When 5 is 7: Advanced Facebook dating math, according to the dude who actually calls himself “Heartiste”
Cats also think they're all that.
Today, a lesson in advanced Facebook dating mathematics, courtesy of our friend Roissy/Heartiste.
First: fellas, remember that online dating is stacked against us, due to the ability of the ladies to post pictures of themselves looking cute on Facebook – one of the gravest injustices of the modern world. As Heartiste explains, in a post with the bracing title You’ll Need Hard Negs For Facebook Game:
So you’ve got millions of women posting flattering pics of themselves and personal details that are uniformly positive on their FB walls, and you’ve got a bunch of cloying betas feeding the egos of these women even further with painstakingly crafted supportive comments, and you expect to make any headway with tepid game? That is a bitch shield too strong to breach.
But if you must engage the ladies on this unfavorable terrain, remember to adjust your calculations accordingly. As Heartiste explains this new math:
The combination of self-selected profiles and nonstop beta adulation will boost a 5′s self-conception to a 7. Since 5s already have a self-conception of 6 thanks to the phenomenon of female upward dating momentum and the alpha cock carousel, you now have a double-strength bitch shield to bust instead of a single strength.
I’ve prepared a simple chart to illustrate this point:
How to date on Facebook
But wait! There’s more:
Remember, if a 5 believes she’s a 7 (“But I *feel* like a 7!”) she is also going to believe that male 7s are not high enough status for her. Women are not truly happy unless they are dating men 0.5 to 2 sexual market value points higher than themselves.
Five thinks it’s seven. But seven is five. SEVEN IS FIVE!
The reality, of course, is that the male 7 is two full points higher than the female 5. But the Facebook wall has meddled with the primal forces of nature. An unbridgeable chasm brought about by the advance of technology has severed the organically emergent hierarchy of the dating market where there is no escape from soul withering judgments made in mere seconds.
So, as always, the best bet for the modern man is to find some lady in the real world who actually thinks she’s the number she is. Then, simply neg her until she hates herself. That’s how the math is supposed to work.
Posted on December 14, 2011, in beta males, creepy, douchebaggery, I'm totally being sarcastic, kitties, men who should not ever be with women ever, misogyny, PUA. Bookmark the permalink. 399 Comments.
Now I feel like I’m some sort of unfair bitch for not posting hideous photos to Facebook, and status updates about how ugly and worthless I am? Not sure what he wants here.
Well, he wants the usual paradox of “women must sleep with any man who wants them or they’re bitches, but they must carefully reserve sex or they’re sluts.” So I guess I am sure, after all.
The OP is too stupid to acknowledge. I comment only to say that is the prettiest kitty! Look at cat. So self-satisfied.
Dang, I’m only batting a 4.2973 this month. I’m going to need to convert 8 of 14 free throws in the last wicket if I’m going to win the ladiez on the internetz.
You’ve got to love it when their actual complaint is “most women don’t hate themselves enough to sleep with me.”
I was already confused this morning, now it’s quite worse.
Face book assimilation makes you seven of nine!
@juliejezebel, David’s chart helped me.
BORG!
I’m still mystified as to why MRA’s seem to spend so much energy obsessively whining about women who are difficult to date, instead of just… you know… not dating them. Surely if MRA’s are as wonderful as they think they are, they shouldn’t settle for a bitchy 5. Unless, I suppose, MRA’s are subject to the same egotistical inflation of self-worth that they accuse the hated women of, and the self-reported 7’s are actually 2’s because they come across as assholes.
But no, that couldn’t be it.
This facebook game math is complicated. I want to know this, though. If you take the square root of a negative alpha, do you get an imaginary alpha? Also, is it beta to visit your friend’s Farmville game and fertilize their crops? Heartiste has a lot of questions to answer.
It is definitely Beta to fertilize your friend’s crops. (Although rich in symbolism.)
