W.F. Price: A Daisy Picking Mangina?
I'm onto you, all women!
MRAs and MGTOWers are, as you might have guessed, some pretty acronym-happy people. And one of their favorite acronyms — besides those two – is NAWALT, which stands for “Not All Women Are Like That.” This is a phrase often uttered by people who are not misogynist assholes in response to things said about women by people who are misogynist assholes. Apparently many MRAs and MGTOWers hear this so often that they’ve turned it into a running gag, the “joke” being that in their minds all women really ARE like that.
Now W.F. Price of The Spearhead has caused a tempest in the teapot that is the manosphere by admitting that, in fact, not all women are like that:
We all know that there are good women out there, including some who comment here, in our families, at work and in neighborhoods all over the land, so why shouldn’t we listen to women who tell us this is the case?
Now, Price has not suddenly become a feminist or anything. Indeed he went on to argue that even if not all women are horrible monsters,
a lot of them are, and we have no assurance that the nice girl who is smiling and saying she loves you won’t at some point destroy your life. …
If somebody handed you a revolver with three loaded chambers and three empty ones and said, “go ahead and aim this at your head and pull the trigger — not all the chambers are loaded,” would you go along with the suggestion? Of course not. It would be sheer folly.
And, oh, it goes on. Blah blah blah, men, don’t get married. Blah blah blah, and you good ladies out there better give up some of your rights – sorry, advantages — because the bad ladies abuse them and pretty soon no man will want to marry any of you:
[T]hose women who really “aren’t like that”… are less likely to find a man willing to marry them, and more likely to be used and abandoned at the first hint of commitment. Society at large is increasingly skeptical about the virtues of women, and the word is bubbling up from the grass roots that women are a risky proposition. …
Until the laws are reformed and some balance is restored to relationships, men who care at all about their lives will have no choice but to regard any woman he becomes involved with as a loaded gun pointed straight at him.
So, yeah, this is the same old W.F. Price we know and don’t love.
On The Spearhead itself, the dissenters were at least generally polite. “Nah, sorry Mr Price,” wrote oddsock. “Your well written post cuts no ice with me. All women are like that.” Herbal Essence also challenged Price’s math:
The argument needs to be rejected because nearly all women are enabling the behavior of the worst of them. And nearly all women stand, arms akimbo, as a bloc to preserve female superiority. ..
[I]t’s time that men take off their rose-colored glasses and realize that nearly all women are waging a war against us. For god sakes, our own mothers, sisters, wives, and daughters support the female hive mind over their own flesh and blood. (us.)
Over on MGTOWforums.com, the judgment was a little harsher. The commenter calling himself fairi5fair reacted as though Price had lopped off his own dick and announced his engagement to the ghost of Andrea Dworkin.
W. F. Price is just a daisy-picking mangina with a chip on his shoulder imo. Even the woman MRA I knew was probably just using it as a slick way to trap a nesting male.
Bottom line: if words are coming out of a woman’s mouth, she’s a lying cunt. Mr. Price probably wants to believe in some romantic fairytale because he just got divorced and wants pussy again, and doesn’t want to face the reality of his options.
Yes, Mr. Price, you’re going to get your sorry ass handed to you again if you keep thinking with your dick and your heart. Use the brain, moron. Next!
Whenever I run across something this idiotic, I have to remind myself that Not All MGTOWers Are That Astoundingly Stupid. NAMGTOWATAS, for short.
Posted on May 13, 2011, in antifeminism, evil women, idiocy, internal debate, manginas, marriage strike, men who should not ever be with women ever, MGTOW, misogyny, MRA, oppressed men, the spearhead, western women suck. Bookmark the permalink. 315 Comments.
… a slick way to trap a nesting male.
“Nesting male”?
If we are waging a war, we are doing a pretty poor job of it since we still have men roaming around free.
