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When is a slut not a slut? When he’s a dude.

I did a search for PUA and this showed up. So, fuck it, I'm going with it.

When is a slut not a slut? When he’s a dude. So says the (He)artist(e) formerly known as Roissy, in yet another post of his trying to prove that his brand of Pick-Up Assholery is fully proven by SCIENCE!

His evidence in this case? A recent study of speed dating that showed that (straight) women, in addition to being attracted to attractive men (duh!), also seem to be attracted to men with high “sociosexuality” ratings. “Sociosexuality,” for those not fully immersed in the SCIENCE!! of dating, is basically someone’s propensity for casual sex.

In other words, the study found that guys who do a lot of casual dating tended to do better at casual dating.

Heartiste/Roissy puts it this way:

Men who have high sociosexuality (HSS) are more attractive to women because the suite of characteristics associated with HSS suggest prior experience bedding women and possession of mating skills that attract women.

It’s akin to a form of preselection for men, minus the actual women he’s banging being physically present at his side to aid in the alpha judging process that all women, consciously or not, impose on their suitors.

In a very loose sense, high male sociosexuality is male sluttiness.

If you strip out the PUA nonsense about the “alpha judging process,” all this seems fairly self-evident, if not simply tautological. Guys who’ve been with a lot of women will probably do better with women in the future than guys with no experience who view women as strange alien creatures. (Note: In all this, we’re only talking about straight people; PUAs don’t seem aware that gay people exist, outside of their own fantasies of hot bi girl threesomes.)

It’s at this point that Heartiste/Roissy amps up the assholery:

Male sluttiness is not equivalent to female sluttiness. It is more difficult for a man to be slutty that it is for a woman owing to the discrepancy in worth between sperm and egg, so people justifiably perceive male sluts to have higher quality mate value, and higher quality mating skills, than female sluts for whom the act of sexual conquest is merely synonym for being easy.

In other words, it’s bad to be a female slut, but great to be a male slut:

[T]he study results confirm the validity of game when its conclusions find that male sociosexuality is a relatively powerful predictor of attractiveness to women, even to women looking for long-term relationships.

Not only can this SCIENCE!! of game help to get dudes laid – it can basically save the world from evil fat chicks.

It’s vital to readers to get this scientific information validating game out there, because there are a lot of doubters and haters who are blinded by what they won’t see. Sometimes, men need to know that there is an experimental foundation supporting all these seduction techniques and peculiarities of female behavior. It’s not necessary to know this stuff to start gaming chicks out in the field right now, but for men with a cynical bent or shy disposition, it helps to know that there are rules that govern human interaction. It may be the boost they need.

Turning former nerds into wily lotharios will help to put those uppity female sluts in their place:

[A] moment of candor. This blog is first and foremost a source of self-amusement, but it is also a true and real desire to teach and to see men succeed sexually and emotionally with women. Men who become better at attracting women increase their options in the mating market. Men with increased options cause women to behave better. Women behaving better redounds to the benefit of families, and to society.

And by “behave better”, I mean the whole panoply of awful modern female behavior: cheating, cock carouseling, divorcing on a whim, eat pray loving, straycationing, spinstering, attention whoring, voting and fattening up into repulsive dirigibles.

Yep, he did slyly insert “voting” into all that. Sneaky!

So slut it up, fellas! It’s the only way to put those evil lady sluts in their place. And, thereby, save the world from sex-having, vote-casting slatterns.

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no more mr nice guy
8 years ago

Brandon, do you understand that the video ridicule the double standard and the way MRAs think ?

burgundy
burgundy
8 years ago

Ooh Austin meetup!

God, I couldn’t even make it through that video. But it did remind me of the conversation the other day about fat beardy poly guys. I know plenty of guys who get laid a lot who aren’t traditional studs, and I know women who would love to be having more casual sex who aren’t able to find partners. Why, it’s almost as if people aren’t monoliths acting in accordance with simple formulas!

Julie Gillis
8 years ago

Burgundy! Yes! email me!

KristinMH
8 years ago

Skyal – yay yay yay! How’d it go?

I’m still a week away from my due date…wish me luck…

KristinMH
8 years ago

Also Nephrite was pure comedy gold.

Kendra, the bionic mommy
Kendra, the bionic mommy
8 years ago

Congrats, Skyal and good luck in your birth, Kristin. It will be any day now. 🙂

I agree that Nephrite was comedy gold. I think he’s a keeper.

captainbathrobe
8 years ago

I don’t know. Nephrite responded to a Monty Python reference about The Judean People’s vs. The People’s Front of Judea by accusing us of anti-Semitism. That’s Poe territory. Of course maybe I just can’t conceive someone who knows about Judea, but it’s that ignorant in the ways of Monty Python.

captainbathrobe
8 years ago

Man, Swype auto-correct sucks.

ozymandias42
ozymandias42
8 years ago

CB: I’ve met people who’ve never heard of Life of Brian. Besides, a sufficiently entertaining Poe is worth keeping around. Better than His Snoozeliness Brandon, anyway.

