Elam: Take My Male Privilege, Please!
Paul Elam, head ranter at A Voice for Men, has a new video out called “You want privilege? You got it!” The thesis: if women really did have the so-called privileges that men have, they’d hate it and want men to take them all back. Because all of these so-called privileges are really giant burdens. Or, as Elam puts it, somewhat more melodramatically, these privileges have “begun to more resemble an anchor around your neck than the helm of a great ship that everyone tells you that you are captaining.”
Here’s the video.
Well, all right, that’s not really Paul Elam. But that little clip does capture pretty well the tone of his latest post, which is indeed about how male privilege is really a terrible burden.
I mean, this is his opener:
I swear by everything holy that the next time I hear some fembot caterwaul about “male privilege,” I am going to find something to break, turn it into shards, and drag the broken pieces across my chest just to distract me from the pain of their increasing stupidity. Just picture me like Martin Sheen, collapsed in a heap of bloody, tearful insanity on the floor of a cheap hotel in Saigon.
Heck, compared to that, Mr. McDuck’s reaction to the news about his “ice cream” was, if anything, rather restrained.
The rest of Elam’s post is, as is typical for him, a rather trite recitation of a number of standard Men’s Rights talking points about male “disposability” written in some of the most ridiculously overblown prose ever seen outside of an Ayn Rand novel.
Elam complains that he hasn’t seen much benefit from his privileges:
Mind you I still don’t know what that privilege is. One time when I was young and very poor I was late on my light bill. I showed the electric company my balls, but they cut my power off anyway. …
Yeah, as someone who’s also had his power cut off, I’m pretty sure they do that with everyone. I’m also pretty sure that no feminist has ever or will ever argue that male privilege means you won’t get your power cut off for nonpayment.
Here’s Elam addressing women as if they’ve traded place with men:
With your privilege comes the right to work on crab boats, drive trucks, work on electric lines, walk into burning buildings and sink into the bowels of the earth digging out coal and other things people find useful.
Apparently having greater occupational choices is scary and bad.
When a ship goes down, or any other life threatening disaster strikes, you have two choices. Be a real woman and die, or treat your life like it has value and have the world shit on you as a coward who refused to perish on cue. There is also the possibility of third option, either die from the disaster so that men can live, or have another woman blow a fucking hole in your face with a pistol because you tried to save yourself.
Yeah, I believe we may have addressed this earlier. Oh, but there’s more:
Like noticing the emperor has no clothes, it may hit you one day when you decide not to offer your seat to a man; when the stares at you from all around seem to come down people’s noses. …
You must learn not to say a word. Not to anyone else, not even to yourself. You must learn to see flames, coal dust, icy saltwater, death and sacrifice for the trappings of power that the world around you thinks them to be.
Says a dude typing out his manifestos on an expensive laptop he conned nagged his followers into buying for him.
And you must be willing to hang your head in shame over that power, even as the world chews you up, spits you out, and gets ready to take its turn with your daughter.
Elam’s rousing conclusion:
So, that is it, ladies. You want my privilege, it is yours. I will gladly hand it over to you this very minute. I am just waiting for you to meet the pre-requisites of disposibilty and an utter lack of self-value. I am waiting for you to woman up to the job, take off your fucking make up and be ready to bleed, blah blah blah look at me I’m mad!
I paraphrased a little at the end there. But, yes, the world champion at seeing male “disposability” everywhere did in fact misspell the word “disposability.” That was all him. And so, believe it or not, is the following:
I, like a Jew gone weary of being called a chosen one, am completely ready for anyone else, and in particular, you, to be chosen.
Personally, I have had about all the privilege I can stand.
Yep. He went there.
Also, I don’t know if you all knew this, but when women serve in the military these days it’s “like a day care camp for them.”
Also, not to pat myself on the back or anything, but my headline is much better than his. Maybe he should get me to write all the headlines on A Voice for Angry Duck Plutocrats Men.
Discuss.