Alphas make tons of “help me build my barn!” requests on everyone’s friend feed and then don’t ever visit their farm-neighbors.
As a former math major I must know where irrational and imaginary numbers lie on this scale.
I personally feel like an i, so I welcome neverdid question.
And what if I’m actually a 9? That means I believe I am a 11 and I’d like to date a 13?
What if you don’t post pictures, how can they know if you’re worth it?
MRAL is reading the graph and nodding approvingly. “Yes, yes, it all makes sense now!”
So, as always, the best bet for the modern man is to find some lady in the real world who actually thinks she’s the number she is. Then, simply neg her until she hates herself. That’s how the math is supposed to work.
LOL!
Is this why 7 ate 9?
Forget not posting pictures, I’m not even on facebook! Alas, I have no one to fertilize my farms. Or have farms for that matter.
Basic premise of the article: Attractive women on Facebook receive a lot of attention from men. This inflates attractive woman’s ego to the point of bursting. Men should give her a neg, dig or verbal jab to pop her ego back to reality.
Wait a second. If women want to date 2 points above themselves, and 5s think they’re 7s, doesn’t that mean that a 5 male has to actually take someone down four points until she’ll date him? Convince her she’s a 3?
Ouch.
“Forget not posting pictures, I’m not even on facebook!”
*high five though the internet*
We’re the only real ladies here, not tauting betas with slutty picture.
I don’t want my farms to be fertilized. That’s to avoid it that condoms are for.
Brandon, are you agreeing with the premise and a conclusion?
So if attractive people are attractive and are told they are attractive then other people who many not be as attractive should tell the attractive people they aren’t attractive so that the less attractive people can…what? Mate with the actually attractive people?
Posts like this make me wish we all didn’t need to actually see, but I’m sure we’d find some other ridiculous scoring system based on smell or vocal tone.
She’s too nasal! She’s a 5!
Five thinks it is seven? But seven ate nine! :o
My profile picture on Facebook is a picture of my cat. He is an 11, but he is not above dating lady cats who are lower on the numbers scale, as long as they’re smart, good conversationalists and have a good sense of humor.
Hey all, part time lurker first time poster. Love the blog, it alternatley makes me cry with laughter and with dispair at humanity.
Anyway, do people actually think like this guy? I mean, really? They think dating boils down to numbers assigned to subjective characteristics like attractiveness?
It’s like they treat dating as some version of a Total War game. Like, she’s using the dating equivalent of armoured cavalry, so I need to deploy dating skirmishing pikemen.
Why is it that feminists and the left will lecture us on homophobia and then resort to it? I don’t find anything wrong with calling himself Heartiste.
Online dating is stacked against us because it’s a sausagefest. Even the most attractive guys will get fewer messages than the average women. Heartiste has some good ideas for guys that are nearly sociopaths. It doesn’t seem like it is worth becoming a sociopath just to have a woman like me.
*Girl posts attractive picture of herself*
Brandon: You look like you could lose some weight.
You must make so many friends that way.
@Kyrie: That is what I think Roissy/Heartiste was trying to get across in that post.
@Julie: Physical attractiveness matters when it comes to men looking for sex/girlfriends/potential wives. Most men want a woman with a good body. And if two women were completely identical in every way, except one was overweight and the other was not. I would bet 9 times out of 10…the man would pick the non-overweight girl.
Also, have you ever tried picking up women? A lot of attractive women move through life as if their shit doesn’t stink. This is delusional thinking. So a neg can simply be about reminding them that they aren’t perfect (just like you). A neg such as “Your nails look nice, are they press ons?”.
You know, I have an alternative theory to that of ‘Heartiste’ on why cruising on FB is hard: it’s not a fucking dating site.
People have this expectation that they will be mainly in contact with a small circle of people they already know, and that interactions with third parties will occur through intersectionality (I wish B happy birthday, and B’s friend ALSO wishes him happy birthday, but I will rarely have interactions with B’s friend unless he’s also in my friend list).