Kristin and Skyal: Good luck! With your uteruses, the Feminist Army acquires new recruits! 🙂

M Dubz
M Dubz
8 years ago

@ozy- Wait wait wait, this can’t be right. According to our dear friends in the OP, given that sperm is just so much more valuable, it is the fathers of these new children who will influence the fighting ability of the new babies. And since only manginas would ever procreate with feminists, the babies will be weak and useless!

… that’s how that works, right? You guys?

thebewilderness
thebewilderness
8 years ago

It is my understanding that “spinsterism” is a euphemism for LESBIANS!!!!!

ozymandias42
ozymandias42
8 years ago

No, no, no. As Dearest Nephirite has told us, men and women have entirely separate genomes. Therefore, they will become true fymynysts if they are women, and mangina slaves if they are men. Thankfully, as feminists, Skyal and Kristin have both aborted all of their male children as part of our plan to eliminate the poisonous Y chromosome, so we don’t have to worry about manginas.

Pecunium
8 years ago

Ozy: It’s that womyn realise that the “Y” is inferior, since it’s merely a malformed “X” chromosomes, which means are imperfect, and so not worthy of life.

ersatzmoons
ersatzmoons
8 years ago

But men are visual creatures! Men only select for looks! Nopthing else about a woman is importannnttt!

I know… I’m so misandristic, pillowinhell. D:

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
8 years ago

*sigh*

Brandon’s vid is just another example of the nearly-unconscious bias of sex: men are obtaining, women are giving. Women who have lots of sex give too freely, men who have lots of sex are obtaining very easily. All these arguments about locks and keys, innies and outies, etc… it’s all the same dang thing.

On spinsterism, from the wiki:

“A “spinster” is not simply a “single” woman, but a woman who has not formed a human pair bond by the time she is approaching or has reached menopause and the end of her reproductive lifespan.”

How did the age of a spinster go so low, from 50s down to 20s, in MRA land? If this keeps up, women will be dried up and useless to them by age 13.

pillowinhell
pillowinhell
8 years ago

Dried up and useless by 13? Sigh. I knew I was forgetting something important. Time to get my daughter hitched!

I think spinsterism is kinda mixed in with other traditions. In the dark ages, women who weren’t married by eighteen had to explain themselves to the local priest, who would then either find a man to fob them off on or send them to a nunnery where she would be adequately policed..er..protected. At this point in time, I guess what they thought of womens sexuality was more like what MRA proposes is male sexuality. Strange how things got reversed.

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

you know, I really fail to see the point in shaming women for having sex. Maybe if getting sex is so hard for dudes, they’d have a hell of an easier time getting it if they weren’t ranting about sluts all the time.

And I still disagree that its sooooo hard for guys to have lots of sex. They’re probably having sex with women who they probably consider sluts anyway, in the end the way to have lots of sex is to find other people who enjoy having lots of sex.

Pecunium
8 years ago

pillowinhell: Actually the “get married by 18” trope is that of the upper middle classes, and the more recent middle classes. In the middle ages it was more common for women to marry in their early to mid-twenties (among the peasantry) because the men needed to establish themselves.

Elizabethan England has averages for women around 23, and for men about 27.

The folks who had money, and wanted to keep it in the family/increase the familial wealth were engaged in systematic hypergamy, with fathers arranging “dynastic” matches, and the idea of getting a woman married off by about 21.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
8 years ago

@Quackers:

“And I still disagree that its sooooo hard for guys to have lots of sex. They’re probably having sex with women who they probably consider sluts anyway, in the end the way to have lots of sex is to find other people who enjoy having lots of sex.”

That has to be the case, and why this whole thing is so annoying. If a man who has a lot of sex has sex with a woman who has a lot of sex, its the woman that is slapped with the “slut” label. It doesn’t say anything about the man because “she was easy.”

If a guy who has a lot of sex has sex with a woman who doesn’t have a lot of sex, he becomes a stud. Either way, men win.

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

@kirby

Exactly. Its downright depressing. Just think of how much happier everyone would be if this double standard didn’t exist…and how much more sex people would probably be having.

pillowinhell
pillowinhell
8 years ago

Pecunium

That’s interesting to know! Public edumacation has failed me again! Lol.

I find it strange though, that even the lower classes married in their twenties.. I would think that infant mortality and other pressures would have seen them marrying earlier. Unless nutritional factors delayed the onset of menstruation? Men marrying later has been a long standing tradition, given the pressure of supporting a potentially large family. What factors do you think contributed to marriages of women in their twenties?