Posted on May 3, 2012, in a voice for men, antifeminism, grandiosity, hypocrisy, I am making a joke, I'm totally being sarcastic, irony alert, misogyny, MRA, narcissism, oppressed men, paul elam, reactionary bullshit, shit that never happened, the fucking titanic, victimhood. Bookmark the permalink. 494 Comments.
It’s kind of amazing that Elam is still harping on men predominantly being in dangerous occupations.
Two words: Radium girls. That example is particularly nice because the guys in charge knew that shit was dangerous. It would be difficult to find a comparable situation with the genders reversed – i.e. with an upper class of well-informed, exclusively female workers keeping the lower-level exclusively male workers in the dark while providing absolutely nothing in the way of minimum safety equipment or procedures.
Antz you have been upgraded to troll book worthy material! Congrats XD
http://manboobz.forummotion.com/t893-antzcyclopedia#24006
Yep! You can’t make this shit up. It’s that sort of thing that makes this site so entertaining. (Well, that and the delicious feminazi gazpacho.)
with Antzy’s interest in sexbot technology, I’m surprised he hasn’t brought up robot soldiers. This is actually a thing (mind you soldiers is pushing it quite a bit) but they are developing technology to aid and hopefully replace human beings as soldiers.
For example this which is used to carry heavy equipment (it is a creepy looking thing but pretty damn impressive…yay robots!)
Antz on citations tl;dr: “Yeah, I get that a lot.”
And maybe there’s a reason for that, sweetie pie.
Marc Raibert of Boston Dymamics practically invented legged robots at CMU in the 1980’s. He is not messing around. Eventually his robots will be weaponized and able to run down absolutely anyone in virtually any terrain.
I, for one, welcome our new robot overlords.
Er…….. Did Zarat just say that CITATIONS and FACTS are mutually exclusive concepts
“Citations” are vulnerable to spin; “facts”, simply speaking, are not.
“There are lies, damned lies, and statistics”. -Mark Twain
AntZ, I’ll try explaining the women’s health care provisions of the Affordable Care Act again, but this time I’ll make it simpler.
1. Cis men and cis women have different reproductive body parts that require different types of medical care.
2. Pregnant people have different medical needs than people who aren’t pregnant.
3. Cis men do not get pregnant.
4. Many of the screenings offered to pregnant women are for the purpose of keeping the baby healthy.
5. Half of the babies that are born are male, and the other half are female.
6. Good prenatal care helps male babies just like it does female babies.
All of these points prove that good prenatal care is not misandry. It is absurd that I would even need to explain this to you.
I kind of love it when MRAs go on about how all;the poor menz have to do manual labor jobs so that lazy women can work in their PR firms in silky, silky office clothes.
NWO loves to talk about how much he wishes he could wear silky dresses, makeup and perfume. I’m always like, dude, go for it. We don’t judge around here.
I went to AVfM and read the whole article for myself because a) I was hoping you didn’t take anything out of context, and b) I actually couldn’t believe he would write this dreck.
Why. Oh, why did I? I’ve never appreciated those five minutes I once had than I do now.
Mr. Futrelle, you are a man of noble sort.
Antz really lives in another world, with no resemblance to the fact-based one the rest of us deal with. Here is how he is spinning his visits here over on AVfm: http://i.imgur.com/ij5BI.jpg (screencapped so you don’t have to taint your browsers)
SQUAWK, SQUAWK! :-)
@Idylle Here’s 0:32 that will help you recover from that misspent 5:00:
@Shaenon – I’m sure he’d love to, but apparently the silkiness of a worker’s garment is inversely correlated with the validity of zir work.
He forgets that the idea of privilege is basically something that is considered the “standard” and that male privilege is only one type of privilege (privilege being how much you fit into the “ideal” person to the point that you DO NOT HAVE TO DEAL WITH SHIT unless you choose to. Privilege also has a lot to do with how OTHER PEOPLE TREAT YOU, which you individually have little to no control over).
So, for example, if a man conforms to all the masculine stereotypes, is white, able, rich, hetereosexual, and Christian (in the US at least), the amount of shit that he has to deal with is relatively minor compared to a female, black, disabled, poor, homosexual, atheist person.