A person who violates this unspoken social contract and contacts an unknown simply because of the Friend-of-a-Friend linkage is unlikely to be welcomed in the first place. It will throw red flags to women because of the sort of entitled attitude one is likely to have in order to do this sort of cold contact. An exception might be made if the two FoFs had some long term contact via their mutual friend’s wall and it was made clear through that interaction that some sort of commonality or connection exists that might be explored… But contact out of the blue is likely very much a red flag.
So here’s something that’s getting me, now:
My “number,” whatever the fuck that means, has presumably remained stable over the last 5 years or so. I’ve stayed at about the same weight and haven’t had any surgery or made any major changes in my “style” or whatever.
But I’ve dated guys who looked very different from each other! Some of them were (purely physically) more attractive than others and in no discernible order!
What on Earth could be going on here?
@Crumbelievable: That is a flat out insult…not a neg.
Why should anyone care how inflated some stranger’s ego is? What, are men reality police now?
MRAth is hard :*(
Is that even a neg? That’s just going to get a response of “huh? No, they’re real.” or “yep, aren’t they nice ones?”
I’m having trouble seeing how that wounds a woman to the point where she’ll sleep with a man, any man, just to prove I’m still beautiful!
Then what’s a good example of a “neg”?
Actually Brandon, my post was tongue in cheek silliness. Also, yeah I’ve picked up a number of women. I never found it necessary to insult anyone, nor would I anyway.
There is a big difference between negging as teasing banter back and forth and actually insulting someone to make them feel shitty about themselves (so they hope you fuck them).
At one point when I was on facebook my profile picture was of me drinking out of a toilet (that had been rigged to be a water fountain and never used for it’s original purpose… I don’t drink that much). So that surely dropped me down some points. But everyone loved it, which gave me back points? Plus at the time of the pic I had sexay red hair? I’m going with tau. I was totally tau points.
@Amused: Because men want to get laid and popping her ego helps facilitate that.
When a man expresses such a keen interest in how manicures work, it’s a definite turn-off.
No, it doesn’t. Insulting people does not lead to them wanting to have sex with you. And besides — if anyone’s ego needed popping, it’s yours.
You’re not perfect, Brandon? I am disappoint.
No, it doesn’t. And if it does, she’s got issues larger than the douchebag she just fucked.
Brandon, how does popping an ego help a man get laid? I mean, I suppose in some part of the world it does. Something about this must work, but I fail to understand why being insulted would make me want to sleep with the man insulting me.
Is it supposed to be some kind of Moonlighting “hatesex” tension? Or that if she can prove her worth to the man who has insulted her, he’ll somehow stop insulting her? Cause my guess is he’ll just keep insulting her.
@Holly: It isn’t just a neg that makes women jump in bed with men. Thinking that is foolish. But certain behaviors that a lot of PUA’s try and teach work well with women: don’t be clingy or needy, stand up for yourself and your beliefs (e.g having a backbone), be presentable (clean shaven) because you never know when you will meet someone.
It isn’t JUST the neg or JUST the clothes. It is the sum of everything the man is doing which makes him attractive to a larger pool of women. The clothes, the behavior, body language, stories, wit, jokes, job, etc..
What a lot of men are trying to accomplish by being apart of the “PUA lifestyle” is to make themselves more attractive to more women.
Negs only work on women who: 1) already have low self-esteem or 2) are actually just trying to get laid themselves and are only minimally interested in what the man talking to them is saying. They’re not magical; there’s no code that’s being cracked. A woman with healthy self-esteem, especially if she’s very attractive and knows perfectly well that she’s got a lot going for herself besides her looks, won’t respond positively to negging.
But I’ve seen it work on women who think their looks are the best thing about them. What reads as “ego” to the men who are trying to get next to them is often (though not always) a defense built over time to mask a sense of low self-worth and deal with men.