Also, this winter has been extremely mild. I normally grow root veggies and spinach in a cold frame (one I’ve insulated) until February when its too cold. This year, those veggies are a bit stressed because the box is too warm! I just throw a blanket over top at night in case the temp drops, otherwise I have to prop open the top to cool it down! I could grow berries this winter, its been so warm in the cold frame.

Skyal
Skyal
8 years ago

First attempt at block quotes:

Thankfully, as feminists, Skyal and Kristin have both aborted all of their male children as part of our plan to eliminate the poisonous Y chromosome, so we don’t have to worry about manginas.

Damn, I knew I was doing something wrong to end up with all these boy children! It’s ok, though, I’m already indoctrinating the older 2. That will make up for it, right?

Kristin, labour was super easy, transition and pushing sucked enormously thanks to my newest love having a 15 inch head & weighing nearly 3lbs more than my last baby. Natural home waterbirth and he’s a healthy little guy, so that’s the important parts. Just need to get his tongue tie clipped.

Bostonian
8 years ago

Are you going to out Neph? or are you leaving it up to zir?

Pecunium
8 years ago

pillowinhell: Women married later because they didn’t need to marry sooner. It’s sort of the visible contradiction to the Brandon Rule of “Men always want younger women (because there were a number of younger men… in their early, as opposed to later, 20s who married women in their later 20s, early thirties, e.g. William Shakespeare and Anne Hathaway).

The thing to realise is that, prior to the 19th century, the ways in which sexuality (as opposed to chastity) was seen were very different. It had it’s own problems, but repressive sexual ideas weren’t really among them (though there was a lot of fulmination about it from religious figures, which tells you there was a lot of sex going on. No one rants about things which aren’t happening, and Paul’s comments about sexual behaviors were poorly translated, and lost almost all their context; but I digress).

So marriage was as much about establishing a stable family environment as it was one for getting sex (men could go to prostitutes [there is a really interesting study on village prostitution in 15th-17th century France, which I no longer have. Basically the village prostitutes were young women who chose to do it for money, and they’d quit in their mid, to late, 20s, and get married. In the viliage, and no one seems to have cared, but that was France, not England, and it was rural, not urban], and/or other men. What women did isn’t as obvious, but from plays, and poems, and songs it seems that non-PIV sex wasn’t uncommon. There were also abortifacients, and of course sometimes one had to get married; again, see William Shakespeare and Anne Hathaway).

Which means that marrying a child, who wasn’t going to be able to do the work needed to run the house/manage the shop was stupid. That, and they (as do we) didn’t think that children ought to be getting married.

Pecunium
8 years ago

I’m glad it wan’t MRAL.

pillowinhell
pillowinhell
8 years ago

Thanks Pecunium, that was quite the history lesson. Isn’t it interesting how documented history and sciences frequently show how much sexual mores change over time. And that it never seems to match with what MRAs and conservatives seem to teach (or school for that matter). The way I’ve always heard it, girls were marrying at 15 and 16 up until the victorian era. Hmm, wonder why someone might want that meme spreading around…

I think I’ll save you history lesson. It might come in handy to make someones head explode.

darksidecat
8 years ago

Giving birth at a younger age increases risk of infant and maternal mortality, as well as serious maternal injury (I’m using maternal because that is the most common term, not all people giving birth are women or mothers).

You double maternal mortality by birthing between 15-19 vs 20-24, for people 10-14 the rate of death is up to five times as high (according to the WHO). They are more likely to suffer from anemia when pregnant, as well as suffering from higher rates of malnutrition, high blood pressure, and eclampsia (Women’s International Network 2000 and IHEU 2006). Birth fistulas are more common the younger the person giving birth is, worldwide 75% of obstetric fistula is in girls under 20 (WHO 2009)

Infant mortality is up to twice as high for the infants born to people under 20 as their over 20 peers (UNICEF2001).

We have this twisted cultural notion that once a girl menstruates and become pregnant that she is physically as mature and ready to birth as adult women, but in fact the health risks are significant, and it is not ideal from a health perspective to have high rates of birth before 20.

Ymata
Ymata
8 years ago

*delurk*

But Neph wrote almost exactly as MRAL does. The talk of height, “womyn”, the particular swears used, and the thing he does when he keeps posting about a topic he’s interested in even if no one else is talking about it.

*relurk*

Ami Angelwings
8 years ago

Congrats Skyal and Kristin (again)! 😀

Entrap those men! XD

Given what I’ve seen of our trolls, it’s possible that he just saw “Judea” and took the easiest path in his brain to insult us XD

Pecunium
8 years ago

Ymata: That habit (never changing the topic) isn’t unique to MRAL. NWO does it. There were stylistic quirks that weren’t MRAL,and seemed unique to Nephy. So I’d have been not surprised to find it was MRAL, but am less surprised to find it’s not.

