Educated women: Boner killers?

Guys never ever creepily obsess over women like this.

Dating guru RooshV — whose name conveniently rhymes with “douchey” — is convinced that, when it comes to women, smartness is inversely correlated with hotness. As he puts it in a post today, committing at least one logical fallacy in the process:

Femininity is a quality that pleases men. Therefore from the chart we can deduce that educated women decrease a man’s happiness. … Anything beyond a bachelors at a public university is a near guarantee she’ll possess a large basket of masculine traits that will prevent boners.

The “chart” in question is one that RooshV made up himself, and which contrasts the purported sexiness of less-educated women with the purported unsexiness of more educated women. As he explains:

A good test to see if a girl is over-educated is to add the word “sexy” before her job title. If the resulting phrase ignites arousing images in your head, then she’ll most likely have what it takes to satisfy you.

Amongst RooshV’s “boner inducing” job titles for women: Sexy waitress, sexy teacher, sexy librarian, sexy flight attendant. Amongst the “boner softening” job titles: Sexy IT specialist, sexy anesthesiologist, sexy tort attorney, sexy financial analyst.

There are more than a few problems with RooshV’s little list, not the least of which is that plenty of dudes do in fact get boners thinking of “sexy” female IT specialists, lawyers, financial analysts and other smart women. (I’m kind of partial to sexy professors, myself.) And if you don’t want to take my word for it — and MRAs never do — I invite you to investigate the vast amount of porn involving “nerdy girls” or simply girls with glasses (NSFW link).

Also, if you’re going to base your notions of male and female sexuality on which job titles sound like the best sexy Halloween costume, how can you leave out such classics as “sexy nurse” (a job that actually does require specialized education) or “sexy kitty” (which requires whiskers and little cat ears)? And should we conclude from the perpetual popularity of the latter as a Halloween costume that furry women with tails who shit in a box are sexier than the furless standard models?

Also, if you’re a guy who fetishizes less-educated women, and refuses to date women as educated or as well-paid as you are, you pretty much lose the right to criticize women for wanting you to pick up the check for dinner.

If you enjoyed this post, would you kindly* use the “Share This” or one of the other buttons below to share it on Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, or wherever else you want. I appreciate it.

*Yes, that was a Bioshock reference.

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Posted on March 22, 2011, in kitties, men who should not ever be with women ever, misogyny, rhymes with roosh, sex. Bookmark the permalink. 120 Comments.

  1. >Relax and repeat after me; "nobody likes a fatty."I don't view my reasoning as "upstream" when I deny a statement like this. I actually like heavy women myself. Not BBW territory, but certainly heavier than what the media portrays as typically beautiful. One of the most beautiful women I've seen weighed about 200 pounds. That's my taste.But go on pretending that your taste is right/normal and anyone who doesn't share it is wrong/abnormal. You're right, your line of reasoning is easier. But it's weird that you've gotten it in your head that "intellectually lazy" correlates with "correct."

  2. >And another addendum! I'm going to be doing this all night at this rate. –lifeisugly thinks ascii penises are a counterargument. Lifeisugly is possibly eleven years old? That would explain a lot actually.

  3. >that I can't fuck because I'm monogamous now! le sighHa, I'll never make that mistake again. Polyamory all the way, whoo!

  4. >Lifeisugly: While your acknowledgment that intelligence doesn't automatically render women unfuckable is heartening, I have to take issue with the tired "education makes women uppity" argument.And please don't give me that bullshit about men and women being different — because the reality is that men and women are far more the same than they are different. For example, men and women are the same in that acquiring an education and building a career takes talent, dedication and hard work regardless of one's gender. It is quite offensive, therefore, that the term "career-obsessed" when applied to women is just code for "reluctant to flush her talents and two decades of work and sacrifice down the toilet in order to have more time to cook me dinner, keep the baby from being an inconvenience to me and wipe my ass." If men and women similarly put effort into a career, why is it that men like you consider WOMEN's achievements, aspirations and labor disposable and secondary to men's mere domestic convenience (while MEN's careers must be cherished, promoted and sacrificed for)? Please don't insult us by saying this is so simply because men and women are different, because that would be saying that women have inherently less worth than men and should expect far less consideration. If that's what you actually believe, then we simply have a fundamental disagreement on values, and let's leave it at that.This is the problem with gender essentialists who claim to be moderate: they would "allow" women to have careers as long as women never actually have the temerity to value their own minds, achievements and academic and professional work; as long as they are ready to drop everything and let a chunk of their lives to have been for nothing in order to become full-time maids. And we are allowed to be intelligent as long as we behave as quiescent, simpering globs of protoplasm, and never use that intelligence to disagree with a man or make him think he knows less than we do about something other than childcare and household work.As for differences, note that "sacrificing for the family" by advancing in one's career and increasing one's income is NOT the flip side of "sacrificing for the family" by throwing one's career and achievements away.