And just like most multifaceted issues, your privilege can change based on where you are and who is around you! If you go into an area where the culture and appearance of everyone is completely different than yours, suddenly YOU become the person who has less privilege, even if you have some markers of status that translate over. For example, if you’re uneducated and come from generational poverty and then end up in a rich, mostly Black suburb because you inherited a house from a great aunt who died and left you her estate. Suddenly, you’re in a situation where you’re the minority IN THAT AREA, and you may encounter feelings of being uncomfortable or out of place WHILE IN THAT AREA (you may still be treated.
I’ve always taken a look at privilege as the amount of crap you can ignore if you choose to ignore it. For example, I generally don’t have to think about the plight of the average homeless person and constantly try and strategize where might be a safe and relatively sheltered place to sleep outside because I have an apartment where I can go sleep at night. I have privilege that a homeless person does not.
Similarly, my husband has the privilege to not think about how shitty round ligament pain in pregnancy feels because he is male and can never be pregnant. Of course, if he CHOOSES TO, he can sympathize with me when I’m having trouble carrying things or squatting down without pain because I’m 4-ish months pregnant, but that’s completely optional.
Many white people don’t have to worry about being automatically scoped out by clerks as being shoplifters or robbers. And adults generally don’t have to worry about being snatched up by predators the way that children might. Of course, young people have the privilege to be considered more knowledgable about technology due to their age, while older people are often considered technologically ignorant when it comes to the newest tech products.
Many of these assumptions are not outright harmful, though. Most of them can be cleared up, or they can be changed.
But the source post by Elam basically ignores the fact that NOT ALL MEN ARE FORCED TO BE COAL MINERS.
Some men are. Some men live in places where there are practically no choices when it comes to jobs. You either work in a coal mine or you sit on your ass. And in many of these places, moving away isn’t an option because you either don’t have education (and therefore less educational privilege) or you don’t want to move away from family and friends and places that you are familiar with (location privilege).
In a decent and just world, we’d be able to choose freely without any major sacrifices to our well-being, but sometimes shitty choices in the job or career department means that your home life is bearable or enjoyable. Sometimes, joining the military can lead to job prospects you would otherwise not have (and your increased rank in the military can often lead to higher pay and more privileges in society based on your merit).
So some privilege can be changed, but a lot of it cannot be changed without major sacrifices in other areas.
And I think it’s really disingenuous for Elam to bring up the suffering and discrimination of those who are poor, disabled, old, etc due to the fact that there are REAL destructions of certain types of privilege in these categories and then chalking it up to “men not having privilege” or alternatively, having “shitty privilege.”
True story- I was in college and walking home after watching a late movie with two of my male friends. I commented that I was really happy to be walking home with them because I like being out late at night but being out alone made me feel uncomfortable and worried.
Both of them looked at me like I was crazy. It literally HAD NOT OCCURRED to them that it could possibly be dangerous to walk around downtown late at night alone.
Privilege allows you to not think about things that are really big barriers and can lead to other people (who do not have the privilege you have) being hurt. It’s like a magical invisible shield that you wear, one that you can’t see, and generally you can’t notice the beneficial effects, but if you were to remove it, you’d suddenly see what those who do not have that privilege must prepare for, expect, and endure every day.
TL;DR- Privilege doesn’t mean your life is perfect and you never have problems. It means you have significantly fewer problems and have the ability to not think about certain things because you HAVE that particular type of privilege.
@clauciah
I requested guidance from HQ because I was perplexed. Boob land discussion are usually relatively civil. If anything, the boobland faithful are usually (on average) more civil than I am. Naturally, I was confused by the intensity of your hostility, on a day when I have been (mostly) civil and upbeat:
“don’t hate males. Just you. Yes you. YOU, PERSONALLY, AS A HUMAN BEING. Not because you’re a male. Just because something about your personality is repulsive.”
“.. fuck you, Zarat .. liar and a disingenuous scumbag .. you ridiculous jackass .. how fucking dare you .. how anyone here tolerates such an insipid liar such as yourself .. you’re a bottom feeder .. toxic hatred ..” — Lady Zombie
“.. misogynist douchebag ..” — Tulgey Logger
“.. Fuck all these MRAs ..” — Quqackers
So far, this is all I got in response:
“You insensitive brute Antz, violating a feminist safe space with your manfacts.