KristinMH
8 years ago

I know Manboobz has Moved On, but I wanted to respond…

Glad it went well, Skyal! I’ve been fearing a giant baby, since my sister and I were both around 9 1/2 pounds (and yet I’m only 5’1″-5’2″…oh well). But it’ll get out one way or another.

Ozy, not only have I never aborted a male fetus, I chose not to find out what sex my baby would be! So until it actually comes out I am pregnant with Schrodinger’s Baby.

Do I have to hand in my feminist card now? XD

Skyal
Skyal
8 years ago

I’m only 5′, Kristin. And this baby was 9lb 3oz. I was sure at most he would be 7lb 8 or so. Took about twice as long to get him out as my 6lb 6oz baby, but I did it. I know of some women my size who’ve had 11lb babies. Pretty sure I couldn’t, but I figured about 8lb was as big as I could grow/birth a baby. Have you looked into optimal fetal positioning? If baby is in a good position, it’s a lot easier for them to come out, even if they’re bigger. Great site is spinningbabies.com

kristinmh
kristinmh
8 years ago

The midwife who taught my prenatal class talked a lot about fetal positioning…I’ve been spending lots of time on my hands and knees to try to prevent back labour. Fortunately the little bastard is head down and engaged, so at least that’s not an issue.

felixBC
felixBC
8 years ago

I could swear that’s MRAL. Just even meaner, slightly angrier, more in control, and long winded. So, MRAL in 5 years

Emetique Necrotica
Emetique Necrotica
8 years ago

I was with you guys until the virgin-shaming happened.

If you guys are going to take the piss out of Roissy for being an illogical, overcompensating con man he deserves it, but leave us virgins out of it.

I consider myself a feminist to a degree. As a matter of fact, I’ve been lurking on here the past several days after seeking a bit of “relief” from a misogynistic website I had accidentally stumbled upon that made me feel icky.

I’ve been lurking on here the past several days, but this thread in particular highlights the main disconnect between myself and other feminists. I am a virgin, and yes, I am female. Granted the number of times I’ve seen the word “slut-shaming” being thrown around, to see the word “virgin” applied often in a negative context waves a huge red flag of inconsistency.

It’s quite obvious that Roissy’s fetish for sexually inexperienced women is to exploit them, but to read comments like “Who wants a sexually inexperienced woman anyway?” (to paraphrase Scar’s comment) makes me feel no better. Why am I, a virgin, being targeted in this statement instead of him? In March, I turn 24 and I will still be a virgin and I’m at odds with my status. Being a virgin, I already feel undesirable in the first place, especially facing social anxieties over having sex, why? Not because of some moral hangup at all, but because I feel unattractive. Just because Roissy prefers sexually inexperienced women, or god-awful virgins according to a few of you, to suit his predatory, pseudo-scientific agenda to corrupt them doesn’t mean that we don’t think or feel as much as any of you do.

Don’t worry, Roissy wouldn’t touch me with a ten foot pole anyway, since I’m an overweight metalhead who thinks independently and can spot a predatory creep from a mile away.

It’s a serious Catch-22 for people to undermine my sexual desirability as never having had sex when the only way that can change is by *gasp* having sex, but I’m a virgin and am therefore, as a sexual being, less valuable than sexually active women. Who wants a virgin, right? We’re just all so awkward and unsexy. I guess you were all born experienced.

I’ve distanced myself from feminism because of the selective humanity. In defending one group of women, you manage to outcast others. Feminists are so quick to react negatively to sexually active women being called “skanks” and “whores” yet they refer to being a virgin as though it’s a bad thing. Way to reinforce a sense of community by alienating the rest of us, ladies.

For the record, last year I had to report someone at my job for sexual harassment because he wouldn’t stop prying about my virginity. He thought he could shame me for my lack of a sex life by continuously asking me why I was still a virgin.

“Are you a prude? Mormon? A lesbian?”. Yet, the most painful part of all, was not only being reminded why I am still, but knowing that he intentionally put me on the spot, because he could sense my insecurity.

Feminists tend to leap forward when the integrity of a woman’s sexuality is being threatened, but are sudden to dismiss a woman as a sexual being if she’s a virgin. I guess some women are just more equal than others. Tell me, is there a minimal requirement for how many men I need to sleep with in order to be sexually adequate? So much for women sticking together.

Drakalandar
Drakalandar
7 years ago

Roissy is completely retarded : he doesn’t seem to be aware that for a man to have sex with many women, many women have to actually sleep with him. There wouldn’t be “female sluts” if there weren’t “male sluts” (because he only considers heterosexual relations), and he promotes the latter while looking at the former with contempt. Because the more women a man sleeps with, the more chances that the women they sleep with are actually having more partners than the average increases.
But if we had to explain all the things wrong about him, I bet the amount of words would exceed by far the one contained in every Bible printed over the world put together.

Sorry if this is a bit confused but English isn’t my first language.

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