It’s hilarious though that folks like Brandon and MRAL, are always going on and on about the “egos” on good-looking women. Really good looking women are constantly being approached by men based on nothing more than physical attraction and yet they’re supposed to act flattered and appreciative that yet another stranger is attempting to get into their pants. But apparently the women have the “ego” problem.
Too funny.
@Brandon: I can read the article and it’s not rocket science. My question is, do YOU, agree with the premise and the conclusion of the article?
Do you think hurting someone’s self image is a valid way of finding sex partners?
Oh, really? Because everything you said before that boils down to PUA’s trying to make attractive women hate themselves.
Oh ok, I think I have a better understanding of what “neg” means. Let me try again
*Girl points cute photo of herself in new outfit*
Brandon: Ooh, cute dress. But I wouldn’t be caught dead wearing it with those heels. I mean Hellooo!
I think the idea is the MRAL-like delusion that women are too high-and-mighty to sleep with men, instead of, you know, not wanting to.
It all makes sense if you approach sex as a scenario where:
1) Everyone’s attractiveness is objectively ranked
and
2) A woman will accept any man over her attractiveness “threshold.”
Concepts like “you’re cute but not my type” or “you’re cute but I’m not into you like that” just sail over these guys heads and all they here is “Sorry, ugly man, you don’t meet my threshold.”
*sorry, I forget to get my whole username in ^
YOU SHALL NOT PASS
Brandon, that’s called bullying and we don’t do that in this classroom, ok? Go sit in the corner and think about what you did.
I think #2 accounts for 90% of PUA success stories.
“Yeah yeah, my nails are press-on, whatever, we gonna do this or not?”
I didn’t know what a neg was, had never considered it “flirting” to tell someone something unflattering. Then I went to a party with a friend of mine. While I was at the bar, getting us drinks, a guy came up to her and said “Why did you have to destroy your beauty with that horrible piercing?” (nose btw.) She blinked, turned around and left.
I am not so sure, this strategy is successful!
@Amused:
1) I don’t insult people, I may however make a less than stellar observation about something I see around me.
2) Saying a neg doesn’t make women jump into bed with you. It does work on highly attractive women because most men don’t talk to her like that (usually they are kissing her ass or doing whatever she says). So you appear different in her eyes. Thus it allows you to begin a conversation. If you didn’t say that, then she would most likely blow you off.
3) When I was in high school, I was the typical Nice Guy, while I didn’t expect women to give me anything, I did think that niceness and accommodation would work in meeting a girl and getting a girlfriend. Needless to say, I had limited success. However, I acted slightly aloof and made comments to girls that no other man would make…and lo and behold, I had more girlfriends, dates, sex, etc…
So behavior matters when it comes to women and women as a whole view certain behaviors more attractive than others. The idea is to add more attractive traits while removing unattractive ones.
Holly, I’d wager that it’s 90-95% easily. Naturally, this is a difficult concept to understand for the kind of guys who think that women don’t have internal lives/their own needs/sex-drives that are independent of men.
“Negs only work on hot women” is the new “only smart people can see the Emperor’s clothes.”
Yeah, “less than stellar” sums you up pretty well.
So how does failure feel?
@Julie: Because you keep equating it to being insulting when it isn’t. If I say “You are fat as a cow”…that is an insult. If I say “you have something in your hair” or “You say “like”/OMG/”whatever” a lot”.
You aren’t insulting them, you are just saying something mildly unflattering. And saying unflattering things does not equal being insulting.
@Nobinayamu: Wrong.
@Kyrie: I don’t see it as hurting ones self image.
———————————-
I am actually curious as to what the commenters here actually think are negs. Can anyone provide examples of what YOU think a neg is?
Wow. Just… wow. Honestly, anyone who thinks insulting people is the way to get sex/dates deserves who they end up with.
I think #2 accounts for 90% of PUA success stories.
“Yeah yeah, my nails are press-on, whatever, we gonna do this or not?”