Look, you’ve made poor David feel faint. Quick, get the catnip!”
Not much to go on, is it?
I’m bored with Sarcastic Health-Care-Reform-Obsessed Zarat. Where’s Wifebot-Building Zarat of the Future? He’s my favorite.
@ AntZ – There is no fucking way you’re a scientist. Anybody with a science education knows what a goddamned citation is, because scientists have to use them all the time, in every science-related thing they write. It’s part of the backbone of scientific communication, for fuck’s sake.
A citation is the provenance of a fact. Don’t be so dense; you’re embarrassing yourself.
Boobland faithful
LOL. Nice, one, Anthony. I’ll be taking that back with me to MGTOW, if you don’t mind. ;)
VAWA passed today! Just thought I would let everyone know.
Also, nice to see Zarat still cannot read.
PS, when you ignore facts and citations, it makes you look really, really stupid.
Zarat, shouldn’t you be spending time with your FOREIGN BRIDE that you’re going to replace as soon as you get the technology up and running?
VAWA passed, that means we can expect a frothy shitstorm from NWO. That’s his favoritest thing besides Title IX.
True story – I was driving back to grad school after my 10 year HS reunion. I stopped at a “Scotty’s” hardware store to buy fluorescent light bulbs. I asked a crying employee what was the problem, and she told me her father had kicked her out of her home because she drank too much alcohool (her mother was in another relationship and could not receive her).
I offered to let her stay in my spare bedroom for the summer and to help her prepare for the GED (I used to teach for Kaplan, to make ends meet). On the drive home, I realized the danger of my situation.
So, I phoned a grad school buddy that had a sexual interest in me. I started a physical relationship with my grad school buddy just so she would move in with me and protect me from a potential false accusation by the 17 year old homeless girl that I was trying to help.
No false accusation materialized. However, if the 17 year old had accused me of rape, there is not one living person in the United States that would have believed me. NOT EVEN MRA’S :)
By the way, her mother agreed to the plan, and called CPS. They inspected my apartment for adequate space and food resources (strange, but true).
“.. You might find it beneficial to study the concept of intersectionality to better understand the conversations happening here ..”
“.. Zarat, shouldn’t you be spending time with your FOREIGN BRIDE that you’re going to replace as soon as you get the technology up and running?”
I am going to do both of these things … TONIGHT! Unlike feminist women, my FOREIGN BRIDE does not consider sex (and children) to be commodities to be peddled for profit (in cash or kind) 8)
Antz, you really need to learn to tell stories better, because this one reads like the worst Penthouse Letter ever.
Out of the blue you offered to let a 17-year-old girl you’d never met before who’d been kicked out of her dad’s home for excessive drinking stay in your house over the summer?
Then started having sex with another woman so she’d move in with you, jsut to preotect you from a possible false accusation from the 17 year old?
None of this sounds even remotely plausible. I think we’re going to need some more details here before we even consider believing any of it.
Yeah, Zarat, cool story bro.
Pantz: Hostility? I offered you the sweetest Sesame Street video ever! Did you even watch it? And then facts, lots of juicy facts, but I think you must be allergic, poor dear.
[pats Pantz on head, heads off to the market]
Anthony, I’m sorry… for the whole situation. Sounds like it sucked for everyone involved.
This is what I find so damn galling about a lot of the feminists. The fact remains that a woman can essentially ruin a man’s life at any time with a false accusation, a social phenomenon that the feminists are mostly responsible for. And yet they expect men to be receptive to them? It makes no sense!
Upbeat I’ll grant you. (Though “smug” is more accurate.) But civil?
From your very first post on this thread. This you call civility? If you’re gonna lie, at try to make it plausible. Oh, and incidentally, there are feminists who have male privilege. Because they’re, y’know, male.
So, since a woman can essentially ruin a man’s life with a false accusation, there must be many well known cases of men’s lives actually being ruined by false accusations. I would like to see some substantiation of that assertion.