I really don’t understand this whole boycott women then complain about them constantly mentality. I get it, you don’t like women and do not want to be married. I respect your rights to live the way you got to live. But STFU and go live your life. If MRAs really didn’t care about women, they wouldn’t be talking about them CONSTANTLY. Stop obsessing and whining.
And I really don’t think women are what are screwing up MRA lives. I suspect it’s their own mental problems and chronic insecurity. That’s the only explanation for that Greek Classification crap.
I always think these guys don’t realize just how common women are. There’s more than three billion of us! And we don’t exactly coordinate our movements. Not all women are like anything. What the hell do I have in common with Sarah Palin, Ellen DeGeneres, Oprah Winfrey, Michelle Kwan, Camille Paglia, Jenna Jameson, Angela Merkel, bell hooks, Amber from “Teen Mom”, and the lady sitting across from me on the subway?
Trust me when I say that Michelle Kwan and I do not get together and decide how we’re going to exploit men today.
Camille Paglia
Please, I’m eating lunch here.
I have actually never had a conversation with any woman about exploiting men, unless you count the times when I was “AAAAH! That is so unethical” to a high-school friend who was dating a guy for presents.
On the other hand, high school. Lots of people are douchebags in high school.
What I want to see is a follow-up essay by Petra, entitled: “Yes, I am a lying cunt.”
These Spearhead guys keep warning “Men are catching on to women’s evil ways, word is bubbling up, you’ll be sorry when we reject you women, etc”. Yes, I’m sure the women of the world are mourning the loss of Spearhead men from the dating pool. Women are just dying to marry misogynistic jerks.
So W.F. Price doesn’t trust any women and will never remarry? Oh no, he’s such a great catch with all of his rants about feminazi conspiracies! He’s actually right that marrying a woman carries a high risk of divorce for him, because how could a woman be happy married to such a hateful man? I think it would be very interesting to hear a lot of those MRA’s ex wives tell their side of the story.
“He’s actually right that marrying a woman carries a high risk of divorce for him, because how could a woman be happy married to such a hateful man?”
But see, Kendra, that’s precisely the point — women are evil because they act in pursuit of happiness, and that’s just plain wrong. Only men should get to do things for their own happiness. Women, on the other hand, should just serve. Any woman who does anything for the sake of her own happiness is a selfish, evil bitch (not to mention, a lying ****).
“Society at large is increasingly skeptical about the virtues of women, and the word is bubbling up from the grass roots that women are a risky proposition.”
Anyone else find this statement really weird? “Society at large”? It’s like he’s unaware that a large part of society at large consists of WOMEN.
You know I’m going through a divorce right now myself (it’s going about as well as such things can, so there’s no temptation toward MRA-ism or MGTOW-ism). One of the major factors was that my ex didn’t get along with my family, particularly my mother.
WTF, female hive mind?
I mean, is the hive mind actually suffering from a split personality, or is it just pretending to in order to mess with me?
I have to remind myself that Not All MGTOWers Are That Astoundingly Stupid.
OK, Dave, I know you’re making a rhetorical point here, but do you actually have any examples of MGTOWers who are, in fact, not that stupid? Because all I’ve seen are the Stupid, the Stupider, and that How-Are-You-Even-Able-To-Live-Day-To-Day-Without-Eating-Random-Inanimate-Objects level of Stupid.
I love this part: Society at large is increasingly skeptical about the virtues of women, and the word is bubbling up from the grass roots that women are a risky proposition.
It’s like, the widespread, canonical idea that women are inherently bad news hasn’t actually been around since Genesis and before, historically used to oppress women for virtually forever. Nope! It’s all the brainchild of innovative MRAs and MGTOWers! Thanks, MRAs and MGTOWers, for getting out The Word! It is as accurate and helpful as it is groundbreaking!
@Samsara
It’s the same reason why the Republicans are so obsessed with gay sex and abortions. They really don’t understand what the words “freedom” or “human rights” mean.
For MGTOW human rights are a zero-sum game rather than a win-win situation.
