thumb” has an origin that’s so murky that I don’t think it should be an instant black mark if someone should use it.

    It’s like language should be like Caesar’s wife — beyond even the thought of reproach. If someone could find a problematical etymology, that’s it, don’t want people thinking we’re assholes, we’ll just stop using this language.

    But don’t let me tell you what to do. I’m just explaining my thinking, not trying to dictate.

  57. Certainly I’m not going to stop using “creepy” because some people who have a really odd view of the world are looking for words to fight against in imitation of a much older, much more successful civil rights movement.

  58. @Pear_tree: If I find it offensive to be called “racist”, does that mean that I can say racist shit and it would be wrong to call me racist?

  59. We might be more inclined to believe you when you say you’re on the spectrum, Toaster, if you weren’t so much of a lying douchebag the rest of the time.

  60. @ Monsieur Sans Nom

    Oh I’m well aware of this, The way I see it is that it’s best to not let it get to me, most of the people I’ve talked to who used to find me creepy only thought that way because I’m tall, have a large frame, and keep to myself. Usually when people get to know me the creepiness factor goes away, what I’m really focused on is opening up to people and being less anxious around them.

  61. You don’t have to like everbody, but you do have to learn to get along with people whom you are repulsed by and who even make you a little uncomfortable.

    Nope! I have to get along with those people sometimes for school/work/family purposes, but I do not have to get along with them just for the sake of getting along with someone!

    In social situations, I can ignore anyone I like for any reason I like! Even bad wrong reasons! Even no good reason at all! This is called being an independent human being!

  62. People don’t have to like people.

    THE MORE YOU KNOW.

  63. Men can say what they want where ever they want.

    Nope! Men can say what they want in forums that are either public property or their own property! You don’t own Manboobz’s servers or Reddit’s, so the owners of those servers are free to decide what gets hosted there!

    This seems to be the problem with modern day women. Men are ridiculing you not because you’re women. you’re being ridiculed for the things you say and do.

    This is splitting a pretty small hair, NWO. “I don’t hate you because you’re a woman! I hate you because you’re a woman and women are terrible!”

    How is it a stupid question? If both parties are drunk, then both parties are either guilty of rape or neither is. Otherwise what you’re saying is the man is responsible for both their actions.

    If both parties are drunk, but one party initiates sex and the other doesn’t, then no, it is not exactly the same on both sides. Initiating sex is something a person (even drunk) chose to do. “Having someone else initiate sex” is obviously not a choice.

    If a woman feels a guy is being creepy, but the guy doesn’t feel he’s being creepy, why are her feelings correct and his feelings incorrect.

    Actually, both of their feelings are correct! The woman feels afraid, and this is real–the man feels not afraid, and this is real!

    No one is asking the man to feel afraid. We are only asking that he not demand the woman pretend she isn’t afraid.

  64. We probably all read this here as I learned about it from this site, but relinking that Jezebel article about why dudes don’t like being called creepy: http://jezebel.com/5903883/why-guys-really-hate-being-called-creepy

  65. So, aside from a bunch of stuff about body language that I have been physically incapable of memorizing. When I have good intentions, and am trying to not be a creep, how do I actually not be a creep?

  66. @Cliff- *high five* (if wanted, that is).

    Of course NWO listening to reason and logic is about as probable as a pumpkin turning into a carriage.

  67. @MSN, there’s no guarantee anywhere that anyone will ever find anyone ‘not creepy.’ Or ‘nice.’ Or ‘hot’ or ANYTHING because those are subjective opinions based on the feeling of the person holding those opinions and guess what we are all entitled to our own feelings ta daaaaa what is this like, 2nd grade?

  68. Crumbelievable

    I’m trying to imagine the shitstorm that would ensue if feminists suddenly took over r/mensrights.

    The MRAs would be screaming about how the feminists are trying to suppress their voices

    Paul Elam would be writing another hate-filled diatribe about how feminists need to suffer pain but totally not in a violent way you guys!

  69. @ aworldanonamous–I can’t promise you that you’ll never creep someone out, but the first thing I’d tell you is to be careful about other people’s personal space and not get to close to them. If you don’t feel comfortable reading signals that tell you to get closer, don’t get closer. Also, if you can, pay attention to any situations where you might be blocking someone’s way out. The creepiest goddamn thing my harasser would do is lean over me while I cowered at my desk. Other women might have other triggers, but that’s mine.

    Also, don’t make gross sexualized comments, but I doubt that was your problem. If you can’t read situations well, don’t talk about sex unless the other person starts it.

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