Hi, William. If you believe Zarat’s tale, I have some Florida swampland that might interest you.
Every false accusation story I’ve heard of has ended with “so I never faced any legal proceedings and I stayed in school/at my job and all my friends and family rallied around me and the girl was ostracized forever… but I was VERY NEARLY INCONVENIENCED.”
Still waiting for one with life-ruination.
(Double mega bonus points if it happened to a white man. Sorry, but zero points if it involves a woman actually being raped but the wrong person going to jail, unless “sometimes women make true accusations which are poorly handled by the police and leave dangerous rapists on the streets” is the point you’re trying to prove..)
Bostonian. Come on now. Duke. Strass-Kahn. Many, many, many that I know personally, though their names will mean nothing to you.
Sometimes I just wish women would stay away from me entirely, or at least, women I do not trust implicitly. Anthony can vouch for me here.
John-John grew up hot. I don’t know how to feel about that.
http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/John_Williams_III
Anthony, how does your story, even if true, show that life is anything like what you think it is? The girl did not falsely accuse you of rape, and her mother and CYS had no problem with her living with you. They didn’t think you were exploiting her, and everything was sunshine and roses. What the hell does your story prove?
Every false accusation story I’ve heard of has ended with “so I never faced any legal proceedings and I stayed in school/at my job and all my friends and family rallied around me and the girl was ostracized forever… but I was VERY NEARLY INCONVENIENCED.”
William:
Come on now. Duke. Strass-Kahn.
…Yup.
WWB, keep company like Zarat, and I think women swarming you won’t exactly be a problem.
Over/under on this being another MRAL sock?
Yeah, CPS is always super eager to help 17-year-old girls move in with strange older men they met in parking lots.
You poor baby, what a terrible thing didn’t happen to you even in the story you just made up.
You dumbasses, since you’re making up stories anyway, you could at least make up ones that prove your point.
Okay, this is a new level of horrible I hadn’t even anticipated.
Men who actually raped women and were VERY NEARLY INCONVENIENCED.
fuuuuck
Cliff, in both cases the defendants were acquitted. Certainly in the Duke case, there is very little doubt that they were classic victims of a false accusation. The accuser in the SK case also seems to be a false accusing scumbag.
Also, isn’t the fact that having another woman in the house would be “protection” for you just evidence of yet another way rapists get away with it?
When you’re discussing your wily ways of protecting yourselves from false rape accusations, do me a favor and leave out the ones that would protect actual rapists just as well. :(
As rapists usually are.
Seriously, what’s your evidence in either the Duke or DSK case?
I’m going to blow your mind here, but sometimes people say they’re innocent even though they aren’t innocent.
I know, it’s a wild world we live in.
Details?
The 17 year old was called Melissa. Melissa is one of the most obese women I have ever seen in my life. Melissa attended AA meetings while she was in my apartment, and did not drink. She put a $2000 bill on my phone by dialing 1-900 “psychic” numbers. The phone company never made me pay the bill because I told them Melissa was underage. After she failed to pass the GED, her father let her move back. I borrowed $500 from a credit card and gave it to her as she climbed onto her Grayhound buss to go home. She never wrote me or contacted me again. From time to time, I fantasize that somehow the kindness of a stranger eventually helped her find her way. When the 4 year statute of limitations on rape passed, I silently felt very relieved.
The grad school buddy who I started a move-in relationship with to protect me from a false rape claim is a stunningly beautiful woman with a perfect body, and I mean PERFECT. Maybe in part because she was surprised by the odd act of kindness, she fell insanely in love with me. I tried everything that I could think of to get her to forget me, or to find another man. Nothing worked. She became violently possessive. She would hit me over such trivial “offenses” as not having an adequate answer to the question “did you like the girl who was teller at the bank?” when I withdrew money.
She threatened suicide. When that stopped working, she threatened to falsely accuse me of domestic violence if I left her. When that did not work, she used the phone receiver to split her lip, said she was going to call the cops, and said “do you think anyone will believe you NOW?” The only way I was finally able to leave her was to get an audio recording of her threats. The audio device made an audible “click” when the tape finished, so I eventually had to “agree” to get back with her, to get her away from the device before the noise revealed its presence. She demanded and received “reconciliation” sex.