Bee: I like even more how they treat women as being somehow outside of “society at large” and “the world”. Apparently, in their view, society and the world’s population are com prized solely of men.
Female Hive Mind – does that mean I’m telepathic?
I am Jean Grey, and soon, I will be…THE PHOENIX
Seraph, I would explain how the female hive mind works, but I have received instructions from our Borg queen that it is supposed to be secret from all men. Those pesky MGTOW weren’t supposed to know about the hive mind. Oh no, I’ve said too much already.
“He’s actually right that marrying a woman carries a high risk of divorce for him, because how could a woman be happy married to such a hateful man? I think it would be very interesting to hear a lot of those MRA’s ex wives tell their side of the story.”
I’ve always wondered what Bill Price’s ex would have to say about what her marriage was like to him. Especially since he mentioned being involved in a “SWAT incident” related to “trying to be a father to his children” in a post last month. http://www.the-spearhead.com/2011/04/07/fathers-damned-if-you-do/
Given his belief system and severe entitlement, he would be hell to live with.
If the SWAT team shows up at wherever you are at because of you, it is pretty obvious you are not that interested in your kids otherwise you would not cause the kind of problems the SWAT team is needed for.
…I really do not get how they can say things like “Society at large is increasingly skeptical about the virtues of women, and the word is bubbling up from the grass roots that women are a risky proposition. …” seriously.
I mean, does society not include women? If women are such a risky proposition… I just… How do you even fucking parse that?
Also, the whole MGTOW seems like the male side of lesbian separatism, only less understandable. And without any understanding that this makes these ostensibly straight dudes look like the worst stereotype of the woman-hating closeted misogynist.
Holy crap! Maybe if your idea of trying to be a father to your children involves a SWAT team, you are not a very good father. Most Spearhead posts are extremely painful to read. That one was excruciating.
I like the idea of men being a part of their children’s lives. It’s strange to me that Price there has framed the discussion of men being a part of their children’s lives as something that can only happen after divorce. Like, I dunno … maybe that’s part of the problem, dude. Well, that, and the SWAT team.
As a side note, do you think Price ever gets anything right?
Amused: Yeah, it’s all pretty “likeable.” Hey, look at me, I’m an alien!!!
Price has a son and a daughter. I feel sure he’s teaching his daughter how to be a “obedient wife” and his son that he deserves one.
Women always lie.
If a woman says, “I am a lying cunt,” is she telling the truth??
OMG PHILOMOSOPHICAL DILEMMA!!1!
MGTOW would be like lesbian separatism if they didn’t have to put so much damned effort into squelching their desire for pussy. Maybe they should all join the priesthood or something.
I wonder how Price’s son and daughter would feel reading his posts on the Spearhead. I think it would damage a child to read his or her dad trying to argue that all women are evil, lying bitches. How could he treat his daughter well if he views women with such contempt? Someday that girl will be a woman, too.
Why do MRAs hate the idea that less people are getting married but also hate the idea that anyone would get married?
*headdesk* *headdesk* *headdesk*
Ow.
Bushfire, I think their dissatisfaction is with marriage as it’s currently constituted. They then cite the decline in marriage rates as proof that things aren’t right. It’s a retrograde movement, with its aim being the restoration of some idyllic past that never actually existed.
Picking out individual venting-comments and displaying them here as representative of MRAs.
Interesting strategy to get approval from feminists but not the strategy of a truth seeker.
You mean if I become an MRA I can trap a nesting male? SCORE.
Anit – uh, have you read the little blurb up at the top right of the blog here? The point of this blog is mockery, plain and simple. We’re here for the LOLz, not the search for The Ultimate Truth About All MRAs Everywhere. Well, ok, that’s why *I’m* here. I suppose I can’t speak for all the commenters :)
@Plymouth – some of that for me, and some reminding myself that people like the ones quoted here exist.