  5. >triplanetary: I would if I could, but my boyfriend is monogamous! And I would rather have him than a harem's worth of nummy geekboy cock. :( Amused: WORD. What zie said.

  6. >Sexy environmental scientist, eh? Sweet? Now I can collect sexy water samples and do sexy analyses of them. And create sexy maps of super sexy water quality indices.

  7. >Now I can collect sexy water samples and do sexy analyses of them. And create sexy maps of super sexy water quality indices.Presumably this is what happens with Zapp Brannigan is assigned to chart a planet.

  8. >He is the Velour Master.

  9. >@Ozymandias"Lifeisugly is possibly eleven years old? That would explain a lot actually."You'd think David was running an MRA daycare, judging by the maturity level of some of these commenters.

  10. >Presumably this is what happens with Zapp Brannigan is assigned to chart a planet. Yes. Also, like Zapp Brannigan, sexy environmental scientists never wear pants.

  11. >Pointing out that doodz who hate on women for being ugly are ugly is a bit like pointing out that Congressmen who vote against gay rights are gay. It's not relevant, and it's not really good form–except there's the whole hypocrisy thing.

  12. >Feminism only happened because men let it

  13. >Decolonization only happened because the British let it. Doesn't make it less of a moral imperative.

  14. >Some men let it, other men have been crying about uppity women since, well, at least since things started being written down and most likely since long before that.

  15. >Look up the definition of 'educated' and then do the same for 'smart'. Note the difference.Needless to say, if you were a woman you'd probably be extremely wealthy. (Because a successful older man would've married you when you were young and sexy… obviously.)

  16. >Feminism only happened because men let itAnd integration in the US only happened because the group of old white men on the Supreme Court let it. What's your point, beyond an admittedly correct acknowledgment that patriarchy is still alive and well in our culture?Is your point that women should bow down and be grateful to men for treating them slightly less like subhumans? Because fuck that.

  17. >""Douche." Isn't that a gender-specific insult like "bitch" or "whore?" Aren't you feminists always complaining about double-standards? How is using a word like "creepy guy" or "douchy" which is a label used by women or the feminine-minded any different from a man using "gold-digging slut" or "mouthy bitch?""Not all feminists think douche is a good word to use as an insult, especially since it started out as a gendered insult against men, like pussy or cunt.No amount of "useless and unhealthy to women lol" can erase the history of the word. I'm always frustrated when I see that "explanation" because it's frankly retcon bullshit.

  18. >Oh, and "creepy" is used on both sexes, at least in my world.

  19. >i used to love smart women. still do. but the problem is that the smarter the woman, and the more accomplished she is, often that means that she is more demanding and more of a pain in the ass. harder to please, harder to keep happy.

  20. >i used to love smart women. still do. but the problem is that the smarter the woman, and the more accomplished she is, often that means that she is more demanding and more of a pain in the ass. harder to please, harder to keep happy.I know, right! You give these women an education and suddenly they're demanding the same consideration as men. It's awful. Next thing you know they'll get it in their heads that they're full human beings.Educating women was a mistake in the first place, I say.

  21. >I know I am wrong to expect the guy I date to be able to hold a decent conversation on anything, to bathe daily, to brush his teeth and hair, to make some kind of effort to support himself after turning 25…must be that uppity edumucation I got.

  22. >Saying creepy is an insult to men is just being silly, women get called creepy too…in fact if you are constantly being called creepy, then maybe you are!Trip and Elizabeth….don't you know that women are just so gosh darn mean now in days! I mean, if a guy is nice and shows the girl attention she needs to just give him a chance! How dare women have expectations and standards! And educated women just have too many of those things!

  23. >@jupiter, "douche" it is not comparable to the other terms you discuss. "Pussy" and "cunt" are explicit references to genitals. "Bitch" and "whore" apply to behaviors that are only punished in women or viewed as feminizing, whereas the behaviors addressed by "douche" are not ones exclusively punished in men or ones that are seen as automatically masculinized. When a woman is called a "douche", there is no suggestion that her behavior is masculine, whereas when a man is called a "bitch" it is pretty explicit that his act and the term are seen as feminizing. The same applies to the term "creepy". Neither "creepy" nor "douche" is actually a gender specific insult. Even if it is an insult that is applied at higher rates to men, it is not gendered per se, unlike the terms you cite. The term "dick" or "cock" as an insult is a specifically gendered one, however, this still does not get it to the level of being comparable. Social power of the respective groups matters in the level of hurt inflicted by an specified insult. Cracker and the n-word are not equivalent. Breeder and fag are not equivalent. Walkie-talkie and cripple are not equivalent.