The next day I woke up early, secured my audio tape, and left. She called the police and falsely accused me of domestic violence. I called back and told the police that I had an audio recording of the whole thing. I accused her of raping me, because she had used the threat of a false accusation to obtain sex from me (many times). The police never even listened to the audio tape, told me “coercion is not rape”, and never investigated her story either. All of this is contrary to Florida law.
As part of the process of getting away from her, I persuaded “us” to move into a “better” apartment. I lied. I had no intention of giving up my own lease, and no intention of ever moving into “our” new apartment. As a result, she won a sizeable civil lawsuit against me for non-payment of my half of the rent (because my name was on the lease). I was happy to pay, because I knew the “victory” was necessary for her to get over me. I have no ill will towards her, and I wish her well. She is a doctor, married, living in Canada. She looks like Freida Pinto:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freida_Pinto
Criminy! WWB, would it comfort you to know that you too “can essentially ruin a man’s life at any time with a false accusation”?
Would it provide even more comfort to you to know that men can and do essentially ruin womens lives by bearing false witness?
It just seems bizarre to me that in the face of the reality of rape and abuse, well documented, you are entirely focused on what some woman might possibly maybe could do that could embarrass you. Narcissist much?
Actually William, I don’t think that is clear at all. To you it is of course, but that’s understandable, you being you and everything. *psst hellkell I bet one internet that this is yet another mral sock*
Whereas SK is just a scumbag. Who rapes.
Cliff, so how do you determine who is “really” innocent? By any measure Duke was a sham. SK, probably was too.
Actually, your attitude is very illustrative- you’re not unique, sadly. This is exactly what I mean when I say any woman can ruin a man’s life at any time, with a false accusation. People (such as yourself) will consider him a rapist.
Anthony, can you back me up here? Boobland is more radical than I thought.
There’s not actually any evidence that the woman was lying regarding Strauss-Kahn, merely her past, which isn’t actually relevant to the charges. So even if he were convicted that wouldn’t be where you make your stand.
Oh, AntZ, do you have that story in a Word doc ready to deploy? It’s so cute. Too bad it never happened.
You are a warped goddamn man.
And let me get this straight… she never even threatened to false-rape-accuse you or talked about it or anything? But you just figured because she was female it was sure to happen sooner or later?
…And you think she’s the one with the problem?
…Oh, now there’s another false accusation in AntZ’s story and this one involves female-on-male rape as well?
Anyone want to start an over/under on how long it takes until he mentions he was spermjacked too?
Oh do fuck of William. Of course you know someone. You MRAs always seem to know someone…it never happens to you though.
Strauss Khan was most likely guilty. There was DNA evidence and bruising of the victim’s cervix.
Why don’t you freaks actually tell us what you want to do about false accusations? because they unfortunately happen sometimes…like false accusations of other crimes happen too.
Yeah, and poor DSK has only his riches, fame, family, friends, and many many supporters to comfort him.
RUINED
Strass-Kahn and the Duke boys are not only not in jail, none of them have a criminal record, all of them are doing well in their respective spheres of influence.
So, again, a case where someone was falsely accused of rape and had their live RUINED by the false accusation.
Cliff, I’d prefer to focus on the Duke case, because that, to me, is a classic false accusation case. Do you seriously think those lacrosse players are rapists? There is literally zero evidence against them that was not fabricated by a scumbag lawyer who is now disbarred, and abundant evidence to the contrary.
“…Oh, now there’s another false accusation in AntZ’s story and this one involves female-on-male rape as well?”
I guess I have lived an interesting life:
At 13, my mother gave me to her friends as a sex-toy.
Antz, oh boy. When I asked for more details I didn’t mean “was the 17 year old HOTTTTTTTT?” I was asking because, I dunno, people don’t usually offer out of the blue to let people they don’t know live with them. And apparently your experience, if your new story is true, shows why this tends to be the case.