@Plymouth, @ Sivi me too, but also because for me anyway, reading arguments I disagree with helps me to clarify for myself WHY i disagree with them. So if this ever came up irl, I might be able to say something intelligent, rather than ‘duhhhh are you serious?!’
Or you could mimic NWOSlave and conclude your argument with “TADAA”, which gives you an automatic win.
Anit
Please explain how there is anything individual or simply venting about the mra: a very small fringe group consisting of much less the 99.9% of the population even by conservative standards.
Then explain how woman are not individuals as 50% of the population and somehow work as a collective mind.
Riddle me this.
Also, anit, I was responding to a post made by the guy in charge of one of the biggest online hangouts for MRAs and MGTOWs; one of the comments on the site I quoted in the OP has gotten more than 100 upvotes from readers there, the other, 80. (both are many times the # of downvotes they got.) No, these guys do not represent every MRA, and I would never suggest that, but they do seem to represent a fairly broad consensus among spearhead readers.
The quote later? As I said, NAMGTOWATAS.
This site is about misogyny; I go where it is online. I find a lot of it where MRAs and MGTOWers tend to hang out.
But I’m curious, if you feel there are sites that are more representative of MRAs, let me know.
This combination of hating women and obsessing about them is weird. Someone needs to look into developing a reversed version of that fake “conversion therapy” for “curing” homosexuals, so that all the MRAs can turn gay. That way they’d no longer need to worry about women, and women would no longer need to worry about them. Everyone would win.
Sometimes I think these guys are just pissed that the 19th century is over. Except for the whole technology thing, of course; the internet does make whining easier.
Anit
Show us a mra website, thread, forum which you would imagine the mra should be.
These same type of men were bitching about women in the 19th century. Actually they have been complaining about some golden age not being in place where women were doing whatever the contradictory requirements of MRAs have had since the beginnings of recorded history.
Kind of depressing if you think about it.
NWO is gone; anit shows up. It’s seriously like there’s a law of troll conservation.
Incidentally, how does something bubble up out of grass? Grass is not bubbly.
The only thing I can think of that bubbles out of grass is raw sewage from an overflowing septic tank. Which is actually very fitting, here.
Katz, I was wondering that too. Perhaps the grass is over a septic tank? Stuff could bubble up out of that.
HA! Snowy beat me to it.
@infidel, except, of course, other gay and bi men…
@darksidecat
I can imagine gay men everywhere saying, “Hey, don’t dump your garbage over here!”
@Infidel753
Why do you hate the Gays so much that you would send MRAs to them?
Wow! They only posted it less than 36 hours back on The Spearhead. And the hive is buzzing with Queen bees already? Best of luck, NAWALTS! ;) I guess, you really need a life. All that snaring and shaming tactics, not working out well for you, huh?
Lets imagine for one moment that there was a systemic injustice towards a group of people. If some of them make a forum and try to point out and fight those injustices, you are always going to find a lot who are just venting. They’ve been hurt and they found a place where they can let that anger run free.
If you think MRAs are so exceptionally bad, then how about a fair comparison? Just log into a few feminist forums with a male avatar, and politely ask about mens issues and try to defend the need to address them. I tried it a few times and the responses were typically full of hate, misandry, anger and a complete lack of willingness to actually improve anything. Constructive comments were the exception there too. Basically they’re just as bad.
If you really just want to mock people’s bad behavior then perhaps you should keep in mind that some of them are in pain and they’re just venting. And mocking that is quite cynical really. Would you also mock a victim of domestic violence who was letting out their pain and thus making no sense?
The real sad thing is that MRAs and feminists should have been the same organization from the start. Both have set the goal to achieve equality but both are fighting each other and turning men and women against each other.
And blogs like this only make it worse. I wish you’d realize it.
@Rico:
Queen bees??? Is this some sort of new thing I haven’t heard about? Man, I must be really behind on my feminist terminology.. wait…
@anit:
Lets put aside for the moment that I hardly think you could present men’s issues in a polite manner (for long, anyway). We mock because the issues MRAs whine about either don’t exist, or exist in a very small way, or MRAs go way overboard with what you call “venting” and what we call hate speech. At least with domestic violence we can recognize a real problem.