  24. >Social power of the respective groups matters in the level of hurt inflicted by an specified insult.This is something the MRAs really need to start understanding.

  25. >No, DarkSideCat, the original insult within "douche" was that it was water made dirty by contact with *female* genitals. It's an insult based on contamination with femaleness.

  26. >Hold on guys, GET REAL. Roosh is right, albeit incidentally.Often very attractive women do not need to rely on an education to get ahead; their looks provide. As such, less attractive females are required to 'get smart' to compete, at least in terms of value. It's how natural selection works. Beauty and brains are rare indeed.I'm generalizing of course, but this unfortunate correlation provides a rational justification for such a chart.

  27. >It's how natural selection works.Conveniently, when somebody uses the phrase "natural selection" while describing human behavior, I take that as a sign that I don't have to bother paying attention to them anymore.Thank you.

  28. >"i used to love smart women. still do. but the problem is that the smarter the woman, and the more accomplished she is, often that means that she is more demanding and more of a pain in the ass. harder to please, harder to keep happy."Yes, I see what you mean. As an evil mastermind, I used to prefer the smart minions myself, but it's such a pain in the ass to get them to do what I say, they're always demanding their fair share of the spoils once I take over the world-Oh, you were talking about relationships not based on misguided assumptions of authority? My mistake. Just ignore me, I'm not a suspicious character at all.

  29. >@Naughty Nomad:Your argument is assuming that women are all scheming from an early age and making a decision about how best "to get ahead." When in reality, women (and men, I assume) spend a lot of time trying to figure out what *we* like. What people look like is related to the things we like, and how other people who like those things generally look, it's not a genetic reflection. That's why men and women who like to get dressed up and go to clubs look one way, while men and women who like to hang out in libraries and drink coffee look another. If you take a person out of the library and dress them like a club kid, they will be as pretty as a club kid. And if you take a person out of the club and dress them like a library-goer, they will look like the other people in the library. See? None of these choices involve natural selection.

  30. >I know I am wrong to expect the guy I date to be able to hold a decent conversation on anything, to bathe daily, to brush his teeth and hair, to make some kind of effort to support himself after turning 25…Most guys do that, more so than women in fact. Oftentimes women are so used to men leading the conversation and entertaining them like children that they would be autistic if judged by the male end of the double-standard. Additionally, many women will leech off of wealthier men to help pay their bills.I guess men are just more tolerant then women of social and economic ineptitude. You're welcome.

  31. >No, many guys do not have that ability I find. After the initial hi, how are you, the male just goes blank. Even trying to bring up movies, sports, computers, video games, fiction, nonfiction, television shows, the justice system, politics, religion, geography, travel, weather, and what they did that day at work does nothing to have an actual conversation.

  32. >No, many guys do not have that ability I find. After the initial hi, how are you, the male just goes blank. Even trying to bring up movies, sports, computers, video games, fiction, nonfiction, television shows, the justice system, politics, religion, geography, travel, weather, and what they did that day at work does nothing to have an actual conversation.1) Meet woman2) ???3) Get laid!

  33. >Most guys do that, more so than women in fact. Oftentimes women are so used to men leading the conversation and entertaining them like children that they would be autistic if judged by the male end of the double-standard. Additionally, many women will leech off of wealthier men to help pay their bills.People keep telling me that but quite frankly I have never seen any of these women who are interested in any kind of money that I have. The gold digger is incredibly rare and quite frankly? We would probably do the same if offered a sufficiently large amount of money. I cannot say that I would not be tempted (primarily because no woman is offering me large sums of money to sleep with them. I am not that attractive and women of the world aren't that desperate… yet!)Hands up men, who here thinks that women who expect you to pay their bills are attractive? I am betting not many of us. It's brains and personality that always win, dating attractive supermodels with the brains of blancmange and the personality of a dead fish would be a terrible terrible thing.

  34. >Actually, e-string, I would argue that women are more used to men not listening to them. In group conversations, men often dominate the discussion, and pay little mind to what women contribute. Except, of course, when a man decides to repeat what another woman just said and everybody attributes the idea to him. The idea is brilliant just as long as it's phrased in the form of a man.In one-on-one conversations, many men have a habit of assuming they must know better than women about any given topic, even if the subject is menstrual cramps or changing names after marriage. We call this mansplaining.Oh, and if men were judged by the female end of the double-standard, the majority would be derided as whiny, ball-busting, feminazi bitches. Because the double standard sucks.