Now you’ve added even more implausible details onto your original implausible tale.
What I’d like to hear are details that might explain why you acted in such a strange fashion with both of these women. (And which might make your story sound vaguely plausible.)
I like how he thinks linking to some actress and saying his ex looked like that is suppose to make it more believable when in fact it makes it appear the opposite.
I’ll be honest and say I do not wish to know how far down Antz is going to take his tale of extremely improbable events.
“.. Oh, now there’s another false accusation in AntZ’s story and this one involves female-on-male rape as well ..”
I guess I have lived an interesting life:
1) At 13 my professional academic feminist mother gave me to her feminist friends as a sex toy.
2) At 28 I attempted to help a 17 year old homeless girl. This happened largely because of (1). My mother used sex, guns, and more to train her children as good little manginas. During the drive home, I realized there was a danger of a false rape accusation.
3) To protect me from (2), I agreed to a sexual relationship with a hot woman who agreed to move in with me on the same day. She then fell obsessively in love with me.
4) The hot woman used many threats, including false domestic violence, to force me to have sex with her.
5) When I finally left her, the hot woman called the police and accused me of domestic violence. She was not believed because I had an audio recording of the whole thing.
Any questions?
Wrong. In order to be aquitted you have to have a trial. Both of these cases were dropped before ever going to trial.
In the Duke case the young men in question lost a lacrosse season and were put under a fair bit of stress (which I will agree is bad) but their lives were in no way ruined. They have no criminal records, few people outside their immediate circle of friends and family even know their names, and as far as I’m aware they’ve all completed their undergraduate degrees and probably have jobs (or are furthering their educations).
Strauss-Kahn on the other hand is under investigation on other charges at the moment and he has a history of treating women badly even before the sexual assault complaint. He really isn’t the example you want to use since he truly does appear to be at best a corrupt politician and at worst a rapist and criminal.
Of course William would rather focus on Duke, because it’s MRAL.
AntZ, I don’t even know what to say about your story. On the one hand, if that happened, that is terrible. On the other, you are a known liar.
The Duke case is a mess all around. I don’t think the woman consciously made things up. I think something traumatizing, perhaps rape perhaps not, actually happened to her but she wasn’t in a state to give a clear account (not uncommon when drugs and/or alcohol are involved) and police questioning along with other things helped build a story in her mind. The research on false memories is fascinating. I don’t lay the blame for Duke at her feet but at the feet of the investigators and prosecutor who tried to build a case on a poor recollection of events and virtually no evidence.
yeah, what it is that compels you to keep making this shit up?
so at this point avfm basically exists to be elam’s pity party, huh?
Antz, like… get help, dude. Just get help.
Most people’s BAD relationships are far less warped than this little tale you’ve spun.
David, the only explenation that I can give is that I was a hopeless mangina at the time. It was terribly important to me to be a perfect “nice guy”. I fancied myself a gifted teacher (turned out not to be true), and I thought I could train the girl to get her high school equivalence and also to overcome alcohool addiction. Helping her was supposed to be a badge of honor that I would have worn my whole life.
Barf. Disgusting.
Oddly, I already hated feminists then. I know because I remember visiting a Barns & Nobles book store and reading a book in the women’s studies section. The book made me incredibly angry, and I remember the book’s spine breaking. This made me feel relieved, as though I had struck back somehow.
Maybe the best answer to “why” is, because I was an idiot.
I never told anyone this stuff, not even my wife. Why am I telling you people?
Dude, this isn’t even what “nice guy” MEANS. Even the most negative connotation is “a shy, awkward, passive aggressive dude who can’t get laid”, not “a guy who makes deeply warped moral choices because his mom threatened him with a gun and then decides to have a sexual relationship with someone for the strangest reason possible”.
Again, get help. There’s even FREE therapy available!
I don’t know, AntZ, why are you telling us? Is it because you’re lying? I mean, you’ve never once come here in good faith, so now you can go back to your rock and say how mean the feminists are to you.
Seek a more productive outlet for your shit than coming here and spreading lies. Sympathy is between shit and syphillis if you’re looking.