If only MRAs and feminists were on the same side. Both organizations, the MRM and the Feminist Movement, are ostensibly about equality between the sexes, and go about it by trying to raise the status of one or the other gender. Trouble is, that puts them at odds. If you could somehow put both sexes on a single scale (an oversimplification), at this point we feminists would say that women are lower on the scale then men. We want to change this by raising women up. MRAs think feminists want to lower men down, and assert that it is actually MEN who are lower on the scale. Therefore their solution is to raise men up (and some of the more extreme want to bring women down).
Hence the problem, even more so if you take into account that the facts and history support the idea that women are lower on the scale at the moment. Thus, what you call “venting” to us looks like whining, delusional thinking, and the spread of misinformation (at best). This is why we mock.
Just log into a few feminist forums with a male avatar, and politely ask about mens issues and try to defend the need to address them.
Ah, mens issues like false rape accusations and sperm stealing and how men shouldn’t have to pay child support? Yeah, I can imagine how that went.
The real sad thing is that MRAs and feminists should have been the same organization from the start. Both have set the goal to achieve equality but both are fighting each other and turning men and women against each other.
MRAs do not want equality. They suffer from delusions of persecution for a variety of reasons, and they want to end this imaginary persecution by harrassing women.
And blogs like this only make it worse. I wish you’d realize it.
Why, it’s an MRA concern troll! I’ll have to add that one to my collection.
Also, what kirbywarp said.
Anit: That’s a combination of concern/tone trolling and tu quoque. Neither of them flies.
Add the goalpost moving (you started by saying this wasn’t a fair representation of MRAs, now it’s just a bunch of guys with manpain whining about how they don’t deserve the sort of butt-hurt they have. I don’t care which position you take, but you do have to stick with it, and either admit you were wrong [i.e. the comments being discussed here aren't outliers] or defend it.)
As to the new argument that MRAs are talking about equality and equitable treatment for all I’d like to see how you square the tone and tenor of MRA boards with those ideas, and I’d like to see where you see congruence between feminism and MRA.
I’d also be interested in the concerns you say were met with hate and misandry.
As to the whining that blogs like this one only increase the divisive relationship between men and women… hard to credit, since the commenters here seem to be a mix of men and women. I don’t see, all things being equal that the attitude of MRAs can be made worse. Having made comments at a few of their boards, in an attempt to discuss the counter-arguments to their positions, and been met with abuse, villification, and the odd death threat (and I mean odd in the sense of ‘strange’. When I was doing journalism I got some pretty passionate ones, and when I was in the Army I got some fairly credible ones, but the stuff from the MRA boards was small beer compared to the former, and laughable compared to the latter; since there was nothing in them to make my specific ID, or location, apparent), I don’t see them as likely to get any better because of sincere engagement.
That leaves making other people aware of just how ridiculous they are; in much the same way it’s effective to stand up to a bully or to point at laugh at a flasher.
@Pecunium:
You forget yourself. Us men here are “manginas,” not “real men.” We’ve already bought into the feminist conspiracy and are now sad shells of our former selves, down on bended knee begging our women overlords for pussy. All the “real men” are going their own way.
@Pecunium:
Also, the tag fail invalidates your entire argument.
Fixed the tag fail! I am a full-service blogger.
Hrm.. Lets put this to the test then. >:)
@Johnny Pez:
Your reference to a nonexistant tag fail invalidates your entire argument.
kirbywarp: They can call me anything they like. I’m at least a beta, and maybe an alpha, so I can pour all the disdain them I like. I go my own way; that way happens to include women; women who have opinions, and attitude and like having sex with me.