  35. >I had a rough last couple of years in graduate school, to the point where I'm considering leaving the field in which I (finally) earned my doctorate. I've been feeling really down about that, wondering if all the blood, sweat, and tears were really worth it.Then I read this post, and learned that my degree is repulsive to "dating gurus" and "pick up artists." And you know what? It really was all worth it. Thanks, He-Man Woman-Haters Club!

  36. >@bottle – That was bitter and uninformative, but you did your best so thanks for sharing!

  37. >Mr. E-numbers:Please know that I am deeply, deeply sorry for using a tone that PUAs like you don't like, and for failing to be "informative" enough for you. See this face? This is my sincerely-sorry face. What? I often laugh uproariously when I'm being sincere.

  38. >Wicked Witch of the West laugh? Sexy anaesthetist? They are doctors you know and as sexy a stereotype as it goes. Sadly not true (Most of us medics are hit by the ugly stick. Too much work not enough time for exercise. I have bags under my eyes and put on weight. Also women are surprisingly not so interested in our money since we often lack it.)

  39. >No, we just want your brains….brains…brains…so we are like zombies or something.

  40. I wonder what evolutionary biologists think of all this? RooshV was clearly oversimplifying, but I think there’s a slight negative correlation between highly competitive career tracks (testosterone maybe?) and femininity…how about we all try and distill this hypothesis to its smallest elements and see if any psychologists/biologists have studied it?

  41. Yuyuko Saigyouji

    This guy’s website is one of the most disgusting readings I have ever seen. You really should blast him a lot more, there’s plenty of material to mock in there.

    He has such a single-minded obsession with sex that it seems like some sort of alien. And in one post he even recommends “Rape Game”, which is exactly what you would imagine…

    He’s just the kind of person I can’t even stand having around.

  42. bruce mcglory.

    “He’s just the kind of person I can’t even stand having around.”

    No one can. That’s why he makes hilariously crappy excel graphs to explain why it’s not that women don’t like HIM, it’s that HE doesn’t like women.

    Except poor and uneducated ones that he can dominate. Nothing pathetically cowardly and inadequate about that!

    I mocked the shit out of him in the comments, but of course Mr. Big Macho Man has moderation on. Wouldn’t want anyone who isn’t as pathetically cowardly as he is commenting!

  43. Oftentimes women are so used to men leading the conversation and entertaining them like children that they would be autistic if judged by the male end of the double-standard.

    A) Have you ever observed the fact that women talk to each other? In fact there’s a whole chatty gossiping women stereotype around that fact. That women often get talked over by men and eventually give up participating in conversations with them doesn’t mean they are unable to have them.

    B) You clearly have no clue about the autism spectrum at all. It’s not uncommon for people with autism (especially Aspergers) to not be able to read the cues people give around conversations and as such keep talking and can’t read when other people want to talk. I know this is something I do, it’s one reason it took me a long time to recognize the way men talk over women or try to bully conversations because it doesn’t work on me. I also have times when I shut down and me to say even one word is difficult. Most women are not like me.

  44. Shabba Ranks (Mr. Loverman)

    Good thing you have the likes of roosh to write about eh ? you need him, he dont need you. He wins.

  45. Presented without further comment, a porn film about financial analysts: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0083314/ .

  46. Enjoy your cats in your old age, Ms Amused. Or do what Ms “Eat Pray Love” did in her actual real life (not the Hollyowood version) marry a bald guy 17 years her senior who wanted a visa to the USA.

  47. You know what else is sad? Teachers, librarians, and P.R. reps require the same level of education (i.e. bachelor’s degree with an education certificate and completion of a teaching internship for teachers, but a masters is helpful, particularly for librarians) as civil engineers (bachelor’s degree and license, obtained after passing the exam after being permitted to take it after four years of actual work being supervised by other C.E., but a master’s can help) and business managers (bachelor’s degree with certification and a master’s can help). It took me five minutes on google to confirm all of this. In short, not only is this guy an asshole who doesn’t understand that men don’t form a collective that only finds one type of woman attractive and that men who disagree with him about what he finds attractive are genuinely attracted to different types and aren’t beta losers. Oh no. RooshV can’t even UTFSE.

  48. Well this has just been the necro thread from hell, hasn’t it? I don’t know why Karl thinks an old age with cats would be so terrible. Perhaps he’s never met the right cat ;-)

    AllyLS, good point re the education levels required for traditionally “female” professions. RooshV was never one to let the truth get in the way of a good misgynistic rant though. /rollseyes

  49. Cats are awesome! Necro trolls, not so much.

  50. “Enjoy cats in your old age”

    I know this comment is old, but ok. Cats are pretty fun, and aging isn’t an option.

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