Yeah, the whole “Woman was going to fuck him anyway, so she let him think his Game bullshit was working long enough to get into bed.” theory is a pretty sound one, based on the fact that women;
A) Aren’t any more stupid, on the whole, than any other person.
B) Can read. It’s not like women aren’t aware that PUA bullshit exists.
You know what’s kind of sad? Watching guys who’ve eaten up this whole “Negs only work on hot women” thing actually try this shit in social settings. They’ve eaten up all this PUA foolishness, hook-line and sinker…
As an aside, isn’t PUA one of the greatest hustles ever?
At any rate, the guys who’ve bought into this “No one ever says anything mean to a pretty woman so if you tease/insult her in just the right way she’ll be intrigued!” are often not the most socially adept guys out there. But armed with this little bit of “knowledge”, they forge ahead trying to create a sense of false intimacy and flirty banter with strange women they find attractive by making just the right kind of insult. The results are… sometimes not pretty.
People who don’t already feel badly about themselves don’t actually like being insulted.
The idea of the “neg” can work. Sometimes. But it isn’t linked to some objective standard of attractiveness.
“Oh, yeah I did. There, I got it. Thanks.”
or
“No I don’t. Why did you say I did? What’s up with you?”
“Yeah, heh, I guess I do. Whatever!”
I’m not seeing the straight-line path to “take me home, please, take me home and prove to me that I’m still a woman!”
Brandon, if a girl has spent ample time on a manicure (meaning she probably spent money too) then implying her nails are cheap and trashy is actually an insult.
But you know, whatever works I guess. Gettin’ laid!
Brandon: How about ‘That’s a nice necklace/brooch/other bit of random jewelry. My grandma had one just like it.’ I’ve heard of that being used for clothes, too. I know nothing put me in a sexytime mood like being told I remind some random dude of his grandma! (if someone told me I remind them of my recently passed grandma, I’d be flattered beyond belief. She was awesomesauce.)
@Holly: Wrong. You rarely need negs on fatter/uglier women because 1) Any mild criticism will be overblown and she will feel hurt and 2) fatter/uglier women tend to not get approached as much. This makes her more available since she will tend to be more forgiving of any negative traits the guy has. Wherein more attractive women will get rid of you at the very first thing they don’t like about you since the chances of another guy hitting on her soon is pretty good.
I had no idea Brandon is an I-used-to-be-a-Nice-Guy(tm)! They’re always my favourites. “I tried to hide my entitlement and misogyny behind a screen of ‘niceness’, but I didn’t get laid enough, so I removed the screen!”
Sure I am Brandon. What about?
Incidentally, offering a stranger a completely unsolicited unflattering opinion is, here on earth, considered an insult. I realize that you barely understand how language works but, context matters.
Your distinction between insulting and making “less than stellar observations” is arbitrary and self-serving. Criticizing someone’s appearance and picking over their physical flaws or their wardrobe choices is fucking rude, and a de facto insult.
Oh, so the key is to appear different? Sweet! What a world of possibilities out there for getting your foot in the conversation door. Examples:
“I put marshmallows in my cole slaw. Do you?”
“I find talking to dead people soothes my tortured genius.”
“The Holocaust was a joke.”
“T’was brillyg, and ye slythy toves
Did gyre and gymble in ye wabe:
All mimsy were ye borogoves
And ye momeraths outgrabe.”
Notice, none of those entail a direct insult of the person you are talking to.
Right, here comes the standard “I was a nice guy, but girls didn’t treat me right, so now I punish them” story. A decent person will not act like a rude asshat, even if he didn’t get any in high school. Your typical “Nice Guy” is a blight on the face of humanity.
My profile picture is currently of a Christmas penguin, but normally it is the same Aeris icon that I use here. Because I do not use Facebook to find teh sex. I use it to keep in touch with family/friends across the country and to play dumb games.
@Julie: And how do I know if she spent hours doing her nails? For all I know, they could be kmart press ons.