As I said, I’ve been around the block a few times. I don’t care what they call me. Won’t make them any more attractive, nor any less ridiculous. If they had half a brain in their heads, and the courage God gave rabbits they’d be out there trying to figure out why it is they are unhappy, when so many other men are able to cope with the modern world’s women.
As Socrates said, “Know thyself, the unexamined life isn’t worth living”. I’ve examined mine and I’m happy with it.
That, IMO, makes me an adult. They are having playing a game of “no girlz allowed”. Fine, if they want to ape nine-year old boys, and talk about the nasty cooties girls have they can. So long as they keep the circle-jerk in the clubhouse I don’t care.
But they keep aiming it out the window of the tree house, and that’s just gross.
Thanks Dave. I hate it when that happens. I’ve been using my blog to proof things with links, but sometimes I’m lazy.
It’s a conspiracy! You’re all in on it! It’s because I’m short, isn’t it?
Johnny Pez: It’s actually because the Hive-mind is jealous of your basenji.
@Johnny Pez:
Yep. :P
@Pecunium:
Hear hear (or is it “here here?”). I’ve read a bit about cults (in reference to Scientology) before, and one of the key parts of indoctrination is the creation of in-group lingo to separate themselves from others. Hence all the bizarre acronyms, like MGTOW, NAWALT, and insults like “mangina” or (apparently) “hampster.” It serves to alienate group members from the outside, while cementing bonds between members.
Its frustrating, because every aspect of their group becomes a further mental block in being able to deal with their problems rationally. Its probably why nearly all the MRAs who show up here sound like trolls; they are prevented from considering any sort of argument the way a troll could only dream.
It’s Hear! Hear! (from the habit in the British Parliament of calling out, from the back benches, “Hear him!, Hear him! [though in more modern times this is “Hear Her!, Hear Her! when it’s a female MP).
It calls on others to pay attention.
And well it/they should be. Bee is right; they are little cuties.
Hear hear (or is it “here here?”). I’ve read a bit about cults (in reference to Scientology) before, and one of the key parts of indoctrination is the creation of in-group lingo to separate themselves from others. Hence all the bizarre acronyms, like MGTOW, NAWALT, and insults like “mangina” or (apparently) “hampster.”
Yeah! Or, you know, “cis-gendered”, “ableism”, “bingo card”, “oppression olympics”, “mansplaining”, “douchecanoe”, “flounce” etc.
It serves to alienate group members from the outside, while cementing bonds between members.
Very true.
Lets put aside for the moment that I hardly think you could present men’s issues in a polite manner (for long, anyway). We mock because the issues MRAs whine about either don’t exist, or exist in a very small way, or MRAs go way overboard with what you call “venting” and what we call hate speech. At least with domestic violence we can recognize a real problem.
So when someone vents out of anger the proper response is to mock and insult them for it? You sound like a great friend… :P
So when someone vents out of anger the proper response is to mock and insult them for it? You sound like a great friend…
MRAs are nobodies friends. Especially themselves.
You got it, Ion, any time anyone vents for any reason, you must mock them. That is exactly what that quote, as well as the rest of my post, was supposed to convey. -_-
Bingo card? Douchecanoe? Opression olympics? Haven’t heard these ones before. In any case, I will concede that there is a fine line between in-group lingo and jargon. The main difference between the words I cited and words like “cis-gendered”, “ablism”, and even “flounce” is that those are words meant to be used, and to be meaningful, outside of the group.
In any case, its most likely that the presence of jargon is a hint towards cultish behavior, but not sufficient for it. The MRA group, as I see it, has plenty more problems going with it than just the lingo.
@ Kirbywarp
“Lets put aside for the moment that I hardly think you could present men’s issues in a polite manner (for long, anyway). We mock because the issues MRAs whine about either don’t exist, or exist in a very small way”
This is just a subjective opinion of yours. Just because you haven’t encountered any issues or don’t see any doesn’t mean there aren’t any. There are also plenty of people who deny that jews were persecuted. Mocking them for it is only going to provoke more quarrels.
“Both organizations, the MRM and the Feminist Movement, are ostensibly about equality between the sexes, and go about it by trying to raise the status of one or the other gender.”
This is the sad mistake that both sides make: play genders against each other. What you, and most others need to learn is that neither gender will be able to emancipate without the other. Women will never be free of their gender roles until men are and vice versa. This is why the fighting over who has it worse or who’s more responsible is absurd and infantile. It’ll only make things worse, not better. But it has been my experience that both MRAs and feminists usually don’t really want things to improve. Of course they say they do, but their actions and words reveal a lust for blood rather than a desire for peace and harmony.
@ Johny Pez
“Ah, mens issues like false rape accusations and sperm stealing and how men shouldn’t have to pay child support?”
You can paint any group’s concerns as ridiculous using rhetoric like that. It’s certainly a good way to keep the quarrel going.
“MRAs do not want equality. They suffer from delusions of persecution for a variety of reasons, and they want to end this imaginary persecution by harrassing women.”
They say the same thing about feminists. I doubt both and so should anyone else who cares about the truth.
“Why, it’s an MRA concern troll!”
Sure. I’m clearly only here to cause trouble. You caught me and my secret’s out. All those vicious personal attacks must have tipped you off.
@ Pecunium
“That’s a combination of concern/tone trolling and tu quoque. Neither of them flies.”
Nice little attempt to discredit me without addressing anything I say. More subtle than most I must say.
“Add the goalpost moving”
No goalpost moving here. Conversations move across various topics at times. My position hasn’t changed. Why should it. I’ve read nothing remotely adequate to justify my changing my position.
“I don’t care which position you take”
Sure. If I’d come here applauding the MRA bashing then you’d have called me a troll nonetheless.
“As to the new argument that MRAs are talking about equality and equitable treatment for all I’d like to see how you square the tone and tenor of MRA boards with those ideas, and I’d like to see where you see congruence between feminism and MRA.”
I’ll ask a question as a response: Do you think it’s possible for somebody to advocate for men’s rights and not be a misogynist/sexist and genuinely seek equality? I’m not asking if you’ve encountered such a person yourself, just if it’s possible that they exist.
“I’d also be interested in the concerns you say were met with hate and misandry.”
The hate starts before you go into specifics. Try it. Just say you think men’s issues should be addressed too and see what happens. I’m not doing your homework for you. Experience it yourself. If you’re so right then all you risk finding is a confirmation of you being right. Win win.
“As to the whining that blogs like this one only increase the divisive relationship between men and women… hard to credit, since the commenters here seem to be a mix of men and women.”
Ah, the phenomenon that many feminists are men. My experience is that many of them are not really interested in genuinely empowering women. Since I am, I easily spot the frauds. In fact, they have shifted feminism away from women’s empowerment and towards a new version of patriarchy – a kind of political chivalry. That imbalance is probably just an expression of the imbalance in sexual selection.
Alrighty then, anit. Sure, you can find people who say Jews weren’t persecuted. But the evidence of history says otherwise. I have yet to see an MRA bring forth legitimate evidence showing that he is persecuted by some feminist conspiracy. The two sides are not equal, and trying to say they are is rather terrible form.
“This is the sad mistake that both sides make: play genders against each other.”
Trying to improve life for one gender does not automatically mean playing genders against each other, the mistake that you yourself are so loathe to make. Improving the standard of living for blacks did not reduce that of whites, and the increase of women’s rights in the past 100 years has not decreased that of men. (By the way, this is the product of the feminist movement, which you say is not trying to improve life for anyone)
Furthermore you make another equivication between the Men’s and Women’s rights movements, completely missing the point of my scale analogy. Or are you trying to suggest that both men and woman are equally oppressed by… each other? A third party?
The fact that their is wrong happening on “both sides” does not make each side equally at fault, and trying to insist such only clouds the real issues, preventing a solution from happening. Again, rather terrible form.